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DoofQuest- a Disney Villains Victorious CK2-Style Quest

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Hmmm... decisions decisions.
A Small Boost in Intrigue is Nice, especially since we might get Wasabi'd and roll a 2 on it otherwise, but also Xanatos isn't trustworthy.

On the other hand I don't think we can ever hope to truly out intrigue Xanatos and he is... probably the most Trustworthy King who actually knows what is going on? Not like, actually Trustworthy mind you, but the least likely to just Stab us in the back since that isn't really how he operates. Getting Extra Intrigue would also be useful, right now Doof is the King with the lowest Intrigue and this will put him at a minimum of what believe Shego's level.

I say we take it, It'll help with further actions related to what is our second weakest stat right now, and that trying to get into an intrigue war with Xanatos is almost completely futile. If he really wanted to, I feel he could find another way to get to tier 3. At the very least we can probably use it with Monogram and Mez to get those damn digitizer codes, and maybe even eventually get some dirt on Doom if we ever infiltrate his area.

Also the other major advantage is keeping Xanatos informed of some major issues, such as what Toffee is doing and anything else we learn about the Hats.
 
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Guys.

I just realized that we could probably collaborate with Xanatos on finding Star. With us being in a (somewhat) united front against Toffee's incursions into this dimension, he would realize the value of someone like Star.

And before you go "but he'll just steal her from us", consider: Xanatos is a serious businessman and very clever schemer and if Toffee weren't a genocidal maniac, he and David would probably be great friends. We, on the other hand, are kooky and chaotic and have several of her friends on the workforce. Either David will have to pass a ridiculous diplomacy check to keep Star, or he'll realize that the best place for Star is with us, especially if we've taken lessons in Intrigue with David.
 
Made in Heaven said:
[ ] Take Xanatos' Promotion
Your "Ask Mirage to let you practice lying" Personal Action changes to 'Ask Xanatos to let you practice lying'. Reward changes from gaining 1d4+1 intrigue to 1d4+3 intrigue.
Xanatos will teach you Intrigue.
Xanatos will teach you Intrigue.
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So it 'only' makes a difference of 2 Intrigue? It's something, but not a huge boon.
I'm a bit more worried about the red text. Could it be that taking classes from Xanatos will change Doof's personality or style of doing things in a negative way?
 
Jastolus said:
I'm a bit more worried about the red text. Could it be that taking classes from Xanatos will change Doof's personality or style of doing things in a negative way?
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It's green because you have Xanatos teaching Intrigue, a clearly positive step-up from before.

It's red because you have Xanatos teaching Intrigue, aka official Tier 3 Infiltration from him.
 
Regarding Xanatos, I think that we can trust him to act consistently on whatever he feels ensures Alexander's safety.

IIRC, Xanatos knows enough about the leading extradimensional factions that he won't work with either Toffee or Phobos, who'd see his kid as a hated human or a light meal, respectively.

Bill, in the other hand... Well, David may just be willing to become the dorito's dancing jester in a cage, if that results in Alexander being spared.
 
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Jastolus said:
So it 'only' makes a difference of 2 Intrigue? It's something, but not a huge boon.
I'm a bit more worried about the red text. Could it be that taking classes from Xanatos will change Doof's personality or style of doing things in a negative way?
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Actuall, 2 Intrigue is huge both since its on Doof, and it lowers our Floor.

The range for learning Intrigue from Mirage is +2-5, while with Xanatos It is +4-7. Since Doof has 18 Intrigue right now, that is a 20-23 vs a 22-25. Every bit of Intrigue also helps do to how crits work. +2 can get us to a new crit threshold, or help us turn a bare failure into a bare success.

The Red Text means that Xanatos is the guy teaching us, and he always has an angle. He will likely be able to see through us more easilly, though since he has over 3 times out intrigue anyway its likely if he wanted to he could beat us in most intrigue related manners.
 
TheGleeman said:
A kind of Tier 3 Infiltration we can easily deal with by *Doof simply keeping his trap shut every now and then*, since HE HIMSELF is that leak rn
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...Have you MET Doof? The whole reason we're asking is because he's TERRIBLE at infosec. And, while Xanay teaching him would make him a lot better, it would also mean Xanatos would inevitably be exposed to a lot more info from Doof, and would know how Doof thinks. I wouldn't be surprised, if mechanically, we'd be stuck with our current Intrigue against Xanay himself after his training, because, well, he knows our methods, he TAUGHT us our methods.

Murazor said:
Regarding Xanatos, I think that we can trust him to act consistently on whatever he feels ensures Alexander's safety.

IIRC, Xanatos knows enough about the leading extradimensional factions that he won't work with either Toffee or Phobos, who'd see his kid as a hated human or a light meal, respectively.

Bill, in the other hand... Well, David may just be willing to become the dorito's dancing jester in a cage, if that results in Alexander being spared.
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Heh heh. While Bill is scary as all get out, if Stan could figure out a way to con him, Xanatos would see through him like a greasy paper bag. Don't bullshit a bullshiter. I think if the dorito tries to make a deal, he may end up on the losing end for once.
 
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A big question that remains is if the tier 3 infiltration will end once the training action is over, or how else things develop from there. Maybe there will be another choice to determine the future of the 'partnership'.
In any case, if we go for this offer, best to finish the training as fast as possible.
 
TheGleeman said:
A kind of Tier 3 Infiltration we can easily deal with by *Doof simply keeping his trap shut every now and then*, since HE HIMSELF is that leak rn
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Okay, that's just categorically false. Xanatos teaching Doof means that every strategy Doof has regarding infosec will be something Xanatos taught him. What this means, is that Xanatos is essentially social engineering Doof's responses in such a way that Xanatos will know exactly how he'll be thinking.

It's entirely likely that if you learn under him you will never be able to hide anything from him ever again.

Side note it's a little sad that no one's looked into the name of the interlude and what that means.
 
Argidoll said:
Okay, that's just categorically false. Xanatos teaching Doof means that every strategy Doof has regarding infosec will be something Xanatos taught him. What this means, is that Xanatos is essentially social engineering Doof's responses in such a way that Xanatos will know exactly how he'll be thinking.

It's entirely likely that if you learn under him you will never be able to hide anything from him ever again.

Side note it's a little sad that no one's looked into the name of the interlude and what that means.
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Some people did, though most of it was after the rival report.

Basically, D2 is a position to which you could only put a pawn if it is a pawn that has moved across the entire field from the other side. A pawn that has made a lot of small steps, and is now only one move away from promotion to a higher piece, the kind of piece that could turn an entire game around.

In the context of the choice, this leads me to the following interpretations.
If we accept the tutoring, we become a higher value piece in David's game. Derived from this interpretation is the idea that he may have spent a long time maneuvering us to our current position, where we are confronted with the choice. This maneuvering could be the symbolic chess playing inside this interlude, but could also be the longer history of interactions we had with him. Because despite what he said, he most likely was intentionally manipulating us all along.
If we reject his offer, we are emancipated form being a piece in his game. He loses tier 3 infiltration and with the sweep this turn maybe even tier 2 (and with last turn's sweep he may not have tier 1, putting him at 0, but that seems overly optimistic.) We emphasize our independence. Or rather, our reliance on the people we have gathered around ourselves and come to trust.
 
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Doofquest is, in my opinion, a game about priorities. We can do just about anything if we let everything else crash and burn. We could keep Xanatos out. It would take a lot of actions, though.

I'd rather focus on other things. Xanatos infiltration, while not precisely good, also really isn't that bad. We don't just pick things to succeed at - we also pick what we're comfortable failing at, where we can surrender something that doesn't matter to gain an advantage.
 
Something to keep in mind: For Xanatos to regain tier 3 infiltration, he'd have to compromise someone on our council. Do we have that sort of weakness?
Coyote? Unlikely. He's prime suspect for Blot infiltration, but more because we think he got replaced.
Goofy? Eh.
Janus? Maybe. But also unlikely, given how he found a friend and support for his projects with us.
Mirage? No way.
Ludevine? We only just got a loyalty boost for her from the flubber thing.
Malifshmerz seems unlikely. At least intenionally.
 
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[X] Develop Your Center
-[X] Pick up the boxed in screw and use it somewhere in the Inator you're working on.

I'm torn. If this had been last turn I'd be more for Xanatos, but…I think I want to go with this.
 
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[X] Develop Your Center

Among other reasons, we'd be giving Xanatos access to anything Winston and Olympia entrust to us, without their consent. And if we aske them first, they may just not tell us in the first place, seeing us worse off.
Just generally, it seems like going with him has the potential to betray a lot of people's trust, at least implicitly. None of them agreed to have Xanatos look over Doofs shoulder when they get involved with him, or tell him information.

From a perspective of ethics and mutual loyalty, it's just not worth a 'mere' 2 points of Intrigue.
 
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See, I think accepting Xanatos purposal is a good idea.

I feel that Intrigue, from now ownards, it's going to become a key thing if we want any of our plans to succeed. We have seen how powerful using the shadows is: just ask Kat how much damage he managed to do under our noses.

Being stealthy is one of the biggest things we should be wary from now onward, even more now that we're planning to stub the toes of many people.

And, at the end of the day, from all kings, besides Winston/Sinatron, Xanatos is the king least likely to screw us over, as he's not one to discard pieces at a whim, even more one as wild as Doofenshmirtz. Now, here's a list of my opinions in each king:

Toffee: Didn't see all of SVTFOE, but this guy is just plain evil, and was likely looking for us to help only to further his goals. All give, no take, that's what I feel.

Judge Doom: HAHAHAHAHAHAHA, no. That guy is our literal antithesis in the toon way. He will betray us, if we ever need him.

Bellweather: We are in good terms for now. But I will not be surprised if she turns on us to further her predator-hate campaign, or just to make DEI look bad.

Shego: Probably the third least likely king to betray us because of all of our history in the Gala sand and the "familiarity" we have. Most likely won't betray us because we proved that we have our value.

Yokai: A pretty awkward spot, I will not lie. Yokai is dominating the underground of San Fransokyo, and has an eye on one of our members, but I still think that he wouldn't turn coats on us if we ever allied.

Negaduck: No. Just no. So chaotic that it will turns us in the first opportunity he has. Don't know why is even here.

Government: May turn on us if we prove too dangerous. Emphasis on may.

MCP: I don't fucking know.

Gloomgold: Will turn on us if there's a way to make more profit. That's his gist.

Xanatos is an absolute powerhouse in the Intrigue field, that's not a lie. But he also is not perfect. The Twelfth Night shows that even he can be outsmarted at times. We would be giving a lot of our hand to him. And New York is a pretty central place in the world: we can improve our occult, find new business opportunities in the area, and do a shitload of stuff in there. Having Xanatos as our opponent in that field is too much of a pain in the ass.

And I get to think that Xanatos, even if we refuse his offer, will find a way to still win. That's his trope, after all: except for one single time in Gargoyles, he never truly lost a battle. If we refuse his offer, he still has a handle in our corp: sure, we're doing a clean-up, but I feel that it won't be too hard to infiltrate us again (sidenote: I really want we to fortify ourselves against Intrigue moves, even more after Blot's trickery. He also could make your life harder in New York. He likely won't, but he could. At least, no help from that front. We may fend him off with the sweep, but that's only going to do so much.

On the other hand, if we accept, he will have a handle in our corporation, which is bad at first, but Xanatos is (to a extent) trustworthy. He's somewhat reasonable, and like Shego, won't betray us if we don't go against him. Unlike Shego, he knows more of our firepower, and how we are tricky. He wants that alliance.

The question we should be making here it's not what Xanatos wants. Either way, he gets something. What we need to ask is: what we win and lose?

[X] Take Xanatos' Promotion

Maybe our independence. But rather that that making an enemy of Disney Luthor.
 
[X] Take Xanatos' Promotion

Just making my voice heard, although I don´t expect that vote to win because people are just too focussed on "standing strong *alone*" and "not making any compromises"
 
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