Bakkasama
There is always a greater fool
- Location
- Buenos Aires, Argentina
- Pronouns
- He/his
Too right! Ask Cell, he had to learn it the hard way.
Dragon Ball: After the End
Which part, precisely, are you contesting?
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- Location
- Somewhere I shouldn't be
We have a LOT of training in fighting, just not much formal training in any particular style. Take a look at our skill for hand-to-hand.
We are highly skilled in many ways to fight. Styles simply tie those ways together with coherent strategies and techniques.
We would do well in the tournament, but not amazingly - people with better strategies and battlefield control could compensate for our individual skills, and there are certain to be some people who are at least as skilled as us in a given skill.
It would not, however, have been the embarrassing insta-loss you seemed to fear.
- Location
- Rockford, USA
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Qualification: Depending on against whom you were at first matched.
She is "talented" at combat in piecemeal, and a complete novice at the only style she knows. This is far, far, far from good enough for a royal in a professional tournament. The royalty's fundamental job is to maintain a monopoly on force, and in exchange they protect those they forcibly limit from challenging that monopoly from the need to protect themselves. When it comes to combat, Kakara is treating that monopoly as nothing but her personal crutch, and entering the tournament would reveal that. This tournament is based on an imminent existential threat, and will conclude with the announcement of another one. The active royalty has already been cut in half, taking with it the prodigy who invented and mastered his own super-style before the age of eight. Finding out that half of the remainder, the notorious weakling, has been so negligent that she is still an obvious novice at the most critical part of her entire job in this context would be devastating.
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- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
When one feels entitled to exaggerate everything to the maximum, it's very easy to make an argument that appears convincing... to oneself, if one believes one's own hype.
There are specific areas in which I would expect Kakara to be able to hold her own even in the formidable company of tournament-grade Exile fighters. Aerobatics would be one. Single-combat hand to hand "dueling" is another. I'm not sure how well she'd hold her own in a beam struggle; I imagine she'd do quite well with only a little more training, but without it she wouldn't be competitive with the best at equal power levels.
If she were up against an opponent whose own style would bring her areas of greatest talent to bear,* she could give them a very formidable challenge. Even if she lost, calling her a "weakling" would be a fucking obvious lie.
On the other hand, a style that lent itself well to avoiding her areas of greatest strength (say, by keeping her at a distance and engaging her in beam combat) could well result in Kakara being badly defeated There is some legitimate risk of a poor showing.
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*(Probably a Goku stylist, who would go out of their way to seek out hand to hand combat and be susceptible to being outmaneuvered. It's noteworthy, now that I think about it, that during the period of her most active training, Kakara was training disproportionately with her father, who is himself the archetypal Goku stylist)
There are specific areas in which I would expect Kakara to be able to hold her own even in the formidable company of tournament-grade Exile fighters. Aerobatics would be one. Single-combat hand to hand "dueling" is another. I'm not sure how well she'd hold her own in a beam struggle; I imagine she'd do quite well with only a little more training, but without it she wouldn't be competitive with the best at equal power levels.
If she were up against an opponent whose own style would bring her areas of greatest talent to bear,* she could give them a very formidable challenge. Even if she lost, calling her a "weakling" would be a fucking obvious lie.
On the other hand, a style that lent itself well to avoiding her areas of greatest strength (say, by keeping her at a distance and engaging her in beam combat) could well result in Kakara being badly defeated There is some legitimate risk of a poor showing.
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*(Probably a Goku stylist, who would go out of their way to seek out hand to hand combat and be susceptible to being outmaneuvered. It's noteworthy, now that I think about it, that during the period of her most active training, Kakara was training disproportionately with her father, who is himself the archetypal Goku stylist)
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
I honestly think it would be incalculably valuable. It might not be as practical to use in combat, as Perfect Multiform (then again it might), but the political ramificiations of reinventing Ancestor Goku's lost technique would be staggering.
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
You likely don't want to use spirit bomb too much or you end up with a dead planet.
Cariyaga
Handsome Gentleperson
- Location
- United States
Yep. Imagine how much our good friend Papata would give to get the scoop on that
The Fourth Monado
S U B A R A S H I I
- Location
- Away
Honestly, you just need to draw from other planets- even ones without life would still have power to be drawn upon.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Ehhhh, debateable... Also, other planets are a lot farther away for us than they are for Namek.
That's likely to happen if you use it too hard in any one instance, but it seems like the reservoir of ki from which a spirit bomb is charged replenishes itself rapidly, and Goku's use of it never killed anything that we know of.*
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*(at least, if you don't believe the apocrypha to the Attestations of Rakkyo, and even he didn't take those seriously given how drunk he was at the time.)
It was a lie the first time, yet it nevertheless became her defining public reputation. She is not being judged against commoner standards. She is being judged against royal standards and inevitably the half of the active royalty her father sealed away. The royalty's monopoly on the SSJ state is only justified by their removing the need for anybody else to have it. Her allowing herself to be a mere, if talented, novice at the very time when those comparisons and duties are most acute is the kind of thing which starts whispers that the lazy scion and her usurper father who sealed the brightest talent in generations and only checks on themselves might not be the best people to lead, and even that perhaps something should be done about it.
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fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
Earth is not a good example considering how many times it got restored by the dragon balls. Also I am worrying more about if the technique became public knowledge and you have thousands of Saiyans using it.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Well, you'd have to wonder what they'd be using it on, but you're not wrong to point the issue out.
Then again, it's not like Goku ever taught the technique to anyone else. We'd be fully within our rights to declare it a secret of the royals, just like the super-saiyan transformation and its advanced forms. Arguably more within our rights, since the Spirit Bomb is already well established in the known legends and canon of the Exiles as "the thing you use to blow up the unstoppable monster and save the world."
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
Eh, should not be a problem when I realize that most of the power is likely to come from Saiyans raising their hands. We should have a reservoir of ki several hunderd billion times what Goku had on earth.
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Bakkasama
There is always a greater fool
- Location
- Buenos Aires, Argentina
- Pronouns
- He/his
Dude, chill. This is a tournament where the best warriors of our race participate and we are all restricted to the same power level. Losing against one of them in those conditions do not make us a weakling. The lack of style means our moves might not flow together in the most optimal way but we are still exceptional at dueling and we have been since we were eight. We spar against our dad who is an elite fighter. We didn't do that bad in our last spar with Jaffur. We know IT which is a really complicated technique, we are an acknowledged prodigy in ki manipulation, we discovered GO and first became SS in battle. Plus it has been over four years since anyone has seen Jaffur fight and people know we have been busy with other things. We are considered wise beyond our years. And we are what? 13?
Nit showing we know a style means we haven't quite decided on one yet, not that we don't train at all. We have shown ourselves skilled enough and have enough under our belt that it is not in question. Unless we have an utterly pathetic showing, which is extremely unlikely, any hit we would have from losing would be minimum because people don't expect a 13yo, even if tgey are scion, to be perfect. Our reputation is too big for that, they would probably assume we were having an off day.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Uhhh.
We've been told by @PoptartProdigy that the mean saiyan power level is "between one and two million..." though that might be the median, I don't remember. Let's be generous and say the mean is two million.
If so... well. There are roughly three hundred thousand Exiles. Their combined power, if we can use a strictly additive model, punches at six hundred billion. And that is a LOT.
But by contrast, if the Earth Goku lived on had a population anything like the Earth we live on, then just the human(oid) population, with average power levels of say, four... totals out at somewhere between twenty and thirty billion.
So "ten times," very probably. "a hundred times," maybe. "Several hundred billion times?" I think you're exaggerating for dramatic effect?
When a commoner uses the wrong fork it is a barely remarkable embarrassment. When the queen does it at a state function it is international news. Being the most dangerous thing around is the fundamental essence of her job, and she's about to be called upon to do it to a degree which hasn't been seen in the entire history of the Exiles, twice. Again, the typical Saiyan attitude towards the sort of piecemeal expertise you describe:
Finding out that she's a mere novice at her very best style in this way at this moment and isn't even ashamed of it would make a lot of already very scared and angry people even more upset. Jaffur and Jaron's reactions are not unique. Even her father, who would bend the universe to save her from needing to fight, has questioned if she has done enough. The uncle of the only other pacifist she has met in her entire life has called her out on it.
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fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
She's 12.
She's royalty. She's supposed to be a quarter, now half, of the only institution standing between her entire planet and oblivion.
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
Hence why we should have been in the competition. We needed every bit of experience we could get.
I suggested a means by which both her and her allies could gain experience in the form and against the type of opponent which are actually relevant without any of the PR downsides. There were no takers.
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
Your way was non viable. Instead of clinging to it you should have switched votes.
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You assumed that it was non-viable. The GM says that an all-out Oozaru match was entirely possible. A golden great ape getting 4x experience against a dozen or two future kaiju-busters in Oozaru form simultaneously was an option.
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