Raiseth
I Find Your Lack of Memes Disturbing
- Location
- Russia
Puella Magi Adfligo Systema
- Thread starter Firnagzen
- Start date
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- Tags
- puella magi adfligo systema puella magi madoka magica be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist bad decisions dating mami tomoe (tomoe mami) diabolical laughter friendship is the best ship handholding identity crises microwaving tea gets you put in the bad place names are important the body is the fursona of the soul this is not the baked goods thread we don't talk about rionna what could possibly go wrong? who in the world is azure sanfrancisco?
The Phoenixian
The Glacier Witch
- Location
- My own little world
- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
A few things.
First, I'd like to give her the detailed rundown of what happened in Fukushima that we skimmed through earlier - the details on Airi and dewitching, and the whole Iowa Group angle.
We can share our suspicions that Iowa might be fed information by Kyuubey - and even if they aren't, their modus operandi of attacking things the defenders find important as a terror tactic will raise certain... concerns for Homura.
I'd also like to argue to Homura to keep Madoka (and Hitomi) somewhat in the loop regarding our Iowa plans :
• Madoka was there when Nadia mentioned that the Iowa group exists, so knowing we're doing something about them should make her more comfortable with the situation, not less.
• Madoka being aware also makes it much simpler for Homura to keep her safe from Iowa - if we know Iowa's incoming while they're in class, Homura tell Madoka what's up and GTFO with her without any issues.
• Our deal with Fukushima to help provide foreign land for Yuki to claim is a pretty big political agreement, and we explicitly invited Madoka on the team to provide political advice. It'd be unwise to lock her out this early.
@The Phoenixian You were also planning to ask Homura more about last loop sometime, if I recall correctly? Don't know if that fits now, but if you want to go for it I won't mind.
- Location
- Illinois
Meanwhile I feel that Iowa is a chance to talk with Homura about how, specifically she is irreplaceably valuable to our efforts. 'cuz Iowa is exactly the sort of thing that could really fuck us up without her around, and it should be possible to segue into standing hypotheses on her impact as a deterrent, and all of this could play into keeping her standing long run.
That said, we have got to ask about last loop and I'm not sure that doesn't take priority over my social.
Did she simply ignore what sounded like another brain damage moment, or did she acknowledge the Rebellion reference and not follow up on it because there's other people around?
- Location
- Massachusetts
The simplest way to start would be with enchantments - something the crew are focusing on anyway. Pens that empower systemic perspective, pins that allow them into warded areas, rings that allow them to detect and resist witches - that sort of thing.
Actually modifying their allies might be in the cards as well with MG surgeons/biokinetics working with reinforcement/healing teams.
Organizational support would be the most powerful immediately and long term. To The Stars had the Mitakihara Four of the same time ally with their neighbors and take over a delivery company using support specialists and actual teleportation to beat their corporate rivals into the ground. They then expanded like crazy, buying and magically upgrading company after company, that they eventually ran a shadow empire while pushing for real world change - like decapitating the Yakuza.
Apparently the best way to become a world-spanning Puella Magi association is to have so much magic and money running through your organization that most of your members just end up regular people with magical jobs.
There are almost no Puella Magi settings where immediate enchantment upgrades would be possible simply because magic costs too much. However here we have Sabrina and a lot of idle Magi.
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Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
What rebellion reference?
Raiseth
I Find Your Lack of Memes Disturbing
- Location
- Russia
Blueberry.
SolipsistSerpent
Endlessly Devouring
From that song they sing? It might be too subtle for Sayaka.
Godwinson
"Well, I've got nothing."
You mean raspberry. Blueberry is a reference from elsewhere. In the cake song, Sayaka is associated with raspberry.
Raiseth
I Find Your Lack of Memes Disturbing
- Location
- Russia
The Phoenixian
The Glacier Witch
- Location
- My own little world
How does this look?
[] Timestop talk with Homura:
-[] You've asked about Iowa and indication is that they open by targeting places and people of personal significance, possibly with the help of either a clairvoyant or Kyuubey. Given how important Madoka is to everyone here, she and her family are likely target candidates. As are Sayaka's parents for that matter.
-[] You're planning to take the fight to Iowa once you know enough and have the needed allies but you feel it would be best to talk about how to prepare Madoka for the possibility of the fight coming to Mitakihara instead.
-[] Just knowing what to do will help immensely if she's in our position.
Made an adjustment to the rationale since if they're going after people and places of significance, families are just as big a target as Madoka herself
(In fact, if their informant is a real clairvoyant, rather than coobie, Sayaka's family being held might well be more likely than the alternative.)
Well, Firn wants it in the vote if possible so I'd appreciate if you could write up a proposal. I don't know your full intentions here.
- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
We need to tell Homura that we actively discussed hiring with Fukushima - this keeps "needed allies" unnecessarily vague.
Huh? "if she's in our position"? I don't get it, who's "she"? Iowa? Madoka?
It shouldn't be the focus, but we should briefly fill her in on Airi too.
DB_Explorer
Purveyor of alternate realities.
- Location
- San Diego, California
- Pronouns
- He/Him
HELP
IM TRAPPED IN THE WIKI
(also PMMM wiki cross referencing stuff)
IM TRAPPED IN THE WIKI
(also PMMM wiki cross referencing stuff)
The Phoenixian
The Glacier Witch
- Location
- My own little world
Whoops, missed an incomplete thought on the editing pass.
Revised version:
[] Timestop talk with Homura:
-[] Iowa plans
--[] You've asked about Iowa and indication is that they open by targeting places and people of personal significance, possibly with the help of either a clairvoyant or Kyuubey. Given how important Madoka is to everyone here, she and her family are likely target candidates. As are Sayaka's parents for that matter.
--[] You're planning to take the fight to Iowa once you know enough and can pay Fukushima --- and any other needed allies --- but you feel it would be best to talk about how to prepare Madoka for the possibility of the fight coming to Mitakihara instead.
--[] Just knowing what to do will help immensely if Madoka's targeted or caught up in things beyond our ability to prevent.
-[] In the background: Fill Homura in RE:Anri's progress.
Torgamous
Aspiring Gynoid
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Is there any part of this that needs Sayaka and Mami to be excluded? If not, we can talk about Anri first and include them for the rest.
Nagisa is also a possible target. On that note, I would like to talk to Shin about magic at most within a couple days of our dinner with Hitomi's parents. It's important that he knows to call us if anything happens.
- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
@The Phoenixian
How about:
[] Timestop talk with Homura:
-[] Offscreen: Fill her in on Airi's situation.
-[] Iowa Plans:
--[] You've asked about Iowa and indication is that they open by targeting places and people of personal significance, possibly with the help of either a clairvoyant or Kyuubey. Given how important Madoka is to everyone here, she and her family are likely target candidates. As are Sayaka's parents for that matter.
--[] You talked to Yuki about taking the fight to Iowa once you know enough and can gather allies. She was willing to provide her teams services in exchange for helping her claim territory for her power internationally.
--[] You feel it would be best to talk to Madoka about this:
--[] Just knowing what to do will help immensely if Madoka's targeted or caught up in things beyond our ability to prevent.
--[ ] Madoka already knows about the Iowa group, so telling her we're working on it might actually reassure her.
I think Homura would prefer if we discussed the Madoka situation with her first, before pulling others into it.
How about:
[] Timestop talk with Homura:
-[] Offscreen: Fill her in on Airi's situation.
-[] Iowa Plans:
--[] You've asked about Iowa and indication is that they open by targeting places and people of personal significance, possibly with the help of either a clairvoyant or Kyuubey. Given how important Madoka is to everyone here, she and her family are likely target candidates. As are Sayaka's parents for that matter.
--[] You talked to Yuki about taking the fight to Iowa once you know enough and can gather allies. She was willing to provide her teams services in exchange for helping her claim territory for her power internationally.
--[] You feel it would be best to talk to Madoka about this:
--[] Just knowing what to do will help immensely if Madoka's targeted or caught up in things beyond our ability to prevent.
--[ ] Madoka already knows about the Iowa group, so telling her we're working on it might actually reassure her.
I think Homura would prefer if we discussed the Madoka situation with her first, before pulling others into it.
Torgamous
Aspiring Gynoid
- Pronouns
- She/Her
We could ask. I think it would be weird not to include at least Mami, after last night.
- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
Fair point with Mami, since she knows how important Madoka is to Homura. We should ask Homura to include her.
- Location
- Illinois
So basically--
Unless we're planning on having this timestop be "tell Homu we're hitting Iowa and explain why, then ask about last loop" I very much want to tie the Iowa issue around into Homura's issues about her role in the present.
One of Homura's primary issues is her belief (held now in part and in the scenario of the Potentialbomb much moreso) that she makes things worse. Weakening that belief is extremely desirable for us, for all kinds of reasons.
However, ths great majority of options for approaching Homura about that topic are non-evidential, non-solid, or otherwise insufficient (often made so by her views and issues).
We've tried pretty frequently to attack her belief that she made things worse in the past, and it has sometimes maybe sort of worked. That angle basically centers around "no, you didn't hurt Madoka" and convincing Homura of that is... Awfully difficult.
Here, though, I think I see a chance to attack the idea that "Sabrina doesn't need me around in order to achieve our goals." Or, well, it's more the converse -- a chance to establish, rationally, that we do need her around to achieve our shared goals. I think that could be very valuable.
And honestly, all we've really got to do is tell the truth:
Iowa is a really bad matchup for us without Homura.
We expect Kyubey to try to murder us through angles resembling Iowa.
A threat like Iowa would massively constrain our options without Homura being around / Homura's existence has already let us do a lot of things we might not have been able to do otherwise, particularly outside Mitakihara.
Just... Thinking about what kind of reaction "Iowa is very powerful and is coming here with a clairvoyant and premeditated intent" might've drawn from us if Homura wasn't around...
It would be a huge problem. It really would. Things would not be under control, and Kyubey would use the hell out of that.
All of these are things I think we could really stand to tell Homura in conjunction with explaining our intention to and reasons for first striking Iowa.
And beyond even that, I am asking myself whether we should point out Homura's role as a deterrent. Because this has gotten me wondering how many other hypothetical problems have basically been staved off by Homura's passive presence -- by Kyubey (or, say, Rionna -- that one is pretty thoroughly proven but also a weak example) looking at us and Homura and going, "No, that won't work" -- and how many of those we can convince her she was probably *actually* responsible for staving off, and whether all of that would be worth exposing her to the existence of those hypotheticals (cuz she is paranoid enough already).
And this was pretty much why I had expected all of that to be better off next vote, cuz I think that between this stuff and talking about our plans re Iowa, I think that's a whole vote of social.
If we wanted to go the other route though... @The Phoenixian can you cook up... A...
...
*Actually looks at proposed vote*
...
Let's not give Homura a heart attack before we have to. I'm not saying this is a bad idea, I'm saying we don't need to do it -yet-. Let's exhaust our obvious options before we start talking about telling Madoka how hostile meguca are coming here to hurt her... Or, no, rather, before we tell her we HAVE to or SHOULD do that -- before we start pushing. Specifically let's at least be sure we can't just get Iowa's location from Oriko. I'm pretty sure we've at least got a couple days before any of that stuff becomes a possibility.
So, my preference would be much... Less.
[] Timestop:
-[] Offscreen: Fill her in on Airi's situation.
-[] Explain everything you have heard about Iowa's methodologies and tendencies, including Yuki's evaluation of them having clairvoyant-esque information and their noted travel path.
--[] There is far too high a chance that their "clairvoyant" is Kyubey, and you don't want them getting anywhere near Mitakihara. You've already gotten a price quote from Yuki in case you choose to buy their help with this and it's not unreasonable.
--[] You are VERY hopeful that Oriko's new magic will help with this problem.
--[] IF you don't manage to neutralize Iowa group abroad within a moderate timeframe you will NEED to read Madoka and Hitomi in on their likely intentions and the threat they pose, because either of them being caught off guard would be far, far worse than them knowing.
-[] Break. Don't leave timestop.
Unless we're planning on having this timestop be "tell Homu we're hitting Iowa and explain why, then ask about last loop" I very much want to tie the Iowa issue around into Homura's issues about her role in the present.
One of Homura's primary issues is her belief (held now in part and in the scenario of the Potentialbomb much moreso) that she makes things worse. Weakening that belief is extremely desirable for us, for all kinds of reasons.
However, ths great majority of options for approaching Homura about that topic are non-evidential, non-solid, or otherwise insufficient (often made so by her views and issues).
We've tried pretty frequently to attack her belief that she made things worse in the past, and it has sometimes maybe sort of worked. That angle basically centers around "no, you didn't hurt Madoka" and convincing Homura of that is... Awfully difficult.
Here, though, I think I see a chance to attack the idea that "Sabrina doesn't need me around in order to achieve our goals." Or, well, it's more the converse -- a chance to establish, rationally, that we do need her around to achieve our shared goals. I think that could be very valuable.
And honestly, all we've really got to do is tell the truth:
Iowa is a really bad matchup for us without Homura.
We expect Kyubey to try to murder us through angles resembling Iowa.
A threat like Iowa would massively constrain our options without Homura being around / Homura's existence has already let us do a lot of things we might not have been able to do otherwise, particularly outside Mitakihara.
Just... Thinking about what kind of reaction "Iowa is very powerful and is coming here with a clairvoyant and premeditated intent" might've drawn from us if Homura wasn't around...
It would be a huge problem. It really would. Things would not be under control, and Kyubey would use the hell out of that.
All of these are things I think we could really stand to tell Homura in conjunction with explaining our intention to and reasons for first striking Iowa.
And beyond even that, I am asking myself whether we should point out Homura's role as a deterrent. Because this has gotten me wondering how many other hypothetical problems have basically been staved off by Homura's passive presence -- by Kyubey (or, say, Rionna -- that one is pretty thoroughly proven but also a weak example) looking at us and Homura and going, "No, that won't work" -- and how many of those we can convince her she was probably *actually* responsible for staving off, and whether all of that would be worth exposing her to the existence of those hypotheticals (cuz she is paranoid enough already).
And this was pretty much why I had expected all of that to be better off next vote, cuz I think that between this stuff and talking about our plans re Iowa, I think that's a whole vote of social.
If we wanted to go the other route though... @The Phoenixian can you cook up... A...
...
*Actually looks at proposed vote*
...
Let's not give Homura a heart attack before we have to. I'm not saying this is a bad idea, I'm saying we don't need to do it -yet-. Let's exhaust our obvious options before we start talking about telling Madoka how hostile meguca are coming here to hurt her... Or, no, rather, before we tell her we HAVE to or SHOULD do that -- before we start pushing. Specifically let's at least be sure we can't just get Iowa's location from Oriko. I'm pretty sure we've at least got a couple days before any of that stuff becomes a possibility.
So, my preference would be much... Less.
[] Timestop:
-[] Offscreen: Fill her in on Airi's situation.
-[] Explain everything you have heard about Iowa's methodologies and tendencies, including Yuki's evaluation of them having clairvoyant-esque information and their noted travel path.
--[] There is far too high a chance that their "clairvoyant" is Kyubey, and you don't want them getting anywhere near Mitakihara. You've already gotten a price quote from Yuki in case you choose to buy their help with this and it's not unreasonable.
--[] You are VERY hopeful that Oriko's new magic will help with this problem.
--[] IF you don't manage to neutralize Iowa group abroad within a moderate timeframe you will NEED to read Madoka and Hitomi in on their likely intentions and the threat they pose, because either of them being caught off guard would be far, far worse than them knowing.
-[] Break. Don't leave timestop.
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Torgamous
Aspiring Gynoid
- Pronouns
- She/Her
We'd probably be with Mami doing the All-Seeing Ribbon Jellyfish full time.
[] Timestop talk with Homura:
-[] Offscreen: Fill her in on Airi's situation.
-[] Does she want to start including Mami in our Madoka Preservation Society meetings?
-[] Whatever we decide about Iowa
- Location
- Colorado
IIRC, Homura recently came clean to Mami about the time loops, right? Or am I thinking of a different story?
- Location
- Colorado
Then I would like to propose that we make it a point to include Mami in as many secret time stop meetings as possible, if we're just discussing Iowa then there's no reason to exclude her if the main topic is Iowa.