Spectral Waltz
Scatterbrained Writer
- Location
- Walking the Endless Corridors
Harsh but accurate.
I may try to work something of my own up based on it.
Puella Magi Adfligo Systema
- Thread starter Firnagzen
- Start date
-
- Tags
- puella magi adfligo systema puella magi madoka magica be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist bad decisions dating mami tomoe (tomoe mami) diabolical laughter friendship is the best ship handholding identity crises microwaving tea gets you put in the bad place names are important the body is the fursona of the soul this is not the baked goods thread we don't talk about rionna what could possibly go wrong? who in the world is azure sanfrancisco?
I may try to work something of my own up based on it.
- Location
- Illinois
@Firnagzen madomadomado?
Right, basically. Yeah it does need some compliments in there but at heart the reason why Sayaka isn't screwed up this loop is that we dodged all her character flaws and turned them against QB while earning her loyalty and friendship.
Onmur
Archangel of Nutella.
I think it would be alright to take some credit for Sayaka doing much better in Homura's eyes this loop.
Homura should be able to relate.
[ ] How do I being to explain Miki Sayaka:
-[ ] Sayaka is normal. She's not prepared for the Magical Girl life... because that's how KB designed the system.
-[ ] KB isolates Magical Girls. Sayaka? She just needs a little helpful nudge here and there from someone she can trust. To stop the little problems from snowballing into something horrible.
-[ ] We tried our best to provide that, to help Sayaka deal with things she doesn't understand; and to reward her efforts, to break her out of the system KB traps meguca into.
-[ ] That's all we did. Helpful nudges here and there. Everything else is just Sayaka.
-[ ] Basically we cheated with metaknowledge.
--[ ] Hug Homura to enhance this point.
Homura should be able to relate.
[ ] How do I being to explain Miki Sayaka:
-[ ] Sayaka is normal. She's not prepared for the Magical Girl life... because that's how KB designed the system.
-[ ] KB isolates Magical Girls. Sayaka? She just needs a little helpful nudge here and there from someone she can trust. To stop the little problems from snowballing into something horrible.
-[ ] We tried our best to provide that, to help Sayaka deal with things she doesn't understand; and to reward her efforts, to break her out of the system KB traps meguca into.
-[ ] That's all we did. Helpful nudges here and there. Everything else is just Sayaka.
-[ ] Basically we cheated with metaknowledge.
--[ ] Hug Homura to enhance this point.
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- Location
- Illinois
No, y'know what, no. I don't like this. Mura's right.
I'll come edit this in a while when I'm more awake.
blast flame
How far will we go if it means lighting the way?
- Location
- Perth, Australia
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Why is this a problem?
Looks like a solution to me.
Yeah, I'm really not sure I like talking about Sayaka this way.
It's pretty easy to forget that Homura can be pretty damned callous since we're close friends with her and can see past that sort of thing to see the genuine goodness underneath. I can see what she's saying, but it's, uh, kind of a jerk thing to say regardless.
Well,
I think you might be buying too much into Homura's view point of her, though there is some truth to it to be fair.
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Spectral Waltz
Scatterbrained Writer
- Location
- Walking the Endless Corridors
[] Sayaka is stubborn, proud, and absolutely willing to do anything she can for her friends, and all three of those traits have their better and worse sides.
-[] She's not impossible to sway, merely difficult.
-[] In other times, you make her your enemy because you threatened her friends, because she learned the wrong things at the wrong times and drew the wrong conclusions.
-[] And once you get her like that, make an enemy of her, that stubbornness makes it harder than ever for her to see you as a friend, and that pride makes it easy for her to fall when it's broken by the world.
-[] But If you're open with her, give her a chance to see you as a friend first, teach her how the world works before it can break her, then she can recover from it, her pride can strengthen your bond, her stubbornness means that she will never stop trying to do her best for you.
-[] It's not an easy road, it takes time and careful steps, but it can be done. It has been done,
Not x-ing, just spitballing.
-[] She's not impossible to sway, merely difficult.
-[] In other times, you make her your enemy because you threatened her friends, because she learned the wrong things at the wrong times and drew the wrong conclusions.
-[] And once you get her like that, make an enemy of her, that stubbornness makes it harder than ever for her to see you as a friend, and that pride makes it easy for her to fall when it's broken by the world.
-[] But If you're open with her, give her a chance to see you as a friend first, teach her how the world works before it can break her, then she can recover from it, her pride can strengthen your bond, her stubbornness means that she will never stop trying to do her best for you.
-[] It's not an easy road, it takes time and careful steps, but it can be done. It has been done,
Not x-ing, just spitballing.
DB_Explorer
Purveyor of alternate realities.
- Location
- San Diego, California
- Pronouns
- He/Him
And then Homucifer splits from Homura to take Madokami away.
Everyone else: wut
Battleship_Fusou
(The Itty-Bitty Pretty Battleship Kitty)
- Location
- Surigao Strait
We should ask what sort of munitions tend to have the best effect on Walpurgisnacht.
Onmur
Archangel of Nutella.
Sabrina: *Tacklehugs Homucifer before she can get away*
blast flame
How far will we go if it means lighting the way?
- Location
- Perth, Australia
- Pronouns
- They/Them
I think we're primarily getting them to deal with other enemies. They didn't seem to effective in the series and I assume those were the most effective ones she knew of.
The Phoenixian
The Glacier Witch
- Location
- My own little world
Hmm... so I'm thinking Kaizuki has the right idea here, even if it isn't yet fully formed. With that in mind, I'd like to give my thoughts on the rest of the vote.
[]How do you respond:
- [] Kaizuki's post-revision thoughts.
[] During the raid
- [] Mix goofy lightheartedness with the rest of what you do. Encourage Homura to geek out a bit over the goods.
-- [] See a warship. Want it. Ask Homura to talk you out of taking it.
-[] Ask if Homura if she knows any Yakuza places other than Mitakihara, to hit somewhere fresh and avoid a magical girl looking into things.
There's probably a lot more to add here, but what comes to mind is mostly flavor to the lighter side of things.
[] Afterwards:
- [] Meet with Oriko to discuss Homura and the potentialbomb
-- [] Make an enchanted Griefhax psychometer for The Feather at some point during the meeting.
It's time to get to work on figuring stuff out. Beyond that, I'd like to specifically move for contacting Kyoko to being the second of these three tasks we do today. Mainly so that we don't call her too early, since she's complained about her sleep before.
Plus doing it like that means we can also talk to the University group shortly after talking to Yuki to keep things neat and tidy WRT all of that.
As far as the psychometer goes, maybe it will work, maybe it won't. I think it's simple and painless enough to be worth trying however, and it's both been on my mind for quite some time, a possible path to learning about Feathers and very relevant here. (There's also the possibility of variations on a theme, such as something to see what and who the feather used to be part of by just looking at the thing itself but I think the psychometer is just simpler to describe and is a good method to achieve the same essential purpose.)
----------
(As far as talking to Yuki herself goes there's a few other things that occur to me: We missed out on talking to her about the real purpose of clear seeds since we miswrote the vote last time and I think informing her that we intend to research dewitching is pretty important. For honesty's sake, since it relates to why her prisoner agreed to be contained, if nothing else.
Beyond that, next time we meet her in person it may be a good idea to check how much she knows about who else is witchbombed around the region. It seems like a pretty important detail to know after all.
It may be minor in the grand scheme of things, but if we can find someone witchbombed in inshinomaki and/or someone who remembers Kato Setsuko's soul gem, we may be able to find her witch, seed and/or one of her witch's familiars since there's every indication that Ishinomaki familar farms and I'm still quite interested in dewitching her specifically, if we can.)
[]How do you respond:
- [] Kaizuki's post-revision thoughts.
[] During the raid
- [] Mix goofy lightheartedness with the rest of what you do. Encourage Homura to geek out a bit over the goods.
-- [] See a warship. Want it. Ask Homura to talk you out of taking it.
-[] Ask if Homura if she knows any Yakuza places other than Mitakihara, to hit somewhere fresh and avoid a magical girl looking into things.
There's probably a lot more to add here, but what comes to mind is mostly flavor to the lighter side of things.
[] Afterwards:
- [] Meet with Oriko to discuss Homura and the potentialbomb
-- [] Make an enchanted Griefhax psychometer for The Feather at some point during the meeting.
It's time to get to work on figuring stuff out. Beyond that, I'd like to specifically move for contacting Kyoko to being the second of these three tasks we do today. Mainly so that we don't call her too early, since she's complained about her sleep before.
Plus doing it like that means we can also talk to the University group shortly after talking to Yuki to keep things neat and tidy WRT all of that.
As far as the psychometer goes, maybe it will work, maybe it won't. I think it's simple and painless enough to be worth trying however, and it's both been on my mind for quite some time, a possible path to learning about Feathers and very relevant here. (There's also the possibility of variations on a theme, such as something to see what and who the feather used to be part of by just looking at the thing itself but I think the psychometer is just simpler to describe and is a good method to achieve the same essential purpose.)
----------
(As far as talking to Yuki herself goes there's a few other things that occur to me: We missed out on talking to her about the real purpose of clear seeds since we miswrote the vote last time and I think informing her that we intend to research dewitching is pretty important. For honesty's sake, since it relates to why her prisoner agreed to be contained, if nothing else.
Beyond that, next time we meet her in person it may be a good idea to check how much she knows about who else is witchbombed around the region. It seems like a pretty important detail to know after all.
It may be minor in the grand scheme of things, but if we can find someone witchbombed in inshinomaki and/or someone who remembers Kato Setsuko's soul gem, we may be able to find her witch, seed and/or one of her witch's familiars since there's every indication that Ishinomaki familar farms and I'm still quite interested in dewitching her specifically, if we can.)
GiftOfLove
From the Heart
I still dont' understand why Homura is so thin in this quest. Was she not fed during her stay in the hospital? Or was it before that?
AsuraKyoko
The Witch who was known as the Goddess of War
- Location
- Brockton Bay
Homura doesn't really eat much, since time spent eating is time that could be spent guarding Madoka. She could eat in timestop, but that isn't an efficient use of resources.
DB_Explorer
Purveyor of alternate realities.
- Location
- San Diego, California
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Clearly she just needs to eat with Madoka.
......
we should figure out how to do that so that Homura eating at Madoka's house is just normal. I bet Madoka's mom would roll with it she seems like a cool mom.
AsuraKyoko
The Witch who was known as the Goddess of War
- Location
- Brockton Bay
Madoka's dad would probably be happy to have her over, too. Actually, he's probably the one we'd have to convince, as I think Madomom often comes home from work really late. I could be wrong, though.
The Phoenixian
The Glacier Witch
- Location
- My own little world
Clearly, the solution is to crib shamelessly from the Maitake doujin: Have Madoka cook for Homura. With the knowledge that Madoka's cooking will go to waste otherwise, there's no way she'll deny it.
GiftOfLove
From the Heart
Generally it takes more than -- what was it, two weeks? -- for someone to become rail thin from undereatting. Especially because I'm pretty sure we've been forcing her to eat every other time we see her.
Makes me wonder what kind of home life she had. Though I can't imagine it being too terrible, since she has her own apartment.
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Onmur
Archangel of Nutella.
She also eats instant ramen and stuff like that, instead of real food.
Would this work?
Godwinson
"Well, I've got nothing."
Homura has every indication of being an orphan who was placed in a neglectful and abusive orphanage.
Then, she had serious heart issues (whether congenital, or due to malnutrition and stress, we're uncertain) which necessitated a months-long hospital stay, which even with proper medical attention, still tends to result in a loss in muscle mass.
GiftOfLove
From the Heart
Thanks, that has been bothering me every time it came up and it's nice to have an answer for it.
- Location
- Here
There's also the possibility that she's just skinny? I'm as grown as I'll ever be, and I've been lucky enough to be able to eat my fill all my life, but if I weigh in at 120 lb or more I'm probably wearing a coat. I've looked at my pediatric BMI charts, and it's a steady line notably under the "normal" area with the exception of one spike into "normal" when I was on meds with a side effect of increased appetite.
(not to contest Godwinson's reading, but seriously, sometimes people are just stably underweight; I never saw the thinness as an issue)
(not to contest Godwinson's reading, but seriously, sometimes people are just stably underweight; I never saw the thinness as an issue)
Godwinson
"Well, I've got nothing."
The issue isn't that she's thin, it's that she's clearly unhealthy, in more ways than just her bodyweight.
And she just came out of a long hospital stay, there's no way in hell she's at her natural build.
Laurelin
Ain't got nothing better.
- Location
- Where the Wild Wolves Have Gone
Think Onmur here put it the best as far as Sayaka goes, the other votes feel a bit too... harsh to me. Sayaka's not a bad person or even one that is particularly flawed, she's just a normal, average teenager who's growing up and does stupid things because that's what teenagers do and there's nothing wrong with that. At least, that's my read of her character, based on what I know. Ironically, I think part of Homura's failure to change Sayaka's fate is because Homura, too, is a teenager, with all the headstrong stupid that comes with the age. Again, nothing wrong with that, but her lack of success is hardly surprising, especially when she seemingly falls in a lot of the same pitfalls Sayaka does. A refusal to call for help, to rely on others, to reach out and the lack of positive, trustworthy adult figures in her life. It's okay to be teenagers and make mistakes, that's why you have parents and adults looking after you.
At least, that's how it's supposed to be, which, well, I guess that explains Homura's failure in that regard.
I kind of also feel we should try and make it clear that it's not okay for Homura to think of Sayaka in terms of "she's useful". Sayaka's not a commodity or a tool, she's a person. Admittedly, the fact that Homura's even asking for help in understanding Sayaka is already a very positive step, but it's not healthy for Homura herself to think of people like that. I understand why she does and what led to it, but I'm sure we can all agree it's not healthy.
So, eh, rambling aside, for now, going with:
[ ] Onmur
Actually, digressing for a moment, but have we ever given it any thought how to help Homura when we actually manage to get Madoka through Walpurgisnacht unscathed and un-contracted? I'm asking because Homura's sole drive and purpose is protecting Madoka and Madoka's survival. Take that away from her, even if it's by actually completing and achieving her goal, will leave her with nothing. That's not going to do her already fragile state of mind any good.
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- Location
- Here
I may just be bad at catching the implications/mentions, I suppose. And I'd forgotten easy to forget how recent the hospital stay was, relative to realtime. And the constant pressing-her-to-eat-eat-you're-too-thin pings "oh, just like my grandparents" long before "noticed actual unhealthy underweightness".