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[X] Linear Configuration (Efficient Cruise: 6 -> 6.2, Maximum Warp: 7.6 -> 7.8) [Range: +10%]

Well this thing probably doesn't need sprint, unless the scientists on board make a really startling discovery and forget interstellar communication is a thing (it should be present in TOS to an extent if I'm not misremembering).
 
Candesce said:
I'm saying they probably do have Warp 8 drives, but I don't expect them to be particularly capable examples of Warp 8 drives on the ships that weren't built for them.
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Let's hope you're right, because unless we make some... Hmm, unique choices for a utility science vessel, this ship will not reach warp 8. Somehow I suspect Klingon military warp 8 drives, will.
 
landcollector said:
I'm still very skeptical about actually landing this hull on planets for multiple reasons. Anyway, the decision was made to sacrifice max Sprint capability so this thing can't outrun any modern threats that may spring up, so nothing for it but to double down and give it the best efficient cruise possible. Just have to hope there's an Excalibur around that can swoop in to save this hull from anything it can't outfight by itself.

[ ] Cruise Configuration (Efficient Cruise: 6 -> 6.4) [Range: +20%]
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This is thoroughly not the case. This thing's top speed matches the Kea's which leaves the D6 in the dust, and if we choose Linear then we're hitting the Canon Connie's top speed. And it was not a slow ship by any metric. Sprint means we surpass even that.

KarmaA said:
Trying to make a bunch of ships with a non-combatant mindset got us into an early war. We need to continue to build some sticks as a form of deterrence. Not every ship needs to be warlike but being our second Warp 8 class I want this thing to hit hard and be difficult to take down.

RIP blister deflector. That would have looked really cool with how compact the secondary hull is. Either the blister could continue all the way back in a cylinder to rectangular transition or there could have been a notch to allow access to the loading bay.

For this vote with the warp 7 cap I don't think we really have bad options here. I'm fine with splitting the difference with linear. It isn't completely federation internal and a full biosphere cataloguing and sampling mission sounds like it'd end at a starbase to drop stuff off and resupply. Some improved range could keep this design usable for an extra decade or two and sprint could keep them alive long enough to get home.
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False. The reason we're at war isn't the ship design mindset but how we chose to make it so the warp 8 engine took longer and isn't back compatible, trading a mid engine that we get fast for a good engine we get later. Klingons who likely chose the former were willing to take advantage of that.
inirlan said:
[X] Linear Configuration (Efficient Cruise: 6 -> 6.2, Maximum Warp: 7.6 -> 7.8) [Range: +10%]

I've been persuaded by the aesthetic argument of the "flat is justice" people.

Also, a little bit of extra max warp is nice in order to GTFO when a Klingon force says hello.

At 7.8 it should be able to out-sprint a D7, no?
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7.8 Is the Canon Connie's speed, so unless the new D7 somehow is vastly faster than it was, we should at least keep them from gaining on us easily.


Brass tacks even with Sprint configuration and no max warp loss this ship would still be slower than the Excalibur. As it stands now we can make it as fast as the Canon Connie without much issue and without breaking the bank.
Cold Dust said:
Let's hope you're right, because unless we make some... Hmm, unique choices for a utility science vessel, this ship will not reach warp 8. Somehow I suspect Klingon military warp 8 drives, will.
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Klingons explicitly chose for POWER NOW and sacrificed the strength of the engine to make it back compatible. In canon Starfleet did something similar and that's why both were peer. Note how the Excalibur's speed blows the Connie's out of the water? There's a reason for that. Since D7 are going to get the lion's share of the Klingon warp 8 and they are not that good compared to ours, just more numerous, this means if we can outrun a d7 we can outrun the rest of their fleet at warp. At least until they make an updated BoP for the warp 8 engine.


[X] Linear Configuration (Efficient Cruise: 6 -> 6.2, Maximum Warp: 7.6 -> 7.8) [Range: +10%]
 
landcollector said:
D6 is last Gen, so not exactly modern.
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Still a large part of their fleet, still in use. Still a principle attacker. If the Klingons of last gen couldn't match the Kea's speed despite being more technologically advanced, then took a less powerful warp engine and are in general noted to have inferior RnD compared to the Federation, I'm fairly confident matching the Connie's top speed from Canon is going to make this a non-issue.
 
CuriousRaptor said:
Still a large part of their fleet, still in use. Still a principle attacker. If the Klingons of last gen couldn't match the Kea's speed despite being more technologically advanced, then took a less powerful warp engine and are in general noted to have inferior RnD compared to the Federation, I'm fairly confident matching the Connie's top speed from Canon is going to make this a non-issue.
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I guess we'll see. Just immensely irritated by the meme over practicality trend. Bah.
 
landcollector said:
I guess we'll see. Just immensely irritated by the meme over practicality trend. Bah.
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Picking an average that provides bonuses to both rather than one that's a larger bonus to one and no bonus to the other is perfectly valid, and it's kind of shitty to discount people voting against your preference as meming.

Like, I think it'll look good aesthetically, but that's just part of the consideration.
 
landcollector said:
I guess we'll see. Just immensely irritated by the meme over practicality trend. Bah.
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Yeah... That doesn't exist.
You have a "when the practical option is also memeable we have fun with that" trend, an Aesthetics over practicality trend (which is a Litlle annoying, but has been around for a long time at this point) and the arguments in favour of cruise just being Really Bad.
 
Ebiris said:
Picking an average that provides bonuses to both rather than one that's a larger bonus to one and no bonus to the other is perfectly valid, and it's kind of shitty to discount people voting against your preference as meming.

Like, I think it'll look good aesthetically, but that's just part of the consideration.
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It's a good point, I'm worried that a top speed of only 7.6 worn't be enough to run away, while also wanting to boost the efficient cruise up from 6.0 as much as possible. The Linear Cruise top speed of 7.8 is what I believe to be the MINIMUM needed to safely run away, while still boosting the efficient cruise up to 6.2. It's a compromise - I can't get everything I want, so get as much past the minimum acceptable level that I can grab.
Here's the various speed options for Y'all:
Warp FactorCDays/LyLy/Day
6216.001.690.59
6.2238.331.530.65
6.4262.141.390.72
7343.001.060.94
7.6438.980.831.20
7.8474.550.771.30
8512.000.711.40
 
The argument for making this ship decently capable in a fight is fairly simple:

(1) We are going to have a limited number of ships with Warp 8 engines for a while, meaning all of the ones we do posses essentially are at a premium for their ability to quickly respond to emergencies.
(2) The TOS era is one where Starfleet is forced to be more militaristic than in other eras due to the ongoing cold (and occasionally hot) war with the Klingons, not to mention other powers like the Gorn or Romulans. More than ever, every starship we have in service needs to be able to pull its weight.
(3) Making this ship better at fighting in emergencies in no way makes it less good at doing science in peacetime. Look at the Excalibur and refit-Kea, which are both heavily focussed on science and exploration, and our number one and number two warships respectively.

That being said, I'm not saying we should go crazy or anything. Two impulse engines, a couple of phaser banks and a rapid-fire launcher is enough to make this ship much nastier than a Newton in a fight, and at a fairly affordable price to boot. We ironically save money with an extra engine because we don't need so much phaser coverage.
 
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