[X] Reinforce Northshore
[X] The king will deal with the problems as they come (No change)
[X] Actively encourage the abandonment of the Dead Priest leaders by their people (-2 Stability, -1 Diplomacy, +4-5 Econ, chance to collapse the Dead Priests)

Considering how much economy we have would love to start another Mega-Project soon like the Gardens or Great Dam. Love the fact we are a people in harmony with nature while at the same time being great builders.
 
I'm basically ok with this. THANK YOU FOR TALKING THIS OUT IN A REASONABLE FASHION!

*Doffs this hat*


Either Warriors or Province. I can see merits either way. Which one I pick will be determined by the situation.

*gentle newspaper whap* Easy there. :p

That way lies salt and bad things.
Well, he hasn't provided a convincing reason to expand other than "They're not looking! Quick, expand to the hills!" while there's several convincing reasons to do other things this turn, so....
 
Depending on how a collapse of the DP goes, a settelment in the badlands could give us a good shot at diplo annexing some of their remants or former tributiaries.
 
[X] Reinforce Northshore
[X] The king will deal with the problems as they come (No change)
[X] Actively encourage the abandonment of the Dead Priest leaders by their people (-2 Stability, -1 Diplomacy, +4-5 Econ, chance to collapse the Dead Priests)

Considering how much economy we have would love to start another Mega-Project soon like the Gardens or Great Dam. Love the fact we are a people in harmony with nature while at the same time being great builders.
Funnily enough the two are most definitely not mutually exclusive.

It's probably best to wait for Mega projects after the new province is settled and secure. I've seen some good arguments for the Dam recently so I'm leaning more that way, instead of the Garden like I was initially.

well given metal isn't in active use we should pursue it at least every other turn so the knowledge isnt lost.
More about the tone they used to try to push martial.

Well, he hasn't provided a convincing reason to expand other than "They're not looking! Quick, expand to the hills!" while there's several convincing reasons to do other things this turn, so....
It's a lead-in into getting more actions. Yep the number of free actions we get is Provinces/2 so this one won't give us an action. But we can start pushing towards the north, or south west along the coast and eventually create a second province giving us four actions. The Badlands will initially be a part of Valley home but if we grow that it will probably turn into it's own province to. Plus eventual overcrowding and a means to start securing this entire region for ourselves. Baby steps. Baby steps.

Edit:
Depending on how a collapse of the DP goes, a settelment in the badlands could give us a good shot at diplo annexing some of their remants or former tributiaries.
And this to.
 
. Yep the number of free actions we get is Provinces/2 so this one won't give us an action.
I'm still pretty certain that it's not "round up" since that just wouldn't make sense, but we lack the information to have a provable answer either way.

Well, he hasn't provided a convincing reason to expand other than "They're not looking! Quick, expand to the hills!" while there's several convincing reasons to do other things this turn, so....
What, "This helps us do literally everything" isn't enough? (since more actions = more things done). Getting more warriors helps us fight better- getting more actions per turn means that everything gets better, including our warriors. It's an investment. Grabbing the settlement itself is an approximately neutral action (1 econ 1 mysticism for 2 actions) but from then on out we'll have an extra half-action every turn. Which doesn't sound like much, but that means 4 turns out it'll have paid for its actions and been a free 2 stats' worth.

Unless we need the warriors immediately, it's more efficient to go for the exponential growth whenever it's available- that helps everything, including our warriors. (And I believe I showed reasonably well that we probably won't need them next turn)
 
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I'm still pretty certain that it's not "round up" since that just wouldn't make sense, but we lack the information to have a provable answer either way.


What, "This helps us do literally everything" isn't enough? (since more actions = more things done). Getting more warriors helps us fight better- getting more actions per turn means that everything gets better, including our warriors. It's an investment. Grabbing the settlement itself is an approximately neutral action (1 econ 1 mysticism for 2 actions) but from then on out we'll have an extra half-action every turn. Which doesn't sound like much, but that means 4 turns out it'll have paid for its actions and been a free 2 stats' worth.
Which we can delay a turn. I'm just saying we can wait on that, while we rather need the martial now due to nomad raids. We can even prep for expanding by getting trails, and getting metal done.

You still haven't provided a reason we need to expand THIS turn instead of next, other than everyone else is distracted.
 
You still haven't provided a reason we need to expand THIS turn instead of next,
Exponential growth. The nomads are dealt with for the turn- we literally just voted on doing that instead of sending a trade mission or figuring out what's up with the vikings. We can delay everything for as long as we want, but that puts us more and more behind.

We don't need to expand this turn. We don't ever need to expand until we're out of space. But that just means we fall behind those who do. Next turn we might not be able to expand there for some unknown reason, and I'd much rather have a +5% compounding every turn than have a single +25% increased martial ability unless we need that bonus now... which we don't.
 
And I'm convinced now is the time to slip in while the HK and TH are preoccupied dealing with the DP in it's death throws. You know how wonky the dice are, there's a good chance the DP will either miraculously recover or go down like a bitch. When that happens we can't actually be of what the hell is going to go down. The TH and HK will probably try and consolidate their respective gains with small raids going back and forth. That's when they'll be looking for a settlement like our Badlands to hit anyways.

I'm not suggesting unsupported expansion into the badlands is a good idea, but I think as things stand even a secondary can do a lot to make it viable. They aren't yet going to be looking in our direction, but I suspect they'll more than be willing to have a swing at us if we wait a whole twenty years to make our first move. We have the advantage of being something of a Dark Horse here- let's try and use it.

Worth taking into account that if we take this option:
[] Send additional resources to assist (-1 Centralization, allows Northshore to spend Econ on defensive measures while being attacked)

We can perform unsupported expansion into the Eastern Hills(and later Badlands, but Eastern Hills is a higher priority because it's more exposed and best taken advantage of while chaos and confusion are at a maximum, and Badlands doesn't strictly need walls because the geography is a nightmare to march an army through) while everyone is distracted, because the Eastern Hills province will be able to take their own actions to build walls without our doing so.

Currently, IF things go as predicted, I think a fair combination of actions may be
[Main] New Settlement - Eastern Hills
[Secondary] Grand Sacrifice
[Secondary] Grand Sacrifice x2/New Trails/Build Walls/War Mission- Nomads

With the conditionals of:
-Grand Sacrifice x2 - If the DPs don't change the situation. We use this to prepare for the buttload of refugees and/or finish them off next turn with a big refugee infusion.
-New Trails - If everything cools off while they lick their wounds, we restore our Centralization.
-Build Walls - If the DPs resurge, then we're going to want walls up first. The Eastern Hills are already sort of defensible terrain, and should be able to hold off the DPs if they attack unless BOTH the HK and the TH suddenly collapse.
-War Mission - If the Nomads don't back off even with the Northshore walls. They probably would. It's not profitable with our new bows based on walls.

Then our provinces will likely take:
Northshore - Build Walls(their priority)
Valleyhome - Study Stars/Stonepen - Expand Economy
Redcoast - Sailing Mission(their priority)

And the turn after that Eastern Hills will almost certainly use their first province action to build walls as long as we have the Economy for it(which we SHOULD have, I have difficulty imagining a combination of actions which manages to burn away 12 Economy in one go).

Remember, dry hills means poor farming. Likely not going to be that much room there.
I'd note that it doesn't have a penalty to production. Slots might be fewer, but while we have high Economy they can do Secondary Forest expansions instead.

A quip but skirmishers will not stop a determined force that is set on a settlement. Hypothetically speaking, if HK/TH ate DP's wonder wall then our wall will not stop them.
As has been established a while ago, you don't ever need to defeat their Megawall to defeat the Dead Priests. You just need to damage their economy enough that they tear themselves into multiple smaller polities from Stability hits.

- Remember that pregnant lady from a few turns ago? Noxivah? I think we're seeing her daughter here, which is kinda cool.
- Her skin is "duskier" then the native kid's. Is that normal? Are the lowlanders naturally darker skinned compared to our people?
Plains people will develop darker skin than forest people over time(mostly since darker skins deal better with constant sunlight without developing skin problems). Though our people likely span the gamut because something like half our population are within 3 generations of migrants at any one point.

- Apparently, we've got enough Blackbirds to check on people's fields now instead of relying on the chiefs to report everything. Or is Jumtyyn just spending a lot of time here so he can hang out with his crush?
He's checking out her fields if you know what I mean. Assessing the options for plowing and planting :p

- Am I the only one who's amused that Noxivah turned out to be an over-protective mum? She went from being terrified of Blackbirds and Carrion Eaters to chasing them away from her daughter
Remember, she crossed miles, pregnant, on foot, over horrendous terrain. To protect her unborn child, because if she remarried the new guy will kill the baby, send the child to the DPs as part ot the tithe or force her to abort.

She was afraid, but she never let it stop her.

Also, why does everyone want Expand Warriors over Build Chariots? Chariots guarantees an advancement and gives more martial for no extra cost.
The first problem is that we don't have enough dudes to do an offensive war without depleting our garrisons. The chariots give more martial, but not that much more raw manpower.

TH: Family groups with an inheritance process based around the axe. Likely shifting toward a raiding military nobility as they subdue and assimilate farmers. Upon entering the lowlands will fracture apart into family tribes who will each grab land and raid other places. Due to strong emphasis on blood ties, will likely remain affiliated in a loose way with a central tribe. Inheritance/Legitimacy likely to be based more on historic possession of axe and relation to general "TH Clan" rather than strict bloodline as intra- and extra-marriage occurs among familial groupings. Likely more prone to power shifts, but less affected by them.
Bolded is wrong. The axe has been sealed away for being cursed
Otherwise looks likely, though I'd caution that due to their cultural traits of "My word is my bond", they MIGHT maintain integrity through oaths of fealty and their proximity to Wendikos' lineage.

Interesting scenario if the governors decides they rather have their children inherit the seat instead of other people, we might get HRE like government started. The king declared himself Emperor keeping his province and turns governors into elector counts for life. Then what would we do?
It's always a risk, but we've already established a superstition against that, since the last guy who tried to force his son onto the position had the would be heir killed by bad luck.

So slightly unlikely unless we keep plunging into negative stability.

I can just see the nega-verse reactions:
"Hey was there a forest here the last time we visited?"
The Nomads might be saying that. We have a new growth forest over on Northshore which wasn't there three generations ago.
Planning more than 1 turn out is doomed to failure due to the sheer number of random events happening, but even excluding that: We've got enough warriors to defend from nomads and we need the centralization bonus when we the the new province. Why waste time settling our accounts now when they're interest-free and we can invest in permanent income immediately?

edit: Also, we want to survey those hills before planting forests all over them, and we don't really need to build walls ourselves now that our provinces can do it themselves (assuming this vote doesn't change)
Noting that while planning more than one turn out is doomed to failure, it doesn't mean that the planning is useless or wasted! Having a direction to push towards makes future actions more coordinated even if some delayed gratification may be involved.

Even if we have to abandon the plans, they have already provided useful long term direction. Compared with instant gratification "I must get my pet project right now, screw everything because I might not get it later".

We've for instance, deferred the lowlands and eastern hills settlements repeatedly, but that they have been planned for means we already have our requirements for grabbing them in mind.

That we have enough martial now to standoff any defensive war is pretty much the result of a long term plan, even if it was deferred repeatedly, and the actions taken out of sequence. It'd not have happened at all if we didn't plot for it instead of pressing the chariot button and wondering why our base defense still blows.
Basically we have this next turn as the HK and TH beat the ever unliving shit out of the DP to sort ourselves and prepare to poke out of our Hill. And then we can use the turn while the lowlands have the dust settle to pop in and take this province which is a bit north of them and the lowlands proper. It's even still minor-ly hilly so we have a defensive bonus of some degree.

Not just minorly, as far as I can tell it's more hilly than our home hills, just not yet covered in terraces and orchards to make it a nightmare.
 
I'm still pretty certain that it's not "round up" since that just wouldn't make sense, but we lack the information to have a provable answer either way.


What, "This helps us do literally everything" isn't enough? (since more actions = more things done). Getting more warriors helps us fight better- getting more actions per turn means that everything gets better, including our warriors. It's an investment. Grabbing the settlement itself is an approximately neutral action (1 econ 1 mysticism for 2 actions) but from then on out we'll have an extra half-action every turn. Which doesn't sound like much, but that means 4 turns out it'll have paid for its actions and been a free 2 stats' worth.

Unless we need the warriors immediately, it's more efficient to go for the exponential growth whenever it's available- that helps everything, including our warriors.
You raise point. *throws up hands* If it doesn't give and action then my reasoning stands. If it does great! :lol
I like investments.

Which we can delay a turn. I'm just saying we can wait on that, while we rather need the martial now due to nomad raids. We can even prep for expanding by getting trails, and getting metal done.

You still haven't provided a reason we need to expand THIS turn instead of next, other than everyone else is distracted.
Huuuuhhhghckh

Ok I could go either way on this. Marital or Province.

But laying it out? The nomad raids are probably going to be handled by the actions the leading vote does. We don't need to take Martial to deal with them. This is them probing and when they hit those actions they'll probably pause. They certainly can't really threaten our COre provinces. We'd eat them like Grues.

We need to take martial, as I see it, to make innovations and to prepare a potentially thorny welcome mat for anyone from the Lowlands who gets uppity. Plus the unknown southern raiders.
 
Exponential growth. The nomads are dealt with for the turn- we literally just voted on doing that instead of sending a trade mission or figuring out what's up with the vikings. We can delay everything for as long as we want, but that puts us more and more behind.

We don't need to expand this turn. We don't ever need to expand until we're out of space. But that just means we fall behind those who do. Next turn we might not be able to expand there for some unknown reason, and I'd much rather have a +5% compounding every turn than have a single +25% increased martial ability unless we need that bonus now... which we don't.
Still no reason we can't do it next turn. Seriously, I'd vote the shit out of going hills next turn, we need to boost martial this turn.
 
Funnily enough the two are most definitely not mutually exclusive.
I'm aware and it's kinda sad most people in the world can't see a balance is possible.
It's probably best to wait for Mega projects after the new province is settled and secure. I've seen some good arguments for the Dam recently so I'm leaning more that way, instead of the Garden like I was initially.
Would like Dam as well since we had idea for awhile and should fit well with the huge canal we have. Not to mention always useful to have more failsafes to deal with extreme weather changes.
 
Worth taking into account that if we take this option:
[] Send additional resources to assist (-1 Centralization, allows Northshore to spend Econ on defensive measures while being attacked)

We can perform unsupported expansion into the Eastern Hills(and later Badlands, but Eastern Hills is a higher priority because it's more exposed and best taken advantage of while chaos and confusion are at a maximum, and Badlands doesn't strictly need walls because the geography is a nightmare to march an army through) while everyone is distracted, because the Eastern Hills province will be able to take their own actions to build walls without our doing so.

Currently, IF things go as predicted, I think a fair combination of actions may be
[Main] New Settlement - Eastern Hills
[Secondary] Grand Sacrifice
[Secondary] Grand Sacrifice x2/New Trails/Build Walls/War Mission- Nomads

With the conditionals of:
-Grand Sacrifice x2 - If the DPs don't change the situation. We use this to prepare for the buttload of refugees and/or finish them off next turn with a big refugee infusion.
-New Trails - If everything cools off while they lick their wounds, we restore our Centralization.
-Build Walls - If the DPs resurge, then we're going to want walls up first. The Eastern Hills are already sort of defensible terrain, and should be able to hold off the DPs if they attack unless BOTH the HK and the TH suddenly collapse.
-War Mission - If the Nomads don't back off even with the Northshore walls. They probably would. It's not profitable with our new bows based on walls.

Then our provinces will likely take:
Northshore - Build Walls(their priority)
Valleyhome - Study Stars/Stonepen - Expand Economy
Redcoast - Sailing Mission(their priority)

And the turn after that Eastern Hills will almost certainly use their first province action to build walls as long as we have the Economy for it(which we SHOULD have, I have difficulty imagining a combination of actions which manages to burn away 12 Economy in one go).


I'd note that it doesn't have a penalty to production. Slots might be fewer, but while we have high Economy they can do Secondary Forest expansions instead.


As has been established a while ago, you don't ever need to defeat their Megawall to defeat the Dead Priests. You just need to damage their economy enough that they tear themselves into multiple smaller polities from Stability hits.


Plains people will develop darker skin than forest people over time(mostly since darker skins deal better with constant sunlight without developing skin problems). Though our people likely span the gamut because something like half our population are within 3 generations of migrants at any one point.


He's checking out her fields if you know what I mean. Assessing the options for plowing and planting :p


Remember, she crossed miles, pregnant, on foot, over horrendous terrain. To protect her unborn child, because if she remarried the new guy will kill the baby, send the child to the DPs as part ot the tithe or force her to abort.

She was afraid, but she never let it stop her.


The first problem is that we don't have enough dudes to do an offensive war without depleting our garrisons. The chariots give more martial, but not that much more raw manpower.

Bolded is wrong. The axe has been sealed away for being cursed
Otherwise looks likely, though I'd caution that due to their cultural traits of "My word is my bond", they MIGHT maintain integrity through oaths of fealty and their proximity to Wendikos' lineage.


It's always a risk, but we've already established a superstition against that, since the last guy who tried to force his son onto the position had the would be heir killed by bad luck.

So slightly unlikely unless we keep plunging into negative stability.


The Nomads might be saying that. We have a new growth forest over on Northshore which wasn't there three generations ago.

Noting that while planning more than one turn out is doomed to failure, it doesn't mean that the planning is useless or wasted! Having a direction to push towards makes future actions more coordinated even if some delayed gratification may be involved.

Even if we have to abandon the plans, they have already provided useful long term direction. Compared with instant gratification "I must get my pet project right now, screw everything because I might not get it later".

We've for instance, deferred the lowlands and eastern hills settlements repeatedly, but that they have been planned for means we already have our requirements for grabbing them in mind.

That we have enough martial now to standoff any defensive war is pretty much the result of a long term plan, even if it was deferred repeatedly, and the actions taken out of sequence. It'd not have happened at all if we didn't plot for it instead of pressing the chariot button and wondering why our base defense still blows.


Not just minorly, as far as I can tell it's more hilly than our home hills, just not yet covered in terraces and orchards to make it a nightmare.
Goddamn @veekie I could kiss you. Your actually using Grand Sacrifice for one! Yay!

Plus that analysis in the first half is basically what my tired brain wanted to say.

Either way I think next turn I will be happy because the vote is gonna be

[Main] Expand Warriors
[Secondary] Festival/Grand Sacrifice
[Secondary] Study Metal

or

[Main] New Settlement Eatern Hills
[Secondary] Festival/Grand Sacrifice
[Secondary] ???

Which I am completely okay with either.
 
we need to boost martial this turn.
Why? I have yet to see a single argument as to why we need the martial this turn aside from nomads- nomads which are being dealt with via walls+the reinforcements we're sending.

And yes, no reason we can't expand next turn. No reason we need to do it that turn either, or the turn after. It's just that every turn we wait we lose another half action- small, but cumulative. There will always be something that needs to get done, so our best investment is in things which let us get more things done.
 
well given metal isn't in active use we should pursue it at least every other turn so the knowledge isnt lost.
Metal is in active use though?

We're importing and working copper for our tools. We already know how to smelt copper ore, and do so for research purposes. We just hadn't release it to mass usage because we hadn't finished studying it yet.

Based on the Scourge Warding project, memories last 3 turns as well. So Metal is nice but not crucial.

One objective of mine is Main New Settlement + Main Grand Sacrifice in that it'd pull us out of the Stability recovery loop so we DEFINITELY can afford a Secondary or Main action the turn after to put towards Metal and Military no matter what the DPs and vikings get up to.
 
Why? I have yet to see a single argument as to why we need the martial this turn aside from nomads- nomads which are being dealt with via walls+the reinforcements we're sending.

And yes, no reason we can't expand next turn. No reason we need to do it that turn either, or the turn after. It's just that every turn we wait we lose another half action- small, but cumulative. There will always be something that needs to get done, so our best investment is in things which let us get more things done.
Blegh.

I think you two lovebirds(snerk-gigglesnort) are talking past each other at this point. :p

Want to let it go?
 
You have no idea how much I want to turn the lowlands into a Desert...so for that we need to take the eastern hills and former ST territory...

As for the north....one day the Forest will consume all.
 
You have no idea how much I want to turn the lowlands into a Desert...so for that we need to take the eastern hills and former ST territory...

As for the north....one day the Forest will consume all.
Former ST's are now the Thunder Horse. We'd have to conquer them to do the desert thing that will shatter our civ due to our level 4 trait that punishes ruining land.

Seriously, would people with a boner for desertifying the lowlands just because please go read a different quest?
 
Former ST's are now the Thunder Horse. We'd have to conquer them to do the desert thing that will shatter our civ due to our level 4 trait that punishes ruining land.

Seriously, would people with a boner for desertifying the lowlands just because please go read a different quest?
Think they meant forest. :drevil:

You have no idea how much I want to turn the lowlands into a Desert...so for that we need to take the eastern hills and former ST territory...

As for the north....one day the Forest will consume all.

The Forest will Grow.

Till the World turns into Dust and the Land of Plenty returns to us.
 
Well, the more people I can convince of my side before the update hits, the more chances it has of winning, even if I'm not there to argue for it when the update drops. At this point I agree we're not really talking to each other, we're talking to all the voters reading the argument instead.

And with how long we've been action-limited in this quest, it's amazing to be able to do more things. The change in civ type gave us 50% more actions per turn, and we're slowly growing that number. We've got a nice source of continuous mysticism and automatic economy and study actions happening, and the more of those the better.

Former ST's are now the Thunder Horse. We'd have to conquer them to do the desert thing that will shatter our civ due to our level 4 trait that punishes ruining land.
Agreed 100%, destroying the lowlands is impossible. We could do a temporary destabilization via the dam to make the river more steady instead of flooding, but that just helps whoever is there in the end since steady rivers are easier to work with (even if they don't automatically fertilize the ground)
 
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Well, the more people I can convince of my side before the update hits, the more chances it has of winning, even if I'm not there to argue for it when the update drops. At this point I agree we're not really talking to each other, we're talking to all the voters reading the argument instead.

And with how long we've been action-limited in this quest, it's amazing to be bale to do more things. The change in civ type gave us 50% more actions per turn, and we're slowly growing that number. We've got a nice source of continuous mysticism and automatic economy and study actions happening, and the more of those the better.


Agreed 100%, destroying the lowlands is impossible. We could do a temporary destabilization via the dam to make the river more steady instead of flooding, but that just helps whoever is there in the end since steady rivers are easier to work with (even if they don't automatically fertilize the ground)
It'd freak them the fuck out at first. And...

Ahhhh the smell of Negaverse SV salt. It's like the sweetest sugar.

Yum.
Adhoc vote count started by BungieONI on Apr 20, 2017 at 5:50 AM, finished with 19939 posts and 53 votes.
 
[X] Actively encourage the abandonment of the Dead Priest leaders by their people (-2 Stability, -1 Diplomacy, +4-5 Econ, chance to collapse the Dead Priests)
Probably just throwing my vote into the void at this point in tome, but this is what I want us to do.
 
[X] Reinforce Northshore
[X] The king will deal with the problems as they come (No change)
[X] The People always welcome the needy (-1 Stability, +2 Econ)

I don't want to invite everyone in because that will bring instability and trigger another round of unnecessary drama. We should be completing the Metal Study before our people forget what we learned generations ago, and we can't do that if we keep screwing up our Stability. :mad:
 
And I have to vehemently disagree once more. Action economy is great here not because it's god- but because it gives us the free action to react and exploit opportunities better.

We can expand our military knowing our econ is stable, or be content we'll eventually get a calendar because Valleyhome likes to star gaze- but they don't necessarily actually resolve or address our present problems. Action economy exists to enable us, opportunity does not exist to enable the action economy.

EDIT:

As far as I'm concerned- there isn't a major immediate threat, but I think that means we have the opportunity to prevent a would be long term threat from popping up, and for short term risk have the chance to massively expand in the long run leaving us much stronger.
I'm going to have to agree in large part of how our action economy works. That said, people are overlooking one simple thing, which I'm going to get to at the end of this post.

Mutual defense, better quality of life, cultural assimilation (something we're damn good at), trade, and cultural inertia.

The better question to ask is- 'what part of being a province in our kingdom is so onerous military rebellion is preferable'. Persia ruled most the known world (at the time)* with a system not dissimilar to ours, and unless this region is much larger than I thought it was, ancient civilizations conquered and dominated the fertile crescent- which presumably is of similar size.

*Frankly, our provincial system seems better than the Satrapy system if only because each of our 'satraps' can potentially win the crown and is thus personally invested in supporting the state. Why rebel to seize the throne when it can be one through political acumen?
Yes, strong social mobility continues to be one of our most bs advantages.

I'm okay with festival. Grand Sacrifice would be nice because it saves our limited(?) Festivals for an emergency. The turn after we get warriors and metal I would like to reach out and settle in East Hills. Badlands would work to, but I think we need to do it as a Main and it returns as a secondary.
Settling for me means A Main Settlement and a secondary Wall/Forest. The other Secondary can be something else dependent on the situation.
Grand Sacrifice is more expensive than festivals. We should only really do it if we want to bring the wealthy down or want to main it for 2 stability.

I'm cool with a main Chariots instead of Warriors. Could go either way. I'd wait on input on possible advances before deciding.
Well-

FYI, chariot archers are elites, the skill to fire from an unstable moving platform is extremely rare.

Though currently the most powerful thing we can do for our military is to boost raw quantity of men and break through into volley fire. It doesn't give us retaliatory force yet, but we can decisively shatter any raiders with bows that completely outrange them.
As veekie has pointed out here, our greatest weakness is troop count, more than anything. Also a lack of troop organization.

-Thunder Horse will claim the northern and eastern stretch of the lowlands. They are poorly suited to making a push across rivers in force, as it is their greatest weakness. They will spread across the Eastern Hills Province given time if we don't take it first, it's not too different from the ST old pad they were living in.
Thunder Horse does not even begin to have the ability to actually hold that much land while remaining sedentary. Even if we did help them with their farming, they're new to the government problem. They're far more likely to fracture if they try that.

Metal is in active use though?

We're importing and working copper for our tools. We already know how to smelt copper ore, and do so for research purposes. We just hadn't release it to mass usage because we hadn't finished studying it yet.

Based on the Scourge Warding project, memories last 3 turns as well. So Metal is nice but not crucial.

One objective of mine is Main New Settlement + Main Grand Sacrifice in that it'd pull us out of the Stability recovery loop so we DEFINITELY can afford a Secondary or Main action the turn after to put towards Metal and Military no matter what the DPs and vikings get up to.
And now we get to the point I want to make. The important part of your statement is underlined, metal tools are not in wide spread use.

What would it mean to make metal tools in wide spread use? As an example, I asked AN awhile back, 'If we mained new trails, would we get 2 centralization for it?' The answer was along the lines of 'maybe if you had better tools.'

This addresses a very important part about action economy that I am seeing heavily ignored here. It doesn't just matter how many actions you have, but what you can do with those actions. With copper tools becoming wide spread we could safely say that our ability to perform construction actions would go up to somewhere between half a tier and a full tier.

Why does this matter? Because if we increase the effective strength of our action economy, that propagates to all actions. We will either gain more raw econ, or our effective econ numbers will be upgraded. Walls will become easier to build and may very well drop somewhere between a full tier and half a tier in difficulty (with the other half of a tier being filled in by experience). Many construction actions that are done are much more likely to gain advances. This holds not only true for us, but down to our provinces, at a time when they all now have econ to spend, pretty much ensuring that at least two of them will. Walls are certainly not outside of the realm of possibility, especially for Redshore. If Northshore doesn't gain walls over this miniturn, they're quite likely to want to build them as well.

There are many places that are likely to be vastly improved by copper tools, thus causing an effectively drastic increase in our action economy with them. As a result, I am highly in favor of Study Metal next turn, and putting off us doing any actual construction actions if at all possible, so they can more efficiently benefit from unlocked copper tools the following turn.
 
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