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RHUNRIKKI STROLLAR (Warhammer Fantasy Golden Age Dwarf Runelord Quest)

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I'm not going to weigh in on the logic of either side's arguments, but I will ask that everyone read over what they write and really consider if the words they used are polite and won't be inflammatory intentionally or not. You cant account for people's tolerances perfectly but at least try to say your piece without saying things that can be easily construed as overly dismissive of the other side of the argument, thank you.

Please endeavour to be cordial. :^)
 
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hugo239111 said:
I don't love the idea of just being aware of it, but we aren't making a az, but summing up a race. Nothing says dawi quite like the left. "Oh sure you got some fancy horns, a flaming sword, slain thousands, burnt worlds to a crisp in the service of your god..." *Snort, hawk loogey* "You think I care, why? I'll still break you over my knee you wazzock!"
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I think center is the one that says that better than left, really. Center is where, yes, you are afraid. And you grab that knowledge and use it to beat the shit out of them. While left just artificially boosts your courage on top of letting you be aware of foreign mental influences.
 
Left makes you aware of external falsehoods. Not internal ones. "To know Falsehood is to understand the Self." This rune simply makes you braver instead. It cannot be the Left rune.
 
Byzantine said:
I think center is the one that says that better than left, really. Center is where, yes, you are afraid. And you grab that knowledge and use it to beat the shit out of them. While left just artificially boosts your courage on top of letting you be aware of foreign mental influences.
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Hmm, you may be right, this should match the overcome of the poem. Few of the dawi reach an age to be inured to the world's horrors. It's the elders that steady the line. To the dawrven people it's overcoming a seemingly impossible enemy. I like both to be honest. they link with the ideals very well. It's really a question of which do we give more credit to, the inner traits of the people (and fit the know falsehoods in left) or the ability of champions of the people (ability to overcome in the center).
 
soulcake said:
"Come along then, we've two Trials left. And I've found myself growing sick of riddles and games."
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I feel you buddy.

I wonder if there are really "wrong answers" here. If what Thungni wanted was someone who thought about things in exactly the same way he thought about things, surely there were better ways to do that.

Maybe the point of the trial is to think about these things and come up with your own answers. Maybe the only "wrong answer" would be to choose what you think Thungi would believe even if it differs from what you believe.
 
I think it's the left one, mostly because of the understanding yourself wordings. To understand what is your own fear and fear that is being produced unnaturally is a step towards understanding yourself. Yea it increases bravery, but it matches so well with the description.

To claim the Hammer is to know Truth.

To know Truth is to spurn Falsehood.

To spurn Falsehood is to know Falsehood.

To know Falsehood is to understand the Self.

Resist.

Overcome.

Endure.

Understanding yourself to me seems to be the most important part of this. Yea the middle doesn't effect mental state but it just doesn't match the description at all. I don't know how to describe it, it just matches.
 
I really don't know what the best answer here is, only that the right option neither helps to overcome nor understand so I'd be against it. It also doesn't fit with the next one which is enduring, that option is basically ignoring it and dealing with it later.

Between left and middle, left helps you understand and has a minor bit over overcoming via the bravery boost. Center seems to have no benefit to understanding but is +overcoming.

Maybe left?
 
A real dawi worthy of the name doesn't need external mental effects or help to know if they're under one. A dawi with proper understanding of the self would therefore find the left option useless, while the center one can double the strength of a properly stalwart dawi when they need it most.
 
Left is I think the best option.

The riddle has 2 components

1) Know truth>Spurn + Know Lies> Know self

2) Resist, Overcome , Endure

Of the 3 options Left seems the best choice as it's the only one to fit criteria 1 while both Left and Cetner fit criteria 2
 
Left seems blatantly, laughably obvious?
soulcake said:
To know Falsehood is to understand the Self.
[...]
They become generally aware of spells and items being used to negatively impact their mental state.
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Like...this is explicitly, specifically what the riddle is describing. I don't see how either of the others can even possibly be correct.

Edit: Hmm.
Byzantine said:
The goal of the rune is not to help you know yourself. The goal is that one that knows themselves can use it to it's true potential. Which does not require being given knowledge, but rather to be aware of how afraid you are, and how to turn that to your advantage.
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This is actually a pretty intriguing theory. 🤔 Hmmmmmmmm.
 
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Bah, shallow thinking Beardlings.
soulcake said:
[ ] [Courage:] Left
[The wearer has increased bravery. They become generally aware of spells and items being used to negatively impact their mental state.]

[ ] [Courage:] Center
[The wearer's physical abilities rise in proportion to the level of natural and artificial fear they feel/are subjected to, up to double their natural peak]

[ ] [Courage:] Right
[The wearer has increased bravery. Casting the Rune renders the caster and nearby allies fearless for ten minutes but they are subjected to the fear they would have otherwise felt after the fact]
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Note how both Left and Right Increase Bravery.
The center being 'correct' would also fit with the usual simpleness the later trials have.

But those simple facts are just the header. The most important part is...
soulcake said:
To know Falsehood is to understand the Self.
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Guess which one of these three require you, the one coming seeking to prove yourself, to show case you have understanding of your self.

The Center. You need to have 100% complete understanding of your own capabilities and mindset, because if you do then the Center does everything the Left does as well. If your body is suddenly stronger than you expect by a bit, and you know that fear you feel isn't what you normally would be feeling, you know something else is effecting you, and you know how much based on your change in physical abilities. And thus, knowing there's an outside interference based on your own condition changing different from your previous experience, you know there is Falsehood.
 
[ ] [Courage:] Center

Good arguments have been made. I am convinced. It gives you strength to overcome the source of the fear, but does not obviate the fear. To use it properly you must know yourself and master your fear, without cheating.
 
LightMage said:
Bah, shallow thinking Beardlings.

Note how both Left and Right Increase Bravery.
The center being 'correct' would also fit with the usual simpleness the later trials have.

But those simple facts are just the header. The most important part is...

Guess which one of these three require you, the one coming seeking to prove yourself, to show case you have understanding of your self.

The Center. You need to have 100% complete understanding of your own capabilities and mindset, because if you do then the Center does everything the Left does as well. If your body is suddenly stronger than you expect by a bit, and you know that fear you feel isn't what you normally would be feeling, you know something else is effecting you, and you know how much based on your change in physical abilities. And thus, knowing there's an outside interference based on your own condition changing different from your previous experience, you know there is Falsehood.
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Neablis said:
[ ] [Courage:] Center

Good arguments have been made. I am convinced. It gives you strength to overcome the source of the fear, but does not obviate the fear. To use it properly you must know yourself and master your fear, without cheating.
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That is not strictly true.

Center reacts strictly to Fear. Which relates to the Courage Rune and the logic of reversing out based on the amp given is a good one.

Left reveals all negative mental debuffs + some bravery. By the wording it'lll include things like the Greed Curse thing that happen a feel trials back.
 
Re reading the chapter, I think there's always 1 clearly wrong option which is Right. That said using the literal interpretation the Riddle has a nuance.

The Riddle doesn't talk about Fear/Courage. The first half only talks about illusions/Trickery/Falsehoods. Of which only LEFT actually interacts with in any meaningful way.
 
Okay so with Resist, Overcome, endure (R+O+E) I think [Courage:] Left fits best. Specifically Resist/Overcome/Endure to Truth/Falsehoods/self .

Extra bravery will let you hit a R+O+E easier when you're afraid. Not just one aspect, but all of it at once. In this sense it's like it'll help you hit the next threshold to level up your reation

However more importantly you can ALSO R+O+E lies and mental manipulation with Left because you're now given the ability to meaningfully interact with negative mental manipulation. It won't help you the way extra bravery works with fear, but it does take you from mostly ignorant to being able to level playing field where your personal abilities will now determine R+O+E


abominable said:
Also, yeah, left.

If we pick left again for the last bit, then we've essentially been going around in circles.
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NOOO Please no

Not the Left Left Left Troll option.
 
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Evillevi said:
Re reading the chapter, I think there's always 1 clearly wrong option which is Right. That said using the literal interpretation the Riddle has a nuance.

The Riddle doesn't talk about Fear/Courage. The first half only talks about illusions/Trickery/Falsehoods. Of which only LEFT actually interacts with in any meaningful way.
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No, the left only interacts with them if they affect the mental state, which is not the same thing.

You are reading into the riddle a solution which is not present.

The center is the rune which best represents what is gained by mastery of self. So the question is do we want the rune that represents what the riddle says, or the one that would help you with part of the riddle, in exchange though it doesn't benefit from truly knowing yourself. It merely helps you know if you are being influenced.
 
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i do not think right will combo with our first choice. center is probably best.

our last choice and center have a general effect of get hit and get better for it.
 
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