Kaworu: "Umm, Ayanami-san, what are you going to do with that power cord?"
Rei: *Smiles innocently* "Plug it in to a power source of course."
Kaworu: *Shudders as his mind connects the dots*"Wa-wait Ayanami-san, I don't think this is a good ide-."
Rei: "Be silent fish and stay still, this won't hurt."
Kaworu: "That thing is too big! I'm going to choke on that!"
Rei: "No you won't, I'll make sure to be careful."
Asuka: Rei, we need to seriously discuss your musical tastes.
Rei: Aren't you the one who puts songs in Spanish despite neither you or Shinji knowing-?
Asuka: At least I read the translated lyrics so I know what the song is about, period.
No AT fields Merge in an 'Impact event' why else do you think Shinji and Asuka are no longer lonely? It's why all the Angels seek the call, because it will end the loneliness that has been with ever since their births, it's also why a physical aspects of the Lilithian being's are capable of ahh lessening the strength of the call, for it is another way for AT fields to connect.
No AT fields Merge in an 'Impact event' why else do you think Shinji and Asuka are no longer lonely? It's why all the Angels seek the call, because it will end the loneliness that has been with ever since their births, it's also why a physical aspects of the Lilithian being's are capable of ahh lessening the strength of the call, for it is another way for AT fields to connect.
No, Third Impact is the dissolution of all AT-Fields by way of a global anti-AT Field. Not a connection of AT Fields, but of souls, who now have no more barriers between themselves - but hence also no real sense of self anymore. Hence the souls, without AT-Field, intermingle and overlap, and you can't tell where one starts and the other ends. That is Instrumentality. Hence the scene with Rei and Shini where their bodies are literally joined at the hip. It shows how there are no well defined boundaries between people in Instrumentality anymore.
So...let me get this straight. The "Forbidden Union" as in "disastrous reaction of merging two gargantuan terra forming machines together" causes Instrumentality? And Instrumentality is heresy of course right? So basically....
So...let me get this straight. The "Forbidden Union" as in "disastrous reaction of merging two gargantuan terra forming machines together" causes Instrumentality? And Instrumentality is heresy of course right? So basically....
As a point of order I'd like to point out that is as much Rei's as Kaworu's obligation
Anyway, more seriously, we don't actually know what is needed to trigger Forbidden Union Third Impact. In canon, Gendo used Lilith's body, Adam's body/foetus and Lilith's soul for that... and judging by Kaworu's appearance in Instrumentality, Adam's soul might also have been present. That's... a lot of components. And it involved fusing those components.
Just the soulbearers of Lilith and Adam banging, and one of them without S2 organ, might not be enough. As Jackie jokes, might be enough to plop some bunnies in the vicinity and leave behind LCL puddles
As a point of order I'd like to point out that is as much Rei's as Kaworu's obligation
Anyway, more seriously, we don't actually know what is needed to trigger Forbidden Union Third Impact. In canon, Gendo used Lilith's body, Adam's body/foetus and Lilith's soul for that... and judging by Kaworu's appearance in Instrumentality, Adam's soul might also have been present. That's... a lot of components. And it involved fusing those components.
Just the soulbearers of Lilith and Adam banging, and one of them without S2 organ, might not be enough. As Jackie jokes, might be enough to plop some bunnies in the vicinity and leave behind LCL puddles
It's likely that without the flesh of both lilith and adam (which is what is absolutely needed, given that that's what SEELE was going to use via Unit-01 and the MP-EVAs) Third Impact CANNOT occur. Between Rei (Lilim flesh, not lilith) and Kaworu (Angelic, not adam), there's neither of those, but Angelic can presumably work in a pinch, maybe.
Well, if EVAs work... EVAs are Adamite to the same degree as Kaworu's body is, after all.
Still, sexual intercourse isn't literally fusing. Then again, given NGE's religious and Freudian themes it wouldn't really surprise me if it counted nonetheless.
Even more so, as most of them were grown from samples of Adam Himself, while Unit-01 was made from the Flesh of Lilith (Her Legs, specifically).
Edit: What I'm saying is that Kaworu and Rei (or any human) could get jiggy with it and the world wouldn't end. Unless it was Asuka because Shinji would reach sufficient rage levels to trigger 3I, requirements be damned.
I was excluding Unit-01 (and any earlier attempts at EVAs made from Lilith) purposefully to make my point more clear, but it seems that failed. I meant that the EVAs are closer to Adam than Kaworu is, being crafted from His flesh, rather than being a derivative form of life.
I was excluding Unit-01 (and any earlier attempts at EVAs made from Lilith) purposefully to make my point more clear, but it seems that failed. I meant that the EVAs are closer to Adam than Kaworu is, being crafted from His flesh, rather than being a derivative form of life.
Oh. In that case... no actually. EVA-01 was carved from Lilith's flesh. The Adamite EVAs were grown from Adamite tisuse. I mean, Adam is a foetus post-2I. Not much meat to carve there.
In fact, if Kaworu really came into existence as effect of 2I... then he is in fact made directly from Adam. So he would be "more Adamite" than the MP EVAs. Yet the MP EVAs apparently were already enough for the Adamite component in SEELE's 3I plan.
Oh. In that case... no actually. EVA-01 was carved from Lilith's flesh. The Adamite EVAs were grown from Adamite tisuse. I mean, Adam is a foetus post-2I. Not much meat to carve there.
They presumably got some samples pre-2I, or from whence would the EVAs (and I mean ALL the EVAs, including the graveyard of them) have come? I believe that they had gotten flesh and had grown it with LCL so they could make EVA parts, rather than finding the equivalent of angel, cut it up, and using that.
That said, if Adamite+Lilith=3I then shouldn't Lilithian(human)+Adam=3I ? I think that an Angel merging with Lilith wouldn't cause 3I, just as a Lilitian merging with Adam (i.ie Gendo binding Adam to his body) most certainly didn't.
Presumably you need A+L=3I, with possible Ai+L=3I, yet A+Li=/=3I. that lack consistent internal logic, which is one thing NGE does have (usually)
The EVAs were finished post-2I. 2I was in 2000. EVA-01 was finished in 2004, EVA-02 in 2005 (or rather, that was when the Contact Experiments were).
I believe that they had gotten flesh and had grown it with LCL so they could make EVA parts, rather than finding the equivalent of angel, cut it up, and using that.
That's exactly what I wanted to say - that technique was only used on Lilith. The other EVAs were not cast out of pre-existing flesh, but presumably grown. Just like... the Rei clones, for example. They are organisms, after all.And you can see the failed attempts of that in the EVA graveyard (EoE).
That said, if Adamite+Lilith=3I then shouldn't Lilithian(human)+Adam=3I ? I think that an Angel merging with Lilith wouldn't cause 3I, just as a Lilitian merging with Adam (i.ie Gendo binding Adam to his body) most certainly didn't.
Well, we know an angel merging with Adam would cause a non-Forbidden Union sort of Third Impact, which is after all exactly what the Evangelions are trying to prevent. So I think an angel merging with Lilith would also cause some sort of Impact event, actually.
Humans are another beast altogether. We can't establish physical AT-Fields. We aren't made of Particle Wave Matter. Maybe that's the difference.
Presumably you need A+L=3I, with possible Ai+L=3I, yet A+Li=/=3I. that lack consistent internal logic, which is one thing NGE does have (usually)
Especially in regards to 3I and Instrumentality it really doesn't. See how the two 3I plans (SEELE, Gendo) just kinda overlap in the end, with no explanation what even set them apart. Anyway, SEELE's contigency 3I plan, after the Spear was lost, was to use S2'ed up EVA-01 as Lilithian component, so apparently, Ai+Li also works. With enough ritual, at least (remember the MP EVAs need to form the Tree of Life, whereas Gendo's 3I apparently requires no such ritual).
Especially in regards to 3I and Instrumentality it really doesn't. See how the two 3I plans (SEELE, Gendo) just kinda overlap in the end, with no explanation what even set them apart. Anyway, SEELE's contigency 3I plan, after the Spear was lost, was to use S2'ed up EVA-01 as Lilithian component, so apparently, Ai+Li also works. With enough ritual, at least (remember the MP EVAs need to form the Tree of Life, whereas Gendo's 3I apparently requires no such ritual).
Except Unit-01 wasn't Lilithian, it was Lilith (at least it was made of Lilith-flesh). Gendo just cut the bullshit by making a purpose built vehicle to transport Adam-flesh into Lilith without an AT-field stopping it. Rei's soul was derived from Lilith's (we know she didn't have Lilith's soul because Lilith wasn't a puddle) so she could slip past, just as the Lance was to be used: to forcibly bind the two. The MP-EVAs (Adam-flesh) were brought into contact with Lilith-flesh via the Lance-turned-tree.
Except we don't. All we know for certain is that an Angel entering Terminal Dogma (or Lilith's champber, I'm tired and my memory's a little fuzzy) would trigger the Geofront self-destruct. Those who say it would be the end of the world/3I either don't know better or would be caught in the explosion.
Except Unit-01 wasn't Lilithian, it was Lilith (at least it was made of Lilith-flesh). Gendo just cut the bullshit by making a purpose built vehicle to transport Adam-flesh into Lilith without an AT-field stopping it. Rei's soul was derived from Lilith's (we know she didn't have Lilith's soul because Lilith wasn't a puddle) so she could slip past, just as the Lance was to be used: to forcibly bind the two. The MP-EVAs (Adam-flesh) were brought into contact with Lilith-flesh via the Lance-turned-tree.
Except we don't. All we know for certain is that an Angel entering Terminal Dogma (or Lilith's champber, I'm tired and my memory's a little fuzzy) would trigger the Geofront self-destruct. Those who say it would be the end of the world/3I either don't know better or would be caught in the explosion.
We -do-, actually. An angel merging with ADAM would make an Impact-event that spreads the Seed of Life for -that- particular Angel across the planet, making that Angel's miniature copies the dominant breed of Fruit of Life existence on that particular planet. Incidentally, it's exceedingly likely that such an Impact event would wipe out all of the -current- life on the planet, as the -starter horn- for the 'race to Daddy' wiped out -half- of it all on its own.
Even if it -didn't-, mankind would be trapped in a fight for its existence against miniature copies of whichever Angel made it to ADAM. With all likelihoods being equal, and all of the possible 'winners' having AT-Field-expression as an entry-level feat...mankind's boned.
Except Unit-01 wasn't Lilithian, it was Lilith (at least it was made of Lilith-flesh). Gendo just cut the bullshit by making a purpose built vehicle to transport Adam-flesh into Lilith without an AT-field stopping it. Rei's soul was derived from Lilith's (we know she didn't have Lilith's soul because Lilith wasn't a puddle) so she could slip past, just as the Lance was to be used: to forcibly bind the two. The MP-EVAs (Adam-flesh) were brought into contact with Lilith-flesh via the Lance-turned-tree.
Adam also doesn't have its soul, and doesn't turn into tang. Likewise for the EVAs before Contact Experiments. Lilith's soul is Rei's soul, the same way as Adam's soul is Kaworu's soul. "We are the same", remember that from Episode 24? And the entire point of my post was to say that the MP EVAs are no more Adamite than angels. They are not "Adam-flesh" in the same way Unit 01 is "Lilith-flesh". They are Adamite tissue, like the angels, like the humans are Lilithian tissue. As for the Spear, its entire purpose is to shut down progenitors. SEELE hoped to control Lilith in the ritual by having her shut down with the Spear. When they lost the Spear, they switched to using EVA-01 instead.
Except we don't. All we know for certain is that an Angel entering Terminal Dogma (or Lilith's champber, I'm tired and my memory's a little fuzzy) would trigger the Geofront self-destruct. Those who say it would be the end of the world/3I either don't know better or would be caught in the explosion.
Kaji explains that to Shinji during the Zeruel attack. So, yes, we explicitly do know. And we have every reason to believe him: It seems pretty clear that this is why the angels are all attacking Tokyo-3: Because Lilith is there. Except Gaghiel, which attacked the UN Fleet... on which Kaji had transported Adam. They are obviously drawn to the progenitors. And we can deduce from Kaworu's monologue in front of Lilith that they think that is Adam they're going for. They want to get to Adam, to, as Kaworu put it "return to Adam". Fuse with it the same way Rei fused with Lilith in the end, presumably. And that will most likely cause an Impact event, which is the reason everyone is so desperate to prevent it.
We -do-, actually. An angel merging with ADAM would make an Impact-event that spreads the Seed of Life for -that- particular Angel across the planet, making that Angel's miniature copies the dominant breed of Fruit of Life existence on that particular planet.
One of the things people seem to be forgetting here is that in Eva metaphysics souls are explicitly divisible. It happened to Kyoko per word of god. It's heavily implied in the original ending by Rei that the reason she wanted to die was that her soul being split hurt. She is explicitly aware of the fact that she has a greater existence which she sought death to rejoin. All (circumstantial) evidence also points to Rei having a lesser soul incapable of manifesting a freestanding AT field until the part trapped in Unit 00 was returned after it's destruction.
Asuka: YOU BITCH! You drugged her again!!!! ::Hair turns blond, spiky and sticks straight out, and a Super Sayian aura appears::
Rei: Calm down Asuka. I asked her to do it. ::hands Asuka a tablet showing video Rei begging for the shot injection::
Asuka: Oh... :owers down, and watches:: But... ::eyes narrow:: You made her BEG? ::aura comes back::
This would be a good one or two-shot to do: For the first time in years, snow starts to fall in Japan. Unfortunately, having not experienced snow for 15 years, and not being properly designed to cope with it, Tokyo-3 is completely and utterly unprepared; the transport systems are completely screwed, power plants fail, and the whole city is generally thrown into chaos. Will NERV be able to get the city operational again? Will they even try? How will poor Rei cope in her squalid apartment with no heating? And what on Earth is everyone going to do when an Angel shows up?
I could argue that with Dallas/Fort Worth TX 2003 practically the entire Metropole was shut down for two weeks due to snow. It would be a daily dusting but people were having to walk to work because of the mass transit shut down because they couldn't keep the roads plowed and salted
Yes. (A&T author fiat here: ) There is still winter in Germany, though it is actually damper and colder than it used to be, thanks to Antarctica melting and throwing things off. It's yet another thing that makes Japan feel weird and alien to Asuka: The near total lack of seasons, and the one they've got being 'always fricking summer'. All her winter clothes are going to waste, and when she does try to make the most of it, like with the class trip to Okinawa, she gets shot down. She's not happy about that. Though recent improvements in things, like how Shinji and Rei watch her in swimsuits are a nice plus.
Gendo might decide that Rei II is simply too great of a risk as well, if her recovery might take too long, or if she simply can't keep up the act around him, now that she has experienced real "human" (and angel) interaction unfiltered.
Here's a thought. Gendo decides Rei II isn't worth the trouble, kills her and brings Rei III online with the backup from circa Zeruel.
Gendo: Your previous version was damaged and not recovering quickly enough. She was also becoming too attached to the 2nd and 3rd Children. Judging by Section 2 footage, a liaison between her and the 3rd Child was not unrealistic. She was eliminated.
Rei III: Footage? what was happening?
Gendo: Gestures of affection. Hugging, etcetra. It is irrelevant.
Rei III: I was getting hugs?
Gendo: It had to stop to preserve the scenario, so I stopped it.
Rei III: I was getting hugs and you killed me to.... ::Rei looks angry::
Gendo: Is there a problem?
Rei III: YOU STOPPED MY HUGGLES! ::eyes glowing red::
With Yui "aware", and Rei "awakened", there might be the chance for a very interesting interaction between Rei who loves Shinji and could be technically Yui's daughter, to set up things for the climax at 3I.
