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Advice and Trust [NGE]

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BaraccaZero said:
Then why that version of Homura is nicknamed as Homucifer?
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Same reason people call the Law of Cycles "Godoka" or "Madokami".

Just because she's not a perfect Satan doesn't mean it's not kind of a fitting name.

I think the official name of Madoka's fully realized form is "Ultimate Madoka", as that's what's used in merchandise, and conversely, usurper-Homura's official name is "Akuma Homura", i.e. "Demon/Devil Homura".

She explicitly refers to herself as a demon when she's created, giving herself that title because she's the one who "pulled the One as Sacred as a God from Heaven".

Take the fact that she's now technically the being directly opposed to Goddess!Madoka(especially since she's usurped and chained Madoka's power), and add in the fact that she has a very heavy fallen angel image after her transformation, and you find that 'Lucifer' isn't a bad nickname for her, all things considered.

She's not "Satan" as in the being that's the incarnation of the ultimate evil, but she's the primary antagonist(and currently the jailer) of the Goddess.
 
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TheDarkFreak said:
Same reason people call the Law of Cycles "Godoka" or "Madokami".

Just because she's not a perfect Satan doesn't mean it's not kind of a fitting name.

I think the official name of Madoka's fully realized form is "Ultimate Madoka", as that's what's used in merchandise, and conversely, usurper-Homura's official name is "Akuma Homura", i.e. "Demon/Devil Homura".

She explicitly refers to herself as a demon when she's created, giving herself that title because she's the one who "pulled the One as Sacred as a God from Heaven".

Take the fact that she's now technically the being directly opposed to Goddess!Madoka(especially since she's usurped and chained Madoka's power), and add in the fact that she has a very heavy fallen angel image after her transformation, and you find that 'Lucifer' isn't a bad nickname for her, all things considered.

She's not "Satan" as in the being that's the incarnation of the ultimate evil, but she's the primary antagonist(and currently the jailer) of the Goddess.
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True, Thanks for the explanation.

Coming back to Eva, could we give symbolism into Advice and Trust? Eva is full of it and it would be interesting what could we put in it.
 
On the TV tropes page for Advice and Trust, This quote is on the page. "The difference that a simple gesture and civil talk can make."
 
To sum up both A&T and NGE as a whole:

The operative fallacy here is that we believe that unconditional love means not seeing anything negative about someone, when it really means pretty much the opposite: loving someone despite their infuriating flaws and essential absurdity ...

We don't give other people credit for the same interior complexity we take for granted in ourselves, the same capacity for holding contradictory feelings in balance, for complexly alloyed affections, for bottomless generosity of heart and petty, capricious malice. We can't believe that anyone could be unkind to us and still be genuinely fond of us, although we do it all the time.

Years ago a friend of mine had a dream about a strange invention; a staircase you could descend deep underground, in which you heard recordings of all the things anyone had ever said about you, both good and bad. The catch was, you had to pass through all the worst things people had said before you could get to the highest compliments at the very bottom. There is no way I would ever make it more than two and a half steps down such a staircase, but I understand its terrible logic: If we want the rewards of being loved we have to submit to the mortifying ordeal of being known.
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--Tim Kreider
 
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BaraccaZero said:
True, Thanks for the explanation.

Coming back to Eva, could we give symbolism into Advice and Trust? Eva is full of it and it would be interesting what could we put in it.
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*Puts on snobby gentleman hat*

I'd say that A&T's themes aren't too different from the source. The major difference is in the title. Trust. The emotional core of A&T comes from lack of barriers between the two leads. Because of the open trust between the two; they can talk to each other and face their individual demons. Not only does this allow them to gain emotional support for each other to get through the troubles of the war, but it allows them to offer genuine support to others. Setting the dominoes in motion for that could very well save the world.
 
Arizona said:
To sum up both A&T and NGE as a whole:


--Tim Kreider
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While i do agree, it's only to a point. There are limits to what should be accepted for both parties of a relationship, both platonic, romantic and familial. Otherwise...well by that logic Asuka's mom should remarry her dad, Gendo should be allowed back in Shinji's life no questions asked, and Rits wouldn't need to work to earn Rei's forgiveness.
 
Notspecialdude said:
Funny enough, crit mechanics were changed in gen 6. If you use one crit boosting tool (inner focus, item, or ability) it raises the crit chance to 25%. 2 raises it to 50% and 3 make crits guaranteed. Super luck ability raises by one stage.

The reason i lay this out for you is because by giving Rei a crit boosting ability for her ally, it means that in doubles, you'd pair her with a super luck pokemon holding a razor claw so that pokemon would do guaranteed crits with no setup. Why is this brilliant? There are only two offensively good pokemon with super luck.

Absol the pokemon that predicts disaster and trys to warn of it, but is blamed for it instead. And togekiss, the peaceful pokemon that cherishs their friends so dearly they would defend them from any threat despite their strong aversion to strife.
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The 24th Commandment of Rei: "The rumour that in one of the many infinite universes I am a Togekiss and the Trout is an Absol is extremely silly and definitely not untrue"
 
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AurelioBahamut said:
Or, considering the VN was an Eroge, maybe the best option should be Fate/Stay Night Realta Nua, which I think was for PS Vita? It had voice acting and no sex scenes, so it would be a nice treat.
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Or we could just use the Eroge version, purely because of Asuka's reaction to it :V
At least this time around, it's not porn of themselves. Lookin' at you, Re-Take :V

BaraccaZero said:
But still, BG, for what reason is Homura in Chronicles having nightmares of her other selfes if Magical Girls don't exist in that timeline?
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We get there when we get there :V
I've got a pretty good idea in the back of my mind in relation to that, so stay tuned :D

Vajrei said:
Does this idea make sense to you?
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I can see it working with a few tweaks :)
Dang it, now I just have this scene in my mind of FAR vs Incubators a la Timelords vs Daleks. The Last Great Soul War :V
 
BG_Character_592 said:
Or we could just use the Eroge version, purely because of Asuka's reaction to it :V
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Honestly, the H-version of Fate/stay night isn't all that bad, there's only 1-2 H-scenes/route, not really necessary (some make more sense than others), but still.

On the subject of that, if you go through the H-scene in UBW, load a save from before it, and then try to skip it, the game crashes. Not sure if it's something in the Ultimate Edition patch or the core game, but still a source of consistent amusement to a friend of mine and I.

Source: Played through most of F/sn Realta Nua Ultimate Edition with H-scenes enabled. If you're gonna do the VN I highly suggest that you use the UE patch because otherwise you have to deal with some weird locale stuff and three separate executables.
 
notraceofsense said:
Honestly, the H-version of Fate/stay night isn't all that bad, there's only 1-2 H-scenes/route, not really necessary (some make more sense than others), but still.

On the subject of that, if you go through the H-scene in UBW, load a save from before it, and then try to skip it, the game crashes. Not sure if it's something in the Ultimate Edition patch or the core game, but still a source of consistent amusement to a friend of mine and I.

Source: Played through most of F/sn Realta Nua Ultimate Edition with H-scenes enabled. If you're gonna do the VN I highly suggest that you use the UE patch because otherwise you have to deal with some weird locale stuff and three separate executables.
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... ... ...This is a good example of how old i am. I have no idea what the heck your talking about, yet it seems pretty simple. By the way I'm only in my early 30s. Heck, one of the reasons i mostly stay away from VN is cause i have to use Steam, and i can never really figure out if it has the..."full package" or not, or where i get the Patches for them, or anything like that.
After the generation where Tick Tack and Really Really (where i only got the former cause it came on a hardcopy) came out I've only downloaded 1 game. And it was from another source outside of Steam. And even then i had to pretty much guess how it all worked.
 
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TheDarkFreak said:
She explicitly refers to herself as a demon when she's created, giving herself that title because she's the one who "pulled the One as Sacred as a God from Heaven".

Take the fact that she's now technically the being directly opposed to Goddess!Madoka(especially since she's usurped and chained Madoka's power), and add in the fact that she has a very heavy fallen angel image after her transformation, and you find that 'Lucifer' isn't a bad nickname for her, all things considered.

She's not "Satan" as in the being that's the incarnation of the ultimate evil, but she's the primary antagonist(and currently the jailer) of the Goddess.
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I pretty much felt that Homura was not evil in and of itself, but that as stated, she set herself up as the force in opposition to Madoka, accepting that she would, in essence, be damning herself. And imprisoned Madoka in her human form, purely out of selfishness and the need to still be with her. I don't see it as Homura taking Madoka's power, any more than Lucifer took any power from God when he became the personification of all evil, but in a sense Madoka and Homura now share that power. (And being a witch herself, Homura has power to contribute to the gestalt)

I think from Homura's point of view, she is thinking "We have this one lifetime together, in which we can be together and be friends. And at the end of it all, Madoka will ascend to her role as the goddess of this world, and I will be forced to be separated from her forever, so I can serve as her equal and opposite. But RIGHT NOW, she and I get to live the life that the Incubators would have cheated us out of, and that's what SHE would have wanted."

In other words, she hasn't stopped the inevitable, but she has postponed it. And honestly, she really doesn't care about anyone else but Madoka, so she's fine with her "friends" thinking of her as the devil. She finds it enjoyable, even.

As for the dreams, well, Kaworu has already established that it is possible to access other timelines and even other universes from this one, and we know that Madoka is able to have dreams of other timelines. It's possible that their friendship and shared tragedy is common to all timelines regardless of the presence of Incubators, and so she is merely picking up echoes of her own trauma. Although the presence of the Rift materials and Hiro and Zero Two in the universe suggests there is or was an actual connection to the PMMM world.
 
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BG_Character_592 said:
Dang it, now I just have this scene in my mind of FAR vs Incubators a la Timelords vs Daleks. The Last Great Soul War
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Rei stare was trying to set ablaze the Incubators in front of her without any success, with a British accent she spoke.

"Your race is dead! You all burnt! All of you! Your planet in smithereens! There's no one left of you alive in this timeline! And if you come I'll burn every single one of you to the ground!"

"You lie, we're thousands and thousand from all over the multiverse. We'll come and then exact our revenge on you." The leading Kyubey said with emulated anger.

Watching this engagement of words, Kaworu rubbed his face trying, but failing, to put to a stop to his ever growing headache from the absurdity that the last days had brought.

"Ahhh, they grow up so fast"

With just a flinch of his fingers, Kaworu sent the Doctor and his blue police box inside a portal to hell before closing it.

He kept rubbing his face while around him Incubators started exploding into tang and the liquid burned by Rei's rage.

On his side came Mari, with her various Doctor Who memorabilia from the 80s, she searched around, seemingly unflinched by the destruction around her, then pouted and turned to Kaworu

"Hey Ash, do you know where he went, I only wanted an autograph."

"Sweet Adam and Lilith save me." Kaworu only muttered.
 
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notraceofsense said:
Honestly, the H-version of Fate/stay night isn't all that bad, there's only 1-2 H-scenes/route, not really necessary (some make more sense than others), but still.

On the subject of that, if you go through the H-scene in UBW, load a save from before it, and then try to skip it, the game crashes. Not sure if it's something in the Ultimate Edition patch or the core game, but still a source of consistent amusement to a friend of mine and I.

Source: Played through most of F/sn Realta Nua Ultimate Edition with H-scenes enabled. If you're gonna do the VN I highly suggest that you use the UE patch because otherwise you have to deal with some weird locale stuff and three separate executables.
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Boy, does that put me in memory of the days when I was reading Umineko no Naku Koro ni as it came out. Witch Hunt's work on the English translation was excellent, but actually getting the game and patch installed was a bitch and a half until they sorted out distribution with MangaGamer(and later, Steam).

The writer of Umineko, Ryukishi07/07th Expansion, certainly helped with that, though, and I mean that sincerely.

There have been VN authors in the past that were incredibly hostile to translators, but Ryukishi07's always been very supportive of those who translated the When They Cry franchise. Heck, in Umineko, he even named an in-game organization after the group that does the fan translations! (The Rokkenjima Witch Hunt is named for the Witch Hunt translation group).

Witch Hunt became the official translators when MangaGamer got distribution rights, and they even became translators for Rose Guns Days, his later work.


... HOLY SHIT THERE'S A NEW WHEN THEY CRY FRANCHISE ENTRY VN AND IT'S ON STEAM, HOW DID I NOT KNOW THIS.


And continuing his reputation, not only are Witch Hunt still the official translators for Ciconia no Naku Koro ni, but he worked with them pre-release so that the English and Japanese versions could release simultaneously!
 
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Higurashi was your first anime? Boy, talk about not taking half-measures, eh?

Like I said, I've completely read the Umineko VN, and I know the whole story of the Higurashi VN(not just what the anime seasons cover), but I still need to read them at some point. Just no time anymore.


But yes, Keiichi/Mion for ultimate happiness, and everyone hugs Rika because the poor girl just really freaking deserves it. I'd be hard-pressed to pick who had the worse groundhog-day-loop fate, her or Homura Akemi.


As for adaptations, while the Higurashi anime certainly could've been better, it at least wasn't too bad(although there were some things that I think could've been explained better, but still, there was a LOT of material the adaptation needed to cover). I actually watched the Umineko anime before reading the VNs, and after reading them, the anime just made me sad. Had some really freaking great music, though; either great original tracks, or beautifully re-orchestrated versions of songs straight from the VN. (worldend dominator is just freaking amazing in the anime, Requiem is somehow even more heart-wrenching than the original, and the biggest sin the anime committed was making an AMAZING remix of dreamend discharger AND THEN NOT USING IT)
 
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DragonUnitOmega's First Time Watching Eva, Ep 1
  • Informational
    • MattmanTheComet said:
    I have done it.

    A week and a half and I have cleared this legend.

    I've never even watched Eva.
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    You know I noticed a couple of people who read A&T and haven't seen NGE. I kinda feel like that kinda proves that the fic is so good, you don't actually need to know the original that much if at all. Of course knowing it makes it better when reading the fic but still, I don't know, I just like the thought.

    I would say that includes me but...I, seeing as I'm in the middle of watching an anime that is decidedly more light-hearted that I love that would be a perfect palette cleanser for me, decided to rectify that! Maybe. Probably. Hopefully won't get distracted. And also decised to write down my reaction to it for fun. Because I blame Chronicles.

    If this ain't the place for this, my apologies, but I thought this might be fun for you guys seeing someone's thoughts on seeing NGE for the first time but knowing of the story pretty well while watching it. And also making comparisons to A&T when it reaches the part where it diverges.

    and i think stryp said it's fine as long as nge is discussed here but i don't remember if he did say it or where if he did

    My reaction to NGE Episode 1
    The Start of a (Not Really a) Thesis
    Cruel Angel's Thesis plays
    Za/n/koku/ no tenshi/ no teze! -continues to sing along-
    First Angel appears
    Oh. I didn't expect to see Sachiel first thing.
    Tanks lined up on shore
    Hey I think I saw this scene as a screenshot once. They're gonna get wrecked.
    First Angel attacks
    Yup. They got wrecked.
    Empty city
    Is this Tokyo-3? I'm not sure yet. Hey, who was that running? That can't have been Shinji. I know he was supposed to talk to a payphone. Unless...oh no. Is that Toji's sister?!
    Blue car pops up and driver complains
    Wow. I didn't know Misato's car looked like that. It looks better than I thought it'd be. I also didn't expect that picture of Shinji to look like that. He looks like he's wearing something green. Is that his uniform for his last school or something?
    Sorry we cannot pick up line.
    There's Shinji! Wow. I forgot how young he sounded.
    Misato's questionable picture
    LMAO I knew this was coming but I still found it hilarious.
    More Angel wrecking
    They're just gonna keep trying, huh? Normally that'd be a good thing but this is a mecha anime unfortunately for them.
    Misato swoops in with her car
    Hey Misato. Good to see you pick Shinji up.
    JSSDF uses last resort
    Eh? What are they doing? Wait, why are these guys in the Geofront?
    Misato looks out her window and panics
    Eh? What's wrong Misato?
    Says N2 Mine and covers Shinji as it explodes
    Oh. That. I remember that.
    JSSDF being smug they beat the Angel
    Wait for it.
    Angel survives and now has a new mask growing. The JSSDF heads don't like that
    There you go.
    Shinji and Misato survive and Shinji helps push the car back right side up
    I'm a bit surprised they all survived all things considered. And that Shinji was able to be helpful in pushing the car over.
    Misato's car's busted and she complains about how to pay for it...
    Wow. How much do they pay you? Actually, better question, how much was that car that you have to make 33...payments? Downpayments? You know the one where you slowly pay for it over a long time so you can use it already.
    ...as well as ruining her dress
    Oh come on Misato. It's just a dress! You guys could've died! Oh well... I guess that's Misato being Misato?
    Shinji being savage--I mean, a cold fish as Misato puts and Misato not amused by it
    Oh my gosh I didn't expect to see Shinji snark back at Misato or the look on her face. I love it. XD
    Shinji and Misato talking a bit about Gendo as they get into the Geofront
    And there's a little of the backstory of Shinji mentioned.
    NOW Gendo is officially Commander of NERV'S Tokyo-3 branch
    Great. This is gonna be fun. Not.
    And Gendo orders the activation of Unit-01
    Case in point.
    More Misato and Shinji talkin of Gendo, this time with a very brief flashback! And the "letter" he sent.
    Geez I knew little was said on it but somehow seeing it be a big paper with most of it blacked out is worse to me than just a piece of paper that has only a couple of words.
    Misato seems to sympathize with Shinji
    And a hint to Misato's father and her past.
    They enter the NERV HQ proper and I see the place properly for the first time
    -stares with wide eyes- Wow. I knew it was advanced and stuff but I didn't think it looked like THAT. It looks so cool!
    Brief show of NGE logo and episode name
    Oh. Kinda surprised for a commercial cut but I guess I shouldn't be.
    Misato tries to use an utterly complex looking map to get through an utterly complex base
    And there's Misato getting lost. But seriously with a map like that and how huge the place is, I can't blame her. It's almost like it's a labyrinth down there.
    Misato: This is why I hate wearing skirts here.
    If you knew, why'd you wear one? Oh right, Shinji.
    Ritsuko scuba diving
    Eh? What's she diving for? Also it looks like grape juice.
    PA tells Ritsuko to get Misato. Ritsuko: I don't believe it. She got lost again, didn't she?
    That's Misato for you (I think). But you're used to that.
    Misato mentions Marduk Institute
    Aka the giant NERV front.
    Misato: He's just like his father. Like how he's unendearing.
    OH MY GOSH MISATO NO DON'T MAKE THAT COMPARISON ARGH. I mean it's probably not entirely wrong BUT STILL ARGH.
    Cue Gendo leaving the bridge to Fuyutsuki before the Angel starts moving and then Misato and Ritsuko talking about Unit-01. Meanwhile Shinji just keeps reading. Also apparently activation rate is 0.lots-of-zeroes-1%.
    Misato wonders if it works. Ritsuko: Oh, don't be insulting. It's not zero.
    Oh so that's a thing she says? I thought it was just Chronicles.
    Shinji meets Unit-01
    And there's Unit-01! I can't help but like seeing it. I like its design the most.
    Ritsuko describes it as "synthetic human"...
    It's probably because I know already what that means but you would think that something called a "synthetic human" would mean they wouldn't be surprised on its feats.
    ...and that it was built in secret.
    I keep forgetting about that part.
    Debate over the launch of Unit-01 as Misato is hesitant and Shinji doesn't want to do it.
    Is this the scene that led to "Get in the robot, Shinji!"? And also the start of why some people thought he was a wimp? I mean I don't blame them with Gurren Lagann to compare to but still. Geez. He's terrified and thinks he's useless/not needed.
    Since Shinji refuses, they have Rei pilot and voices my thoughts.
    Case in point. But then again I am watching to see for myself what happens in NGE.
    Rei pops up on a stretcher.
    LIKE THAT. Oh geez, I knew Rei was hurt but I didn't imagine it to be that bad for some reason. She can barely move. No wonder Kaworu literally blew up when he saw this scene in Chronicles.
    Sachiel attacks and shakes the place and Unit-01 protects Shinji...
    Ah and the first hint of the true nature of Evangelion.
    ...and Gendo is smug.
    ...i wannna wipe that expression off his face...
    Ritsuko complains that it's impossible
    You said it's a synthetic human Ritsuko. Of course it's gonna do the impossible since humans made the impossible: the Eva itself.
    Shinji makes sure Rei's okay and it's clear she's in pain. Then...
    Shinji: I mustn't run away. I mustn't run away. I mustn't run away. I mustn't run away!
    And there's the iconic line. And Shinji's motivation to pilot.
    Shinji pilots and entry plug is filled with LCL
    Remembers Asuka talking about keeping quiet about the stuff for the fun of seeing noobies panic before realizing it's fine. Also wonders if they really did spend a good amount of time to make some of the aspects of piloting realistic, like filling the chamber with liquid being a reasonable way to cushion impacts iirc, or it's just coincidence as it was added for a different reason, like, well, symbolism.
    Launch preparations are done and then, finally, Unit-01 is launched. And then Fly Me to the Moon is playing.
    Wait what? That's the end? Huh. I forgot the fight itself was in the second ep. I was uh...looking forward to seeing Unit-01 berserk. i like things going berserk okay

    Tl;dr got surprised by it (especially snarking Shinji) even knowing what's going to happen.

    Will this be a thing I'll keep doing? I don't know. Depends if I feel like it and if it's okay to put it here as I don't feel this warrants its own thread.
     
  • Informational
    • grommile said:
    It's an electric conversion of a classic French sports car last produced in 1985, with a total lifetime run of 11616 units.

    In 21st century Japan.

    After a half-apocalypse.
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    That... is an incredibly poor financial decision. I was wondering why she lived in such a modest apartment as the 4th most important person at NERV. And while I can attribute some of that to personal taste... some part of me feels that she subsisted of junk food, microwave dinners, and cheap beer for a reason.
     
    Notspecialdude said:
    That... is an incredibly poor financial decision. I was wondering why she lived in such a modest apartment as the 4th most important person at NERV. And while I can attribute some of that to personal taste... some part of me feels that she subsisted of junk food, microwave dinners, and cheap beer for a reason.
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    You mean other then the fact she's as much homemaking skills as one of the Angels?
     
    Fate/Online said:
    You mean other then the fact she's as much homemaking skills as one of the Angels?
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    She made a big deal of a steak dinner as a reward. She's penny pinching BIG TIME. I wouldnt be surprised if the initial reason she had shinji move in with her is for some financial gain, like access to the kid's paycheck. Then after the second angel, (4th if your nitpicky) her motherly instincts kicked in and she grew to care for the kid.
     
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