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Paths of Civilization

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[X] Massively reinforce position (-5 Military, founds new March, war with Highlanders)
God fucking damnit. Well... look on the bright side, if we push the Highlander's shit in in this war, and expand even further south, we'll have plenty opportunity to restructure government... farm the shit out of the lowlands too.... Hmm
Atleast only us and Xoh city state would be left? (other than TH)
Adhoc vote count started by Motoko on May 28, 2017 at 6:12 PM, finished with 42562 posts and 46 votes.
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This is the reason that the Nomads gotta Nomad. Given how many we've absorbed over the years, it wouldn't be surprising if we ended up with one of their deleterious traits if we whole-heartedly embrace their "deal with excess martial by encouraging it to leak out onto the nearest juicy target" philosophy.

Is there an intrigue stat? It would seem fitting that if we ended up rolling an intrigue hero we wouldn't even know for certain.
 
[X] Let the Highlanders extract their vengeance and attempt to make amends after (-1 Legitimacy, -3 Diplomacy, possibility of war with Highlanders, chance of spawning new faction in the lowlands)
 
Karugus said:
I'm not assuming outright civil war, but defections on our end seem likelier than not. Keep in mind, a lot of the warriors we're depending on arresting these guys are likely to at least be sympathetic if not have some knowledge of their families/clans.
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Possible, but unlikely I think

Karugus said:
See, that's a bit more reasonable than; 'Stahp! If we do this we're toatz evul!' or 'Imma do this because fuck military juntas!XD'
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It is evil because it is unjust.

Romv said:
[X] Let the Highlanders extract their vengeance and attempt to make amends after (-1 Legitimacy, -3 Diplomacy, possibility of war with Highlanders, chance of spawning new faction in the lowlands)
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You might want to vote for capturing them so as to consolidate the non-conquest vote.
 
Something else to consider is that ignoring any moral objections (which I have) now is a really bad time to be fighting the HK when the TH are on the door step. Additionally allowing a bunch of warriors who just attacked some innocent settlement and basically dragged us into a war of scot free and actually supporting them sets a terrible precedent, on the other hand abandoning our men to outsiders as also really nor okay and unlikely to go down well, what we really need to do is to resolve this internally and handle punishment before the HK shows up so that we can then try to focus on making it up to them diplomatically.
 
Motoko said:
other than TH)
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I like how you restricted the Massive, militaristic, expansionist, bronze wielding Empire, who think we would be easy to kill and well worth the time it would take to kill us with a little effort, trying to eat everyone into one tiny bracketed part at the end of the last sentence.

You have good priorities.
 
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Powerofmind said:
Oh shit. Was... was I right?

Be more nit-picky. Please. Absolutely avoid my guess on what was actually voted in, because damn that basically defines everything AN said on the matter.
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Oh no!

We went into things well aware that we weren't picking the easiest solution. Whatever will we do?

You get zero credit for restating what AN said.
 
CeBrudras said:
Werent most plans about swooping in once everything tumbles back into anarchy again so we are saviours instead of invaders?
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"Swooping in" is us aggressively putting down settlements, fortifying them, then killing anyone who objects to us. It's the path of least martial resistance if we wait for the polities to weaken themselves.

How would we be saviors? I am incredibly doubtful that our neighbors would appreciate us taking advantage of the chaos and expanding into their territory...and it's not like we'll stop once we reach another persons settlement.

MTB said:
If you've got a culture of responsibility and peace and suddenly go 'let's conquer', that should lead to civil war. The shamans are not happy because it violates the accord with the spirits, the people are not happy because harmony is violated, the north may see it as a good thing because honor ...
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:Citation Needed: Where did it say the shamans were unhappy? Where did it say the people were unhappy? Where did it say that the north is happy? We suffer no stability drops at all if we go to war with the HK.
 
Well since no one I'd going for province guess March will do.

[X] Massively reinforce position (-5 Military, founds new March, war with Highlanders)
 
Entirely pragmatically, I don't want HK fighting a war on two fronts. I want them to bloody TH super hard.

So I'm going with the least chance of war with them and the potential for another lowland competitor.

As I've said before, Iron isn't at risk. We previously voted for iron to be done by shamans and artisans. Our warrior's are taken from farmers.

[X] Let the Highlanders extract their vengeance and attempt to make amends after (-1 Legitimacy, -3 Diplomacy, possibility of war with Highlanders, chance of spawning new faction in the lowlands)
 
Karugus said:
See, I too am fond of baseless statements that twist and take conjecture to our farthest limits. But this takes the cake.

I'm not assuming outright civil war, but defections on our end seem likelier than not. Keep in mind, a lot of the warriors we're depending on arresting these guys are likely to at least be sympathetic if not have some knowledge of their families/clans.

See, that's a bit more reasonable than; 'Stahp! If we do this we're toatz evul!' or 'Imma do this because fuck military juntas!XD'
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...
Yes, because it clearly isn't a power grab from some internal, probably military faction.
 
[X] Attempt to capture the errant warriors and then make amends with the Highlanders (-5 Diplomacy, probable war with Highlanders)
 
Sivantic said:
Oh no!

We went into things well aware that we weren't picking the easiest solution. Whatever will we do?

You get zero credit for restating what AN said.
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No, you went into things assuming that picking the hardest solution was again the best solution. Definition of insanity, yada yada yada.

I get plenty of credit, for calling the options like they were before AN said anything about them in-thread.

I get that you're mad I pointed out my opinion was right in hindsight again. Maybe you shouldn't be grasping at straws trying to prove me wrong and actually say that you're mad I pointed out I was right.
 
DragonParadox said:
It is evil because it is unjust.
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I've already had my daily shouting match with Andres over this. And as I stated before the moral calculus is not the end all be all as far as I'm concerned.
tenchifew said:
Yes, because it clearly isn't a power grab from some internal, probably military faction.
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And you think abandoning the military's men will show who's boss? And the only way we'll have any idea of what specifically caused this is if we get the men back to ask questions. Moreover, we have zero idea- it could have been a merchant clan, it could have been one of our oligarchs, it could have been an outright accident. But immediately seeing it all as some grand internal conspiracy to seize power- when the Stallions refused to do anything remotely like that- is the sort of tinhat asinine paranoia that means you don't deserve whatever power you already have.
 
Hmm really I want to either let the HK kill the stupid rogue warriors or we should go down there and execute the lot of them for going against orders.

[X] Attempt to capture the errant warriors and then make amends with the Highlanders (-5 Diplomacy, probable war with Highlanders)

This feels good. Also for those that are advocating for eating against the HK we'll keep in mind how it'll conflict our justice and symphony trait. Yeah no assholes get whacked not rewarded.
 
DragonParadox said:
Possible, but unlikely I think



It is evil because it is unjust.



You might want to vote for capturing them so as to consolidate the non-conquest vote.
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One can do plenty of unjust things, that still caunt as good. So the sentence it's evil because it's unjust. Is inherently false.

My vote.
[X] Attempt to capture the errant warriors and then make amends with the Highlanders (-5 Diplomacy, probable war with Highlanders)
 
[X] Attempt to capture the errant warriors and then make amends with the Highlanders (-5 Diplomacy, probable war with Highlanders)

And people said it's just a patch on the clan system. Ah well, i will get my city guilds or halls eventually.

Also, this is why we should keep stability at +1.
 
Lailoken said:
Is there an intrigue stat? It would seem fitting that if we ended up rolling an intrigue hero we wouldn't even know for certain.
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For Early Bronze Iron Age, the closest approximation we got for an intrigue stat is Diplomacy. It's how we got the tech steal against the MW and it's how we managed to play the nomads like a fiddle with our Salt Gift by our double Heroic Admin/Diplo leader.
 
[X] Let the Highlanders extract their vengeance and attempt to make amends after (-1 Legitimacy, -3 Diplomacy, possibility of war with Highlanders, chance of spawning new faction in the lowlands)

Quick question here. Is there a way to set up a quarterly war game with our 'military' In an attempt to bleed off our max marital so our people's bloodlust doesn't consume us if we don't have a clear outlet?
 
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