theauthor
Birdie
- Location
- Soerabaja
How come? Kyubey will not taken an action against us just because we beat walpurgis. Although feathers might be.
Puella Magi Adfligo Systema
- Thread starter Firnagzen
- Start date
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- Tags
- puella magi adfligo systema puella magi madoka magica be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist bad decisions dating mami tomoe (tomoe mami) diabolical laughter friendship is the best ship handholding identity crises microwaving tea gets you put in the bad place names are important the body is the fursona of the soul this is not the baked goods thread we don't talk about rionna what could possibly go wrong? who in the world is azure sanfrancisco?
- Location
- South Africa
Why wouldn't he? We've just removed the biggest thing encouraging a Madoka-wish.
No wish was stated, or even started. She did not even say the very first word of her wish.
bird_poison
Knowing their wrath, unfettered and raw
- Location
- margarita
Allrighty, I'll get the proper debating hat.
You said we have backing from an omnipotent "I win" wish. That's your claim, that's yours to prove. I think wise to abstain to plan until said backing has a more concise form, and I suspect given the impeding [hovever jumping a few weeks is called] said power will only manifest after wallpaper is grounded, or by interaction with feathers. Until then, limited reality warping of a 100 meter radius is not enough to exterminate the incubators.
The incubator knows our wish. It knows psychology. We already clearly showed empathy, and hate towards it. It already knows we like to experiment, and that given the chance we would destroy its system. There's no way to hide that, as of present.
Even if we became an hermit, it would still know that we harbored such intentions, and that human minds don't change so radically so quicly.
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theauthor
Birdie
- Location
- Soerabaja
Anything that threaten her friends, family and enviroment is a good enough replacement for encouraging Madoka to wish.
Such as another powerful witch or a hostile magical girl groups attack Mitakihara or her friends or family got into life threatening illness or injury state
Higure
Witch of Faith
- Location
- The Golden Land
....you know, it never even occurred to me. Huh.
Alternatively...
*Nods*
*Sips tea*
"... In comparison, I've hugged Mami a hundred and forty two times."
*SCREEEEEEEECH*
"You OK there?"
*Crosses arms protectively*
"Y... Y... Y-yes."
*Laughs* "Don't worry Homura, I'm not some hug monster that's gonna force my hugs onto you. Much less try to sleep on the same bed~"
*Facepalms*
"Did you know Mami hogs the blankets?"
"Yes."
*Pauses, blushing*
"... I must go."
*Gears grinding*
*Vanishes*
*JustSabrina.exe has crashed*
*Sips tea*
"... In comparison, I've hugged Mami a hundred and forty two times."
*SCREEEEEEEECH*
"You OK there?"
*Crosses arms protectively*
"Y... Y... Y-yes."
*Laughs* "Don't worry Homura, I'm not some hug monster that's gonna force my hugs onto you. Much less try to sleep on the same bed~"
*Facepalms*
"Did you know Mami hogs the blankets?"
"Yes."
*Pauses, blushing*
"... I must go."
*Gears grinding*
*Vanishes*
*JustSabrina.exe has crashed*
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- Location
- South Africa
No, I didn't. I said we had a Madoami-level wish on our side, which we know, because Homura told us.
Why? What in Universe reason would that have? That would be clear "artificial difficulty".People don't gain the ability to invent things because they come across a challenge. They only gain the motivation. The ability was there from the start.
Of course it isn't. Which is why I've been saying that we must have a way to do more somehow and we should be putting effort into finding it before it's too late.
Timestop. The Incubators cannot react to that.
Yes. And threatening us both counts as that and removes alternative solutions which Kyuubey has demonstrated doing before in canon.
bird_poison
Knowing their wrath, unfettered and raw
- Location
- margarita
Of course there's a way to win.
I just disagree on the means, timing and shape. We won't find the holy grail by science farming. We may get leads, but those are scary and black and aerodynamic. Science makes us a better fighter, and reveals details about our nature. It won't solve the incubator problem.
All I ask is not to bloat the thread with anti-incubator strategies when we can't even agree on our own power, much less its (If its limits are physical or psychological is completely irrelevant, by the way).
I think a more fruitful endeavour would be to list all "unusual" things that have happened in experiments, like the barrier incident, Sayaka's copying failure and the thing we *almost* were able to do with grief.
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theauthor
Birdie
- Location
- Soerabaja
I'm sorry but... i'm confused with this statement.
The Narrator
Disembodied Voice
- Location
- Somewhere Offscreen
Maybe, maybe not. Just because the Incubators have advanced technology doesn't mean that they have assets in place to project force here on Earth. We haven't seen any indication that they have a ship in orbit or a platoon of killbots waiting in a warehouse downtown. To me, the fact that Kyubey never takes any direct action himself would indicate that these furry telepresence units are all the assets they have on the planet, and that sending combat units to Earth would be a non-trivial endeavor.
Again, I have to note that we only have Kyubey's word for this, with no independent corroboration whatsoever.
Also, every indication is that magic is a bit of a "black box" for the Incubators that they can't really understand or use themselves. Which suggests that magic was probably something they discovered by accident.
That assumes that he had a Killsat ready and waiting at that exact moment. As I've said, we've yet to see any evidence that the Incubators keep space-based assets in orbit over Earth.
The fact that, when Kyubey wanted Kyouko dead, he had to mislead her into killing herself rather than just taking her out himself, indicates to me that he does not have the capabilites in place to kill any girl he feels like.
He does try to change her mind. "Are you trying to become a God?" definitely strikes me as an attempt to dissuade her. She stands firm and refuses to change her wish.
As for him not aborting her wish, the fact that he doesn't when he had ever reason to indicates that he can't. Whether this is because of some sort of programming limitation or whether he literally can't because the wish-granting process is a black box that he can't truly control is unknown at this time.
Again, having the theoretical technological capability to do a thing does not automatically imply that the assets to do a thing are in place at this particular moment. We don't even know if the Incubators have a standing military, much less how many millions of lightyears from Earth their nearest fleet elements might be. And their "Kyubey" telepresence units appear to be entirely unarmed.
If we're looking for reasons why Kyubey does not do something, I find it easier to believe that it's due to a lack of capability rather than due to ethics. The simple fact is that Kyubey has not demonstrated the existence of any ethical limitations. He has claimed certain ethical limitations on occasion, but his actual actions prove those claims to be false.
There's more than one holy grail here. We need to find a long-term solution to grief build-up, because the supply of Grief Seeds is going to dry up once we stop girls from witching out. Experimenting with our powers might hold the answer to that.
It also might be possible to set up an Asanaro-esque anti-Incubator field around the whole planet. Or a containment field around their homeworld. Magic opens up possibilities that they may not be able to counter no matter how good their technology is.
And I'm going to continue to keep Grief-formed FTL drive and Grief-saboted relativistic projectiles in mind as a weapon of last resort. Our powers don't seem to be subject to the physics problems that such a thing would usually entail.
- Location
- Voidbetweenstars
Sereg is sadly incorrect, considering the fact that in the final timeline in canon Madoka tried to make a wish with the incubator right after Sayaka became a witch..... the whole becoming a magical girl requires someone to have a wish requires the girl to first finish the agreement with the Incubators in the first place which then needs be that the Incubators need to know the wish in order to let it be granted thus the wish can only be granted on the girl after she informs the incubators of what they wish for. A wish is not enough for one needs also the agreement with an Incubator for it granted.
bird_poison
Knowing their wrath, unfettered and raw
- Location
- margarita
Assume we causally isolate mitakihara. By unspecified means, no more grief problem for them, no more witches, no more anything. Would that be a satisfactory solution?
Assume everything I'm quoting you on this post succeeds. Would that be a satisfactory solution, when compared to Madokami?
The Narrator
Disembodied Voice
- Location
- Somewhere Offscreen
Just Mitakihara? No. It still leaves much of the human population at risk, and Kyubey could use deceived meguca as catspaws against us. That might be a good starting place to give us a safe space to work from, but there's a reason that I said "around the entire planet" in my post. I'm thinking of something along the lines of an enchanted satellite network.
bird_poison
Knowing their wrath, unfettered and raw
- Location
- margarita
...I was kinda hoping you answered the second question, using the first as a crutch.
bird_poison
Knowing their wrath, unfettered and raw
- Location
- margarita
I like my crack, my laughts, my fun and my fluffy hugs. But at the end of the day, I'm a debater through and through. My mind dreams of megatons, my blood itchs for references, my first answer to any problem is to nuke it from orbit, and my idea of stopping is to reach concensus or concede.
In this hugboxy halls I get my fill of fluffyness, but when I smell a fight the crack-poster goes away and the battler gets the arguments loaded. Within reason, of course. I'm not suicidal.
Godwinson
"Well, I've got nothing."
You do realize that PMAS isn't a place where biggatons matters in the slightest, right? Sabrina's challenges are all in the realm of dealing with people.
bird_poison
Knowing their wrath, unfettered and raw
- Location
- margarita
Yes I do. I only suggest biggatons in the science sessions, and 90% of my suggestions are on the silly side. Is silly or hard choices, and silly suffices for now.
Higure
Witch of Faith
- Location
- The Golden Land
The root of all her problems is the universe and its laws, the System.
Social isn't going to fix that. That said, brute force won't either. It would help with Walpurgis, but...we can probably do that already.
Wait...this is kinda random, but have we actually tried de-Witching an active Witch? Not sure how that would work, but...might be worth looking into. Maybe if we altered one's Barrier into something that would break her Grief Spiral? Abstract Social, basically.
bird_poison
Knowing their wrath, unfettered and raw
- Location
- margarita
Too much grief, we are weak to grief mental assaults. And the other name of what you suggest is grief rending.
Higure
Witch of Faith
- Location
- The Golden Land
Um, no...Grief Rending is just tearing them apart. I'm talking about creating Grief Constructs (probably Witchy ones), as a means of interacting with the Witch in her natural environment.
Grief Construct Therapy, basically.
Edit: Yes, this idea may not work, but it's worth a shot. We aren't really in all that much danger from Witches, after all.
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- Location
- Academy City
- Pronouns
- They
Does anyone in thread actually wonder that, or is this just one of those times where I'm missing the point?
Godwinson
"Well, I've got nothing."
The latter. We all know why she is the way she is, but some times we rhetorically wonder.
