Remove ads

Puella Magi Adfligo Systema

Reader mode
Guilop said:
I mean a honest answer to this would be that Kyouko kinda expects Mami to attack her as soon as she shows up. Kyouko fairly obviously wants to reconcile with Mami and is just very Kyouko about it, but apart from that what is she expecting? The main thing we have to plan around is probably Kyouko torpedoing herself.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
On which note, I find it very interesting that Kyouko is as worried about a reunion as she is, in contrast to The Different Story where she had to be warned about Mami's reaction to the witchbomb.

And, especially because this...
Firnagzen said:
"If I'm wrong, if Mami attacks you, then I end the fight," you say. "Homura and Sayaka, too."

"As if you'd have a chance," Kyouko spits, pulling her legs up onto the flat rock and hugging her knees to her chest.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Lines up a lot with someone expecting to be shot out of nowhere, as during episode 10.

Might be worth looking into Kyouko having alternate timeline echoes too.
 
[Q] The mind of Koko is an eternal mystery, even to a being such as we.

[] She's hoping to reconcile, but worried that you'll pick up where you left off.
-[] You promised to talk about her first to keep that from happening.
 
God every moment we spend with Mami like this is so gooey and soul-meltingly warm and pure.

Also I sorta laughed when Sayaka pegged Homura with "You've been burned on this before, huh?"

Like damn she's gonna ride the bus and when she gets off be like "Hold up, Homura's a goddamn time traveler."
 
What koko expects?

1. Sabrina to stop Mami from shooting.
2. To put her foot in her mouth while trying to reconcile due being Tsundere. (She may be in denial about this.)
3. Mumihugs. (She may be in denial about this to, due to Tsundere.)

Edit: 4. She probably should expects Mami to spoil grandkouhai rotten.
 
Last edited:
Firnagzen said:
"And... don't get hung up for too long on, like, the details and such," you say, waving a hand vaguely. "Like... There's a fine line between consideration and hesitation - the former is wisdom, the latter is fear, and all that stuff, you know? Homura and I are here if you have any questions, or doubts, and I'm always happy to lend a listening ear or a shoulder."
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Someone's been playing Path of Exile, eh?
 
I think I should take the initiative in vote crafting. Just a draft for now.

[] Answer about Kyouko
- [] I think a coin flip between you still being mad at her and me magically fixing things
- [] Kyouko is pessimistic about herself to the point that she probably leans towards the former
- [] I want to help you dissuade her of that notion
[] When asked about what she should do
- [] You think Mami should approach this with openness, honesty, and understanding. Emotionally as well as otherwise. It's behind all your relationships with the people you care about, and you don't think the heart of the answer is different here.
[] Onwards with dinner!
- [] Experiment with magic cosplay and set the table as maid-brina. With hair extensions.
- [] Any particular dinner conversation?
[] Arrange the meeting with Kyouko
- [TODO] GET THIS FILLED BY BETTER VOTECRAFTERS
 
Just spitballing here, but:

[ ] I think Kyouko really does want to reconcile, but doesn't know how - and doesn't feel like she *deserves* forgiveness.
-[ ] She's scared - she was worried that you'd try to fight her as soon as you met.

I'm... not sure how deep into the Kyouko psychoanalysis we should go. Should we tell Mami about our "suicide by cop" interpretation of what Kyouko was doing? Mention Kyouko's thoughts about how "there's a place for people like me"?
 
Redshirt Army said:
I'm... not sure how deep into the Kyouko psychoanalysis we should go. Should we tell Mami about our "suicide by cop" interpretation of what Kyouko was doing? Mention Kyouko's thoughts about how "there's a place for people like me"?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Prrrrrobably not, no. Although we might have to break it out if we fuck up the explanation and Mami thinks the source of Kyouko's anxiety is the threat of violence from her.
 
Redshirt Army said:
I'm... not sure how deep into the Kyouko psychoanalysis we should go. Should we tell Mami about our "suicide by cop" interpretation of what Kyouko was doing? Mention Kyouko's thoughts about how "there's a place for people like me"?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
We told Kyoko that we'd explain her actions to Mami. "Suicide by cop" is a bit specific to be presented on its own, but we should talk about how it was more self harm than an earnest whatever-the-fuck.

I'm less sure of the stuff Kyoko's said to us. What happened between Kyoko and Mami is Mami's business. The rest might not be.
 
On a surface level Kyouko is afraid that Mami will reject her, much like Mami fears of her. Kyouko being Kyouko says it more as being afraid of getting shot, because of course she does. So telling Mami something in that vein should fit, maybe?
"Kyouko regrets breaking it off as well, and is afraid of getting rebuffed again."
 
For some reason, whenever Homura's shield gets described with a sound of "a clatter of gears", I keep thinking "Ack, she's not Rev-matching"
 
Firnagzen said:
"W-what does she want?" she whispers, finally
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Firnagzen said:
"What I m-meant to ask is, I- we didn't really..." Mami shakes her head. "She- we fought, Sabrina. You... you know that, right? Is..." She takes a shaky breath. "What is she expecting?"
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I'm reading some underlying nervousness over whether Kyouko wants this or not, basically. The "expecting" question is very much double meaning'ed, i.e., "what is she expecting to get out of this" as well as "what is she expecting to happen", and probably meant in both ways.

Under that reading -- which is basically the correct reading once you take the first line, that she rephrased into the second, into account -- we basically need to do something like...

[] Kyouko has a complicated underlying mess of depression and self-blame that makes it difficult to pinpoint exact motivations behind her beliefs. Up until semi-recently you think it's unlikely Kyouko would've sought to reconcile with Mami even without the fight.
-[] That said, at present, by your understanding Kyouko would like to reconcile with Mami but is reluctant to believe that an attempt could possibly go well.

... Is what I would say, except I don't know that...

I don't know that explaining Kyouko's psychoses to Mami is actually a good idea. It could do some awkward things to the conversation between the two, we don't want Mami viewing Kyouko with pity.

On the other hand, openness is a good thing.

Third hand, alternative option is...

[X] Kyouko would like to reconcile with her, but has a *lot* of difficulty believing that that's possible. Whether she believes it's Mami or herself or both of them that makes reconciliation hard varies. If that wasn't your understanding of matters you wouldn't be doing this.
-[X] You won't lie and tell her that fighting Kyouko didn't hurt things on both sides. She knows that full well. You won't lie and tell her that Kyouko doesn't think being shot at is a possibility. You will tell her that that only makes this more important.

i think I like that one better.
 
I had an idea, for how you could plausibly duplicate Sabrina's ability to make Clear seeds, with normal Meguca powers.

You really only need 2 things, a Meguca that can transfer grief between grief seeds, and a Meguca, that can keep a Grief seed from hatching for a time, we know the Grief transfer is possible for normal Meguca, and the ability to keep an overfilled seed from hatching(for a short time at least), don't sound like it should be beyond a normal wish.

This method would be more risky, and cost 2 Grief seeds to make 1 Clear seed of course, but I think it could work.

Then there's the potential to wish for the ability to transfer Grief into Familiars, they're proto-witches after all, and as Sabrina has seen they have a grief core, even if it's incomplete, so such a wish, could allow you to use Familiars as grief seeds, though at the cost of maybe turning them into witches, but is that really a cost, or is that a bonus, of it also providing you prey to get normal grief seeds from?

If nothing else, a Grief Seed suppression power, would work wonder, for stretching a Grief Seed amongst a larger group, as even if you can only keep it from hatching so long, if such a power can let a dozen girls, empty their soul gems into an already full Seed before feeding it to Kyuubei, it would certainly stretch their Grief Seed supply.

But really Grief controllers, should be amazing to have as part of a strong team, because such teams should be able to deal with boosted witches, normal Grief control used properly, basically sound like it's increasing the difficulty, in return for also increasing the reward, by doing things like emptying all your soul gems into a witch, then having a harder time defeating the boosted witch, so they should basically be something toxic to weak teams, but really good for a big strong team to have.

Also if this has already been discussed I apologize, I was away from this thread for a long time.
Firnagzen said:
"That'd be fantastic," you say. "'cuz... yeah. I'm preeeetty sure Mitakihara is going to be a target."

"Unfortunately, I concur," Yuki says. "We'll be there, when the time comes."
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I'm kind of hoping/dreading that it turn out Mitakihara isn't a target, Iowa has apparently managed to successfully plunder dozens of groups of magical girls, that hint that they're rather good at planning, and if they actually know just how valuable a Clear Seed is, well then why would they target Mitakihara, Sabrina has handed out multiple Clear Seeds to less powerful groups, and there's no chance, of accidentally killing the goose that lay golden eggs, if they decide to steal the Pleiades Saints/the University group's/Sendai's Clear Seeds, so just because I would like to see competent enemies that actually think things though, I'm hoping Iowa's actual plan is to go in, grab a few Clear Seeds, and then flee the country.

They're noted to be good at picking their targets, so I really don't see why that would be an exception here, sure they could get an even bigger payday, capturing Sabrina and forcing her to make them Clear Seeds, but when you consider that the payday from just stealing a Clear Seed, is already decades where they don't need to worry about Grief Seeds, I don't see why they would risk the option, that might have hundreds of magical girls coming down on them, because a captured Sabrina, told Nadia that she would make a Clear Seed, for anyone assisting in freeing her.

Their normal tactics are extortion of course, but this is not a normal job, normally they target weaker magical girls, not groups with multiple powerhouses, who have dozens of allies who will come assist them, using their normal tactics here would just be stupid, it's more likely they track down someone who has gotten a Clear Seed, and beat them up until they hand it over.

[X] Kyouko would like to reconcile with her, but has a *lot* of difficulty believing that that's possible. Whether she believes it's Mami or herself or both of them that makes reconciliation hard varies. If that wasn't your understanding of matters you wouldn't be doing this.
-[X] You won't lie and tell her that fighting Kyouko didn't hurt things on both sides. She knows that full well. You won't lie and tell her that Kyouko doesn't think being shot at is a possibility. You will tell her that that only makes this more important.
 
tarrangar said:
had an idea, for how you could plausibly duplicate Sabrina's ability to make Clear seeds, with normal Meguca powers.

You really only need 2 things, a Meguca that can transfer grief between grief seeds, and a Meguca, that can keep a Grief seed from hatching for a time, we know the Grief transfer is possible for normal Meguca, and the ability to keep an overfilled seed from hatching(for a short time at least), don't sound like it should be beyond a normal wish.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Ah, we're trying to stop filling Grief Seeds with more Grief. Not chose one unfortunate target to overfill constantly. Also, the net-average of "grief in seeds" hasn't dropped, compared to Sabrina directly removing grief from the System into her own.

These are souls we're trying to save, yo. Clear Seeds are a temporary, unfortunate compromise until we can figure out a way to drain grief without using Souls and not need our constant involvement.
 
tarrangar said:
it's more likely they track down someone who has gotten a Clear Seed, and beat them up until they hand it over.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Everyone we've given a Clear Seed to knows to call us if that happens, then we'll hit the attackers like Madokami's arrow. Iowa's best shot at getting a Clear Seed aside from requesting probation is to neutralize Homura and/or Sabrina before we know they're there.
 
tarrangar said:
because I would like to see competent enemies that actually think things though, I'm hoping Iowa's actual plan is to go in, grab a few Clear Seeds, and then flee the country.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I do agree that stealing a Clear Seed from one of the peripheral groups we've handed them out to would be more in the interests of the Iowa group.

That said, targeting us directly doesn't necessarily imply incompetence - we've long suspected that Iowa might be aimed at us by Kyubey, and if that's the case, Kyubey will obviously go out of its way to make sure his troubleshooting group actually attacks the anomaly gumming up his system, instead of just hitting an irrelevant group and retiring.
 
Appletank said:
Ah, we're trying to stop filling Grief Seeds with more Grief. Not chose one unfortunate target to overfill constantly. Also, the net-average of "grief in seeds" hasn't dropped, compared to Sabrina directly removing grief from the System into her own.

These are souls we're trying to save, yo. Clear Seeds are a temporary, unfortunate compromise until we can figure out a way to drain grief without using Souls and not need our constant involvement.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Yeah I know that, and Sabrina wouldn't use those methods, I was more thinking how other groups might try to copy Clear Seeds, how much Grief is already in a Grief Seed, when it's acquired from a Witch is genuinely new information, when that information get out, there's probably going to be groups, that experiment with seeing if they can't replicate a Clear Seed, and one of the ways I can think of to do that, would be to work out a way, to shuffle 2 Seeds worth of grief into 1 Seed.
Torgamous said:
Everyone we've given a Clear Seed to knows to call us if that happens, then we'll hit the attackers like Madokami's arrow. Iowa's best shot at getting a Clear Seed aside from requesting probation is to neutralize Homura and/or Sabrina before we know they're there.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
If they do it properly they wont even be in the country when we learn what they did, Airi got a decent lead on us by knocking out Niko, if she had been focusing on running, she could have been in another city by the time we got to her, and we wouldn't have had the time to search all of Japan for her, so she could have gotten away with it if she had laid low.

Iowa might do the same, and if they have access to a teleporter or another form of movement power, they could knock out/kill someone with a Clear Seed, and by the time we learn about it, they're hiding in a small Australian town, even with Homura's timestop, we don't have the mental fortitude to search the whole world for them.
 
tarrangar said:
I was more thinking how other groups might try to copy Clear Seeds, how much Grief is already in a Grief Seed, when it's acquired from a Witch is genuinely new information, when that information get out, there's probably going to be groups, that experiment with seeing if they can't replicate a Clear Seed, and one of the ways I can think of to do that, would be to work out a way, to shuffle 2 Seeds worth of grief into 1 Seed
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I'm not seeing how that's really much different from simply overfilling a grief seed from normal use. You're not getting any benefit out of it, since the average of grief in seeds hasn't gone down. Sabrina's gamechanger is she meaningfully lowers the average.

I mean, sure, someone could try I guess. But the math doesn't really work out, outside of quickly dumping them at the Incubator. And even then, one has to consider the magic costs to do so.
 
Appletank said:
I'm not seeing how that's really much different from simply overfilling a grief seed from normal use. You're not getting any benefit out of it, since the average of grief in seeds hasn't gone down. Sabrina's gamechanger is she meaningfully lowers the average.

I mean, sure, someone could try I guess. But the math doesn't really work out, outside of quickly dumping them at the Incubator. And even then, one has to consider the magic costs to do so.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
The idea was basically getting someone, to wish for a power to prevent a Grief Seed from hatching, then getting a Grief controller to shuffle the Grief over to the suppressed Grief Seed, thereby allowing you to create an extremely overfilled Grief Seed, and an extremely drained Grief Seed, that will last far longer than a normal Grief Seed.

Basically the idea was that if you get someone that can prevent a Grief Seed from hatching for a time, you can absurdly overfil it, to create a much longer lasting Seed, and then feed the overfilled Seed to Kyuubei, the net Grief is still the same, but you have one overfilled Seed, and one very empty Seed, which mean the amount of Grief you will be able to dispose of has gone up.
 
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top