- Location
- America
[X] Action Plan: A New Justice
Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest
- Thread starter eaglejarl
- Start date
-
- Tags
- naruto rational rationalist romance armageddon is looking better and better damn you kishimoto explosions everywhere explosives solve everyone if in doubt surrender to the mercy of zabuza it seemed like a good idea at the time looks like a really bad case of being a jōnin my god. where does the lore end? precommitting is the winning plan screaming in kagome screw the rules i have explosives something bad might still happen sometimes you gotta sociopath stabby zabby subsection c of paragraph 9 should include we can weaponize this so hard
Hot take: Eyeballs don't work like that and aren't supposed to bleed. Please see a doctor.
Y'all have already seen my actual "hot take", and for some reason, some of you voted for it.
Y'all have already seen my actual "hot take", and for some reason, some of you voted for it.
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Noumero
Omit Needless Words
Sure, but consider: if this is some kind of illusion distinct from genjutsu, then we have no reason to believe that dispelling will do anything.
Tua
鸡肉面条汤
- Location
- شوربة الدجاج المعكرونة
So what is the harm in dispelling then? I genuinely don't understand how that is considered a problem because it might be seen as being rude.
If Itachi and Hidan would kill us just for something as small as this then I don't have much hope for the discussion to begin with. They are ninja - and missing-nin at that - if anyone they'd understand the constant paranoia Hazou has been going through.
- Location
- Italy
Some suggestions.
Finally, the biggest problem i see in this plan is that Itachi asked us not only what our plan is, but also "Can we trust you?" and i don't see how that question is answered in the plan. It assumes Itachi is already convinced of our goodwill. If we wrong about that, things won't go well. This said...
[X] Action Plan: A New Justice
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Pedantry: Technically, Hidan is still in the other room making the tea.
Noumero
Omit Needless Words
They won't kill us just for this, but they'll be more likely to kill us if we do that, just because it'd annoy them. Why start with a misstep?
And what's the utlility in dispelling? The situation is almost certainly real, and if it's not real, it's almost certainly not a genjutsu, and if it's not a genjutsu, then dispelling will almost certainly do nothing. I don't think ruling out the far-off possibility where dispelling would be useful is worth even a 15% increase in the probability of our death.
(And no, I have no idea why they'd consider it rude, but it's not like it's the first time we run into bizarre social mores of ninjapeople.)
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Tua
鸡肉面条汤
- Location
- شوربة الدجاج المعكرونة
See, I don't think they would be annoyed but I also don't think it is very likely this is real either. And that's the crux of the issue.
You think it is, and they would.
There is one more reason but I'll leave it at that.
- Location
- Europe
Remember Oro's basement? We never found out what caused the whole "Idiot". Might be scent based this time:
We should just point out that because of our actual intent to investigate whatever was used on Akane that we need to postpone everything for 1-3 days (because Akane still had symptoms on the next day, maybe even some self isolation I think Velorien got really inspiered by the Coronavirus outbreak) and talk then. We really can't trust that they are who they claim to be.
Hell, this whole thing might be a big trail and whoever this is would want us to play along, I just don't like the idea of spilling our Akatsuki sympathy to some unknown person/group.
If it's actually Itachi and Hidan they will likely accept, especially because they can just follow and kill us.
edit: Everyone might just be hallucinating on their own and Hazou is seeing his own vision, for all we now the Oracle is just sitting around and watching, he did go from Not-Hidan to Hidan quite quickly, but there was a pause. That's why we should switch location.
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- Location
- The state of Paranoia
Unfortunately, I'm pretty sure that if we want to catch up with Team Bloodrage we'll have better luck asking Leaf T&I. Jiraiya had them tortured for information on their handler, right?
@eaglejarl since it seems like something that Hazō would know, is dispelling in circumstances such as this (you're in a social situation but something very unlikely or strange just happened) generally considered rude? If so, why? Is there a protocol people usually follow to make it less rude, such as asking for permission or announcing they are about to dispell?
Reasoning:
Dispelling is an EN-wide phenomenon, so if it is considered rude it would probably be considered rude everywhere. Hazō has spent lots of time in the wild being properly paranoid, but before that he was a resident of Mist, a civilized society that also has knowledge of genjutsu and dispel. It stands to reason that he should remember whether it was rude to dispel in the beginning or middle of a conversation.
Edit: We've also had at least one conversation with Shikamaru about the merits of regularly vs semi-regularly dispelling, where the topic of it being rude would presumably have come up as something to account for. Shikamaru would likely either list it as a downside to regular dispelling, or list it as something that would need to be worked around.
Edit:
Subject to Eaglejarl telling me I'm wrong, but for my fellow players here's why I think dispelling would not be rude:
- We have been dispelling every hour, plus or minus 15 minutes. Presumably this happened in the middle of conversation many times. No one pointed us out as rude for that.
- We presumably did not stop semi-regularly dispelling, even when we were talking to Jiraiya or Asuma. Otherwise, all a genjutsu expert would have to do would be to put us in a genjutsu of us talking to Asuma or something and we'd be completely trapped.
- This world may not be properly paranoid like Kagome, but it's much more paranoid than real life. Until quite recently people would chuck a pebble ay anyone who did something out of character (not that I have any idea why that was a thing
). It makes perfect sense that dispelling in these circumstances would not be considered rude.- We've had at least one conversation with Shikamaru on the subject of random dispelling. As far as I can remember, he did not mention that it was rude, or that Ino would get on his case about dispelling in public.
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- Location
- London
- Pronouns
- He/Him/They/Them
@Sentient Tree
So, I think that that is probably true in general, but right now we are standing in front of the crown prince of genjutsu eyes. Do you think that it would be disrespectful to Itachi specifically, even if it is not normally rude?
Edit: Oh wait, no, I forgot. Sharingan doesn't do genjutsu in this universe right? Or does it?
So, I think that that is probably true in general, but right now we are standing in front of the crown prince of genjutsu eyes. Do you think that it would be disrespectful to Itachi specifically, even if it is not normally rude?
Edit: Oh wait, no, I forgot. Sharingan doesn't do genjutsu in this universe right? Or does it?
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- Location
- The state of Paranoia
I guess? I'm honestly not sure. As the crown prince of genjutsu, I would think that he would be pretty used to people dispelling in front of him.
The way I've been thinking of it is that anything that makes people less likely to dispel would naturally be exploited ruthlessly by genjutsu experts. This leads to 'polite' people being dead and 'rude' ones being much more likely to survive. In MfD, that would presumably lead to people not thinking that it's rude anymore, since people want to live. I would think that this would count for Itachi too, but I could be wrong since I don't know what personal pet peeves he has. I guess it's possible that people dispelling is a pet peeve of his, especially since he's a genjutsu user.
The heck? That chapter wasn't an april fool's? well the chapter title says intoxication so Hazou could be hallucinating. which a simple dispel might not fix. and could be a very bad situation. if either the locals drugged him, or something else is happening. i dunno how to quickly get out of an intoxicated state. another worry is whatever hazou does in his intoxication might correlate to something else in the real world. like going on a murder rampage or something
Hidan should still be in Oro's stomach. Him being in one piece sounds suspicious.
Some ideas for checking for hallucination. inflict immense self pain to shock yourself out. have the others do math and tell you the answer faster than you could compute it yourself (tricky part is how do you verify their answer is correct? if hallucinating could cause you to believe 1+1=3). use the Iron Nerve somehow.
if it's a dream things are significantly easier. pinch yourself or open a book and see if it has sentences instead of nonsense words.
on one hand. Itachi could be using a genjutsu/dream/etc. to safely probe our intentions. and merely escaping would ruin the opportunity. on the other hand, if this is drugs i don't want to be randomly spewing our plans for world domination to a random monk at the temple.
incense smoke. mysterious drugs. what.
How strong is this blaze? And does Hazou know whether the sharingan is supposed to blaze this bright?
Hidan should still be in Oro's stomach. Him being in one piece sounds suspicious.
Some ideas for checking for hallucination. inflict immense self pain to shock yourself out. have the others do math and tell you the answer faster than you could compute it yourself (tricky part is how do you verify their answer is correct? if hallucinating could cause you to believe 1+1=3). use the Iron Nerve somehow.
if it's a dream things are significantly easier. pinch yourself or open a book and see if it has sentences instead of nonsense words.
on one hand. Itachi could be using a genjutsu/dream/etc. to safely probe our intentions. and merely escaping would ruin the opportunity. on the other hand, if this is drugs i don't want to be randomly spewing our plans for world domination to a random monk at the temple.
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- Location
- Yes.
Hidan was resurrected by Nagato's kinjutsu?
something something lailoken something something it was orochimaru something something blahblahblah
You can't be resurrected if you never died
- Location
- USA
Violating wordcount guidelines so heavily hurts my inner XP optimizer, and others have expressed a desire to keep things simple (because being honest should be enough), and EJ also tends to prefer shorter, slightly less specified plans (c.f. the Never Break Character speech was specified by only four lines)
[X] Action Plan: Keep It Simple, Stinker
Word Count: 298 (+1 XP)
Be as polite and straightforward as possible. Drink the peppermint tea if offered, (-1 FP: Declare we have honey), offer honey to Itachi if the conversation allows.
You're asking us why we should leave the room alive:
You're asking why you can trust us:
You're asking why this idea is a good thing:
On our own, we will accomplish a lot. Together, we can change the system.
[X] Action Plan: Keep It Simple, Stinker
Word Count: 298 (+1 XP)
Be as polite and straightforward as possible. Drink the peppermint tea if offered, (-1 FP: Declare we have honey), offer honey to Itachi if the conversation allows.
You're asking us why we should leave the room alive:
- Because we know the world is broken and dying.
- We think Akatsuki wants a better system than the one in place now.
- Our goals are probably aligned with yours. If you care about stopping war between nations and improving civilian lives, we have a lot of common ground.
- Let's engage in conversation and find a way to both benefit. Cooperation is stronger than conflict.
You're asking why you can trust us:
- We reached out to you despite killing Jiraiya. We can put our grudges aside.
- We gain nothing from betraying you. You can evade any capture attempt.
- We gain everything from working with you. Your power can be the keystone in a necessary international peace, however you wish to use it.
- Disclaimer: We have made mistakes before - as a result of ignorance and power dynamics. We are improving.
You're asking why this idea is a good thing:
- The system in place right now is self-consuming. It will continue to collapse on itself until there's nothing left.
- Villages will war with each other as they always have done unless something changes dramatically.
- We are worthy allies. We have the tenacity to survive for years under the wrath of Hidden Mist, and come out of it with a desire to help and protect the weak.
- It looks like we're weapons dealers, but we're trying to make Leaf better from within. We're building housing, using ninja powers for clean water and health, and pushing the Clans towards diplomacy, not war.
On our own, we will accomplish a lot. Together, we can change the system.
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- Location
- USA
Changes made to Thinking section to clarify it, thanks for the feedback.
I'd hoped to convey that we were trustworthy with the whole speech about how we care about stopping war and helping people, which marks us as different from all the other ninja schmucks. I stuck in an explicit mention in a place where I hope it doesn't seem to heavy handed. I still want to start with the whole "sorry about the Akatsuki" shtick, but I'm open to arguments for different narrative arcs.
[X] Action Plan: A New Justice
Word Count: 682 (-3 XP)
Dispel
Attitude
Presentation
Word Count: 682 (-3 XP)
Dispel
Attitude
- Be polite, be respectful
- He seems willing to engage on equal footing, but use IN before reacting if he says something you don't like. Not to be hard to read, but because you've been careless with words before.
- We're only alive because he wants us to be.
- He's asking to justify our proposal for Pax Akatsuki - and why we should be involved at all.
- Get impassioned. Why Uplift?
- Incidentally, Haru better be good at OPSEC, because we're about to blow it.
- A logical argument is most likely to work.
- Though he is anguished about his lost friends and failed dreams - be mindful.
- He has a sense of justice. He seems to value individual responsibility for mistakes.
- Our goals are aligned with his, and we're doing work to achieve them.
- While we have made mistakes, we have a way of improving the world that we think will work.
- If he lets us do this, or better yet empowers us, we will improve his ability to achieve his goals.
- We probably have common ground.
- Nagato's philosophy was very appealing to us. We sadly learned too late.
- We've personally seen why that philosophy is important in our travels around the EN.
Presentation
- We want to improve the world in distinct and relevant ways. We are doing this in a structured manner.
- We are sensible and straightforward about this. It's important to us, and we take it seriously.
- We've made mistakes and done things we regret. We take responsibility for them, but continue towards our goals, because that's how we can make amends.
- We didn't know Akatsuki's plan.
- To us, you provoked instability by preying on secretive ninja culture. We barely prevented war between Leaf and Mist in your wake.
- We went to Leaf because Jiraiya honestly wanted a world without fighting. You know that from his students, Konan and Nagato.
- We may have misjudged the path to peace. With respect, we still don't know Akatsuki's plan, so we can't judge that.
- Even within the current regime, the world can be improved.
- Many ninja powers are better suited to creation than destruction.
- Villages dance to economics and politics. These are tools to weaken war hawks and strengthen diplomats.
- We're already doing this in Leaf. Using techniques to provide people with housing and water. Promoting trade across borders. Ensuring Leaf doesn't see open war with Rock.
- This is how we can give justice to the people.
- This is why you can trust us. Because we see that the world is broken, and we want to see it fixed.
- You have more power than us.
- You can do more than guide people towards peace, you can enforce it.
- This isn't enough. A ruling Omnikage will eventually perish, and the hatred of the world, once held static, will flow forth anew.
- We need to change people, from the bottom-up, until we reach a point where going to war is as unthinkable as killing a newborn.
- But that won't happen on its own. Born and raised to be hate-filled, or worse, mindless killers, the children of this world will never see peace as an option.
- We need both.
- We need someone to lift the burden of bloodshed from the world, so people can learn that there's more to life than preparing for the next battle.
- We have reason to hate each other.
- We both think that the world's best shot at peace was put to death at the other's hands.
- But we cannot fall into the cycle of retaliation. This is the blindness of the world as-is.
- I'm willing to put my hate aside and work with you.
- If you want to walk away from us, that's fine.
- I know we share the desire to do the right thing, at any cost.
- I will do my best to save the world. I ask you to do the same.
@eaglejarl @Velorien @OliWhail @faflec Do we know Nagato was Jiraiya's student?
[X] Action Plan: Keep It Simple, Stinker
If we get guidance that dispelling quietly is ok (which I'm inclined to think it is, given our rather frank discussion about dispelling every x minutes with Shikamaru, among other things) I might ask that we add it, but other than that, this looks good to me.
Side note, if you only dispel when weird shit happens, that also opens us up to an attack vector. I feel like we had an SOP to dispel a while ago, does anyone else remember it?
If we get guidance that dispelling quietly is ok (which I'm inclined to think it is, given our rather frank discussion about dispelling every x minutes with Shikamaru, among other things) I might ask that we add it, but other than that, this looks good to me.
Side note, if you only dispel when weird shit happens, that also opens us up to an attack vector. I feel like we had an SOP to dispel a while ago, does anyone else remember it?
- Location
- The Void
- Pronouns
- She/Her
[x] Action plan: When did staring down Demi Gods become normal
- Before we start wait for Hidan to come back with the tea
- Offer everyone honey.
- The world is slowly dying
- Reference the statistics you discovered with Kei and Nara about the world wide population falling.
- When ever ninja fight they are slowly destroying the world
- But just serving as a protective force against chakra beast is not enough
- There are so many things ninjas could do to better the world
- Storage seals to preserve and ship goods
- Earth Jutsu for wall and housing
- summoning scrolls can provide instant transportation
- and so many other chances to change things
- This is Hazo's driving ambition
- To uplift the world
- Everything he has done has been in service of this
- Hazo started with no advantages and has put himself in a position to enact these changes
- He did blaze a trail of destruction across the continent but if he hadn't he would have ended up dead years ago when he lost the game of hide and seek to the greatest hunter nin in the world
- He is standing in front of Itachi as a peer
- He reached out to Itachi in hopes that he could break the cycle of hate and violence that has consumed the world
- Location
- The Maple Syrup Mountains
Except Orochimaru's physical form died in the BotG a little later, which makes a plausible case for Hidan dying in the process.
I think it was to dispel at regular intervals. And also at irregular intervals.
- Location
- Yes.
I disagree with this. Just because our goals are aligned doesn't mean that our methodology is, and if our methodology isn't the same then we may well come into conflict. That should be clear by the fact that we took divergent paths to achieving said goals (we joined Leaf and worked within the system, Akatsuki did their Super Saiyan Ritual to break the system entirely).
All else aside, we've known Jiraiya for a year at most. I don't see this as a vendetta so much as a grudge.
Going by her grieving, Past Mari at least seemed to love Jiraiya as much as a long-time family member. Present Mari less certain.