To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest)

UbeOne · Oct 9, 2016

"Their sacrifice will be honored in the coming-"

*is shot*

Cteatus · Oct 9, 2016

Diplomatic Push on Kadeshi with the intent to induct them into the Federation correct?

That's...a very bold move. I mean their tech is shiny as fuck, but a) considering the devastation of their culture it comes off with an air of gunboat diplomacy, and b) its got to be incendiary to the Romulans.

I'mma need to think about it more before supporting that.

Nix · Oct 9, 2016

Cteatus said:
Diplomatic Push on Kadeshi with the intent to induct them into the Federation correct?

Maybe in the long term, in the short term mostly so their tell us their new address.

cast2007 · Oct 9, 2016

[X] Plan Wind-down

OneirosTheWriter · Oct 9, 2016

Nix said:
I think the diplomatic push on the Kadeshi probably can't wait, and if we are doing something with the Romulans I'd like to also include the Klingons, so let's do that next turn (if there is another emergency turn)? Also trying to fit in as many early demobilizations as possible while still trying to complete projects with long term benefits. We could demobilize McCoy to delay completion of the vaccine and extend the emergency artificially, but that seems too gamey. What do you think?

Just noticed the bit at the end. Trust me when I say you do not want to be the Admiral who is seen to have dawdled on the Vaccine if another world gets hit by the Biophage. The political winds would be ... adverse.

HearthBorn · Oct 9, 2016

[ ] Plan Preparations
Internal Diplomacy
-[ ] [Federation Emergency Council] Demobilise an Asset: Commodore T'Faer (1 turn)
-[ ] [Andorian Civil Service] Demobilise an Asset: Vulcan Science Academy Detachment (1 turn)
Research
-[ ] [Starfleet Command] Suicide Shuttle Countermeasures (1 turn)
-[ ] [Starfleet Infectious Disease Institute] Biophage Vaccine Research Rush - (1 turn)
-[ ] [Comodore McCoy] Join Starfleet Infectious Disease Institute team
-[ ] [Starfleet Tactical Command - Tiger Team] Biophage Combat Research Rush (1 turn)
External Diplomacy
-[ ] [Federation Diplomatic Service] Request Asset from Affiliate [Request something, such as an Amarki Shipyard Berth] (1 turn) [NB: Shipyard berths require 10pp]
-[ ] [Andorian Ambassadorial Team] Diplomatic Push on Amarki (1 turn)
Civil Engineering
-[ ] [Starfleet Medical Command] Deploy large-scale Tachyon Detection Network (2 turns)
-[ ] [Andorian Civil Engineering Team] Improve Indi Beta Power Generation to support new Shield Emitters (+2 L) (2 turns)
Industry
-[ ] [Starfleet Engineering Command] Improve the Machado IV Evacuation Center with Shield Emitters (L3) (3 turns)
-[ ] [North America Productivity Commission] Expand Indi Beta Outpost with Ship Repair Berth (4 turns)
Combat
-[ ] [Starfleet Tactical Command - Runabout Recon Squadron] Scout Neutral Zone Area 6 (2 turn)
-[ ] [Andorian Orbit Guard Runabouts] Scout Neutral Zone Area 6 (2 turn) [Reduce to 1 turn]
Fleet
-[ ] [RBZ Fleet - Commodore T'Faer] Own Initiative
No Orders
-[ ] Tellarite Mining Expedition 1

Edit: changed my vote to another in a later post.

pheonix89 · Oct 9, 2016

OneirosTheWriter said:
Just noticed the bit at the end. Trust me when I say you do not want to be the Admiral who is seen to have dawdled on the Vaccine if another world gets hit by the Biophage. The political winds would be ... adverse.

Yeah, that's gamey bullshit. Honestly if I was you I'd simply lock in putting McCoy and a medical research team on the Vaccine research as mandatory votes, kind of like how other quests have had vote weighting multipliers based on PC personalities.

Nix · Oct 9, 2016

pheonix89 said:
Yeah, that's gamey bullshit. Honestly if I was you I'd simply lock in putting McCoy and a medical research team on the Vaccine research as mandatory votes, kind of like how other quests have had vote weighting multipliers based on PC personalities.

No one suggested actually doing that. I just mentioned the possibility after putting other incompatible choices in my plan.

Cteatus · Oct 9, 2016

Have we made sure that all remnants of the Romulan Inflictor experiments have been eradicated?

Cornuthaum · Oct 9, 2016

OneirosTheWriter said:
I worried about the Klingon reaction to the heavy casualties they took, but I needn't have. Today was, apparently, a good day to die. The experience of Tregh'bak has given them all the encouragement they need to take the fight to the Inflictor.

Qapla'! You really can't lose when you're a klingon.

UbeOne · Oct 9, 2016

Many howls were heard that day.

Massgamer · Oct 9, 2016

@OneirosTheWriter just to make sure once we finish the new vaccine we will naturally give it out to everyone we know of outside the Federation and encourage them to do the same right?

Pretty sure no one wants the Biophage to ever pop up and grow powerful again.

OneirosTheWriter · Oct 9, 2016

Massgamer said:
@OneirosTheWriter just to make sure once we finish the new vaccine we will naturally give it out to everyone we know of outside the Federation and encourage them to do the same right?

Pretty sure no one wants the Biophage to ever pop up and grow powerful again.

Yes - but for clarity's sake, all of that will be automated, since it passes outside the purview of Starfleet Command. It becomes something for the head of Starfleet Medical plus a few Federation committees to deal with.

Winged One · Oct 9, 2016

[X] Plan Wind-down

OneirosTheWriter · Oct 10, 2016

Since the state of emergency is winding down and probably doesn't last past this turn, I'll be trying to sort out a choice of rewards for you guys. For the moment, though, if you guys have anything non-mechanical that you would like to see (characters added to promotion tracking, assigned to places, etc), please let me know

Edit: And remember to vote for this turn everyone, it looks like it is contested

Briefvoice · Oct 10, 2016

Here is my big criticisms of Plan Wind-Down: It completely ignores the need for additional repair berths.

Why do we have have to delay ship production for repair when we could reach out for some additional repair berths? Why are we penny-pinching political will simply to avoid spending 10 for an extra Excelsior repair berth?

Everything else is minor but this plan is going to put us 18 months worth of Excelsior production behind (6 for the Sarek, 12 for the Kumari). That's ridiculous! If we can spent 10pp to get the equivalent of an Excelsior 12 months faster, that's completely worth the cost. pp comes easy! Don't be afraid to spend it for non-permanent results, like you would any other resource.

Spend the 10 pp, borrow a berth from an affiliate, and get the Kumari repaired without kicking another ship out of production for an entire year.

Theunderbolt · Oct 10, 2016

OneirosTheWriter said:
Yes - but for clarity's sake, all of that will be automated, since it passes outside the purview of Starfleet Command. It becomes something for the head of Starfleet Medical plus a few Federation committees to deal with.

Ah I see even a society as enlightened as the Federation still deals in these dark rituals.

Nix · Oct 10, 2016

Briefvoice said:
Here is my big criticisms of Plan Wind-Down: It completely ignores the need for additional repair berths.

Why do we have have to delay ship production for repair when we could reach out for some additional repair berths? Why are we penny-pinching political will simply to avoid spending 10 for an extra Excelsior repair berth?

Everything else is minor but this plan is going to put us 18 months worth of Excelsior production behind (6 for the Sarek, 12 for the Kumari). That's ridiculous! If we can spent 10pp to get the equivalent of an Excelsior 12 months faster, that's completely worth the cost. pp comes easy! Don't be afraid to spend it for non-permanent results, like you would any other resource.

Spend the 10 pp, borrow a berth from an affiliate, and get the Kumari repaired without kicking another ship out of production for an entire year.

First, you are overcounting since you are just getting 1 berth for 10 pp, so just 12 months. Unless you think an emergency deal like that will just be extended automatically as long as we want? There is also the opportunity cost. A diplomatic push usually costs 15 pp (we might not get the full benefit, but even so it should be worth some significant fraction of 15pp).
10 pp, let alone 25 pp are a ridiculous price to pay for one year of shipyard time when we can get a permanent berth for just 30, and it's not like it's an Exploration Corps ship that will be delayed (as for the next built, the delay will make it more likely that we manage to recruit enough crew in time to be able to put it in the Exploration Corps). Getting home fleet Excelsiors slightly faster isn't all that big of a benefit outside a crisis.

Briefvoice · Oct 10, 2016

Nix said:
First, you are overcounting since you are just getting 1 berth for 10 pp, so just 12 months. Unless you think an emergency deal like that will just be extended automatically as long as we want? There is also the opportunity cost. A diplomatic push usually costs 15 pp (we might not get the full benefit, but even so it should be worth some significant fraction of 15pp).
10 pp, let alone 25 pp are a ridiculous price to pay for one year of shipyard time when we can get a permanent berth for just 30, and it's not like it's an Eploration Corps ship that will be delayed. Getting home fleet Excelsiors slightly faster isn't all that big of a benefit outside a crisis.

You seem under the impression that we won't be kicking an Exploration Corps ship of of its berth. We will. See this quote:

OneirosTheWriter said:
Starfleet Engineering Command Report

What a mess. Alright, Admiral, we have several million tons of busted starship that need a lot of TLC and not many places to put them. Excelsior and Kumari both need Shipyards berths, the big triple-em ones. Unfortunately it'll still be almost a year before the new Tellar Prime Yard comes on-line. It'll take us a month just to get ships prepped for towing, out of the RBZ, and into the Core Worlds. I've checked around, and there may be affiliate member worlds with shipyards the right size. Amarkia has two that can fit an Excelsior that they use for their Riala-class. The Caitians have one, and the Rigellians have one. The Federation Council has indicated that they are willing to smooth things over, thankfully, though that favour may cost.

If we don't get the extra yards, we'll start bumping builds. First the 40 Eridani A Excelsior, then the San Fran Excelsior. For the smaller ships, the Oberth, then the Centaur, then the Constellation are the order in which we'll bump projects.

So yes, given that both Excelsior builds will be bumped an Exploration Corps ship will definitely be delayed.

Also, I frankly don't think you should be so cavalier about having almost all of our heavy cruisers damaged. You don't know when another crisis will show up on the random rolls table. You think we're guaranteed a few years of peace after the Biophage is gone? Maybe, maybe not. I'm pretty sure that @OneirosTheWriter randomizes this stuff to some extent, and it would be awful bad luck to have another major "oh shit" problem show up and we're down so many heavy cruisers because we didn't make repair a priority.

Briefvoice · Oct 10, 2016

Briefvoice said:
[X] Plan Emergency to a Close
-[X] Internal Diplomacy
--[X] Federation Emergency Council - Demobilise an Asset (Commodore T'Faer])
--[X] Andorian Ambassadorial Team - Demobilise an Asset (Vulcan Science Academy)
-[X] Research
--[X] Starfleet Infectious Disease Institute - Biophage Vaccine Research Rush [REQ: Medical] (1 turn)
--[X] Commodore McCoy - Join Starfleet Infectious Disease Institute
--[X] Starfleet Tactical Command - Biophage Combat Research Rush (1 turn)
--[X] Starfleet Command - Ship Modifications [REQ: Ship Design] (1 turn)
-[X] External Diplomacy
--[X] Federation Diplomatic Service - Request Asset from Affiliate Caitians [3mt Shipyard Berth, 10 pp] (1 turn)
--[X] Andorian Civil Service Team - Diplomatic Push on Betazoids, thanking them for their help (1 turn)
-[X] Civil Engineering
--[X] Starfleet Medical Command - Evacuate RBZ Listening Posts (2 turns)
--[X] Tellarite Mining Expedition 1 - Evacuate RBZ Listening Posts (2 turns)
--[X] Andorian Civil Engineering Team - Deploy large-scale Tachyon Detection Network (2 turns)
-[X] Industry
--[X] North America Productivity Commission (Earth) - Go Around The Clock On Eriandi A Berth to repair the Sarek (Pick Which) [Ship build/repair proceeds at double pace for duration] [REQ: Heavy] (3 turns)
--[X] Starfleet Engineering Command - Improve the Machado IV Evacuation Center with Shield Emitters (L3) (3 turns)
-[X] Combat
--[X] Andorian Orbit Guard Runabouts - Scout Neutral Zone Area 6 [Scouts Area closest to Klingon Border] [REQ: Recon] (2 turn)
--[X] Starfleet Tactical Command - Runabout Recon Squadron - Scout Neutral Zone Area 6 [Scouts Area closest to Klingon Border] [REQ: Recon] (2 turn)

Okay, here is my plan. I differ from Nix is that I think we need to push on the ship repairs by getting an extra Excelsior berth from an Affiliate. I also want to evacuate those Listening Posts. We no longer have a big enough patrol fleet to properly protect both them and Solitude. I am also not really interested in a diplomatic push on the Kadeshi. Let them alone.

EDIT: Realized we didn't need the Civilian shipyards, so demobilized a second asset more in line with Nix's plan.

FYI, I updated my plan. On a second look we don't need extra small berth civilian shipyards, because we only have two small ships needing shipyard repair and I'm comfortable bumping the Oberth. Decided to imitate Nix and also Demobilize the Vulcan Science Academy,

Now it's clearer that the big difference between the two plans is I want to evacuate the listening posts and I am willing to spend pp for the extra Excelsior repair berth.

SuperSonicSound · Oct 10, 2016

[X] Nix

OneirosTheWriter · Oct 10, 2016

Oh, one other note on the difference in price between Utopia Planitia and other shipyard options. Always worth remembering that PP is not a cost price, and it is not resource-dependent. It is tied to the politics of the matter. Sometimes a number of small-ticket items is more palatable than a single big ticket item, even if they require more work in total. In a society without money, a lot of this comes down to how the Federation Council perceives the situation. (This starts to include concerns about human-centricity in Starfleet after a while).

Briefvoice said:
I'm pretty sure that @OneirosTheWriter randomizes this stuff to some extent

*quickly hides rolz.org behind his back*

Derek58 · Oct 10, 2016

And it was brought up with our last appointment that people in the Federation are taking note, though i don't think getting upset over it yet, of our mainly human picks for Starfleet positions so far, so it's probably best to wait a bit on Utopia Planitia.

Jenny · Oct 10, 2016

[X] Plan Merged Plans
-[X] [Starfleet Command] Suicide Shuttle Countermeasures (1 turn)
-[X] [Federation Emergency Council] Demobilise an Asset: Commodore T'Faer (1 turn)
-[X] [Andorian Civil Service] Demobilise an Asset: Vulcan Science Academy Detachment (1 turn)
-[X] [Federation Diplomatic Service] Request Asset from Affiliate: Amarki Shipyard (1 turn)
-[X] [Andorian Ambassadorial Team] Diplomatic Push on Betazoids (1 turn)
-[X][North America Productivity Commission] Go Around The Clock On 40 Eridiani berth 1 (USS Sarek)
-[X] [Starfleet Engineering Command] Improve the Machado IV Evacuation Center with Shield Emitters (L3) (3 turns)
-[X] [Starfleet Medical Command] Deploy large-scale Tachyon Detection Network (2 turns)
-[X] [Andorian Civil Engineering Team] Improve Indi Beta Power Generation to support new Shield Emitters (+2 L) (2 turns)
-[X] [Starfleet Infectious Disease Institute] Biophage Vaccine Research Rush - (1 turn)
-[X] [Comodore McCoy] Join Starfleet Infectious Disease Institute team
-[X] [Starfleet Tactical Command - Tiger Team] Biophage Combat Research Rush (1 turn)
-[X] [Starfleet Tactical Command - Runabout Recon Squadron] Scout Neutral Zone Area 6 (2 turn)
-[X] [Andorian Orbit Guard Runabouts] Scout Neutral Zone Area 6 (2 turn) [Reduce to 1 turn]
-[X] [RBZ Fleet - Commodore T'Faer] Own Initiative

Nix · Oct 10, 2016

Briefvoice said:
You seem under the impression that we won't be kicking an Exploration Corps ship of of its berth. We will. See this quote:

So yes, given that both Excelsior builds will be bumped an Exploration Corps ship will definitely be delayed.

I did miss that, but it contradicts the Summary of Casualties which stated the Excelsior just needed a Starbase?
@OneirosTheWriter

Anyway, my other point that the delays make assigning the new Excelsiors to the Exploration Corps easier because we'd have more time to build up crews stands for delays to the SF berth as well, so this isn't a pure negative. An 75% for an Exploration Corps Excelsior vs a 95% chance a year later or something like that.

Also, I frankly don't think you should be so cavalier about having almost all of our heavy cruisers damaged. You don't know when another crisis will show up on the random rolls table. You think we're guaranteed a few years of peace after the Biophage is gone?

Not guaranteed, but I expect that making efficient use of our resources will on average put us in a stronger position during the next crisis than inefficient use. Assuming that the tables are designed to put us into a crisis every 10-15 years or so the probability of a crisis within the next two years should be relatively low even if there is no fudging to space them apart. Even more so if you consider that one main type of crisis, war against another of the great powers, looks pretty unlikely for the next while. And "most of our heavy cruisers" should be repaired in 3 months anyway.

To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest)

Daydreaming CPU

A Guy Who Fell Down a Hole

Cabal Core Commander

Wants to be Seven Of Nine

A Guy Who Fell Down a Hole

Be kind to each other.

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Advance toward the Future

Cabal Core Commander

Not the Simurgh

Cabal Core Commander

"Prepare for trouble..."

Shadowmancer of the Shadow Cabal

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Rocket Punch is Best Punch

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