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Dragon Ball: After the End

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Deathbybunnies said:
I don't understand your objection. It's been well-established that the rocks come back fully, given how every day Jaron destroys every single one of them and they grow back. And immediately after it came back, he went from saying he couldn't remember the night at all to saying he remembered nothing happening that night.
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There is no reason his memory being sealed can't both mean he ignores the rock and gets the wrong memory/promptly forgets it.
 
Deathbybunnies said:
I don't understand your objection. It's been well-established that the rocks come back fully, given how every day Jaron destroys every single one of them and they grow back. And immediately after it came back, he went from saying he couldn't remember the night at all to saying he remembered nothing happening that night.
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Which sounds just about exactly like "I remember a false/tampered memory of that night, but I know it's not true."

Or "Every time I access the memory of that night, I scream in horror, and when I'm done recalling it, a pre-existing mind spell laid on me by Dandeer re-erases it, just like it re-erases Jaron's memory of meeting me."

Or, frankly, a lot of possible explanations.

The point is, it's obviously all very strange. And we're unlikely to really understand what is going on until we've personally observed it from the outside and/or learned enough magic theory to understand it. Jaffur himself isn't equipped to figure it out, because he has effectively no formal magical training, and is potentially inside of one or more mind-altering effects specifically intended to prevent him from understanding what happened.

So coming up with highly specific, multi-step chains of inference about how clearly Jaffur must be doing/thinking this but clearly Dandeer couldn't have been doing that, is very likely to lead us astray.
 
Simon_Jester said:
Which sounds just about exactly like "I remember a false/tampered memory of that night, but I know it's not true."

Or "Every time I access the memory of that night, I scream in horror, and when I'm done recalling it, a pre-existing mind spell laid on me by Dandeer re-erases it, just like it re-erases Jaron's memory of meeting me."

Or, frankly, a lot of possible explanations.

The point is, it's obviously all very strange. And we're unlikely to really understand what is going on until we've personally observed it from the outside and/or learned enough magic theory to understand it. Jaffur himself isn't equipped to figure it out, because he has effectively no formal magical training, and is potentially inside of one or more mind-altering effects specifically intended to prevent him from understanding what happened.

So coming up with highly specific, multi-step chains of inference about how clearly Jaffur must be doing/thinking this but clearly Dandeer couldn't have been doing that, is very likely to lead us astray.
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Alright, that's a reasonable position to take. It just seems weird given the wording of the update is all:
PoptartProdigy said:
Something is very, very wrong with the official version of the night prior to the Sealing. Jaffur has asked you to scry for what really happened. You have exactly enough juice to find that out.
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Another possibility: Jaffur did go to sleep normally, and someone else woke up and attacked Dandeer. Is it possible that there's a third person around?
 
I don't think so. Jaffur's sister should be the only other person in the house at the time.

That said, I was thinking on how Kakara might end up traumatised from seeing Dandeer suffer the injuries and a really messed up, though fortunately unlikely possibility came to mind.

You probably don't want to know
Dude, I warned you
It was implied when Dandeer visited Berra that night that in order to get getVegeta to sleep Dandeer had let him rape her. What if her injuries were sustained then... for Vegeta's enjoyment?
It was also implied by how she avoided the topic and didn't show herself that emotionally affected that such an ocurrence might not have been that unusual. With how Senzu can heal wounds, the injuries might also not be. What if, the reason Jaffur's memory was blocked, is because she is used to erase them on such nights to protect him from knowing? What if Jaffur has other nights he can't remember and Dandeer has been using magic on him all the while in an attempt to spare him from the worse and that is how she came up with the idea of the sealing?
I think I actually feel a little sick.
 
Bakkasama said:
That said, I was thinking on how Kakara might end up traumatised from seeing Dandeer suffer the injuries and a really messed up, though fortunately unlikely possibility came to mind.
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I thought that was implicitly stated?
Not in detail, but someone who beats his spouse hard enough she miscarries, and publicly brutalizes his only son, is not likely to have that much interest in her personal rights.
 
Alright, I swear that the request for review is in! Has been, even. Just...taking a while.

That's literally the only thing on which we're waiting. Soon as I get the feedback I need -- and change whatever may or may not need changing -- the update will be posted, promise. It's all worked up, safe and sound in another window, waiting for me to post it.

I hate waiting.
 
PoptartProdigy said:
Alright, I swear that the request for review is in! Has been, even. Just...taking a while.

That's literally the only thing on which we're waiting. Soon as I get the feedback I need -- and change whatever may or may not need changing -- the update will be posted, promise. It's all worked up, safe and sound in another window, waiting for me to post it.

I hate waiting.
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Yeah, it can take days for the submission to be reviewed.
 
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Both More And Less Simple Than Originally Thought
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    • [X] Do it now.

    Both More And Less Simple Than Originally Thought​

    Right. Well. He was...distressed...by what he saw.

    You really see nothing to be gained by delay, here. You told him you'd look. It might be urgent. You really want to see. Time to go under again.

    Marshaling the last dregs of your strength, you plunge back into your Sight, opening a link to the past.

    * * *

    Go-

    * * *
    ​
    Mist swirls. The world is obscured. You don't know what this is. This has never happened before.

    "INTRUSION DETECTED. YOU ARE ATTEMPTING TO VIEW SENSITIVE INFORMATION."

    You flinch. Despite the volume, the voice is Dandeer's.

    "THIS INFORMATION IS RESTRICTED. ONLY MEMBERS OF THE VEGETAN ROYAL FAMILY ARE PERMITTED ACCESS. CHECKING AUTHORIZATION..."

    You have no breath, in this place, but sighs are mental as well as physical. Perhaps you should have spent some time learning about magic, although you imagine that blocking Sight isn't something most sorcerers can do-

    "AUTHORIZATION CONFIRMED. ACCESS GRANTED."

    ...what?

    "UNLOCKING MEMORY FOR REMOTE VIEWING."

    No seriously what the he-

    * * *

    -ne.

    * * *
    ​
    Dandeer steps away from her husband as he settles back in their bed. He relaxes; his expression smooths out; he is calm. Human.

    Even in sleep, sane.

    Lowering her hands, Dandeer collapses with a sob of relief.

    After a moment, though, she collects herself. She's unsteady on her feet, but she manages to climb to her feet. She looks down at her husband. Tears stream down her face. She can't seem to stop smiling.

    Still, though, she steps out of the room. Walking down a hall, she pauses by a door on the left. She opens it, peering in. A tiny little girl, brown-haired, peacefully slumbers in her bed. Still sniffling, Dandeer walks over and tucks in her daughter, smoothing down her hair.

    Then she takes a deep breath, leaves the room, and steps across the hall to the door on the right.

    Jaffur's room is spartan by comparison to his sister's, although whose preference that was is debatable. In contrast to his sister, his sleep is fitful. He mutters to himself below the edge of hearing, and lets out a quiet whine at the sound of somebody opening his door.

    "It's just me, sweetheart," whispers Dandeer, stepping closer to his bed. Jaffur stills, retreating back down into sleep in an instant. His mother sits down on his bedside, laying a hand on his forehead.

    "I did it, Jaffur," she whispers in a tone full of wonder. "I finally fixed him. I was so afraid he'd wake up, but..." She shivers. Jaffur stirs at the motion, and she settles him by stroking his hair. She sighs. "I know that it works, now. Oh, but it's hard. He's so strong, I need to put so much into it...still, at least he was a heavy sleeper."

    She sits there for a moment, fingers twined in her son's hair, staring at the wall.

    "He's not at all like you, that way," she says. "You sleep so lightly, it's a wonder that you ever nod off. I can't fix you like I did him. You'd wake up once you felt it."

    When it happens, there are no fancy hand seals. No incantations. Not even a simple name. She strokes her fingers through his hair again, and magic simply emanates into the world. "So nothing special happened tonight, Jaffur, and you won't remember any of it."

    He stirs, half-waking. "Mom?"

    "Shh, sweetie," she says, still stroking.

    "...felt something..."

    "Nothing important, honey."

    And just like that, his eyelids droop, he gives a sleepy nod, and he sinks back down to the pillow.

    Dandeer waits for a few minutes to be certain that he's sleeping again, and then nods in satisfaction. "Berra will probably try to see what you remember. He'll want to know why you, 'reacted,' the way you, 'did.' I can't risk that. I can't be honest with him about why I'm doing this. He won't understand. Nobody will understand. So I'll give him something he will understand. And you'll be so much better, Jaffur. You'll be so happy." Her hand stills. She swallows. "And your father will be alive. You can't kill him, Jaffur. I won't let you kill him. Not when I only just got him back." She takes a shaky breath. "Now, sleep, honey. I'll see you in the morning. I know you'll probably be furious at me, but I promise, this is for your own good."

    Leaning over, she kisses him on the forehead. She runs her fingers through his hair one last time. She stands. She leaves.

    You feel the vision flickering as you follow her down the hall, but you manage to barely hold it. You need to see. This lines up with Jaffur said; he went to sleep, and woke up the next day. Of course he wouldn't remember these half-woken moments. Nobody remembers these moments, come morning. But you grasp the implications of all that nothing. Just like you know that he must have.

    You follow her as the vision threatens to collapse, desperately hoping that you aren't about to see what you think you are.

    You watch her go down the basement level of the Vegetan royal apartments, to a room with a heavy door. Inside is a library -- until you look closely. Then you see strange instruments, their purposes unknown. You see the chalk, the protractors, the rulers. You see the circles on the floor.

    You see Dandeer step into the center of one of those circles. It lights up as she crosses it, and inside the circle with her, you hear the minuscule noises of the outside world cut off.

    The following contains depictions of severe injuries and self-harm. If you are sensitive to this kind of content, please exercise discretion in your choice of whether or not to read it. If you do not wish to be exposed to this kind of content, you may skip down to the end of Kakara's vision, below, and resume reading there. A summary of the below passage is available at the end of the passage.

    You see her take a deep breath, eyes fixed on a wall.

    "I told him. He went crazy. He attacked me," she says. You can see the skin at her throat fluttering slightly in time with her pulse. She fires up her aura and curls her fingers into fists. Deliberately, she keeps up her power level.

    Just as deliberately, you can feel the bits keeping her durable draining away.

    "He broke my ribs."

    She drives her fist into the left side of her chest.

    poppoppoppoppop

    She gasps, reeling down to her knees, tears immediately springing up in her eyes. She grits her teeth.

    "He...collapsed...my left...lung."

    thump

    That one gets a quiet wheeze. Her voice now comes in a hoarse, dying rasp. She quivers as she manages to say, "He...he broke...he broke my...my arms..."

    Well, he didn't.

    So she does it for him.

    You see her beat herself into a bloody pulp. You see her curl up on the floor and sob in broken agony.

    And afterwards, you see her force herself to her feet, reel away out into the Hall proper, shamble over to your family's apartments, and pin every bit of it on her eight-year-old son    .

    Psyching herself up, Dandeer proceeds to inflict upon herself all of the injuries she ascribed to Jaffur, narrating what, "he," did as she goes in order to avoid losing her nerve. She then goes to Kakara's family's apartments, leaving off where the relevant Prologue scene picked up.

    * * *

    Back.

    * * *
    ​
    When you come out of your trance, you're already sobbing. You wrap your arms around your chest, tears running down your face. You scrub frantically at your sides, trying to get the feeling of filth off of you from what you just saw.

    You love your parents.

    You love your parents.

    You love them so much.

    Jaffur, I am so, so sorry.

    You cry, wondering how the hell you're going to be able to look your friend in the face and tell him that his mother locked him away for an offense that he never even committed, after framing him for it.


    "Hot-Blooded," isn't all the way gone yet, you know. Activated. Remember: Kakara has not had days to consider the implications of how Jaffur reacted to what he saw. She went into this off-balance and got smacked with a woman mutilating herself in order to frame her son.

    [ ] (x2.0) "I'LL KILL YOU!" FUCK! SUBTLE! With what you've just seen, there's not a person in the world who would stand up for Dandeer's choice. Not her minuscule amount of supporters, not her daughter, and certainly not your father. You're going after her directly, right now, and you're going to make her pay for doing this to her son. Despite this option's name, Kakara won't actually be trying to kill Dandeer...but she will not be the model of restraint at present, forcing Willpower checks to avoid accidental use of lethal force.
    [ ] Calm down. Calm down. CALM DOWN. You have plans. You have people to consult. You can take her apart after you talk to somebody and make sure you're making the right choice. Just...just have to...calm down...and not do something to draw people sprinting to you to find out what's wrong. Force an immediate DC 100 Willpower check to calm the hell down. Success: congrats, you calm down! Failure: you flip out and level the mountain. Either way, you don't go after Dandeer now.
    -[ ] Whether or not you succeed, write in what Kakara does next. It must involve doing something about this; Kakara is in no mood to change tracks right now.
    [ ] You're out of juice. You'll make more. Jaffur deserves to know. You...have no idea how you're going to tell him...but you have to. Force a DC 80 Willpower check to push through one last projection while running on figurative fumes, and confirm what you're sure Jaffur has already guessed. No meltdown in the event of failure -- you will be too exhausted to do anything more than cry tears of frustration.
    -[ ] Write in, concisely, what your approach is.
    [ ] Write-in.

    APPROVAL VOTING. NEW MORATORIUM RULES APPLY.

    Writing this was entertaining, if difficult. Dandeer puts on an acceptable front in public, but in private it becomes quite clear that she is completely insane.

    I admit, I've been looking forward to this reveal for a while.

    Have fun, folks. Remain civil. And remember, if your post is comprised wholly of gloating over Dandeer's agonies, it might be wiser to leave it unposted at all.

    See you around!
     
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    • PoptartProdigy said:
    "AUTHORIZATION CONFIRMED. ACCESS GRANTED."
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    Well that's worrying. Very worrying. Best case the fact that Jaffur told us to do this granted us authorization. Worst case... no idea.

    [ ] Calm down. Calm down. CALM DOWN. You have plans. You have people to consult. You can take her apart after you talk to somebody and make sure you're making the right choice. Just...just have to...calm down...and not do something to draw people sprinting to you to find out what's wrong. Force an immediate DC 100 Willpower check to calm the hell down. Success: congrats, you calm down! Failure: you flip out and level the mountain. Either way, you don't go after Dandeer now.
    -[ ] Go to Berra. Demand he Mind Delve you. Show him what you just saw.

    I'm worried about this for multiple reasons.
    1. I'm worried that the lock will keep him out and he'll see nothing.
    2. I'm worried about what it would do to him emotionally.
    3. It would out the conspiracy, which could also have a negative impact.
     
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    Pity, I wonder if her self harming even if its an irrational way of protecting her son is more truer sense of guilt and self punishment for committing to the sealing.
     
    Up till now we could never talk to our dad about this because all we had was a feeling that it was wrong. This? This changes EVERYTHING. We still can't talk to him about this yet because it would be emotionally devastating both because he seriously screwed up and because he's a good person who always tries to do what's right and for all his power there really isn't anything he can do about this until the Senzus finish their part. Still, when it's time to finally enact the plan we can come clean and turn the biggest obstacle into an ally.
     
    PoptartProdigy said:
    Alright, I swear that the request for review is in! Has been, even. Just...taking a while.

    That's literally the only thing on which we're waiting. Soon as I get the feedback I need -- and change whatever may or may not need changing -- the update will be posted, promise. It's all worked up, safe and sound in another window, waiting for me to post it.

    I hate waiting.
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    I'm curious, did you end up changing anything? I only ask because the description of what Dandeer did seemed fairly tame to me, though I suppose some people might feel differently. I'm not trying to be rude, I'm genuinely interested in what the standards are for you and the moderators.
     
    Hahaha FUCK THIS BITCH. No keeping calm, were a teen not a fucking saint, and save for outright murdering our family in front of us, if there was ever a time to rage break it's Right Fucking Now.
     
    [ ] (x2.0) "I'LL KILL YOU!" FUCK! SUBTLE! With what you've just seen, there's not a person in the world who would stand up for Dandeer's choice. Not her minuscule amount of supporters, not her daughter, and certainly not your father. You're going after her directly, right now, and you're going to make her pay for doing this to her son. Despite this option's name, Kakara won't actually be trying to kill Dandeer...but she will not be the model of restraint at present, forcing Willpower checks to avoid accidental use of lethal force.

    LET'S FUCKING RUMBLE.
     
    Versharl said:
    I'm curious, did you end up changing anything? I only ask because the description of what Dandeer did seemed fairly tame to me, though I suppose some people might feel differently. I'm not trying to be rude, I'm genuinely interested in what the standards are for you and the moderators.
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    Mods were fine with it, although it took a while for somebody to get to it. I put it in for review because the way I describe ribs breaking has seriously wigged people out before. One person of my acquaintance gets flashbacks.
     
    But, yeah...she's gone from broken to just nuts in my book.

    I mean I'm still spreading the blame around a lot, but yeah...this just...errugh...

    I'm not 100% sure why she thought he needed to be sealed (I mean I have ideas, but I don't want to believe them) so just...errrugh.

    Also thoughts on telling Grandma and Grand Prince Arse? Cause they've got better self control, but I think they'll likely be pissed...like really pissed.
     
    Rmnimoc said:
    Up till now we could never talk to our dad about this because all we had was a feeling that it was wrong. This? This changes EVERYTHING. We still can't talk to him about this yet because it would be emotionally devastating both because he seriously screwed up and because he's a good person who always tries to do what's right and for all his power there really isn't anything he can do about this until the Senzus finish their part. Still, when it's time to finally enact the plan we can come clean and turn the biggest obstacle into an ally.
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    Strangely enough I'll be perfectly alright with telling it all to dad right now, and even more absurdly I'm starting to pity and understand Dandeer. Never thought it would happen even if understanding doesn't mean I approve or think she was right, but it certainly is something since I was on the path of simply thinking her too crazy to be human anymore.
     
    PoptartProdigy said:
    "THIS INFORMATION IS RESTRICTED. ONLY MEMBERS OF THE VEGETAN ROYAL FAMILY ARE PERMITTED ACCESS. CHECKING AUTHORIZATION..."

    You have no breath, in this place, but sighs are mental as well as physical. Perhaps you should have spent some time learning about magic, although you imagine that blocking Sight isn't something most sorcerers can do-

    "AUTHORIZATION CONFIRMED. ACCESS GRANTED."
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    I'm curious about this. I wonder if Vegetan Royal family refers to the original maybe? Since all modern saiyins are descended from Vegeta...
     
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