Paths of Civilization
- Thread starter Academia Nut
- Start date
- Original
I see.
Annoying that it isn't in mentioned in the king's monologue prior to the vote-options.
Hmm...
Actually, we are at yellow martial. We need to bleed it anyway, taking out barbarians at the gates would be a defensive war so extra stab. once we win - and we will unless there is some ludicrous tribal coalition in the area full of murderhoboes. More boats + better wood should mean we could get enough boatage to secure the trading post too.
Basically: we can tank barbarians, that is my opinion on the matter.
- Location
- his hidden lair
What's interesting is this will help lead to the minors forming their own 'distinct' culture now that they're genuinely free of tribute and internecine warfare. The building of fortifications potentially spells a permanent divergence from their historical fate of being traded back and forth and exploited. Combine that with our religion pervading them, our cultural aspects being accepted by them (ex: half-exiles), their general gratitude for ending their oppression and massively improving their quality of life... I think we're actually going to be seeing more gradual convergence here than divergence- and it's definitely something we can spin our way.
- Location
- Canada
[X] [Exp] Found Trelli Trade Post, West
[X] [Diplo] Need a bigger boat (Main More Boats)
[X] [Int] Party! (Main Improve Festival)
[X] [Diplo] Need a bigger boat (Main More Boats)
[X] [Int] Party! (Main Improve Festival)
Finite Magician
Working within limits
- Location
- World's End
But the bronze they already have do not vanish all of the sudden does it? I'm saying that if they do choose to play (naval) hardball with us, we could likely receive considerable backlash (think repercussions from cut off sea routes and difficulty in supporting Greenshore). All of which could be avoided if we could match them on naval terms or didn't draw aggro from them. There are certainly pros to your approach but I personally do not like the risks involved.
BungieONI
Seven gremlins in a trench coat
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- Lickwidget
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I don't quite agree that they are going for general convergence, yet. And that's a pretty big yet. I am however, confident that if we sent a Secondary Influence their way or a main that it'd flip them over to that track. Like, it's that close in my mind to being a thing.
All told though I completely agree that the idea is possible and feasible to encourage and a great thing to foster.
Aside from that general convergence point though I agree with everything else.
BungieONI
Seven gremlins in a trench coat
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- Lickwidget
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Hey *poke* you have the North West TP in the wrong spot. It's not a North West TP it's a West TP. It's below Greenshore.
What is the timing for provinces w.r.t. city tax and baby boom?
Can they immediately use the baby-boom income?
If not, do they at least assume it offsets the city tax?
Or worst of all, do they assume they need to leave us at least 1 +2 (from tax) = 3 Econ each turn, disregarding the baby boom completely?
Can they immediately use the baby-boom income?
If not, do they at least assume it offsets the city tax?
Or worst of all, do they assume they need to leave us at least 1 +2 (from tax) = 3 Econ each turn, disregarding the baby boom completely?
- Location
- Huezil
I'm confused now, and i'm serious XD
EDIT: Possible Bypass Canal of TP-EAST?
@Academia Nut could we build a Bypass Canal using the Possible TP-East river as a Starting point?
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See that river a little to the west of Trelli? That is the west trading post.
North-West of Trelli it should be, but the current map has it simply be North of them. North-west, west from Trelli, under Greenshore river?
BungieONI
Seven gremlins in a trench coat
- Location
- Lickwidget
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- She/Her
They aim to maintain the baby boom as best they can, but I think it is by admin roll for the city so they assume that happens first.
Yeah that North West TP is north and north only of Trelli.
See? This is the correct place.
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Uh. What?
Could you just specify which of the three choices I laid out you think takes place?
- Location
- Huezil
Them its West North-West, not North-West, but okay, will update my stupid map...
- Location
- Australia
Expansion
[X] [Exp] Found Trelli Trade Post, West
External Diplomacy
[X] [Diplo] Tie everything further together (Main New Trails)
Internal Focus
[X] [Int] Build palace (Extra megaproject action)
I really want to focus on getting our internal affairs in order. Trails to get everyone connected and prepared for both military movements and political - soon everyone's going to be doing a lot of traveling to the palace. I sort of prefer to get the waterwheels out over building the Palace, but I would much rather have a 100% chance of getting the palace done faster. And I can always hold out hope that if we put extra work into it, someone might shove some gardens in with their spare time in the extra space
Edit:a few spelling issues
[X] [Exp] Found Trelli Trade Post, West
External Diplomacy
[X] [Diplo] Tie everything further together (Main New Trails)
Internal Focus
[X] [Int] Build palace (Extra megaproject action)
I really want to focus on getting our internal affairs in order. Trails to get everyone connected and prepared for both military movements and political - soon everyone's going to be doing a lot of traveling to the palace. I sort of prefer to get the waterwheels out over building the Palace, but I would much rather have a 100% chance of getting the palace done faster. And I can always hold out hope that if we put extra work into it, someone might shove some gardens in with their spare time in the extra space
Edit:a few spelling issues
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BungieONI
Seven gremlins in a trench coat
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- Lickwidget
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None.
City is by admin roll when it happens in the turn, but I am pretty sure they can use baby boom if I recall correctly. But they do not assume it offsets the true city or vice versa so they take actions to maintain Expansion space for the baby boom. And finally they save to 2 Econ if I recall correctly not 1 or 3.
Part of the issue is that these are semi separate interactions and your possibilities don't mesh well with my understanding of the system.
But honestly I am barely remembering this shit...
Someone Halp and correct me on this! Plz!
Uh.
And while I can definitely see the use of everything for, it puts us at 6 econ. That is... a problem. Weren't we going to try to finish the palace next turn? Provinces aren't going to spend us down past 1, so that is only 5 econ free. And if they try to keep a buffer of 2 for the city tax, it is only three econ free. That would not only make it impossible to finish next turn, but possibly screw us out of multiple free actions (law bonus, symphony bonus).
@veekie - thoughts?
So, this vote is willing right now.
And while I can definitely see the use of everything for, it puts us at 6 econ. That is... a problem. Weren't we going to try to finish the palace next turn? Provinces aren't going to spend us down past 1, so that is only 5 econ free. And if they try to keep a buffer of 2 for the city tax, it is only three econ free. That would not only make it impossible to finish next turn, but possibly screw us out of multiple free actions (law bonus, symphony bonus).
@veekie - thoughts?
- Location
- nz
[X] [Exp] Found Trelli Trade Post, West
[X] [Diplo] Need a bigger boat (Main More Boats)
[X] [Int] Party! (Main Improve Festival)
[X] [Diplo] Need a bigger boat (Main More Boats)
[X] [Int] Party! (Main Improve Festival)
VoidZero
Passing Flan 布丁魔王
- Location
- Anywhere but RL
Well i guess i will put up my view on land focus nation vs sea focus nation in order to sway people to vote for making our nation more united.
Land focus nation (The People and past China, not PRC)
33% from Not!Egypt
33% from Trelli and other trading partner
33% from The People
Trelli is a middle man, they can't absorb that amount of goods. So they buy low from one side and sell high to the other, using the difference to secure more goods and own industry.
Missing 33% of goods from our side (due to hostility) will clog up the exchange because they can't make up the difference.
So, from the above i draw the conclusion that cutoff of trade between us and Trelli will hurt both sides and cause big budget hole on Trelli.
Land focus nation (The People and past China, not PRC)
- Huge amount of land and population potential
- Headache on managing vast land
- Humongous production capability from massive amount of material source and area for setting up production.
- Able to absorb the trade goods if unsold, even at a "lose" (it lost wealth making margin)
- Able to stockpile goods due to spaceeeee!
- Massive population for warrior training
- Modest land and population potential
- No headache in managing land
- Some headache on tracking budgets and merchants
- Modest production capacity, limited by production space and reliance on imported materials.
- Inability to support industry without trade due to small population base.
- Lesser stockpile room and increased pressure to exchange goods fast.
- Heavily reliant on foreign warriors due to own population being much more productive and lacking in number.
33% from Not!Egypt
33% from Trelli and other trading partner
33% from The People
Trelli is a middle man, they can't absorb that amount of goods. So they buy low from one side and sell high to the other, using the difference to secure more goods and own industry.
Missing 33% of goods from our side (due to hostility) will clog up the exchange because they can't make up the difference.
So, from the above i draw the conclusion that cutoff of trade between us and Trelli will hurt both sides and cause big budget hole on Trelli.
BungieONI
Seven gremlins in a trench coat
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- Lickwidget
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I do know this much, they won't spend down to 1, and I am pretty darn sure they won't spend down to 2. What they are really trying to avoid is less than 0. Besides, they can only use three econ at a time on the mega, while we add the other two and get symphony.
So, my furry horror, how do we cheat and become both a sea and land nation?
An ancillary point, but I got to ask first before I address the meat.
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First and foremost, we probably aren't going to want to do a double main palace next turn.
If the Trelli declare war on us, we'll either do a war mission or found another mercenary company. If they do not declare war on us, we'll probably grab the cataracts (highland kingdom is going to be explosively growing) and a stability boosting option (golden age).
So we'll only have room for three to four grand palace actions regardless of our resources.
I'll leave the resource math to someone else.
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