[X] [Main] Restore Order
[X] [Secondary] Switch Policy - Megaproject Support
[X] [Secondary] Palace Annex - Grand Hall
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders x2
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders x3
[X] [Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X] [Guild] Build Mills
[X] [Guild] Build Mills x2
[X] [Guild Secondary] Survey Lands
 
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[9][Marriage] From the Storm Ymaryn to gain an alliance
WHY ARE THERE PEOPLE VOTING FOR STORM YMARYN.

Those fucks left us! They are slavers, the cousin you dont invite to thanksgiving(topical), the one's who air their dirty laundry on facebook, post anti-vax shit, creepily hang out with their nieces and nephews. Warmongering, likely trying to get us (cooler older brother) into a war they realize they cannot win or maybe use us to help fuel their sanctimonious slave holding would be conquering dark elvish ways!

You don't want that.

Most of that is hyperbole, but let's stay away from our creepo cousins/ Dark elf equivalent thanks.

Martial god of war king marries potentially creepy lady from the black sheep of the family.
Notice something about that?
That's how you get a Malekith.

NEVER GET A MALEKITH.
 
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I don't appreciate the straw man, especially since under my context of reasoning, it actually uplifts them to the next social class.

*shrug*

No, you're destroying the Urban Poor faction by merging them with the Yeomen. After you establish them as farmers, in the process deactivating most of our cities, the Urban Poor faction will be massively weakened because the new farmers won't be Urban anymore.
 
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No, you're destroying the Urban Poor faction by merging them with the Yeomen.
Well I don't think they would much care since they would be rich(if it happens this way), and under my plan as it lies currently we get some of our cities back and then have some more Urban Poor. I'd read it as net neutral at worst.
 
Well I don't think they would much care since they would be rich(if it happens this way), and under my plan as it lies currently we get some of our cities back and then have some more Urban Poor. I'd read it as net neutral at worst.

That's true, I guess I'm projecting some of my anger at @veekie who wants to explode our cities on you. My apologies.

You still have no reason to integrate Txolla this turn beyond a thin narrative justification of questionable veracity, however, so I can't support it. Can't we do it next turn?
 
That's true, I guess I'm projecting some of my anger at @veekie who wants to explode our cities on you. My apologies.

You still have no reason to integrate Txolla this turn beyond a thin narrative justification of questionable veracity, however, so I can't support it.
No prob. :)

But like our current set of actions is hilarious since we only have a single secondary war mission to the HK. We poke em.
Which has me giggling here.
 
People had narrative reasons for wanting it before so I added it in.

If it really bothers you, I can Switch it to another Main War Mission or Secondary War Mission and a Secondary Enforce Justice.

Look at my plan I quoted above. Even without it, we have plenty of Econ. So just calm down and talk to me.
Levy will cost additional Econ each phase, though - and maybe additional Stability thanks to disease. That does not strike me as reassuring.
 
Going with Primal on this one.

[X] [Main] Restore Order
[X] [Secondary] Switch Policy - Megaproject Support
[X] [Secondary] Palace Annex - Grand Hall
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders x2
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders x3
[X] [Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X] [Guild] Build Mills
[X] [Guild] Build Mills x2
[X] [Guild Secondary] Survey Lands

While there may be some narrative benefit to integration, it doesn't seem worth it to kill our cities to do so. We also straight up need more war missions. Similarly, Gymnasiums just do not make sense as an action to me. The bonus for a Double Main Mills seems far more valuable and has no risk of killing us due to overflow.
 
That's true, I guess I'm projecting some of my anger at @veekie who wants to explode our cities on you. My apologies.

You still have no reason to integrate Txolla this turn beyond a thin narrative justification of questionable veracity, however, so I can't support it. Can't we do it next turn?
Even then it is misplaced. He copied my vote.

So just tell me what you want to replace it with and why and I would switch it over.
Levy will cost additional Econ each phase, though - and maybe additional Stability thanks to disease. That does not strike me as reassuring.
In which case I nor anyone else can help you :/

Dam costs 2 and annex costs 2. Nothing we can do about that.
 
[X] [Main] Restore Order
[X] [Secondary] Switch Policy - Megaproject Support
[X] [Secondary] Palace Annex - Grand Hall
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders x2
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders x3
[X] [Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X] [Guild] Build Mills
[X] [Guild] Build Mills x2
[X] [Guild Secondary] Survey Lands
 
Bleh, I aaid already, I'm ill and working math out on phone at present is less of a thing I'm doing and more of going with what sounds good.

Will switch votes once I get the kind of energy together to actually assemble that
 
[X] [Main] War Mission - Highlanders
[X] [Secondary] Change Policy - Megaproject Support
[X] [Secondary] Palace Annex - Grand Hall
[X] [Secondary] Restore Order
[X] [Secondary] Restore Order x2
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders x2
[X] [Guild] Build Mills
[X] [Guild] Build Gymnasium
[X] [Guild Secondary] Survey Lands

Two mains is a bit pitiful, but what can you do. Between that and the Mercs we hopefully at least kick them back to prewar borders. Wish the Harmurri had done a bit better than wet cardboard.

[X] [Marriage] Internally from a patrician family

Be part of the system.
 
If the Storm Ymaryn ask us to join their war, we can just refuse.

If they insist, saying that we're supposed to be allies, then we can tell them to attack the Highland Kingdom if they're so keen on mutual military support.
 
I don't appreciate the straw man, especially since under my context of reasoning, it actually uplifts them to the next social class.

*shrug*

This is outright fundamentally wrong. Urban Poor will not become farmers. They will become Rural Poor - a group so marginalized even in our society that they don't have a faction to represent their interests.

I'm basing it off of what the class system is based on in our current era, which is that the farmers are really really rich. I don't have any support other than this though which is true. If it turns out that this is not the case then ah well.

There is a massive difference between being a farmer, and being a Yeoman. Yeoman are only a small subset of all 'rural farmers'. Most rural dwellers are Rural Poor, they are not Yeoman and life is very bad for the Rural Poor. They have nothing, they'll never get married or find a stable career, they are move between seasonal farm work and government mandated corvee labour without hope of advancement. Rural Poor are so bad off that they go to the cities in order to become Urban Poor!

Yeoman are really rich. Yeoman are also highly skilled workers. It takes a lifetime of learning in order for someone to become a highly skilled Yeoman under our system. Yeoman are trained from birth and are either the existing first sons of yeoman, or the second sons that happen to get lucky when a new plot of land opens up. The Yeoman in Txolla are not going to roll over when you try to push Urban Poor into the coveted roles that their sons could take. We know what happens when yeoman are pissed at people; they turn bandit and murder them.

What do you think is going to happen? The entrenched Yeoman giving up the chance for their second, third, and fourth sons to be a Yeoman just so some smelly Urban Poor can get it? Not only is that going against every selfish human instinct, but it is literal heresy. Urban Poor do not have the skill to be small land holding farmers. They've never learned how to do it, they will be bad at it. Considering how much we hate bad farming, giving them the job would be profoundly offensive to Ymaryn sensibilities.

What's going to happen is that the Urban Poor are going to become rural poor. They cannot be Yeoman because the will always be worse at being farmers than the second sons of Yeoman who have trained for the role their entire life. If they are assigned as Yeoman, they will quickly be removed once it's proven that they are incompetent; they would be since they didn't know better and persecuting incompetence is how people get ahead in our system.

So once the Urban Poor have suffered the massive downgrade in life to Rural Poor, what do they do? After all, no longer being Urban means they can no longer maintain their unique culture, their way of life, families will be split up, support networks and friends fragmented of hundreds of miles, traditional jobs are lost to them, luxuries they once enjoyed are no longer easily bought, even the basic Grain Dole they received will no longer be there. Everything that made them special and distinct in Ymaryn society will be destroyed as they're forced into (worse) poverty.

This is when the Urban Poor start to get angry. Did they fight their entire lives so that they could then be forced to slave away for some Yeoman's second son? No! That's when old crossbow, old iron helms and knives start to make their way out of closets. Sure, they were supposed to be returned, but do you think we'd get all the weapons? Then, these marginalized former Urban Poor lash out, going bandit and killing and fighting and looting in order to get what they deserve.

Your plan makes things worse. The Urban Poor do not want to be displaced into (shitty) Rural Poor work. They want to go back to their lives as they knew it.
 
Hmm. This is the Tally.

Vote Tally : Original - Paths of Civilization | Page 5325 | Sufficient Velocity [Posts: 133117-133343]
##### NetTally 1.9.9
Task: Marriage
[16][Marriage] From one of the Forhuch tribes to secure their loyalty
[9][Marriage] From the Storm Ymaryn to gain an alliance

——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: Main
[13][Main] Great Dam
[12][Main] Restore Order
[6][Main] War Mission - Highlanders
[2][Main] Integrate Colony - Txolla
[1][Main] Enforce Justice
[1][Main] Hunt Troublemakers

——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: Guild Secondary
[18][Guild Secondary] Survey Lands
[14][Guild Secondary] Build Mills

——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: Guild
[32][Guild] Build Mills
[20][Guild] Build Mills x2
[11][Guild] Build Gymnasium

——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: Secondary
[33][Secondary] Palace Annex - Grand Hall
[20][Secondary] Integrate Colony - Txolla
[19][Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders
[18][Secondary] Restore Order
[18][Secondary] Switch Policy - Megaproject Support
[17][Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders x2
[17][Secondary] Enforce Justice
[16][Secondary] Restore Order x2
[11][Secondary] Integrate Colony - Txolla x2
[10][Secondary] Survey Land
[4][Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders x3
[1][Secondary] Hunt Troublemakers
[1][Secondary] Dam
[1][Secondary] Switch Policy - Offense
[1][Secondary] Expand Economy
[1][Secondary] Switch Policy - Balanced
[1][Secondary] Retraining
[1][Secondary] Dam x2
[1][Secondary] Retraining x2
[1][Secondary] Sailing Mission
[1][Secondary] Library - Redshore
Total No. of Voters: 38

So actions are

Main Great Dam
[Secondary] Palace Annex - Grand Hall
[Secondary] Integrate Colony - Txolla
[Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders
[Secondary] Restore Order
[Secondary] Switch Policy - Megaproject Support
[Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders x2
Guild Build Mills
Guild Build Mills x2
Guild Secondary Survey Lands

Which means that... I think the provinces don't do anything but Expand Econ for 36 Econ and -36 Econ Expansion.
 
This is outright fundamentally wrong. Urban Poor will not become farmers. They will become Rural Poor - a group so marginalized even in our society that they don't have a faction to represent their interests.



There is a massive difference between being a farmer, and being a Yeoman. Yeoman are only a small subset of all 'rural farmers'. Most rural dwellers are Rural Poor, they are not Yeoman and life is very bad for the Rural Poor. They have nothing, they'll never get married or find a stable career, they are move between seasonal farm work and government mandated corvee labour without hope of advancement. Rural Poor are so bad off that they go to the cities in order to become Urban Poor!

Yeoman are really rich. Yeoman are also highly skilled workers. It takes a lifetime of learning in order for someone to become a highly skilled Yeoman under our system. Yeoman are trained from birth and are either the existing first sons of yeoman, or the second sons that happen to get lucky when a new plot of land opens up. The Yeoman in Txolla are not going to roll over when you try to push Urban Poor into the coveted roles that their sons could take. We know what happens when yeoman are pissed at people; they turn bandit and murder them.

What do you think is going to happen? The entrenched Yeoman giving up the chance for their second, third, and fourth sons to be a Yeoman just so some smelly Urban Poor can get it? Not only is that going against every selfish human instinct, but it is literal heresy. Urban Poor do not have the skill to be small land holding farmers. They've never learned how to do it, they will be bad at it. Considering how much we hate bad farming, giving them the job would be profoundly offensive to Ymaryn sensibilities.

What's going to happen is that the Urban Poor are going to become rural poor. They cannot be Yeoman because the will always be worse at being farmers than the second sons of Yeoman who have trained for the role their entire life. If they are assigned as Yeoman, they will quickly be removed once it's proven that they are incompetent; they would be since they didn't know better and persecuting incompetence is how people get ahead in our system.

So once the Urban Poor have suffered the massive downgrade in life to Rural Poor, what do they do? After all, no longer being Urban means they can no longer maintain their unique culture, their way of life, families will be split up, support networks and friends fragmented of hundreds of miles, traditional jobs are lost to them, luxuries they once enjoyed are no longer easily bought, even the basic Grain Dole they received will no longer be there. Everything that made them special and distinct in Ymaryn society will be destroyed as they're forced into (worse) poverty.

This is when the Urban Poor start to get angry. Did they fight their entire lives so that they could then be forced to slave away for some Yeoman's second son? No! That's when old crossbow, old iron helms and knives start to make their way out of closets. Sure, they were supposed to be returned, but do you think we'd get all the weapons? Then, these marginalized former Urban Poor lash out, going bandit and killing and fighting and looting in order to get what they deserve.

Your plan makes things worse. The Urban Poor do not want to be displaced into (shitty) Rural Poor work. They want to go back to their lives as they knew it.
I don't feel like continuing this conversation. I'm ambivalent at this point in regards to Txolla.
 
[X][Marriage] From one of the Forhuch tribes to secure their loyalty

[X] [Main] Restore Order
[X] [Secondary] Palace Annex - Great Hall
[X] [Secondary] Change Policy - Megaproject Support
[X] [Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X] [Secondary] --
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders
[X] [Secondary] War Mission - Highlanders x2

[X] [Guild] Build Mills
[X] [Guild] Build Mills x2
[X] [Guild Secondary] Survey Lands
 
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