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Paths of Civilization

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[X] [Dam] Move to the bigger but more useful proposal (1 Wealth and 1 Tech per action added to remaining costs, requires an additional 2 actions to complete)
 
[] [Purity] If slavery is so bad in comparison, maybe even the half-exiles need to be addressed (-1 Stability, the next Patrician, Guild, and Trader quests are all spite quests, all Wealth costs are doubled going forward)
So, if this is at all tenable, it's clearly the thing to do. Is it at all tenable? Clearly there are things that we currently plan to do that we would never do once this effect is in place; are those things worth pseudo slavery?
Are there things required to address existential threats which we would be unable to do with this option? If we do this and fracture, you can be quite sure that slavery will come back in force, so it's only if we can go for this and hold it that we should do it.
For reference, here's our up to date action list:
Academia Nut said:
There should have been an update, but I got caught up in reworking some stat stuff. So the front page has been updated, and here's the reworked actions to look over.

Art Patronage [Guild] [Priest] - Wealth of the first and second kind can be used to create wealth of the third kind to the benefit of all
*S: -1 Econ, -3 Wealth, +3 Culture, +1 Tech, +1 Prestige, potential innovations x2
*M: -1 Econ, -5 Wealth, +5 Culture, +1 Tech, +1 Prestige, higher chance of innovations x2

Black Soil [Yeomen] - There are many places that could benefit from further black soil, but making more is starting to take up more resources than it is currently returning
*S: +2-3 Econ Expansion, -1 Tech
*M: -2 Econ, 1 Forest Slot Consumed, -1 Tech, +6 Econ Expansion, other effects [King]
* used 3 times

Build Chariots - The vehicle of the elite, chariots are the most effective way of waging war the People know.
*S: -1 Econ, -2 Wealth, +2 Martial, +1 Culture
*M: -2 Econ, -5 Wealth, +6 Martial, +2 Culture, +1 Prestige

Build Docks [Guild][Trader] - With large numbers of ships being built, a new place to store them all, the goods they bring in, and a place to build them might be a good idea
*S: -1 Econ, +1 Diplo, increased trade power
*M: -2 Econ, -1 Wealth, +3 Diplo, potential for new innovations x2, increased trade power

Build Ceramics Kilns [Guild] – With similar demands for high temperature kilns, glass and fine pottery are growing increasingly close together
*S: -2 Econ, -3 Tech, 1 Sustainable Forest used, +2 Wealth, +3 Culture, chance of new innovations x2
*M: -3 Econ, -4 Tech, 2 Sustainable Forest used, +2 Wealth, +7 Culture, increased chance of new innovations x2

Build Gymnasium - With the games on people's minds, a place to train for them would be most useful. +2 to Games, +1 non-primary Tolerance
*S: -2 Wealth, -2 Culture, +2 Bonus to Games rolls per turn, +1 non-primary Martial tolerance
*M: -3 Wealth, -3 Culture, +5 Bonus to Games rolls per turn, +1 non-primary Martial tolerance

Build Mills - By harnessing the power of flowing water, work can be done, freeing up considerable amounts of labour
*S: -3 Wealth, -1 Tech, +3 Econ, potential for innovation x2
*M: -4 Wealth, - 1 Tech, +4 Econ, increased potential for innovation x2

Build Roads [Yeomen] - New roads can better tie the people together, so more could be useful. (17/46) +5 Centralization Tolerance
* S: -1 Econ, -2 Wealth, -1 Tech, +1 Centralization, +1 Diplo, other effects
* M: -3 Econ, -2 Wealth, -2 Tech, +2 Centralization, +2 Diplo, other effects

Build Theatre [Urban] - Having a place for the presentation of plays should be a great way to propagate the People's culture and entertain the masses
*S: -1 Econ, -1 Wealth, -1 Culture, +4 Culture end of turn, other effects
*M: -1 Econ, -2 Wealth, -1 Culture, +4 Culture end of turn, +2 Culture next turn, other effects

Build Wall [Urban] - The practice of building city walls has reached new heights with access to superior tools making the cutting of stone simpler (26/58 significant walls, 4/45 massive walls)
*S: -2 Econ, +1 significant walls
*M: -4 Econ, +1 massive walls

Build Watchtowers [Yeomen] - Stone and brick towers for warriors to sit in and scan the horizon for trouble, these towers can help stave off raids and improve response against attacks. (35% coverage)
*S: -1 Econ, +5% coverage
*M: -1 Econ, +10% coverage

Change Policy - Adjust the current Policy to one better fitting the situation
*S: Change Active Policy to one of the available ones listed below
Balanced - Takes whatever actions seem reasonable. Expand Economy is considered a Policy action for interaction with other effects
Defence - Builds walls and watchtowers
Expansion - Builds new settlements, expands economy, expands forests, and can even create new provinces
Infrastructure - Extended projects
Megaproject Support - Provinces can spend actions in support of a megaproject
Offence - Can recruit warriors and specialists, can send war actions against declared enemies
Progress - Takes studying actions and art patronage
Restoration - Takes stability improving actions
Spirits - Builds temples
Trade - Sends out trade missions, produce art and luxuries

*S: Change up to two Passive Policies (5/9) to one of the available ones listed below
Agriculture (+3 Econ, -3 Econ Expansion, -1 Tech/turn)
Diplomacy (+1 Diplo/turn)
Skullduggery (+1 Intrigue/turn, -2 Diplo)
Trade (+1 Wealth/turn)
Armament (+1 Martial/turn)
Patronage (+1 Culture/turn)
Mysticism (+1 Mysticism/turn)
Industry (+1 Tech/turn)
City Support (4 Econ cost for True Cities offset each turn, -1 Tech) x1
Expansion (So long as there is land to expand into, +1 Econ Expansion/turn, reduces threshold to produce new provinces the longer active)
Innovation (Extra 2 innovation rolls each turn, -1 Wealth)
Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn)
Defence (+1 significant walls/turn) x1
Special: Forestry (+1 Sustainable Forest and -1 Econ Expansion/2 turns) x2
Special: Vassal Support (+1 Subordinate while active, increases Loyalty while active at less than full subordinates) x1

Develop Intrigue Web [Urban] [Trader] - With contacts in the right places, all sorts of fun things can be done
S: -2 Wealth, -2 Diplo, +1 Intrigue
M: -3 Wealth, -3 Diplo, +2 Intrigue

Distribute Land - By reworking the distribution of land, the king can improve tax income and reduce pressures administrative overhead. 0/4 Progress to Min Centralization increase
*S: -1 Centralization, +2 Wealth
*M: -2 Centralization, +5 Wealth, +1 Progress

Enforce Justice - The king is a servant of the law, and he can use the army to remind people of that fact [GJ]
* S: 1 Stability, +1-3 Centralization
* M: 1 to 2 Stability, +2-3 Centralization
* the more settlements with walls outside of the capital, particularly large walls, the less effective this action is
*Max Stability: Legitimacy

Efficient Charcoal Kilns [Guild] - With better processes, large Guild controlled kilns can be built to efficiently turn wood into charcoal
*S: -1 Econ & Wealth, -2 Tech, -2 Sustainable Forest used
*M: -2 Econ & Wealth, -1 Tech, -3 Sustainable Forest used, other effects
Note: Efficient Charcoal production cannot take the total Sustainable Forest usage below 1/2 of the total

Expand Economy [Yeoman] - Encourage the growth of food producing activities such as farming, pastures, or fishing, depending on where focus is placed
*S: +6 Econ, -2 Tech, -6 Econ Expansion, potential additional effects

Expand Forests [Yeoman] - The People have knowledge of how to regrow and repair forests, which extends to bringing them to places they have never been, with considerable effort. With charcoal now in higher demand, can also provide a sustainable supply (7/8 currently locked up)
* S: -2 Econ, -1 Econ Expansion, grows forest, +2 Econ next turn if in settled territory and controlled, potential discoveries, +0.5 Sustainable Forest
* M: -3 Econ, -3 Econ Expansion, grows forest, +4 Econ next turn if in settled and controlled territory, improved odds of success, other effects, +1 Sustainable Forest

Found Colony - When a province gets too distant, sometimes it is best to grant it additional autonomy so that they can get down to the business of working the land and gathering resources without needing to talk to the king about every little thing. Current Target: Spirit Channel
*S: -1 Econ, 4 Econ Transfer, -2 Martial, founds colony to produce raw resources

Found Free City - Cities are hard to manage, giving them increased autonomy to manage themselves will reduce administrative overhead. Current Possibility: None
*S: Transfer 2 Econ and Econ Expansion, converts True City to Free City. Free Cities now produce a Passive Policy of their choice in activity each turn

Found March - Sometimes you need an extra buffer between you and hostile powers, or a place to stash excess warriors. Current Target: Spirit Channel, Northern Steppe, Northwestern Steppe
*S: -5 Martial, 2 Econ transfer, founds march to take independent martial actions

Found Mercenary Company - With new coinage, those who fight for less than savoury reasons can be bargained with more effectively. Paid well they can enhance your forces, or can be hired out to other groups, but beware of having them sit around without pay!
*S: -8 Martial, -1 Wealth per turn in your employ, +1 Wealth per turn if hired out to another group, or 0 Wealth per turn and adds directly to Martial score

Found Trading Post - When doing long distance trading, sometimes having your own infrastructure in place at the other end can be quite useful. Current Target: Steppe Portage (risky)
*S: -3 Diplo, -2 Wealth, -1 Econ, 2 Econ Transfer, -2 Martial, founds trading post to generate Wealth and Diplomacy

Hunt Troublemakers - Those who would do harm to the kingdom rarely plan this openly, so subtle methods are needed to find them and root them out
S: -1 Intrigue, information on problems
M: -1 Intrigue, -2 Wealth, 0 to +1 Stability, information on problems

Increase Cement Production [Guild] – While this material can use the same kilns as for pottery and glassmaking, it benefits more from raw size and throughput than the more precise control of those materials, and the other artisans complain if you take up their space with cement
*S: -1 Econ, -3 Wealth, -2 Tech, 1 sustainable forest used, certain projects boosted, other effects
*M: -2 Econ, -4 Wealth, -3 Tech, 1 sustainable forest used, certain projects boosted, other effects

Influence Subordinate - By transferring specialists and teachers to subordinates they can be nudged into behaving more to the liking of the core provinces
*S: -2 Diplo, Transfer 2 Econ, Wealth, Culture, Tech, and Mysticism; influences subordinate culture
*M: -3 Diplo, Transfer 3 Econ, Wealth, Culture, Tech, and Mysticism; significantly influences subordinate culture, +1 Loyalty

Integrate Colony - Part of the colony of Western Wall, Txolla, or Hatvalley can be integrated into the People more fully, transitioning from a Colony to a province
*S: -6 Diplomacy, gain Econ and Martial from integrating Colony
*M: Same as above, completes at mid-turn

Integrate March - Better communications and administration means that the Heaven's Hawk can be integrated into the People more fully, transitioning from a March to a province
*S: -6 Diplomacy, gain Econ and Martial from integrating March
*M: Same as above, completes at mid-turn

Integrate Vassal - Now in contact with the core territories, the lowlanders can be brought more fully into the traditions of the People
*S: -4 Diplomacy, transitions vassal to March or Colony
*M: -8 Diplomacy, transitions portion of vassal to full province, converts rest to March or Colony

Improve Annual Festival - A festival for every season, but their expansion can help put the People at ease and teach good practices.
* S: -1 Econ, -2 Wealth, +1 Stability, +2 Culture, chance for additional effects
* M: -2 Econ, -2 Wealth, +1 Stability, +4 Culture, chance for additional effects
* Max Stability: Legitimacy - 1

Invite to Games [Traders] - There are some of your neighbours who might be convinced to come (back) to the Games
*S: -1 Diplo to invite most neighbours, -3 to invite a Great Power (currently Khemetri)

Launch Intrigue Mission - Whether inside or out of the kingdom, more offensive uses of intrigue can be used to attempt to gain an advantage
*S: -1 Intrigue, -2 Diplo, -2 Wealth, begins an intrigue event in target location
*S: -2 Intrigue, -3 Diplo, -3 Wealth, begins an intrigue event in target location with higher odds of success

Support Sacred Orders [Priests] – The various sacred orders of specialist warriors provide a number of benefits and special skills, but require considerable investment
*S: -3 Econ, -3 Mysticism, -6 Wealth, +5 Martial, +1 Light Cavalry, +2 Culture, other effects
*M: -4 Econ, -4 Mysticism, -7 Wealth, +7 Martial, +2 Light Cavalry, +3 Culture, other effects

More Warships [Guild][Traders] - Many standard boats are no longer things need to worry about, but warships are something else entirely
*S: -3 Econ, -3 Wealth, -2 Martial, +1 Tech; +1 Naval, additional effects
*M: -3 Econ, -5 Wealth, -3 Martial, +1 Tech; +2 Naval, additional effects

New Settlement [Yeomen] - There are a few new sites that could have new settlements placed on them: northern Blackriver (+3, moderate mineral, 1/6 province), internal reorg (+3, 4/10 places available)
* S: -1 Econ, +1 Econ and Mysticism end of turn, increases number Econ Expansion depending on environment, +1 Province progress
* M: +1 Econ and Mysticism, increases Econ Expansion, +2 Province progress
Plant Cash Crops - Drugs [Priests][Yeomen] – Some crops produce peculiar effects on the mind that can be in high demand for spiritual and medical uses. Available: Hemp, Poppies
*S: -2 Econ, -2 Econ Expansion, +1 Mysticism, +3 Wealth
*M: -3 Econ, -3 Econ Expansion, +1 Mysticism, +7 Wealth, other effects

Plant Cash Crops - Textiles [Guild][Yeomen] – Planting these water and soil hungry crops can produce large quantities of useful fibres for sturdy ropes and comfortable clothing. Available: Hemp, Cotton, Flax
*S: -3 Econ, -4 Econ Expansion, +6 Wealth, +1 Diplo with boats, +1 Econ next turn other effects
*M: -5 Econ, -5 Econ Expansion, +7 Wealth, +2 Diplo with boats, +1 Culture, +1 Econ next turn, other effects

Plant Cash Crops – Luxuries [Yeomen] – These crops are those that make life a bit more vibrant, flavourful, and exciting. Available: Wine, Dyes, Spices
*S: -2 Econ, -1 Econ Expansion, +2 Wealth, +2 Culture, other effects
*S: -5 Econ, -2 Econ Expansion, +6 Wealth, +2 Culture, other effects

Proclaim Glory - By using art the King can promote people to trust his decisions; modified by Diplomacy skill
* S: -3 Culture, -1 Econ, +1 Legitimacy, +1 Stability, potential +1 Prestige
*M: -6 Culture, -2 Econ, +1 Legitimacy, +2 Stability, +1 Prestige
* Max Stability: Legitimacy

Raise Army - More men can be inducted into the ranks of the warriors every year and not face major food shortfalls
* S: -2 Econ, -3 Wealth, +5 Martial, +1 Culture, potential additional effects
*M: -3 Econ, -5 Wealth, +9 Martial, +2 Culture, potential additional effects
*2M: -4 Econ, -5 Wealth, +2 Culture, founds Martial 10 Mercenary Company

Retraining - When there are more warriors than the People know what to do with, it may be a good idea to find them something else to do
*S: -4 Martial, -2 Econ Expansion, +2 Econ, Culture, and Tech
*M: -6 Martial, -3 Econ Expansion, +3 Econ, Culture, and Tech

Restoration of Order - The people are uncertain, and into that uncertainty bad behaviour can flow. Send in the warriors to reassure people and root out corruption and dissent, restoring the proper function of the People, at the cost of disturbing their confidence that the king has their best interests at heart. Max Stability: Legitimacy-1
* S: Gain 0 to 2 Stability at a cost of -1 Legitimacy
* M: Roll twice, take best result, chance of additional +1 Stability
* modified by Administrative skill

Sailing Mission [Traders] - Boats have proven themselves capable of exploring long distances, so what else might they discover along the shores of the sea? Sailing missions can also locate pirates.
* S: Potential new discoveries
* M: -1 Econ, improved odds of success

Salt Gift [Traders] - With the saltern, the People have access to tremendous amounts of salt, which can be used to awe outsiders
*S: -5 Wealth, random amount of Diplomacy, Culture, and Prestige generated (min. 1 of each) and the possibility of Mysticism generation
*M: -8 Wealth, random amount of Diplomacy, Culture, Mysticism, and Prestige generated (min. 1 of each)

Study Alchemy [Priests] - Materials can be made to transform their form through special treatment. What wonders can be discovered in this process?
*S: -2 Mysticism, -3 Wealth, +1 Tech, potential new discoveries x2
*M: -4 Mysticism, -4 Wealth, -1 Econ, +1 Tech, increased chance of new discoveries x2

Study Health [Priests] - What secrets of nature can be used to improve the health of the People?
* S: -1 Econ, -2 Wealth, -1 Tech, potential new discoveries x2
*M: -1 Econ, -2 Wealth, -3 Mysticism, -1 Tech, increased odds of success x2

Study Metal [Priests][Guilds] - Iron and copper, gold and silver, what other secrets are hidden in metal and stone?
* S: -1 Econ, -2 Wealth, -1 Mysticism, +1 Tech, small chance of new insights x2
* M: -1 Econ, -3 Wealth, -1 Mysticism, improved chance of new insights x2

Study Stars [Priests] - What secrets do the heavens hold when you study the stars and their motions carefully?
*S: -1 Wealth, +1 Mysticism, gives mid-turn astrological predictions
Cannot be used as a Main action

Support Artisans [Guild] - With the growing importance of skilled artisans to the maintenance of society, additional support may sometimes be needed
*S: -1 Econ, -3 Wealth, +3 Tech, +1 Culture, potential innovations x2
*M: -1 Econ, -5 Wealth, +5 Tech, +1 Culture, higher chance of innovations x2

Support Subordinate - Send resources over to a subordinate state to help prop them up.
*S: Transfer 2 Econ and Martial, chance of +1 Loyalty
*M: Transfer 4 Econ and Martial, at least +1 Loyalty

Support Faction - Use influence to increase the power of a faction.
S: -4 Culture, +1 Faction Power, +1 Time to current quest

Suppress Faction - Use influence to curb the power of a faction.
S: -2 Stability, -5 Culture, -1 Faction Power, current faction quest fails but consequences negated

Survey Lands [Yeomen][Trader] - What interesting discoveries are within the People's lands?
* S: Potential new discoveries
* M: -1 Econ, improved odds of success

Terrify - You've killed cities, walls will not keep your enemies safe
*S: -3 Diplo, can force minors to become vassals or integrate, can cause major civilizations to lose Stability
Special: Not applicable to nomads, efficiency greatly improved by performing a War Mission against the target the same turn
Warning: Crit fails can cause backlash, losing Stability

Trade Mission [Trader] - Sending a major caravan to another large group can bring new opportunities and find out more about the outside world
* S: -2 Diplo, additional effects depending on target, +1-2 Wealth
* M: -2 Diplo, -1 Econ, additional effects depending on target, +1 Wealth, +1-5 Wealth end of turn

Diplomatic Mission [Trader] – Contact with the outside world is expensive, but can bring its own rewards
* S: -2 Wealth, additional effects depending on target, +1-2 Diplo
* M: -2 Wealth, -1 Econ, additional effects depending on target, +1 Diplo, +1-3 Diplo end of turn, +0-2 Wealth end of turn

War Mission - You can send raiding parties against groups that have declared themselves hostile. Can only declare war if you have a valid casus belli (currently only if someone declares war first)
* S: Potential loss of Martial, can prevent Econ and Diplo damage when being attacked, can damage enemy Martial and Diplo
* M: Probable loss of Martial, can prevent Econ and Diplo damage when being attacked, can damage enemy Martial, Diplo, and Econ, always has a mid-turn decision point

Extended Projects- Extended Projects are major infrastructure projects that take more than a single Main action to complete but aren't as all consuming as megaprojects
Library [Priest] - Any location with a temple and/or True City status can have a library, with each {S} committed consuming 3 Culture and 3 Mysticism for 3 progress. Completion grants Mysticism, every 2 libraries past the first increases the Mysticism refund by 1. Sacred Forest (0/3), Redshore (0/3), Redhills (0/3), Stallionpen (0/3), Blackmouth (0/3), Valleyguard (0/3)
Saltern [Guild][Yeomen] - Northshore Saltern Expansion (0/3), Southshore Saltern Expansion (0/3), Gulshore Saltern (0/3). Each {S} committed consumes 3 Econ and 3 Tech for 3 Progress. Completion gives additional Wealth and every 2 salterns or expansions increases the per turn Wealth by +1
Temple [Priest] - Progress listed below, each {S} committed consumes 3 Econ and 3 Culture for 3 Progress. Completion increases Religious Authority
Observatory [Priest] - Certain temples can have astrological observatories, with each {S} committed consuming 3 Econ and 3 Mysticism for 3 Progress

Academy – These centers of learning provide a well-rounded education in topics both general and esoteric, providing a more informed population who are better able to deal with the complexities of the world, although direct reference to the records can be called into question more often. Each level increases RA tolerance by 1, decreases the refund from Libraries by 1 (min. 0), and provides other effects. Each {S} committed consumes 3 Wealth and 3 Culture for 3 progress
Redshore (0/3), Redhills (0/3), Valleyhome (0/3), Sacred Forest (0/3), Blackmouth (0/3), Stallionpen (0/3), Valleyguard (0/3)
Aqueduct [Urban] - Stonepen (0/3), Hatmouth (0/3), Yellowshore (0/3). Each {S} committed consumes 3 Econ and 3 Tech for 3 Progress. Completion adds +1 Econ Expansion, increases City Attraction by 1, can allow for the formation of another True City, and decreases disease roll penalty for True Cities
Bath [Urban] - Any city with an aqueduct may have a bath. Each {S} committed consumes 3 Wealth and 4 Tech for 3 Progress, and then ties up 1 Sustainable Forest once complete. Completion adds +1 Econ Expansion, increases City Attraction by 1, and decreases disease roll penalty for True Cities further. Redshore (2/6), Stallionpen (0/3), Valleyguard (0/3)
Block Housing [Urban] - Multilevel housing that allows for many, many people to be stuffed into a small area. Can only be built in locations with sufficient shipping to bring in enough external food to keep the locations fed, but can allow for Level 2 infrastructure to be built. Block Housing increases the city's EE limit by 5, but decreases the limit for cities without Block Housing by (5+total number of block housing). Each Block Housing also increases the Econ tax of a True City by 1. Every {S} cost 3 Econ and 3 Tech for 3 progress. Redshore (0/6), Blackmouth (0/3), Valleyguard (0/3)
Colossal Walls [Urban] - True Cities can support truly gigantic walls. Each {S} committed consumes 3 Econ and 1 Martial for 3 Progress. Redshore (0/9), Redhills (1/9), Valleyhome (0/9), Sacred Forest (0/9), Blackmouth (0/9), Stallionpen (0/9), Valleyguard (1/9)
Governor's Palace - Every palace lowers Min. Centralization by 0.5 and adds +1 to max interconnectivity, Temp Econ damage resistance, and adds +1 to max Martial, but also reduces Max. Centralization by 1 and can serve as the core of a breakaway state in a civil war. Each {S} costs 3 Econ and 3 Culture and produces 3 Progress
Ironworks [Guild] - Huge, centralized centers of iron production, these facilities make high quality iron tools cheaper and more widely available. Every facility adds +1 Econ, -1 EE, -1 Tech to the Expand Economy action. Level 2 and higher also increase the effect of Agriculture and City Support policies at the cost of additional Tech. Each level increases City Attraction by 1. Every {S} cost 3 Econ and 3 Tech for 3 progress, and each completed level of Ironworks also consume an additional 2 sustainable forest. Valleyhome (0/3), Redshore (0/6), Redhills (MP), Blackmouth (0/3)
Marketplace [Trader][Urban] - A more significant section than what is typically found in most settlements, these sorts of markets are meant to service massive urban populations. Level 1 transforms half of the Econ spent on a True or Free City into Wealth income. Level 2 increases this to 100% of the spent Econ. Each level increases City attraction by 1. Each {S} costs 3 Wealth and 3 Culture for 3 progress. Redshore (0/6), Redhills (0/3), Valleyhome (0/3), Sacred Forest (0/3), Blackmouth (0/3), Stallionpen (0/3), Valleyguard (0/3)

Palace Annex - Can construct additional palace annexes, with each {S} committed consuming 2 Econ and 2 Culture for a new annex (15/17)
-Great Hall Expansion
-Shrine
-Library
-Gardens
-Storehouse
-Arsenal
-Fortifications
-Stables

Reminder: 2 {S} applied to the same project = 1 {M}
Additionally: 2 Mains may have non-linear effects

Mega-Projects - Mega-Projects can require many generations to complete, take an unknown amount of time to do so, and drain Econ while active, but can produce massive benefits once complete. Once chosen, the occupy the Main Focus slot until either completed or stopped early. Early stopping once started does not refund any of the investments and increases social strife. To reduce confusion, mega-projects are not listed as part of the voting project list and must be "written-in".
Boundary Passage - The Boundary Hills are rough terrain with few wells or springs, making them almost impossible to pass, but if one were to cut through the rock to install tunnels and staircases, and build some bridges, this would provide an easy but easily controllable and defensible route between the steppes and lowlands (5-8? action commitment, -2 Econ per action)
Great Dam - The river can run wild and dangerous when the rains come strong, but could it not be controlled by the same principles by which the water on the hills is channelled and contained, merely on a larger scale? (2/4-6? action commitment, -2 Econ per action)
Great Library - The libraries thus far are fine, but with many of them and one on a port location, the possibility of an even larger library where everything might be stored presents itself (5-7? action commitment, -3 Mysticism and Culture per action, 0/2 Econ commitment)
Triangle Canal - There is land in the north where the soil is mostly clay and can be cut efficiently, allowing for a great canal to be cut between the two forks of the Black River, from which smaller irrigation canals can be built to water the land of the Stallions, massively increasing the available well watered land (8-11? action commitment, -3 Econ and -1 Tech per action)

[Stewards] special kicker: Pay 1 Stability to double the effort on a megaproject action, consuming twice the required per turn resources but advancing the job faster. If taking a second main action on a megaproject, requires additional Stability payment to double that as well.
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Academia Nut said:
Forgot an action:

Increase Cement Production [Guild] – While this material can use the same kilns as for pottery and glassmaking, it benefits more from raw size and throughput than the more precise control of those materials, and the other artisans complain if you take up their space with cement
*S: -1 Econ, -3 Wealth, -2 Tech, 1 sustainable forest used, certain projects boosted, other effects
*M: -2 Econ, -4 Wealth, -3 Tech, 1 sustainable forest used, certain projects boosted, other effects
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And here's @PrimalShadow 's recent shortlist of ways to spend Wealth:
PrimalShadow said:
Keep in mind that we've got a LOT of wealth sinks.
  • Build Roads
  • Build Mills
  • Efficient Kilns, Increase Cement Production
  • Improve Annual Festival
  • Hunt Troublemakers, Launch Intrigue Mission
  • Support Sacred Orders, Raise Army
  • More Warships
  • Salt Gift, Diplomatic Mission
  • Study Alchemy/Health/Metal
The point is, we can actually spend a huge amount of wealth, and often have to to get the projects we want done. And it is only going to get worse as our factions start spending spare resources without our input.
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  • We'll take Roads less often with this - it's already a little tricky to work them in and 4 Wealth will make them hard to budget from that end as well
  • Build Mills we can live without and probably won't ever take. Our exciting new Increase Cement Production will be torturously difficult to work in at -8 Wealth.
  • Kilns become less convenient, but we do have Repeated Expand Forests to look forward to - we'll have to limit our Infrastructure policies to account for this.
  • Festival is already rare for us to take - I expect us to eschew it entirely with this.
  • We'd switch to Secondary Hunt Troublemakers, I think, which isn't so bad. Launch Intrigue Mission becomes much harder to pair with military buildup which is usually when we'd want to use it.
  • -14 Wealth for Main Support Sacred Orders , -10 Wealth for Main Raise Army, and -10 Wealth for More Warships. How do we accomplish that??
  • Diplomatic Mission instantly supplants Salt Gift's role - and is probably a bit less effective at it.
  • Study Health doesn't change that much, and Study Metal is probably still justifiable. We already have trouble justifying Study Alchemy, so I don't think we'd take that. I hope you didn't want gunpowder or better paper.
The main takeaway here is that the advancement of our internal logistics would be massively slowed, and military buildup would become very difficult - the most efficient way much of the time would be to lean hard on stat positive actions for several turns to overflow into Martial, then hold very tightly indeed onto that Martial. War would be a far more costly concern than it is now, as our ability to bounce back would be crippled. Watchtowers and Defence Policy would become important, I think, as a way to build up against the nomad threat without spending Wealth.

The other main aspect is our Wealth income and maintenance. With all three mercenary companies on our Wealth income - which I believe is what we need to do for them to properly maintain their role and for their loyalty to increase again - we'd go from +7 net currently all the way to -2 net. From tied as our largest income to having to actively generate a fairly difficult to generate stat just to stay afloat. That means that this change could potentially cost us our professional army if we discover problems with keeping them added to our martial score.

I'm tentatively in favor of going for this option, but let me say now that I expect severe buyer's remorse if we do. I think this needs to be worth, say, 5 Megaprojects over the next 15 turns to be the right choice, because in quite a few areas we will be barely treading water or our development will be stalled for centuries.
 
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These wealth problems sound like the opposite of fun so lets approval vote against it.

[X] [Purity] The Puritans broke (Lose the Purity trait, possible loss of the prohibition on slavery)
[X] [Purity] While their vigilante violence was wrong, maybe they have a point here (Pride in Acceptance downgraded to Cosmopolitan Acceptance)
[X] [Purity] Some hypocrisy is acceptable (Greater Justice modified)
[X] [Purity] Look to the heavens for a sign (Random, could be all good results from above options, could be all bad results from above options, likely a mix)
 
So, have the mercs not ticked up in loyalty yet? I don't want to send 3/5 mercs to Harmurri, but it'd help solve our wealth and help contain highlands.

So if/when the option becomes available, Hire out the Dragon Banner (4/5 Loyalty) to Harmurri is sounding really attractive.
 
Glassware said:
Pragmatism? But the big expensive version of the dam isn't pragmatic. We gain very little in terms of efficiency, and even if the half-exile reform doesn't win the increased cost will massively curtail our options next turn. I don't think you're voting for pragmatism but rather for a poorly thought out backlash against perceived whiteknighting.
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Andres110 said:
If you want pragmatism, why are you voting for the dam option whose purpose is mostly to wave our dick?
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I meant in terms of the puritan vote, I honestly just want an impractical and awesome Dam after so long. :V
 
Some highlights on what the half-exile option will do:
  • Purity remains unaddressed. Only the first option does anything about that.
  • {M} More Warships now cost 10 wealth. If anyone planned to be a major contender w.r.t. the Not!Black-Sea, please cut those plans back.
  • {M} Support Sacred Orders now costs 14 wealth. If anyone planned to do significant expansions of our cavalry, please cut those plans back.
  • {M} Salt Gift is now effectively unaffordable. If anyone was planning to bribe nomads at some point in the future, please cut those plans back.
  • {M} Support Artisans and {M} Art Patronage are now effective unaffordable. In fact, every time one of our factions take these actions, it costs us a net total of 5 stat points.
  • {M} Increase Cement Production is now unaffordable. If anyone planned to get cement, please cut those plans back.
  • {M} Efficient Charcoal Kiln is now highly expensive, as is {M} Build Road. If you planned to keep up with forest demand and keeping enough roads built, please cut those plans back.
On TOP of all that, doubling our wealth expenses means that we are losing out on the equivalent of a Golden Age innovation every 1-2 turns.


Between Artisan Games (+1 Wealth cost to actions that give innovation rolls) and Life of Arete (+1 Wealth to basically everything), we are not well adapted to this.
 
[X] [Dam] Make it as big and impressive as possible (2 Wealth and 2 Tech per action added to remaining costs, requires an additional 3 actions to complete)

I can see why you thought this would be so contentious. After all everyone that opposes the wondrous Dam are irrational bigots that want little more than to destroy the very foundation of the People.
 
May I just say that double wealth cost on everything is bullshit because a lot of the actions we have use no half exile labor to begin with? I mean, pretty much everything that isn't explicitly dirty is done by free people. Crafting is done by free people, mining is done by free people, farming is done by free people. Aside from some vital actions like black soil and a whole bunch of minor stuff like garbage disposal of various kinds, half exile labor isn't actually necessary for anything.
 
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[X] [Dam] Move to the bigger but more useful proposal (1 Wealth and 1 Tech per action added to remaining costs, requires an additional 2 actions to complete)

[X] [Purity] The Puritans broke (Lose the Purity trait, possible loss of the prohibition on slavery)
[X] [Purity] Look to the heavens for a sign (Random, could be all good results from above options, could be all bad results from above options, likely a mix)

[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn)
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn) x2
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn) x3
[X] [PP] Skullduggery (+1 Intrigue/turn, -2 Diplo)
 
On the spite quest front, we can fail the patrician and guild quests without any terrible consequences thanks to our Division of Power trait. If we support the traders next turn, and then build the navy the turn after, we should be able to fail the next trader quest without consequence.
 
Yes, things will be harder with the doubled Wealth cost.
Yes, there is no benefit to be gained mechanically from this action.
Even narratively, reforming the Half Exiles pisses off the most important and influential people in our Society.

Yet, it is still the right thing to do.
It is something that has been a long time coming, that has been a stain upon the Ymaryn for centuries.
This is our chance to set things right.
This is our chance to point things in the right direction.

It will be hard, but I believe the Ymaryn shall persevere, and become better for it.
 
Andres110 said:
I think we might want to do a Survey action next turn. Gold and silver would help pay for the increased costs.
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Not sure that'll work. Who works in the Gold mines? Half Exiles.

Which leads me to a very weird piece of gameplay and story segregation. Naratively, this is us paying half exiles more. But in practice, it's paying more for labor saving and elite stuff, and not paying extra for manpower using actions.

Hence, as such I must conclude that this reform will destroy itself through narrative.

The extra wealth cost will force us to use manpower intensive actions. Those actions will create demand for a cheap and exploitable laborsource.
 
Division of power makes the spite quests cheap, but the Wealth costs doubling is massive pain. One we can afford, barely, but we'll NEED to be able to pay for it.

That means markets, that means not taking the biggest dam, and that means we can't afford a lot of our old actions. I think it's worthwhile, but we NEED to have those markets online ASAP if we don't want to be poor people who can't afford anything.
 
I feel like we all know we can't double the costs of our wealth and expect it to be fine. We all know our civ will quickly find some other way to get quick cheap labour to do tasks that generate no wealth but are essential for us.
 
Its really not worthwhile it seems to pretty much eliminates like Half our choices since they'd all become inhumanely expensive
 
065tdsa said:
May I just say that double wealth cost on everything is bullshit because a lot of the actions we have use no half exile labor to begin with? I mean, pretty much everything that isn't explicitly dirty is done by free people. Crafting is done by free people, mining is done by free people, farming is done by free people. Aside from some vital actions like black soil and a whole bunch of minor stuff like garbage disposal of various kinds, half exile labor isn't actually necessary for anything.
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We have a huge amount of half exiles actually, I can't remember the exact number but last it was mentioned it was around 25% I think.
 
[X] [Dam] Make it as big and impressive as possible (2 Wealth and 2 Tech per action added to remaining costs, requires an additional 3 actions to complete)

Why the fuck not? As others have noted, this is the only chance for this wonder. We can't upgrade a dam, and building another to be a wonder would likely not make it a wonder, as wonders are unique and marvelous. The world's first dam being an impressive construct worthy of talk all over the world certainly satisfies that. Outside of the prestige, wonders grant all around better bonuses.

[X] [Purity] If slavery is so bad in comparison, maybe even the half-exiles need to be addressed (-1 Stability, the next Patrician, Guild, and Trader quests are all spite quests, all Wealth costs are doubled going forward)

All the other options are flat unacceptable. Allowing actual slavery and not just the covered over and hidden practice of the half exiles opens up a whole bag of shit I don't want to touch. This will suck for a bit until we clear those quests, but it is doable. Diplomacy and societal change are give and take.

[X] [PP] City Support (4 Econ cost for True Cities offset each turn, -1 Tech)
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn)
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project (Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn) x2
[X] [PP] Infrastructure (+1 Free Progress to an infrastructure project(Aqueduct, governor's palace, saltern, etc.)/turn) x3

I have been convinced of the necessity of this.
Ghostdevil said:
we can regain slavery ban later,
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lolwut. Do you realize how long it took for slavery to Ben abolished IRL. It is one of the most difficult things to get rid of as a cultural practice because it is so attractive to the freedmen of a society. Not to mention the effects it has on the society as a whole. Productivity, wealth disparity, disease; all of these get worse with slavery.
 
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@Academia Nut out of curiosity how does having Legitimacy 3 and RA 9 affect our odds of picking up slavery here. You think the combination of powerful cultural guardians crushing heretics and the people believing in the legitimacy of the system would kinda strangle things in the crib.
 
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