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Paths of Civilization

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tenchifew said:
I would fully support a new northern march.
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I'd just use a merc company instead to bulk norther defense. Serious risk of steppe overreach
PrimalShadow said:
Wouldn't we normally get +4 EE for each of our new Aqueducts?
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Missed that. Not sure what happened to them.
Also, I think Canal no longer counts 'mere' extended projects anymore
maximillian said:
As for bronze Age intricacies on social standing and worth and interaction with lesser, I don't know much Admittedly, am just basing it on what I know of the early Romans and proceeding civs.
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Romans and Greeks were hilariously xenophobic. And even they allowed even the smallest cities to participate...well as long as they were Greek enough.

For such Grand Contest type events, usually the more the better because it was a major opportunity for diplomacy and prestige.

How often does a Thunder Horse or a Nomad even meet a Khemetri prince? The great powers enjoy lording it over lesser powers in the games, the more states involved, the more it validates their status.
Lesser powers would be there to lose with style, but diplomacy of great powers let them squeeze out edge benefits by playing one against the other.

Meanwhile the host twirls mustache and rakes in All the lewts
 
pblur said:
Alright, history sheet is updated (see my sig for the link). We are up to 994 old-secondary actions to date. Guild Mercantile has fully compensated for losing the Stallions, so we're still running 54-56 old-secondaries per turn. The format of the sheet is drastically improved; much easier to use now.

On that note... we need to start getting more subordinates. From what I can tell, trading posts are the least controversial action-granting subordinate, so it's about time for a northern and khemetri (if we can) TP.

Colonies also seem to be pretty chill, so if we had anywhere to colonize... but we already control pretty much all of the Black sea aside from what Trelli controls.

We need one slot for an HK vassal. Frankly, they're too small to be relevant any more, and we're too early for them to start acting like a small neighbor. They're still trying to be big-man-on-the-block, and that's really problematic given their position.

On the plus side, we know the land they took from Hathatyn back in the day was rich in tin. Maybe we'll get Leading in Tin?

I want another march to the north, but I don't expect enough support for that... I see the Stallions as a great success, and well worth the handful of issues they caused. (Many of those issues, IMO, were simply because they were our first subordinate state and we didn't know how to handle them.) On top of that, nomads are about to hit hard mode, and the QUEST just switched to hard mode. More non-king actions devoted to defense could be very handy.
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I would definitely support a northern march
 
[X] [WB] Upgrade Cosmopolitan Acceptance
[X] [Inv] Trelli
[X] [Inv] Thunder Horse
[X] [Inv] Swamp Folk
[X] [Inv] Metal Workers
[X] [Inv] Storm Wolves
[X] No
[X] [King] Kinda mediocre (Mediocre Admin, Diplo, and Martial)
 
veekie said:
I'd just use a merc company instead to bulk norther defense. Serious risk of steppe overreach.
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I am not sure if it would suffice.
A waagh can be a sudden thing, and a mercenary company can be out of position.

Besides a march is a province dedicated to martial improvement - given that we need to stay ahead of the curve another march would certainly help.

This said, I am ok with waiting a couple of turns first.
 
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@maximillian Random OTy thing. My D&D group just came up with an animal that I think the flock might have an interest in...

The Dire Battle Ram(Huge-sized sheep). Trained much like Elephants by the tribes of the foo race, these massive beasts provide many of the usual benefits of an Elephant of equal size. Where they differ is in Wool production. A Dire Battle Ram produces significant wool growth year round, allowing trained groomsman to sheer year-round wool, despite the frigid climates these Rams normally call home.

This unusual feature also provides a battle function, as the Wool of a Dire Battle Ram is thick enough to hide a number of medium sized riders comfortably of weight equal to its heavy load, that encumber the beast as normal. When so hidden, riders are seated comfortably and treated as having full cover. Riders can partially expose them selves, recieving the benefits of normal cover, but no associated penalties at-will. Because of the unusually warping nature of the wool, riders have get a +4 bonus to hide checks while recieving the benefit of cover, and a +8 while recieving the benefit of total cover, in addition to any other bonuses or penalties.

A Dire Battle Ram's primary attack is a headbutt, which ignores hardness, but the creature cannot attack targets that are shorter than half its size with this attack.
 
tenchifew said:
I am not sure if it would suffice.
A waagh can be a sudden thing, and a mercenary company can be out of position.

Besides a march is a province dedicated to martial improvement - given that we need to stay ahead of the curve another march would certainly help.
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Sure, and marches also diplomance and raise martial. Mercenaries ONLY do war missions.
 
I would support a northern march in a few generations
 
I wonder if all those Aqueducts and Walls the passive policies are churning out are bringing us closer to concrete. There is certainly a lot of mortar used, and odds are that they try to use local sources for mixing. At some point a happy accident should occur.
 
pblur said:
@maximillian Random OTy thing. My D&D group just came up with an animal that I think the flock might have an interest in...

The Dire Battle Ram(Huge-sized sheep). Trained much like Elephants by the tribes of the foo race, these massive beasts provide many of the usual benefits of an Elephant of equal size. Where they differ is in Wool production. A Dire Battle Ram produces significant wool growth year round, allowing trained groomsman to sheer year-round wool, despite the frigid climates these Rams normally call home.

This unusual feature also provides a battle function, as the Wool of a Dire Battle Ram is thick enough to hide a number of medium sized riders comfortably of weight equal to its heavy load, that encumber the beast as normal. When so hidden, riders are seated comfortably and treated as having full cover. Riders can partially expose them selves, recieving the benefits of normal cover, but no associated penalties at-will. Because of the unusually warping nature of the wool, riders have get a +4 bonus to hide checks while recieving the benefit of cover, and a +8 while recieving the benefit of total cover, in addition to any other bonuses or penalties.

A Dire Battle Ram's primary attack is a headbutt, which ignores hardness, but the creature cannot attack targets that are shorter than half its size with this attack.
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Glorious!
 
pblur said:
Alright, history sheet is updated (see my sig for the link). We are up to 994 old-secondary actions to date. Guild Mercantile has fully compensated for losing the Stallions, so we're still running 54-56 old-secondaries per turn. The format of the sheet is drastically improved; much easier to use now.

On that note... we need to start getting more subordinates. From what I can tell, trading posts are the least controversial action-granting subordinate, so it's about time for a northern and khemetri (if we can) TP.

Colonies also seem to be pretty chill, so if we had anywhere to colonize... but we already control pretty much all of the Black sea aside from what Trelli controls.

We need one slot for an HK vassal. Frankly, they're too small to be relevant any more, and we're too early for them to start acting like a small neighbor. They're still trying to be big-man-on-the-block, and that's really problematic given their position.

On the plus side, we know the land they took from Hathatyn back in the day was rich in tin. Maybe we'll get Leading in Tin?

I want another march to the north, but I don't expect enough support for that... I see the Stallions as a great success, and well worth the handful of issues they caused. (Many of those issues, IMO, were simply because they were our first subordinate state and we didn't know how to handle them.) On top of that, nomads are about to hit hard mode, and the QUEST just switched to hard mode. More non-king actions devoted to defense could be very handy.
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I really do not want any more steppe lands to defend.
OTOH, I think we ought to create another merc company and permanently put it somewhere in the north, to act as a fast response force against nomad incursions.
 
Azel said:
We should colonise the river mouth first or the Trelli might decide to box us in and demand tolls.
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We might respect Trelli ownership of their strait but if they try something like that our rather large fleet is going to tell them to sod off.
 
[X] [King] Hertythn (Heroic Admin, Average Diplo, Poor Martial; takes control while alive (1, possibly 2 turns))
[X] [WB] Upgrade Cosmopolitan Acceptance
[X] [Inv] Highland Kingdom
[X] [Inv] Trelli
[X] [Inv] Swamp Folk
[X] [Inv] Metal Workers
[X] [Inv] Storm Wolves
 
[X] [WB] Upgrade Cosmopolitan Acceptance
[X] [Inv] Highland Kingdom
[X] [Inv] Trelli
[X] [Inv] Thunder Horse
[X] [Inv] Swamp Folk
[X] [Inv] Metal Workers
[X] [Inv] Storm Wolves
[X] No
[X] [King] Hertythn (Heroic Admin, Average Diplo, Poor Martial; takes control while alive (1, possibly 2 turns))
 
Reader of all said:
If we are talking about periphery state when are we going to build the far northern trade post?
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I'd be willing to do it next time it came up midturn as an option, maybe. But right now, I'm not particularly interested in expanding our territory when we could instead be building up what we have - starting a golden age, extending our road network, taking some forest actions, etc.

EDIT: I previously made a list of things I'd like to do with our time, and I stand by it:
PrimalShadow said:
Hmm. On the subject of forests. I'm putting together a "wish list" for things I'd like to do on our turn once we have free actions. This does NOT include major short-term projects like warfare/megaprojects.

  1. Found Mercenary Company / Support Subordinate (until out of Red Martial)
  2. Expand Trails (until Yellow Centralization)
  3. New Settlement in southwest hills (1 Secondary once we start getting low on EE)
  4. Festivals (1 Secondary/turn until 2 stability)
  5. Plant Poppies (1 Secondary total if we haven't done the action yet, to ease into it)
  6. Expand Forests (Double Main if possible, 2-3 Mains total for now)
  7. Triple-Main a Guild Action with provinces on Trade Policy (once, just to see what it is like...)
So, this is what I'd really like to have if given free reign. Here is my reasoning:
  1. Red Martial has a constant potential for trouble; better not leave it to fester.
  2. More Trails increases our Centralization cap, which effectively means our lands are being administrated more efficiently. I also expect decent narrative bonuses from increasing road coverage. Finally, a high Cent gives us the room to integrate Provinces or take Wildcat actions freely.
  3. We get a decent amount of EE from expanding if we need EE, and this would finish up a Province, giving us +1 to all stat caps and additional passive income per turn. It also puts us one integration away from 9 provinces, which is a threshold for TWO extra secondaries (one from Provinces/2, one from getting a new Guild secondary).
  4. Festivals are a cheap and effective way to keep Stability high; we should be doing them whenever time allows and we are below 2 stability (which is the cap for Festivals).
  5. Just want to do this once so that our Shamans have a chance to vet the action.
  6. FORESTS!
  7. I just think it would be super-cool. And may very well upgrade Symphony or something...
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A Northern Trading Post would be useful, but it also exposes us to danger and increases our borders; I'd rather focus on useful things that we can do from the safety of our core territories.
 
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PrimalShadow said:
I'd be willing to do it next time it came up midturn as an option, maybe. Right now, I'm not particularly interested in expanding our territory when we could instead be building up what we have - starting a golden age, extending our road network, taking some forest actions, etc.
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Making more action-taking subordinates is good to do first, because they can help put out fires and build up in the mean time. Our road network is the best its been in centuries, partially because we've been absorbing subordinates who spent their actions on roads (so we don't have to.) Same for forests.

I'm not arguing against doing those with main actions of course (and I want to do more roads soon.) But if we create a couple subordinates first, they can build roads, diplomance, plant forest, whatever while we're building roads.
 
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[X] [WB] Gain a free random value slot
[X] [Inv] Highland Kingdom
[X] [Inv] Trelli
[X] [Inv] Thunder Horse
[X] [Inv] Swamp Folk
[X] [Inv] Metal Workers
[X] [Inv] Storm Wolves
[X] No
[X] [King] Kinda mediocre (Mediocre Admin, Diplo, and Martial)

Maybe we should start getting mediocre female kings, which would break down the bias against female kings according to AN.
 
[X] [WB] Upgrade Cosmopolitan Acceptance
[X] [Inv] Highland Kingdom
[X] [Inv] Trelli
[X] [Inv] Thunder Horse
[X] [Inv] Swamp Folk
[X] [Inv] Metal Workers
[X] [Inv] Storm Wolves
[X] No
[X] [King] Hertythn (Heroic Admin, Average Diplo, Poor Martial; takes control while alive (1, possibly 2 turns))
 
Current Tally:
Adhoc vote count started by gutza1 on Aug 2, 2017 at 8:03 AM, finished with 93846 posts and 96 votes.
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