Remove ads

Dragon Ball: After the End

Voting is open
Reader mode
Bakkasama said:
Question, just to make things clear. This means that, even if we exhaust ourselves while fighting in our base form then, as long as we are not wounded then the streght of our Oozaru form wouldn't change but what happens if we fight as a super saiyan before going great ape? Does its power lower? I mean, they have the same power source but they are also different transformations so...
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Oozaru rejuvenates much like SSJ does. Nobody has ever been in a situation where switching from SSJ to Oozaru seemed like a good idea, but that might just be because nobody's thought of it, so you aren't sure.
 
Pretty sure Vegeta become Saiyan Beyond God and Super Saiyan Blue purely from training with Whis, and didn't Gohan become a god in this quest after he's presumed dead with no Saiyan around? I'm pretty sure Vegeta (canon) and Gohan (this quest) achieve godhood simply by being strong enough and getting godly ki transfer from Whis / other god. Confirmation on this @PoptartProdigy
 
Disregard what I previously wrote here, I had second thoughts.

That aside, seems pretty clear. If we avoid answering, she's goingto assume that we were respnsible for helping. If we do answer, she's going to start shit, get squished--or worse, she manages to kill Berra and now there's nothing that could ever balk Lady Vegeta if she finds some way of neutralizing us as well, especially now that she may have the old Lord Vegeta on a spell leash, and she certainly has Jaffur (Who she mindfucked along with the mindfuck).

God damnit, I hate dealing with masterminds. The only upside is that as long as Berra is in power, she's forced to move with discretion. As guilt will only give you so much protection from a guy who's willing to destroy his own relationship with his daughter in the course of doing what he thinks is Right. Especially since he's feeling so guilty about the whole thing that he can't even face us about it, which is just making things worse.
 
Last edited:
[X] No, they're not true
[X]--But there's not really anything we can do about it right now without playing into Lady Vegeta's hands. She pulled Father over a barrel by playing on how I got beat up while pushing Jaffur to Ascend--she lied to him, and he believed her enough that he was willing to hold me down while she did this. I will make this right somehow, I just need to figure out how to do it without destroying us as a people."
 
Alectai said:
Disregard what I previously wrote here, I had second thoughts.

That aside, seems pretty clear. If we avoid answering, she's goingto assume that we were respnsible for helping. If we do answer, she's going to start shit, get squished--or worse, she manages to kill Berra and now there's nothing that could ever balk Lady Vegeta if she finds some way of neutralizing us as well, especially now that she may have the old Lord Vegeta on a spell leash, and she certainly has Jaffur (Who she mindfucked along with the mindfuck).

God damnit, I hate dealing with masterminds. The only upside is that as long as Berra is in power, she's forced to move with discretion. As guilt will only give you so much protection from a guy who's willing to destroy his own relationship with his daughter in the course of doing what he thinks is Right. Especially since he's feeling so guilty about the whole thing that he can't even face us about it, which is just making things worse.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
She's likely not going to be able to kill Berra, straight up, he's just too powerful, and even assuming our guess that in a straight hand-to-hand fight we'd win is false, our father is still miles above us in all combat-based disciplines.
In any case, she's probably smart enough to not start shit like that.
 
Alectai said:
Disregard what I previously wrote here, I had second thoughts.

That aside, seems pretty clear. If we avoid answering, she's goingto assume that we were respnsible for helping. If we do answer, she's going to start shit, get squished--or worse, she manages to kill Berra and now there's nothing that could ever balk Lady Vegeta if she finds some way of neutralizing us as well, especially now that she may have the old Lord Vegeta on a spell leash, and she certainly has Jaffur (Who she mindfucked along with the mindfuck).

God damnit, I hate dealing with masterminds. The only upside is that as long as Berra is in power, she's forced to move with discretion. As guilt will only give you so much protection from a guy who's willing to destroy his own relationship with his daughter in the course of doing what he thinks is Right. Especially since he's feeling so guilty about the whole thing that he can't even face us about it, which is just making things worse.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

She is past her prime, Berra is her son and she would probably be way more ofended and willing to act against lady Vegeta. I would be more worried about her trying to move the rabble of clan Goku tan of her acting directly against Berra. If she wanted to fight him, she would have done so already and if she wanted a second super to even things out then we can always say no.

There is also no reason to believe she has the old lord Vegeta on a leash and if she tries to pull her shit again then people won't believe her about it being for the greater good this time. So even if you say that as long as Berra is in power Dandeel is forced to move with discretion, if he is not in power then we can pretty much assume she is screwed. We are against her, grandma is against her, the previous lord vegeta is likely against her. She can't cast fast enough to beat a super saiyan and if she tries while we are asleep then people will rebel since right now it is respect of her position that lets her keep it.
 
Icefyre said:
Pretty sure Vegeta become Saiyan Beyond God and Super Saiyan Blue purely from training with Whis, and didn't Gohan become a god in this quest after he's presumed dead with no Saiyan around? I'm pretty sure Vegeta (canon) and Gohan (this quest) achieve godhood simply by being strong enough and getting godly ki transfer from Whis / other god. Confirmation on this @PoptartProdigy
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

It's canon to Super that Vegeta managed to train his way to Saiyan God and above, yes. It's canon to this quest that Gohan achieved Super Saiyan God in the last moments of his life, in just enough time for a self-destruct. The ritual requires five Saiyans, but you can grind your way there. Now, as to whether or not Future Trunks managed it, I don't know. I doubt it'll happen in Super because his name isn't Goku or Vegeta, but we'll see. If it happens I'll do a retcon, but it's not like it'll matter terribly much anyway.

Execute/Dumbo said:
She's likely not going to be able to kill Berra, straight up, he's just too powerful, and even assuming our guess that in a straight hand-to-hand fight we'd win is false, our father is still miles above us in all combat-based disciplines.
In any case, she's probably smart enough to not start shit like that.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

You're actually on-level with Berra in Hand-to-Hand Combat (Dueling). Nowhere else, though.
 
[X] No, they're not true


If future trunks did make SSG, it's entirely possible people here won't know. After all, most of his time is going to be spent on time patrol stuff. And future trunks isn't the one our saiyans are descended from.
 
[X] No, they're not true
[X]--But there's not really anything we can do about it right now without playing into Lady Vegeta's hands. She pulled Father over a barrel by playing on how I got beat up while pushing Jaffur to Ascend--she lied to him, and he believed her enough that he was willing to hold me down while she did this. I will make this right somehow, I just need to figure out how to do it without destroying us as a people."
 
Aranfan said:
@PoptartProdigy So there was never a chance of being both Seer and Sorcerer?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

There actually was, just a stupidly slim one. For every character significant enough to merit me making a sheet, I roll 2d100. On the first, a roll of 95+ results in the Gift -- the ability to use magic. On the second, a perfect 100 results in the Sight -- the fact of being a Seer, what the Exiles call Bardock's Craft. I rolled a 23 for the Sorcery roll, so you're about as magic as a brick. But yeah, nat-100 on the Seer roll. If you'd rolled high enough on both, though, you'd be both, and utterly trivialize anything I had planned for you -- I planned my challenges for a Seer Scion or a Sorcerer Scion, but not both.

All told, the chance that you'd be both a Seer and a Sorcerer was 0.05%. Possible. But highly unlikely.
 
PoptartProdigy said:
There actually was, just a stupidly slim one. For every character significant enough to merit me making a sheet, I roll 2d100. On the first, a roll of 95+ results in the Gift -- the ability to use magic. On the second, a perfect 100 results in the Sight -- the fact of being a Seer, what the Exiles call Bardock's Craft. I rolled a 23 for the Sorcery roll, so you're about as magic as a brick. But yeah, nat-100 on the Seer roll. If you'd rolled high enough on both, though, you'd be both, and utterly trivialize anything I had planned for you -- I planned my challenges for a Seer Scion or a Sorcerer Scion, but not both.

All told, the chance that you'd be both a Seer and a Sorcerer was 0.05%. Possible. But highly unlikely.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Right.
So, also, just how powerful is this 'seer' bullshit going to get? I know Bardock had visions years in the future as an untrained seer, so I'm trying to figure out if we can start doing that 'fuck ki' thing our teacher did.
 
Aranfan said:
Also, we meed to patch things up with dad next turn.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Only way that's going to happen is if we accept he did the right thing. That's never going to happen, so he's going to keep avoiding us because he doesn't like us judging him.

He's the kind of person who has the mentality of doing the Right Thing, and he was convinced he was doing it here--and that once you've set to a course, you stay it as long as you have to. He's never going to accept that he might have been wrong, because that would break him.

Kakara will never acknowledge that he did the right thing, and he'll never allow himself to think that he may have been fooled. Him keeping his distance is one part him thinking he's doing us a kindness, and one part him not wanting a constant reminder of the atrocity he assisted in committing with the best of intentions.

He's not going to give because he's older, and Kakara isn't ever going to forgive what happened, and considers him part of the problem because he's not only refusing to acknowledge that he might have been wrong, but basically tried to bury what happened instead. The best that might be expected is some form of distant equilibrium, because neither side is going to give an inch, barring Lady Vegeta's bullshit being brought to light in a way that can't be explained away.
 
Last edited:
[X] No, they're not true
[X]--But there's not really anything we can do about it right now without playing into Lady Vegeta's hands. She pulled Father over a barrel by playing on how I got beat up while pushing Jaffur to Ascend--she lied to him, and he believed her enough that he was willing to hold me down while she did this. I will make this right somehow, I just need to figure out how to do it without destroying us as a people."

We also need to tell her about being a Seer.

Let's use our bullshit future vision to absolutely DESTROY Lady Geet's bullshit chess plot.

Then let's plan for going Super Saiyan Great Ape God, tearing Goku, Gohan, and Vegeta out of the afterlife, and finding the fucker that killed Earth.

Also, let's have a tea party! Our human social group needs activities too!
 
Execute/Dumbo said:
Right.
So, also, just how powerful is this 'seer' bullshit going to get? I know Bardock had visions years in the future as an untrained seer, so I'm trying to figure out if we can start doing that 'fuck ki' thing our teacher did.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I reinterpret Seers, here, as those gifted with the ability to truly see.

So...pretty powerful. Past, future, and present are all, to the proper mindset and the right level of skill, laid totally bare. Seeing ki is actually one of the tamer applications -- it's just inherently impressive to a nine-year-old who has become accustomed to the idea of being functionally invincible outside of three other people. You'll never hit omniscience, but you will have unfettered access to all the bullshit that having the gift of Sight is privy to. Every opponent might as well yell out an itemized itinerary of their attack plans, your opponents might as well share their schemes with you over scones and tea, the works. You aren't invincible -- you still need to be capable of acting on that Sight -- but it's a hell of an advantage.

Ho hum. However will I make that not hilariously broken? :evil:

I once read a fascinating quote: "You can't give Frodo a lightsaber unless you're willing to give Sauron the Death Star..."
 
PoptartProdigy said:
I reinterpret Seers, here, as those gifted with the ability to truly see.

So...pretty powerful. Past, future, and present are all, to the proper mindset and the right level of skill, laid totally bare. Seeing ki is actually one of the tamer applications -- it's just inherently impressive to a nine-year-old who has become accustomed to the idea of being functionally invincible outside of three other people. You'll never hit omniscience, but you will have unfettered access to all the bullshit that having the gift of Sight is privy to. Every opponent might as well yell out an itemized itinerary of their attack plans, your opponents might as well share their schemes with you over scones and tea, the works. You aren't invincible -- you still need to be capable of acting on that Sight -- but it's a hell of an advantage.

Ho hum. However will I make that not hilariously broken? :evil:

I once read a fascinating quote: "You can't give Frodo a lightsaber unless you're willing to give Sauron the Death Star..."
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Clearly, you'll give the main villain King Crimson.:V
 
Execute/Dumbo said:
we need to patch up our relationship with dad on year 2.
I know, it's horrible what he did, but he did it for reasons he thought were good, so that's something, right?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Aranfan said:
Also, we meed to patch things up with dad next turn.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
On top of what Alectai said, the wound is festering.

But we're Sayians, any confrontation is likely to end in a fight, and with both of our feelings on the matter, its only likely to compound the issue rather than help it.
PoptartProdigy said:
I once read a fascinating quote: "You can't give Frodo a lightsaber unless you're willing to give Sauron the Death Star..."
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
That is one of the single most fanfic ruining tropes on the entire net. If you have to use that to keep a story interesting, you already lost.
 
I like how Mistborn actually handles it. Two people using precog on each other cancel each other out and bring the fight back to even terms.

There was this super metal called Atium that a Mistborn could eat, that gave them a few seconds of localized omniscience. So you'd have someone downing a vial with Atium beads, and then they kill everyone in the room--except for another Mistborn that sees them doing it, actually has Atium of their own, and manges to get enough of theirs down that it becomes a chess match of who burns their limited stock of precog out first. (Since Atium burns stupidly fast, and the distribution is controlled by the godlike immortal Emperor, so nobody's allowed more than small amounts that are reserved for the rare Mistborn operatives)

In other words, Precog makes you nearly a god in personal combat, but even another weak Precog can more-or-less neutralize you in a duel, since they don't need to see every possible action they could make and automatically take the best one--they just need to see which routes have them getting killed by you, and do anything else.
 
Last edited:
ShadowAngelBeta said:
That is one of the single most fanfic ruining tropes on the entire net. If you have to use that to keep a story interesting, you already lost.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Seriously though, yeah, SAB is right. Or rather, most fanfic authors...tend to get the sentiment all wrong. Going extremely overboard with it (such as the very example used there) is one of the quickest ways to break SOD.
 
ShadowAngelBeta said:
That is one of the single most fanfic ruining tropes on the entire net. If you have to use that to keep a story interesting, you already lost.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

...eh? I don't quite know what you mean. I interpret it as, "you can't make your hero powerful unless you make your villains powerful enough to challenge that," which is...well, just good storytelling. Boring invincible heroes are just that: boring. I mean, how would it be interesting if I just let you romp all over every opponent by being a combat seer? I mean, you're going to be powerful, but I'm not going to let you break the setting.

I don't literally think that the Death Star is an equitable match for a lightsaber, I just think the quote is pithy and illustrative of the concept of narrative balance.
 
ApocalypticFish said:
Seriously though, yeah, SAB is right. Or rather, most fanfic authors...tend to get the sentiment all wrong. Going extremely overboard with it (such as the very example used there) is one of the quickest ways to break SOD.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

What the story's trying to say is not literally "If you make your protagonist stronger, you need to make the villain stronger".

The idea is that threat should be scaled to the story. And a story about a plucky hero getting a magic sword does not fit in an epic journey to destroy a forbidden, all-corrupting relic, putting the heart of people against a nigh almighty, faceless evil. It would defeat the purpose if the Ring Bearer could just froom-room all of the problems away and drop the ring into Mount Doom unopposed.

Curbstomps aren't fun, whether you're on the recieving end of it or the giving one. That a power like this was possible to achieve simply means that we get to take on more significant threats that would require such a power instead--not that the universe got stronger because we got an awesome perk.
 
Last edited:
Anyone else up for training our human friends in martial arts? It doesn't have to be a dedicated thing (we aren't making our own Special Forces) but it would be fun and would let us practice our Masque better.
 
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Voting is open
Remove ads
Back
Top