DoofQuest- a Disney Villains Victorious CK2-Style Quest
- Thread starter Made in Heaven
- Start date
- Crossover
[X] Take Xanatos' Promotion
- Location
- Germany
But some people are *fixating* on him being our Rival, which to them is synonymous with *enemy*.
So here we are, I guess - stuck fighting against almost everyone because of widespread Highlander mentality.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
No offense but I think that's the "we are a King" talk Gleeman talked about? People are taking too serious the becoming his pawn thing I think? As I mentioned before we can grow out of that with time. One thing is to let Xanatos know what we find out, another is literally doing whatever he command without us gaining anything about it, just following orders. If it reaches that point then yeah, we are gonna have to take extreme measures. But it hasn't reached that point, the thing is to let Xanatos help us, but NEVER become dependent on him.
I think Xanatos will just get his infiltration back up and we'll gain nothing from rejecting his offer.
- Pronouns
- She/Her
This amuses me because there's a similar line in the Xanatos negaquest.
I'm fine with Xanay as an ally. But I don't want him too close. He would do no less.
Given what Argi's said, I feel like we aren't. And, besides, I think taking this vote WOULD make us at the very least, less able to act against him if need be.
That'll still take a turn or two. And this time...We'll be ready. We can't do that if he's the one teaching us.
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- Location
- Germany
*Exactly*
Being someone´s junior-partner is NOT the same as being their subordinate, even though it still is kinda limiting admittedly.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] Take Xanatos' Promotion
- Pronouns
- She/Her
I think I just don't like the narrative, of how Xanatos is transparently maneuvering us into this position. I wouldn't mind if it was purely the laid out deal, we practice intrigue with Xanatos and so he gains access to our secrets. But this is more than that, this is Xanatos maneuvering us into that position.
- Location
- USA
Pretty much.
It's pretty much common sense but some people just want to make a statement.
A permanent potential +7 intrigue is huge but not at the cost of Xanatos helping us out and having the same infiltration he currently has. Apparently.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Exactly!!! Saying no doesn't cost him anything except a few Introgue actions, but that isn't a lot to him, we gain way more on the long run by accepting his offer.
Again, Keyword, IF, I take we are a corporations, we have rivals and everything, but we also need Allies, we have one with Winston I think, but Having THE Xanatos in our Corner is several times better than Winston or Sinatron, we can't be an Island, we need people who we can ask for help on some situations. Xanatos CAN become that Ally if we had our own Twelve Night or something like that, we just have to bite the bullet now. Even if people won't like it.
I repeat once more: Even if having Doof tell him a few things technically meets the definition of tier 3 infiltration, it simply wouldn't be sufficient to spill all our secrets. There wouldn't be the opportunity to trigger all the memories, nor the time for everything. Don't just look at the surface mechanical description.
Not exactly related to another king, but I get the idea.
By how I understand it, to you this situation is representative of a long term problem in the game, where both Doof and the players make bad or suboptimal decision based on pointless sentiment, rather than based on the actual effects of their actions. In the example, Doof can exert basically just as much influence without losing out on opportunities related to the government. Only the reluctance to give up an idea almost no one else shares, and that doesn't really affect the world stands in the way.
And like, I can relate. Been annoyed by something like that in the past.
But at least for me, there are good reasons not to accept that go beyond vague ideas such as 'not being a piece of his'.
Come on. The votes so far are almost equal, there's no reason to pose as a solitary warrior against emotional idiots.
The phrasing promotion is in the context of a chess game. A pawn gets promoted to a queen or other better piece. But it's still a piece he owns.
You don't need to care about the symbolism, of course. But it is what it is.
Please. Please please please don't use false dichotomies like that. The 'alternative' is a permanent potential +5.
And again, assuming ex ante that he'd get an effectively higher infiltration just cause he's Xanatos is not good.
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- Pronouns
- She/Her
I agree with this statement in general, but please don't misrepresent things. It's 2 more intrigue than if we did the personal the normal way, not 7. 2 is still big, of course, but there's no point in exaggeration.
That still seems to depend on the idea that we can rival Xanatos by letting him in.
See, your problem there is the assumption that he's helping. Xanay doesn't do no-strings-attached "help" to anyone except his immediate family. We're a resource. He cares about us the same way we care about a cow. Sure, it's a useful resource, and we may feed it well, but, in the end, it'll get slaughtered in the heartbeat if and when the time comes.
This doesn't make him an ally. He wants us to think that, but Xanay doesn't do that kinda thing. I don't think we can have him as more than an ally of convenience, it's just not how he works. I think we need to accept that instead of trying to "win over" someone who doesn't really do fair dealing.
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- Location
- USA
Okay...? I did say potential but alright.
I'll rephrase.
It's a minimum of +4 maximum of +7 instead of a minimum of +2 maximum of +5.
All for the cost of things staying how they have been the last several turns except now doof is completely aware of it.
We are telling him some private information, not swearing fealty to him. We can always stop later if we need to.
That's not how this works. We're giving Xanay an in, not just into our corporate operations but into how Doof THINKS. Maybe he would get it anyway, but I see no reason to leave the door unlocked.
We're also letting him tutor us in Intrigue, thus potentially crippling our ability to do Intrigue against him even more then now.
This too. Honestly, while Xanay doesn't really do friendship, I think, if we want him as an ally, showing him we can stand on our own is just as good if not better then accepting his overtures. I want him to respect us as a fellow player, not treat us like his pawn.
So what you're saying is that you are a XanaDoof shipper.
Well, who am I to judge.