- Location
- Brazil
Risky, but devious. Worst case we complete the Quest, eh?
Paths of Civilization
- Thread starter Academia Nut
- Start date
- Original
VoidZero
Passing Flan 布丁魔王
- Location
- Anywhere but RL
This is what we call downward tantrum spiral, where the negative fuels more negative until the system breaks.
- Location
- From the moon
Yes []Supress Faction
- Pronouns
- They/Them
[X][Main] Enforce Justice
[X][Secondary] Change Policy - Megaproject Support
[X][Secondary] Palace Annex - Great Hall
[X][Secondary] Build Temple - Horse Valley
[X][Secondary] Found March - Spirit Channel
[X][Secondary] Invite to Games - Forhuch
[X][Secondary] Support Faction - Traders
[X][Guild] Salterns
[X][Guild] Plant Cash Crops - Textiles
[X][Guild Secondary] Efficient Charcoal Kilns
Directs the Priest quest towards completion (and frees infrastructure passives to do something worthwhile with their time), and found the Spirit March that we've been wanting for a while now. Gets us to 3 stability,repairs our legitimacy legitimacy does not matter right now because the Urban Poor will be Suppressed soon. Now, with our limited wealth it's likely that the provinces will take Expand Econ on Megaproject Support in an attempt to overflow to wealth-or just to prop us up. Thus I believe it's safe to not take a King action expand econ.
[X][Secondary] Change Policy - Megaproject Support
[X][Secondary] Palace Annex - Great Hall
[X][Secondary] Build Temple - Horse Valley
[X][Secondary] Found March - Spirit Channel
[X][Secondary] Invite to Games - Forhuch
[X][Secondary] Support Faction - Traders
[X][Guild] Salterns
[X][Guild] Plant Cash Crops - Textiles
[X][Guild Secondary] Efficient Charcoal Kilns
Directs the Priest quest towards completion (and frees infrastructure passives to do something worthwhile with their time), and found the Spirit March that we've been wanting for a while now. Gets us to 3 stability,
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- Location
- The Middle of the Howling Wilderness
You need an action that works on the Dam.
...Actually, looking at it, we CAN get more time on a faction quest by supporting that faction and all it really costs is Culture.
'Support Faction: Traders' could give us some time to actually do their stupid quest or at least stall failure.
'Support Faction: Traders' could give us some time to actually do their stupid quest or at least stall failure.
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- Location
- Staring into the void
[X][Main] Great Dam
[X][Secondary] Found March - Spirit Channel
[X][Secondary] Palace Annex - Great Hall
[X][Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X][Secondary] Hunt Troublemakers
[X][Secondary] Invite to Games - Forhuch
[X][Secondary] Support Faction - Traders
[X][Guild] Salterns
[X][Guild] Plant Cash Crops - Textiles
[X][Guild Secondary] Efficient Charcoal Kilns
[X][Secondary] Found March - Spirit Channel
[X][Secondary] Palace Annex - Great Hall
[X][Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X][Secondary] Hunt Troublemakers
[X][Secondary] Invite to Games - Forhuch
[X][Secondary] Support Faction - Traders
[X][Guild] Salterns
[X][Guild] Plant Cash Crops - Textiles
[X][Guild Secondary] Efficient Charcoal Kilns
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Suppress Faction, but we can't use it on every spiteful faction because it costs two stability, we are at one stability, and we fracture at negative four stability.
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Also, conveniently boosts the Traders back up and may reduce the spite level of their quest. Probably not enough to turn it into a benefit, but since the Patricians are trying to make it worse it follows that it can also get better.
- Location
- Austria
We can, and/or we can do a new Temple to ensure completion of Priests quest.
[X][Main] Enforce Justice
[X][Secondary] Change Policy - Megaproject Support
[X][Secondary] Palace Annex - Great Hall
[X][Secondary] Found March - Spirit Channel
[X][Secondary] Expand Econ
[X][Secondary] Invite to Games - Forhuch
[X][Secondary] Support Faction - Traders
[X][Guild] Salterns
[X][Guild] Plant Cash Crops - Textiles
[X][Guild Secondary] Efficient Charcoal Kilns
Difference: Expand Econ secondary, EJ Main, remove PG, replace it with March, let Priests quest fail
The point of Enforce Justice was the narrative follow-up after a slavery prohibitiob: enforcing that it is actually followed.
Plus Centralization so that we can keep spamming PSN Expand Econs or whatever for -2 Cent apiece.
PG does not do this.
- Location
- Voidbetweenstars
It would al
so likely piss off the Priests, which means 4 spite quests.
- Location
- Canada
Swap out proclaim glory for EJ since the Patricians will supress the Urban power thus losing the extra legitimacy. EJ also gives us the needed centralisation to use max PSN option to expand economy.
- Location
- Australia
[X][Main] Expand Economy
[X][Secondary] Change Policy - Megaproject Support
[X][Secondary] Palace Annex - Great Hall
[X][Secondary] Proclaim Glory
[X][Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X][Secondary] Invite to Games - Forhuch
[X][Secondary] Expand Economy
[X][Guild] More Warships
[X][Guild] Plant Cash Crops - Textiles
[X][Guild Secondary] Plant Cash Crops - Textiles
[X][Secondary] Change Policy - Megaproject Support
[X][Secondary] Palace Annex - Great Hall
[X][Secondary] Proclaim Glory
[X][Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X][Secondary] Invite to Games - Forhuch
[X][Secondary] Expand Economy
[X][Guild] More Warships
[X][Guild] Plant Cash Crops - Textiles
[X][Guild Secondary] Plant Cash Crops - Textiles
- Location
- United States
AN said that the Patricians are likely to suppress the Urban Poor next, and the extra legitimacy goes away when the Urban Poor faction power decreases.
So, you should probably make that a Main Enforce Justice instead, both because it gives us the cent we will need, and because it will narratively help find any new abuses that will come with radically changing a well liked system like we just did.
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Good point, changing.
In a way, I'm glad that you brought up the Haudenosaunee, although probably not for the reason that you brought it up.
Everything that ExtraHistory said in that video? Mostly true. It has its mythologizing, but as the Haudenosaunee teach it, that was how the Five Nation Confederacy (later Six Nations) came to be. The issue is that it glosses over the fact that the Haudenosaunee had a huge fixation on war. To be honest, they're closer to an unholy fusion of us and the Dead Priests.
The Haudenosaunee believed that the death of a close family member and the grief it caused could lead to insanity. Thus, it was considered necessary that such individuals needed to be replaced immediately or the grief otherwise expunged. This lead them to the concept of Mourning Wars. The Nation would declare a Mourning War and then all of their warriors would seek to raid, ambush, and attack another tribe in battle. The goal was to capture as many people as possible with the fewest possible casualties. Sometimes these Mourning Wars were called in the name of vengeance, in which case they would be straight up massacres, but they generally focused on kidnapping.
Once people had been captured, the stragglers and the sickly were quickly executed since they couldn't keep up with the rest of the group as they made their way back to Haudenosaunee territory. Once they finally returned, captives were often split up (often dividing families) among the various tribes and clans that participated in the raid. These clans would then decide the fate of their captives: white paint, red paint, or black paint.
Those painted with white paint would eventually be adopted into the tribe that had captured them. They were put on the fast track into assimilation within the tribe. Frequently, such captives were often forced to directly take on the role of the person that they were replacing, even to the extent of taking their name and place in the family. Women would be forced to become wives of recent widowers and men would be taken by recent widows. Beatings, starvation and other 'light' methods of convincing people to assimilate were often used. In this way, the Five Nations kept their numbers high and their physical and spiritual purity in tact.
People painted with red were conditionally adopted. They were frequently tested in ways that amounted to torture. Some accounts report having their finger nails ripped out, their hands crushed, arrows shoved lengthwise through the body, etc. If you screamed during these sessions, you were deemed unworthy and often executed immediately. Starvation was regularly mixed in as well. Once you'd managed to survive four years, you were generally considered to be a member of the tribe! Although, you would be the lowest possible person on the totem pole. French explorers frequently mistook the people in this category for slaves due to their wounds and the fact that they exclusively got the worst job in society.
Lastly, those painted black. They would be given one last fine meal and then ritualistically tortured to death in order to assuage the guilt and mourning felt by the family they were assigned to. People who were in the white and red category were also sometimes spontaneously tortured to death as well in response to the death of a close family member, but that was down to an individual family's choice, not a matter of course. Needless to say, substantially higher numbers of men were disposed of this way while women and children tended to be in the white category. I'm not really going to go into what occurred, but suffice to say that you can use your nightmares for inspiration.
Mourning Wars were the building block of Haudenosaunee culture. Recent anthropological evidence indicates that this type of kidnapping and bride stealing was one of the prime motivating factors for the 17th century Beaver Wars. The Beaver Wars were a period where the Haudenosaunee wiped out and assimilated virtually every tribe and nation in their immediate area. The only reason that their conquest didn't keep going was because they eventually conquered so much territory that they couldn't settle it, even with the people they had captured from enemy tribes. Even before that, the Haudenosaunee were known to constantly raid the Algonquin and Huron. The only thing the Great Law of Peace did was displace the raiding from an internal problem to one that they acted on externally.
Originally, I was going to make a point about how the Act of Empire is one that's inherently corrupting. Moral compromise is necessary, etc, etc. but I really can't. There was some parts of Haudenosaunee culture that was worthy of emulation, but their treatment of outsiders was certainly not it. That Purity priest last update advocating a path of conquest and slavery where all foreigners are forced to live as Half-Exiles is what the Haudenosaunee did (plus some outright torture on top).
Now the more I think about it, I don't feel that the Act of Empire is corrupting. The people who engage in such acts were morally corrupt before they ever started. Every culture had problematic elements, even modern day ones. Trying to establish a relative moral is useless because everyone is wading through the muck. The only questions is if wading through the mud was truly necessary to get to your destination or if you're tracking it over a fine Persian rug.
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BungieONI
Seven gremlins in a trench coat
- Location
- Lickwidget
- Pronouns
- She/Her
[X][Main] Great Dam
[X][Secondary] Found March - Spirit Channel
[X][Secondary] Palace Annex - Great Hall
[X][Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X][Secondary] Hunt Troublemakers
[X][Secondary] Invite to Games - Forhuch
[X][Secondary] Support Faction - Traders
[X][Guild] Salterns
[X][Guild] Plant Cash Crops - Textiles
[X][Guild Secondary] Efficient Charcoal Kilns
[X][Secondary] Found March - Spirit Channel
[X][Secondary] Palace Annex - Great Hall
[X][Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X][Secondary] Hunt Troublemakers
[X][Secondary] Invite to Games - Forhuch
[X][Secondary] Support Faction - Traders
[X][Guild] Salterns
[X][Guild] Plant Cash Crops - Textiles
[X][Guild Secondary] Efficient Charcoal Kilns
Abby Normal
High Clerk of the Ymaryn
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Ok, some diffs before i start heading towards sleep
Actions relative to last turn: Diff Checker
Actions relative to AN's sneak peak of the new actions: Diff Checker
@Academia Nut diplo, intrigue, econ, EE, and wealth project incomes are all out of date, between the policies and the wealth cost changes.
Actions relative to last turn: Diff Checker
Actions relative to AN's sneak peak of the new actions: Diff Checker
@Academia Nut diplo, intrigue, econ, EE, and wealth project incomes are all out of date, between the policies and the wealth cost changes.
VoidZero
Passing Flan 布丁魔王
- Location
- Anywhere but RL
Seems reasonable, a bit of concern that march dropping martial to 6 martial. That saltern feels funny to me, practically everyone is made of salt at this moment.
[X][Main] Enforce Justice
[X][Secondary] Change Policy - Megaproject Support
[X][Secondary] Palace Annex - Great Hall
[X][Secondary] Found March - Spirit Channel
[X][Secondary] Expand Econ
[X][Secondary] Invite to Games - Forhuch
[X][Secondary] Support Faction - Traders
[X][Guild] Salterns
[X][Guild] Plant Cash Crops - Textiles
[X][Guild Secondary] Efficient Charcoal Kilns
[X][Main] Enforce Justice
[X][Secondary] Change Policy - Megaproject Support
[X][Secondary] Palace Annex - Great Hall
[X][Secondary] Found March - Spirit Channel
[X][Secondary] Expand Econ
[X][Secondary] Invite to Games - Forhuch
[X][Secondary] Support Faction - Traders
[X][Guild] Salterns
[X][Guild] Plant Cash Crops - Textiles
[X][Guild Secondary] Efficient Charcoal Kilns
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
They're making it worse by making the faction powerful enough for the more extreme quests, not by changing the quest quality.
Are you sure it's not better to just build roads?
*nods*
Of course we don't get a CB. Well...
[X][Main] Great Dam
[X][Secondary] Found March - Spirit Channel
[X][Secondary] Palace Annex - Great Hall
[X][Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X][Secondary] Hunt Troublemakers
[X][Secondary] Invite to Games - Forhuch
[X][Secondary] Support Faction - Traders
[X][Guild] Salterns
[X][Guild] Plant Cash Crops - Textiles
[X][Guild Secondary] Efficient Charcoal Kilns
This looks good to me. I'd rather not focus too much on the megaproject and let balance put out some fires or help put out some fires. It is also more likely to overflow into martial than megaproject support by... a lot.
Of course we don't get a CB. Well...
[X][Main] Great Dam
[X][Secondary] Found March - Spirit Channel
[X][Secondary] Palace Annex - Great Hall
[X][Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X][Secondary] Hunt Troublemakers
[X][Secondary] Invite to Games - Forhuch
[X][Secondary] Support Faction - Traders
[X][Guild] Salterns
[X][Guild] Plant Cash Crops - Textiles
[X][Guild Secondary] Efficient Charcoal Kilns
This looks good to me. I'd rather not focus too much on the megaproject and let balance put out some fires or help put out some fires. It is also more likely to overflow into martial than megaproject support by... a lot.
- Pronouns
- They/Them
They're also trying to make the current quest fail to increase spite. That tells us there's a level of spite we can avoid reaching by completing the quest anyway.
- Location
- Canada
Honestly it actually is and with our reform coming up it makes it the perfect repeated action.
- Location
- Voidbetweenstars
But without roads will we really be able to enforce justice in the hinderlands?
Patricians (6) - Power: Add or subtract their faction power from factions they are supporting/opposing. Objective: Build 3/4 Great Hall Annexes within 2 turns Reward: Government upgrade
We won't need to build the last Annex manually, we currently have 11 Progress, so the Patricians will build it on their own.
Do this only to save resources.
Guild (5) - Power: Half faction power added to Max Wealth. Objective: Have a level 3 Ironworks within 2 turns. Failure: -1 Stability
They may try to jack the passives for theirs.
Traders (2 {8}) - Power: Add or subtract faction power modifier to all innovation rolls. Objective: Have Naval power 3 or above within 1 turns. Success: +1 Naval [1/2]
We need a Support Faction on this to buy a turn.
Yeomen (2)- Power: Adds faction power to secondary Martial Objective: Have 30 EE within 2 turns. Failure: -1 Stability [1/2]
Nothing to do here
Priests (2)- Power: Adds faction power to RA. Objective: Have a new level 2 temple somewhere within 1 turns. Success: +1 RA tolerance. Failure: -1 Stability
Priests are too weak to jack an action unless we start it manually.
Urban Poor (4) - Power: +1 Max Legitimacy every 3 full power. Objective: Have 5 or more Free Cities within 3 turns. Success: New Social Value slot
We have time on this, but marking Free Cities is cheap and beneficial for us.
We won't need to build the last Annex manually, we currently have 11 Progress, so the Patricians will build it on their own.
Do this only to save resources.
Guild (5) - Power: Half faction power added to Max Wealth. Objective: Have a level 3 Ironworks within 2 turns. Failure:
They may try to jack the passives for theirs.
Traders (2 {8}) - Power: Add or subtract faction power modifier to all innovation rolls. Objective: Have Naval power 3 or above within 1 turns. Success: +1 Naval [1/2]
We need a Support Faction on this to buy a turn.
Yeomen (2)- Power: Adds faction power to secondary Martial Objective: Have 30 EE within 2 turns. Failure: -1 Stability [1/2]
Nothing to do here
Priests (2)- Power: Adds faction power to RA. Objective: Have a new level 2 temple somewhere within 1 turns. Success: +1 RA tolerance. Failure:
Priests are too weak to jack an action unless we start it manually.
Urban Poor (4) - Power: +1 Max Legitimacy every 3 full power. Objective: Have 5 or more Free Cities within 3 turns. Success: New Social Value slot
We have time on this, but marking Free Cities is cheap and beneficial for us.