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Paths of Civilization

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=_= This is one of those moment where it went unexpectedly strange isn't it?

 
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[X] [Refugee] Bring in a bit more than usual (-1 Stab, potential further loss, +4-5 Econ)

[X][High] Extra tribute (+2 Prestige, +2 Wealth, probably completes this turn)

[X][RB] Deploy against Highlanders from Hatvalley

[X][React] Main Improve Annual Festival

[X][City] Yes (Transfers 2 Econ + 2 Econ expansion, nulls cost of maintenance for Sacred Forest)
 
[X] [City] Yes (Transfers 2 Econ + 2 Econ expansion, nulls cost of maintenance for Sacred Forest)
[X][Refugee] Bring in a bit more than usual (-1 Stab, potential further loss, +4-5 Econ)
 
I'd switch to yes if necessary to prevent a tie. I'm not hugely invested in either choice.
 
Hmmm that's strange.

NetTally and SV Tally really do not agree.
 
Vote Tally : Original - Paths of Civilization | Page 2770 | Sufficient Velocity
##### NetTally 1.9.1
City:
[1] Yes

Total No. of Voters: 1

[1] Increase debates to determine the truth (-2 to +2 Religious Authority based on success of debates, potential shift in Spiritual Values)
——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: RA
[72][RA] Increase debates to determine the truth (-2 to +2 Religious Authority based on success of debates, potential shift in Spiritual Values)
[4][RA] Stamp down on all of this (-2 Stability, +2 Religious Authority)
——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: Low
[77][Low] Introduce black soil to improve their conditions (Teaches black soil to vassal)
[71][Low] Force them to follow the spirit of the law (Potential stability loss, potential war with vassal)
[69][Low] Introduce mill technology to improve their conditions (Teaches water mill to vassal)
[39][Low] Send over assistance (Transfer 1 Econ + 1 Martial)
[20][Low] Crack down on their priests (-1 Stability, potential war with vassal, potential +1 Religious authority)
[13][Low] Restrict right to wage war to defensive only (Potential stability loss, potential war with vassal)
[6][Low] Permit their use of iron tools (Allows iron tools to be traded to vassal)
——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: High
[48][High] Extra tribute (+2 Prestige, +2 Wealth, probably completes this turn)
[16][High] Demand territory (+3 Prestige, +3 Wealth, +2 Econ, +4 Econ expansion, -1 Centralization, requires further military commitment, likely requires more actions)
[13][High] Humiliate (+1 Prestige, completes immediately)
[3][High] Subjugate (+5 Prestige, +5 Wealth, gain new vassal, unlikely to complete this turn)
——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: RB
[27][RB] Deploy against Highlanders from Hatvalley
[18][RB] Deploy against Highlanders from Valleyhome
[14][RB] Deploy to assist vassal against the Swamp Folk
[9][RB] Remain at rest
[5][RB] Deploy north to guard against nomads
——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: React
[68][React] Main Improve Annual Festival
[6][React] Main Expand Econ
[3][React] Main Build Mills
[1][React] Main Expand Forests
[1][React] Main Survey
——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: City
[44][City] Yes (Transfers 2 Econ + 2 Econ expansion, nulls cost of maintenance for Sacred Forest)
[43][City] No
[1][City] Yes
——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: Refugee
[39][Refugee] Just those who come of their own initiative (Potential stab loss, +2 Econ)
[34][Refugee] Bring in a bit more than usual (-1 Stab, potential further loss, +4-5 Econ)
[2][Refugee] Let everyone know that your environment is stable (-3 Stab, potential further loss, +9-11 Econ, ???)
[1][Refugee] Bring in absolutely everyone you can (-4 Stab, potential further loss, +11-14 Econ, overcrowding, ???)
Total No. of Voters: 97
Adhoc vote count started by BungieONI on Jul 7, 2017 at 9:38 PM, finished with 70076 posts and 97 votes.
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Adhoc vote count started by BungieONI on Jul 7, 2017 at 9:39 PM, finished with 70076 posts and 97 votes.
Click to expand...
 
Ahah!
I figured it out. We have to actually set the tally option to "Newest votes only", how we have been assuming it is run, in order to have the tallies agree.
 
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Basic decision:
-Yes
--Loss of Long Term Econ
--Increased religious authority, both good and bad
--Political divergence of priesthood
--Relieved immediate administration stress
--Worsened tax situation once that rolls around in 4-6 turns

-No
--Continued temporary econ loss
--Maintain current Centralization situation(which, again, is explicitly still high, we don't need to do this until the cap hits 3, and we'd get a decision point to make the switch at that time too)
--Maintain social-political status quo

Starting up a free city in a time of troubles would only compound the troubles. The Vatican is not a good model here if you want the priesthood maintaining political stability rather than playing silly buggers for their political power.
 
[X][Refugee] Bring in a bit more than usual (-1 Stab, potential further loss, +4-5 Econ]
[X][City] Yes (Transfers 2 Econ + 2 Econ expansion, nulls cost of maintenance for Sacred Forest)
[X][Low] Introduce black soil to improve their conditions (Teaches black soil to vassal)
[X][Low] Force them to follow the spirit of the law (Potential stability loss, potential war with vassal)
[X][Low] Introduce mill technology to improve their conditions (Teaches water mill to vassal)
[X][Low] Send over assistance (Transfer 1 Econ + 1 Martial)
LLLLET'S GET READY TO ADMINISTRAAAAAATTTEEEE
 
Basic decision:
-Yes
--Increased religious authority, both good and bad
--Political divergence of priesthood
--Relieved administration stress

-No
--Lose 1 Econ/turn
--Maintain current Centralization situation
--Maintain social-political status quo
 
Basic decision:
-Yes
--No Econ/Slot turnover. Immediate cost of 2 in both.
--Political divergence and empowerment of priesthood
--Relieved administration stress.

-No
--Lose/Gain 1 Econ/Slot per turn.
--Maintain current religio-political status quo.
--Maintain city-imposed Centralization cap.
 
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*Looks at Tally*

>.>

<.<

Frag.

[X][RA] Increase debates to determine the truth (-2 to +2 Religious Authority based on success of debates, potential shift in Spiritual Values)
[X][Low] Introduce black soil to improve their conditions (Teaches black soil to vassal)
[X][Low] Force them to follow the spirit of the law (Potential stability loss, potential war with vassal)
[X][Low] Introduce mill technology to improve their conditions (Teaches water mill to vassal)
[X][High] Extra tribute (+2 Prestige, +2 Wealth, probably completes this turn)
[X][RB] Deploy against Highlanders from Hatvalley
[X][React] Main Improve Annual Festival
[X][City] No
[X][Refugee] Bring in a bit more than usual (-1 Stab, potential further loss, +4-5 Econ)


People might want to remember the rest of their votes since a few like the Refugee vote are getting close.
Adhoc vote count started by BungieONI on Jul 7, 2017 at 10:00 PM, finished with 70086 posts and 97 votes.
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[X] [Low] Force them to follow the spirit of the law (Potential stability loss, potential war with vassal)
[X] [Low] Restrict right to wage war to defensive only (Potential stability loss, potential war with vassal)
[X] [Low] Introduce black soil to improve their conditions (Teaches black soil to vassal)
[X] [Low] Introduce mill technology to improve their conditions (Teaches water mill to vassal)
[X] [Low] Send over assistance (Transfer 1 Econ + 1 Martial)
[X] [High] Humiliate (+1 Prestige, completes immediately)
[X] [RB] Remain at rest
[X] [React] Main Improve Annual Festival
[X][City] No
[X] [Refugee] Bring in a bit more than usual (-1 Stab, potential further loss, +4-5 Econ)
 
Academia Nut said:
Can't address the questions asked, but one thing I noted:

Making a True City a Free City does not remove its refund capacity. It just stops churning through Econ and Econ Expansion each turn and stops reducing your Centralization Cap, at the cost of occupying a subordinate slot.
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We do get to keep the refund capacity if Sacred Forest is made a Free City.

[X][City] Yes
 
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PrimalShadow said:
What?

No.


Here is AN addressing this EXACT point:
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drake_azathoth said:
We do get to keep the refund capacity if Sacred Forest is made a Free City.

[X][City] Yes
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Umi-san said:
If the LTE stems from the refunds they still occur.
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No because there is an upfront cost of four LTE.

Which is actually very bad. Good LTE is about 20(10 Econ 10 Slots, allowing us to eat refugee influxes or maintain the kind of Econ we need to spend on I dunno, megaprojects?). Okay LTE is about 16, where we have some leeway, but it can get tight at extremes.

We'd be entering a boom-bust cycle if we drop to 12 LTE. A turn of spending, then the mid turn recovering or vice versa.
 
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