It isn't in the hebrew or greek no. But the latin word for "evil" is also their word for "apple". So guess what the fruit of knowledge is?
Pineapple on pizza?

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What were his unorthodox teachings anyways? Being gay is okay? Old Testament and New Testament God were separate entities? Jesus was a lizard man?
The earth is flat, we should all jump into vulcanos and drink our own blood and the moon is actually an illusion.

No one ever said that he wasn´t ridiculed for a very good reason. It did take literal mindcontrol to get people to attend his sermons after all.
 
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You just described Protestantism in a nutshell. Protestants split into new churches based on ideological differences all the time (I was dragged along in two such splits growing up), so her father would not have gotten the scorn he did for doing so unless he was preaching something so vastly different from the norm that it was considered a cult instead of a new denomination. For context, Mormons are sitting on the border between a cult and a normal sect, so he would have to be more weird than them to get this reaction
I don't know, Mormons were considered a cult for a long time and have managed to make it out of that status by virtue of having a lot of members and lasting a while. I think if you had a very small denomination, you could be considered a cult while being less weird.
 
I've seen some speculation that her dad was actually anglican given he was married and had kids while appearing to be a priest. Granted i've heard that the Anglican Church nowadays is pretty progressive.

What were his unorthodox teachings anyways? Being gay is okay? Old Testament and New Testament God were separate entities? Jesus was a lizard man?
Alright I am going to go with an extremist sect of christianity for him that had always had some problems at least when it came to family and abuse. This was something another author said about their interpretation of the character that stuck me as pretty on point.
Edit: if any one want to check out this authors story it is called As N Approaches Infinity by corisanna which I read on archive of our own it's a very good pmmm bleach crossover that I highly recommend
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I think Papa Sakura is a really complex character we only see posthumously through the eyes of a daughter who damn near worshipped him. Plus she internalizes a lot of blame on herself. And in my story, the adults only know the end result and, as parents of kids with powers, abhor it and skew heavily toward "he was always a monster."

I do think that existential terror was a major factor. But he also had underlying issues that let him not merely derail but jump to a different, terrifying set of tracks given that stressor. The Different Story manga shows him drunkenly say some truly dark shit to Kyoko after the discovery and beat his wife. The PSP game adds that he threatened to beat Momo. I think the existential terror and alcohol brought out the worst in him. But I think he also felt betrayal toward Kyoko.

"I always thought it was exactly the opposite, where he preached peace and love but in a way that didn't mesh with scripture."
Yeah. The thing is, Kyoko is the narrator for her backstory and is notably vague on what his actual teachings were aside from saying the Scripture was outdated. And Kyoko doesn't say what her father identified as the evils of the world nor his proposed solution/doctrine for it. There are those who see a wrathful God as a loving God and collective suicide as the pinnacle of peace. There are those who identify the evils of the world as [insert persecuted group here]'s existence and their eradication as the best solution. (See: The various batshit preachers who say natural disasters are because God is angry that his followers allow The Gays to exist.) It all depends on the individual's goalposts, morals, and mental health.

I kinda have a stack of research and writing I did for the Sakura family backstory, including some stuff I gathered about cults and historical schisms within Christianity. But one thing that always stuck out to me even just from the anime is that the dad was shown taking his very young daughters out to preach in the streets when he knew he would be drawing abuse (as with the person who threw water on him) and he prioritized preaching in the streets over finding a way to provide for his family and preaching in his time off. That was the biggest red flag to me. And then there's a Different Story flashback to a time before her wish that he found out about the apple Kyoko stole to share with the family after the mom cut it up and he made Kyoko eat the whole thing because "we don't need it, and you got it after all." He would let his family starve for principle while inflicting multiple levels of guilt on Kyoko when it was his actions that moved her to those actions.

I have a lot of Feelings about that family. I was never religious but I spent a lot of time in the households of friends whose parents very much were. Especially the Evangelical church leadership that lived across the street from me. They were pretty decent people, very "God is Love," but even they could swerve off into WTFland and be strict in the weirdest ways and/or say things that made me wonder about their church. So I'm experimenting.
 
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What were his unorthodox teachings anyways? Being gay is okay? Old Testament and New Testament God were separate entities? Jesus was a lizard man?
There are litteral demons stalking our streets, abducting people into twisted hellscapes to kill them and devour their souls. Sometimes these demons let someone loose, but leave their Mark upon them, but make no mistake those who bear the Mark of the devil are mere pawns of the demon, carrying its wicked will into our world. Murders, suicides, disappearances of all stripes, all lies we tell ourselves to not agknowledge the supernatural forces that are killing us every day.

If someone caught a glimpse of the truth and Kyubey wasn't doing his mind wipes on them (like we know Kyubey didn't do on Kyoko's dad at least once), it'd be easy to come off like a doomsday prophet cultist. And Kyoko did contextualize her situation really easily.

Kyoko's dad might have been a monster, or the fluffy Satan Kyoko made a deal with might have given him a push in order to put Kyoko into a situation where she was more likely to make an ill advised wish. Wouldn't be the first time Kyubey's used Christian beliefs to advance his own agenda. Joan of Arc anyone?
 
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I'd like to know what he was actually saying, actually.

Was it just stuff like "hey maybe homosexuality isn't a sin", or was it like that preacher in The Backwater Gospel ?

The PSP game actually gives us a little bit of this! He preaches about how Despair is the root of all evil, and Hope is the ultimate virtue that will save the world. Basically he's a Madokamist. However, he literally says "The scripture cannot save anyone, we need a new faith, I'll speak in my own words", and the congregation was just.... not fucking having that at all. Admittedly it was also implied he was preaching that there are no actual sins except for malice (theft, murder) and that stuff like homosexuality was all gucci. So, y'know.

Also, while researching this I have to amend my earlier post. Apples... are Momo's favorite food. Kyouko eats them because they remind her of the last thing she wasn't able to indulge her sister in.

God fucking dammit, Urobuchi.

EDIT: Ugh god no wonder Kyouko fucking nearly choked out Sayaka's ass when she threw an apple to the floor.
 
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The PSP game actually gives us a little bit of this! He preaches about how Despair is the root of all evil, and Hope is the ultimate virtue that will save the world. Basically he's a Madokamist. However, he literally says "The scripture cannot save anyone, we need a new faith, I'll speak in my own words", and the congregation was just.... not fucking having that at all. Admittedly it was also implied he was preaching that there are no actual sins except for malice (theft, murder) and that stuff like homosexuality was all gucci. So, y'know.

Also, while researching this I have to amend my earlier post. Apples... are Momo's favorite food. Kyouko eats them because they remind her of the last thing she wasn't able to indulge her sister in.

God fucking dammit, Urobuchi.
That whole "The books' words cannot help us, my words will" doesn't sound much like a preacher who cares about god. Not one bit. This actually feeds into my theory that Kyouko's father cared more about power than anything else.

There is a reason why sects of Christianity like Mormanism are despised by those other sects. It's because they looked at the holy book, the written word of god in their eyes, and said "that's not how god works, this is, and we'll write our own book for proof!". It's basically saying that you know more about god than those who wrote the bible, and, depending on your view of the bible, god himself.

Kyouko's father has done the same thing, even if his version of Christianity is a lot less 'hateful' than the teachings of other sects. It essentially stated to his congregation that his word is above the word of scripture, of God. That's why they left when he did this, they saw him either as a blasphemer or a megalomaniac

And, given the multiple acts of malice that have been mentioned that he has done, he may not even believe in his own teachings. Granted, a good portion of it was done after Kyouko revealed her wish, but still.

Perhaps that's why he went insane after the wish was revealed?? Because his congregation, his power, wasn't something he gained himself, but something that was gifted to him by some higher power. A power that could take it all away at will. And to a megalomaniac, there's nothing scarier.

(Obligatory 'could be completely wrong')
 
That whole "The books' words cannot help us, my words will" doesn't sound much like a preacher who cares about god. Not one bit. This actually feeds into my theory that Kyouko's father cared more about power than anything else.

There is a reason why sects of Christianity like Mormanism are despised by those other sects. It's because they looked at the holy book, the written word of god in their eyes, and said "that's not how god works, this is, and we'll write our own book for proof!". It's basically saying that you know more about god than those who wrote the bible, and, depending on your view of the bible, god himself.

Kyouko's father has done the same thing, even if his version of Christianity is a lot less 'hateful' than the teachings of other sects. It essentially stated to his congregation that his word is above the word of scripture, of God. That's why they left when he did this, they saw him either as a blasphemer or a megalomaniac

And, given the multiple acts of malice that have been mentioned that he has done, he may not even believe in his own teachings. Granted, a good portion of it was done after Kyouko revealed her wish, but still.

Perhaps that's why he went insane after the wish was revealed?? Because his congregation, his power, wasn't something he gained himself, but something that was gifted to him by some higher power. A power that could take it all away at will. And to a megalomaniac, there's nothing scarier.

(Obligatory 'could be completely wrong')

...Um. Okay, nice character assassination of Kyouko's dad.

The reason he flipped out and destroyed his family is because he abused alcohol for the first time in his life after learning his daughter literally sold her soul to the devil (as far as he figured), and that he was bewitched to steal the free will of humans. When she tells him, he literally goes out into the street and tests it with impossible 'gospels', like "Murder is awesome," "God sucks", "The sky is purple", "The walls are made of candy", and everyone keeps AGREEING.

He broke because she told him that he can never convince anyone of anything in sincere faith, he's just brainwashing them. He very clearly didn't want power.

The sentiment of "The old scripture is outdated, we need a new faith" is very common in non-Abrahamic centric faiths, like uh... Baha'i. Which has the literal premise of proposing all the world's religions are different lessons in humanity's development and God sends new manifestations of Truth when we graduate to the next level of our education.
 
...Um. Okay, nice character assassination of Kyouko's dad.

The reason he flipped out and destroyed his family is because he abused alcohol for the first time in his life after learning his daughter literally sold her soul to the devil (as far as he figured), and that he was bewitched to steal the free will of humans. When she tells him, he literally goes out into the street and tests it with impossible 'gospels', like "Murder is awesome," "God sucks", "The sky is purple", "The walls are made of candy", and everyone keeps AGREEING.

He broke because she told him that he can never convince anyone of anything in sincere faith, he's just brainwashing them. He very clearly didn't want power.

The sentiment of "The old scripture is outdated, we need a new faith" is very common in non-Abrahamic centric faiths, like uh... Baha'i. Which has the literal premise of proposing all the world's religions are different lessons in humanity's development and God sends new manifestations of Truth when we graduate to the next level of our education.
Well, once again I put my foot so far in my mouth it comes out my ass, because I keep going off incomplete information.

Thanks for letting me know of that.

Damn. And it would have been so much easier to just say he was a bad dude through and through. Then again, It's PMMM, It's never that fucking easy.
 
I figured it was just one of the boring heresies, like universalism (the concept that because God is good, no one goes to Hell forever and they'll get saved eventually).

Edit: Oh wow. I didn't even notice that there was another page.
 
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I'm gonna post this so I can keep myself from forgetting that I'm not just rereading PMAS. Behold the least necessary thing in all of PMAS history!

March 28th up to and including the Timestop Hunt (although not thoroughly)
Meal TypeFoodWho Ate WhatLinks
March 28th
SnackStrawberry Cake (Mami-made)Sayaka, Madoka, Mami, and SabrinaHere
DinnerFast Food (Burger and Fries specified for Sabrina)Sayaka, Madoka, Mami, and SabrinaHere
March 29th
BreakfastPancakesMami and SabrinaHere
LunchDonburiSabrinaHere
DinnerSmall Restaurant (No further specifications)Mami and SabrinaHere
March 30th + Timestop Hunt
BreakfastWafflesMami and SabrinaHere
LunchAll You Can Eat (Barbeque Pork mentioned)Kyouko, Yuma, and SabrinaHere
DinnerDelivery (Rice mentioned but it's Japan) Madoka, Sayaka, Mami, Nagisa, and SabrinaHere
Timestop MealPasta PomodoroMami, Homura, and SabrinaMade and Eaten (Mami and Sabrina) then Eaten (Homura)

There! The table no one asked for! Kind of a weird thing to do now that I think about it. Whatever.

Shout out to @Redshirt Army for the day planner. It was invaluable in figuring out everything.
 
Thank you both for the extensive analysis. My familiarity with PMMM is strictly the original 13 episode run and the movie remake of that run, so I know next to nothing about all the other craziness the series has gotten up to. I wasn't even aware it had spinoff games.
Yeah, Kinda mad that Magia Record ended in NA.

Also, take at least half of what I said with a grain of industrial grade salt. This was based on bits of information I had picked up here and there, through various means. Also, though this was mentioned before, I should point out that I myself have never seen PMMM.
 
Yeah, Kinda mad that Magia Record ended in NA.

Also, take at least half of what I said with a grain of industrial grade salt. This was based on bits of information I had picked up here and there, through various means. Also, though this was mentioned before, I should point out that I myself have never seen PMMM.

THEN GO WATCH IT! It remains the only anime series I've gone out of my way to rewatch in its entirety, and the first of two series that I have cosplayed more than one character from. That's how much of an impact it had on me despite my not going for the followup materials. It's not even long and it's on Crunchyroll, so time isn't an excuse.

Those two characters were Homura and Mami, fyi, though the second attempt (Mami) was much better than the first.

Edit: The dub is fantastic, btw, so it's worth checking out for an episode to see if you like the format better. Sayaka's voice actor gets all the props.
 
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Well, once again I put my foot so far in my mouth it comes out my ass, because I keep going off incomplete information.

Thanks for letting me know of that.

Damn. And it would have been so much easier to just say he was a bad dude through and through. Then again, It's PMMM, It's never that fucking easy.

It's PMMM, he's a dead loved one who's absence hurts a character so he was amazing and wonderful.

When Kyouko says he cries at the morning paper, the PSP game shows he's not kidding. Full on like, "There's a Wanted ad for a missing purse... it says it was stolen. Why... why would someone do something so selfish and cruel? I know perhaps he had a deep need of his own but why don't we as a society help each other? Why..."

Like... dude was distressingly fragile.
 
It's PMMM, he's a dead loved one who's absence hurts a character so he was amazing and wonderful.
When Kyouko says he cries at the morning paper, the PSP game shows he's not kidding. Full on like, "There's a Wanted ad for a missing purse... it says it was stolen. Why... why would someone do something so selfish and cruel? I know perhaps he had a deep need of his own but why don't we as a society help each other? Why..."
Like... dude was distressingly fragile.
That perhaps explains a bit about his descent into madness and suicide, then. Because he sounds like even relatively small things could hit him very hard.
 
I still think it's pretty questionable that he couldn't like, get a job in addition to his preaching? Did that stuff make it difficult to get a job? Because if he could get a job to provide for his family and just didn't that leads me to believe that he wasn't able to put the well being of his wife and children over his own personal beliefs. What about his wife, did she not have a job? I know that even having a job doesn't mean you'll get out of poverty but at least trying would've been good right?
 
I still think it's pretty questionable that he couldn't like, get a job in addition to his preaching? Did that stuff make it difficult to get a job? Because if he could get a job to provide for his family and just didn't that leads me to believe that he wasn't able to put the well being of his wife and children over his own personal beliefs. What about his wife, did she not have a job? I know that even having a job doesn't mean you'll get out of poverty but at least trying would've been good right?

...you understand that being a priest is like...an actual job, right? And that a lot of denominations don't allow you to have a secular occupation the same way Catholicism doesn't allow priests to marry?

To say nothing of the possibility that he couldn't find work because of his extremely negative reputation.
 
To say nothing of the fact that getting a job instead of revitalizing the church would've basically been an admission that he doesn't think God will provide for him, it that his faith is misplaced. Like come on I know most of you are atheists on this forum but come on.
 
To say nothing of the fact that getting a job instead of revitalizing the church would've basically been an admission that he doesn't think God will provide for him, it that his faith is misplaced. Like come on I know most of you are atheists on this forum but come on.
Well I'm not an atheist, but i probably don't know as much about the faith as I should.

(Mainly because sitting in church is boring as hell (heh) , even though I still go to it every Sunday per family tradition.)
 
...well that's four pages I'm way too late to weigh in on. Probably for the best, that...

So uh, iirc before we suddenly did homusocial, I was asking us to hunt down the whoever-the-fuck(s?) who were incoming to the city via Oriko's... whatever the word is for her power. Because Kyubey timing things so they'd murder our friends while we were away would be so fucking classic Kyubey.

It's been a while and I ain't doing too good IRL rn and I'm on mobile so saying or finding anything is a pain. Who was it that was going to arrive next week? Also Redshirt Army I think the day planner needs updating at some point iirc

Edit: why did my phone autocorrect "friends" into "girlfriends" wtf
 
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