Hard rain or heavy rain are both terms used to mean that there's a lot of raining going on all at once, with a lot of water in a small amount of time.
Paths of Civilization
- Thread starter Academia Nut
- Start date
- Original
pblur
Reminiscing over the halcyon days of Ymaryn
- Location
- Lawrence's Wagon
First of all, gravity dams are rarely built on soil (they're held in place by friction, and friction against dirt is highly variable.) Almost always you excavate the river bed somewhat to build it on rock. In our hilly area, that's probably fairly easy. So the 'soil' under the dam isn't a weakness.
The soil behind the dam is simply providing enough downforce so that the dam doesn't slide. It's not 'structural'; more counterweight. If it softens somewhat, that's OK. If it ERODES a lot, that's a problem. And I'll freely grant that a lot more rain would cause erosion. But... fixing erosion on a pile of dirt isn't a megaproject. It's piling more dirt on and covering it with loose shale or similar.
Finally, failure of gravity dams, if it occurs, is gradual. Not catastrophic. It's one of the reasons we still use the design some places. Hoover Dam is a hybrid gravity-arch design, for instance.
But, gradual or not, we're playing on 20 year turns. A mid turn action is 10 year. Given this downpour, a gradual failure may as well be instant save for a mid-turn intervention to rebuild the dam...vs fixing the forest.
I have some serious doubts about protecting both at the same time while eating random hits.
pblur
Reminiscing over the halcyon days of Ymaryn
- Location
- Lawrence's Wagon
Huh. If he'd said how the rain was heavy, or how it was hard, I'd have gone there. But "the rain is hitting so hard" to me meant literal impact.
- Location
- Simi Valley, CA, United States
...why are people arguing about rain? And how does it relate to PoC?
pbluekan
Somethin's Fucky ...
- Location
- Trumpistan
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Hence your excessive literalism.
"The hurricane hit south Florida hard." ill tell you that this doesn't mean the hurricane literally did anything like hitting hard.
- Location
- Illinois
I believe they are arguing whether creating the dam earlier than this would have been dangerous or not, as the increased rainfall is likely to have created situations that could have caused a catastrophic collapse.
Anyway, since it looks likely we'll have this argument on which policy to switch to during the mid-turn...
Expansion gives us more actions. Last action was in the form of the double-main, but that's still another action. It means that we'll lower our centralization, opening up the opportunity for trails and for Enforce Justice if we take any Stability damage.
Do you want to do more stuff per turn? Expansion is the best way to do that.
Expansion gives us more actions. Last action was in the form of the double-main, but that's still another action. It means that we'll lower our centralization, opening up the opportunity for trails and for Enforce Justice if we take any Stability damage.
Do you want to do more stuff per turn? Expansion is the best way to do that.
pblur
Reminiscing over the halcyon days of Ymaryn
- Location
- Lawrence's Wagon
That... really doesn't address all the points I made about failure being unlikely.
But yes, if it failed, we'd have a 50-50 shot on getting 'Oh crap, dam's gone, people evacuated, -1 Stability, -3 econ slots, but you can build it again as an extended project whenever you want' and 'Dam is slipping, spend 5 Econ and 2 Art to shore it up before it goes (probably with a couple levels of investment options for how SURE we were we wanted to save the dam.)'
IF it failed. And even then, it would NOT be a megaproject. We have WoG that after we build this dam, dams will be extended projects.
pbluekan
Somethin's Fucky ...
- Location
- Trumpistan
- Pronouns
- He/Him
They're talking about dams and how, given the current climate, we're liable to have a collapse if we even tried to build one.
- Location
- Illinois
Problem is that right now we don't know whether getting more territory could increase the action cost for the sacred forest renewal project. It's probably fine, and the chance at getting that badlands settlement is quite appealing, but still...
pblur
Reminiscing over the halcyon days of Ymaryn
- Location
- Lawrence's Wagon
Cost would have rendered the forest rescue impossible. We're barely making it as it is, fortunately for the Library + Temple combo. Only Econ is in some danger.
The cost is real and severe.
The good part is that after this climate settles out we'd MASSIVELY overengineer the dam when we get around to it. Not Even Once.
And then historians are like: "Ah, just old kingdom period stuff." Basically, the struggle of the Ymaryn in this time period would seem trivial as we get bigger and bigger.
@Academia Nut What's the lowland pop compared to us right now? What percentage of the pop did we absorb from HK and the Hath?
DocMatoi
Theoretical Lover of Girls
- Location
- within 2 hours of the White House
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Ah, the Ymaryn.
The available provinces are the badlands and redhills (E and NE). Neither of them have any forests worth speaking of at the present time. I don't see how this could possibly increase the size of the Sacred Forest project.
The biggest issue would be the sheer amount of added space popping a true city, but honestly that's not really a problem since the need for the city is primarily due to the lack of econ slots, and we'd regain the city as soon as those slots start dropping back down. Losing the city innovation rolls for a turn or two isn't a big deal when of comes with extra disaster resistance and raising all our caps.
I suppose the main advantage of balanced is that the lower caps means we'll hit a Golden Age almost immediately, but those things eat our stats like crazy so I'm not sure we want to do that.
pblur
Reminiscing over the halcyon days of Ymaryn
- Location
- Lawrence's Wagon
That's pretty much nonsense. So far we've been running the megaproject harder than necessary, and running it ENTIRELY off midturns and stat reserves.
Here's what we did each turn:
Turn 1
[X] [Main] Megaproject x2 (-4 Econ, -4 Mystic, -2 Art)
[X] [Sec] Policy – Restoration
Provinces – [Main] Improve Annual Festival, [Main] Enforce Justice, [Sec] Enforce Justice
Turn 2
[X] [Main] Megaproject
[X] [Main] Restore Order
Provinces – [Main] Proclaim Glory, [Main] Enforce Justice, [Sec] Enforce Justice
We produced no stats but stability (which we admittedly spent inefficiently for econ on the midturn) and burned ALL THE STATS to get 8 stability in 2 turns. AND we took 2 megaproject actions in one turn.
We could easily have handled a -5 econ by not being all Ymaryn 'weather don't bother me, let's do all the things'. It would have been tighter, but nowhere near a deal-breaker.
Edit: and we're still talking about a relatively unlikely event that would probably provide innovations in water construction...
Last edited:
- Location
- The People's Saltern
I don't have this quote specifically, but I've had other similar quotes under Distribute Land and Wildcat Prospecting.Ooh, good to know-- @Therealtahu given how often the narrative behind Wildcat Prospecting comes up, you should add this to your post
It sometimes feels like people don't bother to check all applicable categories for these things. That and all the people making references to old WoG without using the Mechanics post to source the original quote.
I could expand it and remove all the spoilers, but the post is already a ridiculous 16k words long.
Abby Normal
High Clerk of the Ymaryn
- Pronouns
- He/Him
The fact that they don't have forests is why i think they'll add actions; remember that our forests are half the reason the climate instability wasn't even worse, compared to if we had regular step farms. There's a reason our periphery states immediately planted or expanded like 8 secondaries worth of forest...the megaproject is not just "how can we make our forests survive the changes" it's "how can we adapt to the changes in all our land", with "spread forests that help hold everything together" being one of the biggest means of adapting:
That's actually a pretty good point. Hmm...
Oh well, I'm fine with just getting a golden age off the back of Balanced. Provinces would be better but you make a good argument.
@Academia Nut
Would it be possible to double-main "new province" to make two provinces or would that be more like building a province and a new settlement in that province? Or something else entirely?
DocMatoi
Theoretical Lover of Girls
- Location
- within 2 hours of the White House
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Revisiting rain mud and mosquitoes, and I think our accepting ways saved us some time on this megaproject:
Bets that without that, we'd have had a longer slog ahead of us, people?
Guile
Having a really great time right now
I'd rather take a turn to install a library in our true city and a temple in... wherever Veekie deduced we should put one to trend north without overextending, Redshore I think? Right after the megaproject is done.
It also puts us deeper and deeper into the steppes, which could turn into proper horse-lords any generation now and become an enormous dragon breathing down our necks.
