Remove ads

Paths of Civilization

Reader mode
Duesal said:
That's probably a good point about diplomacy being necessary to understand people while admin is limited to resource management. It's a good thing the King's son has good diplomacy. That should give him the societal understanding he needs to properly utilize that heroic administration. :D
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...


I WILL FIX ALL THE THINGS!

YOURS AND YOURS AND OH HEY THEIRS TOO!



Snerk I was gonna use something serious but this just spoke to me. Heheheheheheek!
Adhoc vote count started by BungieONI on May 14, 2017 at 12:37 AM, finished with 33181 posts and 83 votes.
Click to expand...

Adhoc vote count started by BungieONI on May 14, 2017 at 12:56 AM, finished with 33189 posts and 86 votes.
Click to expand...
 
Ghostdevil said:
No I aint fear mongering, I literally said I hoped that'd happen, because he got politically smeared and fucked over, which is a bad thing because we discriminate against him based PURELY ON HERITAGE, 100%.
Edit: Also NO it fucking isn't, I know your blind but seriously AN EXPLICITLY STATES that it discredits him
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
:rofl:
More fearmongering. Keeping quiet is now a deliberate smear campaign.

Oh and now you reduce it to personal insults as well, how cute.
hylas240 said:
We have no reason to suspect any serious faults in his character (just being particularly horny), so this "scrutiny" will in fact end up with everyone inventing possible reasons for the lack of support from his mother. Everyone has independently agreed that he is the best candidate. They made their own decisions independent of any endorsement from the mother, so they aren't being idiot yes men/women as you are implying.

If his chances of being in the running for kingship wasn't dependent on a roll (which is random and not based on his skills, just how much people believe there's something wrong with him), then I wouldn't have as much of an issue with not supporting him.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
There is that. However their initial thoughts were that he could be a great heir. His own abilities would shine forth, just like they did with his mother. She had to work against it as well and made it work with zero help from anyone. She made her own contacts, she fought on her own ballot.

That is the point of the meritocracy.
 
Sivantic said:
More fearmongering. Keeping quiet is now a deliberate smear campaign.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Its not fearmongering >.>, we Know for a fact that staying silent IS smearing him, whether its deliberate or not, is not what I said.
Its not an insult when its true since its either you being blind or willfully ignorant, AN literally says it hurts his chances because his mother not endorsing him makes everyone think there is something wrong with him that only she can see
Edit: Tho I do apologize since it was uncalled for to say it without elaborating, tho being willfully ignorant is not a good thing still.
Edit2: now that I think about it the original blind comment wasn't entirely at you but yea
Edit3: Now that I am given a few minutes... I realize how unneccesarily aggressive I sound, I apologize for that, but its mostly because your ignoring or at least seem to be ignoring information from the QM that I rationalized it as you not reading it ie blind or dismissing it ie willingly ignorant.
 
Last edited:
Duesal said:
That's probably a good point about diplomacy being necessary to understand people while admin is limited to resource management. It's a good thing the King's son has good diplomacy. That should give him the societal understanding he needs to properly utilize that heroic administration. :D
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
This makes sense to me. As he is likely to win, I hope that it is sufficient.

Academia Nut said:
Civilization Stats

General
Diplomacy 10 [+1]
Economy 10 (+1+2)
Martial 8

Stability
Stability 3 (emboldened)
Legitimacy 3 (max)

Organizational
Centralization 3
Hierarchy 6

Cultural
Art 12
Mysticism 14 (max, overflowing) (+1 Art)
Prestige 9
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Our Art, Mysticism, and Econ are getting too high.

He'll do at least 1 Proclaim Glory, which should take Art down a bit in order to bump the legitimacy he loses.
He'll need to do something to burn Mysticism. I think Blackbirds is quite likely, as we might go to war but need information and a decent response against incursions more than we need healthy warriors.
However, our stability is high enough that a Main Study Metal might be considered worthwhile, assuming he believes as his mother does. It might also be PttS in order to take up some of our econ, too, but the Econ would also be taken up if he switched to Defense or started the Aqueduct.
I think starting the Aqueduct is the most likely. It increases resources dedicated to the north, which reduces internal strife. Also, leaving the Policy on Expansion would allow for more settlements and an Expand Forest or three, which will improve our defenses while improving the land in EH and the steppes.

Therefore, imo, the most likely course of action is [Main] Blackbirds, [Secondary] Aqueduct - X, [Secondary] Proclaim Glory. Tho I'm probably wrong cus my knowledge of action costs is outdated. If he uses his admin skillz to develop a way to split a main he might do like... separate Blackbird + Carrion Eater actions.
 
Last edited:
[X] Send an envoy to request the Thunder Speakers rein in youths (-2 Diplomacy, chance of TS king actually complying, small chance of triggering war)

[X] Support son (-1 Legitimacy, heir becomes Yehlmyn [Mediocre Martial, Good Diplomacy, Heroic Admin])
 
Umi-san said:
This makes sense to me. As he is likely to win, I hope that it is sufficient.


Our Art, Mysticism, and Econ are getting too high.

He'll do at least 1 Proclaim Glory, which should take Art down a bit in order to bump the legitimacy he loses.
He'll need to do something to burn Mysticism. I think Blackbirds is quite likely, as we might go to war but need information and a decent response against incursions more than we need healthy warriors. However, our stability is high enough that a Main Study Metal might be considered worthwhile, assuming he believes as his mother does.
It might also be PttS in order to take up some of our econ, too, but the Econ would also be taken up if he switched to Defense or started the Aqueduct.
I think starting the Aqueduct is the most likely. It increases resources dedicated to the north, which reduces internal strife. Also, leaving the Policy on Expansion would allow for more settlements and an Expand Forest or three, which will improve our defenses while improving the land in EH and the steppes.

Therefore, imo, the most likely course of action is [Main] Blackbirds, [Secondary] Aqueduct - X, [Secondary] Proclaim Glory. Tho I'm probably wrong cus my knowledge of action costs is outdated.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
It is only a chance that he will lose Legitimacy, though I see it as totally reasonable that he will lose it.

Anywho assuming he does I see him grabbing a Main Proclaim Glory (spends M: -3 Art, -1 Econ, and gains +1 Legitimacy, +1 Stability, potential +1 Prestige)
with a Secondary Aqueduct (spends Econ, gains more Econ slots) and Secondary Blackbirds (spends S: -1 Mysticism, gains +1 Martial, more Blackbirds)

With the Main Proclaim Glory he has a big chance of pushing us into a Golden Age that turn or the next.
Adhoc vote count started by BungieONI on May 14, 2017 at 12:53 AM, finished with 33187 posts and 85 votes.
Click to expand...
 
[X] Send an envoy to request the Thunder Speakers rein in youths (-2 Diplomacy, chance of TS king actually complying, small chance of triggering war)
[X] Remain quiet (Next king is probably standard)
 
[X] Send an envoy to request the Thunder Speakers rein in youths (-2 Diplomacy, chance of TS king actually complying, small chance of triggering war)
[X] Remain quiet (Next king is probably standard)
 
BungieONI said:
It is only a chance that he will lose Legitimacy, though I see it as totally reasonable that he will lose it.

Anywho assuming he does I see him grabbing a Main Proclaim Glory (spends M: -3 Art, -1 Econ, and gains +1 Legitimacy, +1 Stability, potential +1 Prestige)
with a Secondary Aqueduct (spends Econ, gains more Econ slots) and Secondary Blackbirds (spends S: -1 Mysticism, gains +1 Martial, more Blackbirds)

With the Main Proclaim Glory he has a big chance of pushing us into a Golden Age that turn or the next.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
IIRC Stability is capped at 3, which we are at. So a Main PG is inadvisable.

Duesal said:
I'm just peeved we don't have too many options to spend our Mysticism. I'm hoping that keeping it maxed generates research effects or more literacy, but I have nothing to go off of.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
If it did I expect that there would be hints in the posts, but I am not seeing them. *shrug*

I feel that Study Metal is a perfectly expensive use of Mysticism, once we've pushed past the stability cost. We could also switch into Progress so that our provinces can burn through their 5 separate secondary actions and thus eradicate our mysticism score.
 
[X] Send an envoy to request theThunder Speakers rein in youths (-2 Diplomacy, chance of TS king actually complying, small chance of triggering war)
[X] Support son (Chance of -1 Legitimacy, heir becomes Yehlmyn [Mediocre Martial, Good Diplomacy, Heroic Admin])
 
[x] Support son (chance of -1 Legitimacy, heir becomes Yehlmyn [Mediocre Martial, GoodDiplomacy, Heroic Admin])

Its a matter of principal.

As for perception? Fuck that shit.
 
Umi-san said:
IIRC Stability is capped at 3, which we are at. So a Main PG is inadvisable.


If it did I expect that there would be hints in the posts, but I am not seeing them. *shrug*

I feel that Study Metal is a perfectly expensive use of Mysticism, once we've pushed past the stability cost. We could also switch into Progress so that our provinces can burn through their 5 separate secondary actions and thus eradicate our mysticism score.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
It is indeed capped at 3 by our Legitimacy.

The general idea is thus:

He comes into office. Assume the chance fails and we lose Legitimacy. Losing Legitimacy forces Stability to 2.

Main Proclaim Glory will push back to the max in both and get us out of the weird zone with our Art.

That's where I was coming from by Maining Proclaim Glory.
 
BungieONI said:
It is indeed capped at 3 by our Legitimacy.

The general idea is thus:

He comes into office. Assume the chance fails and we lose Legitimacy. Losing Legitimacy forces Stability to 2.

Main Proclaim Glory will push back to the max in both and get us out of the weird zone with our Art.

That's where I was coming from by Maining Proclaim Glory.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Oh................ fuck.

@Academia Nut Please don't....
 
Umi-san said:
Oh................ fuck.

@Academia Nut Please don't....
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
DEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHE!

The great part is that we don't know if it works that way, and everybody is just assuming it works that way in the background. It may be that Stability will just stay at 3 without being taken down with Legitimacy.

Let me beg with you. @Academia Nut Please don't push Stability down if Legitimacy falls...
 
[X] Support son (Chance of -1 Legitimacy, heir becomes Yehlmyn [Mediocre Martial, Good Diplomacy, Heroic Admin])
[X] Send an envoy to request the Thunder Speakers rein in youths (-2 Diplomacy, chance of TS king actually complying, small chance of triggering war)
 
Golden Eyed King said:
Still reading the thread but it looks like the best option is to stave off war until we have a Heroic Martial king then declare war on everyone.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Eh.

My hope is to get into a situation to just eat the HK relatively peacefully, or by cleaning up after they have a "Hold my beer and watch this!" moment. From there if the Eastern Thunder Horse King who holds the Thunder Speakers and the Xohyssiri wants to cross our river and hills to poke us they are free to do so. Just hope they are quick to realize there was a very good reason we have been so happily quiet in our hills, and it was not a lack of ability.
Adhoc vote count started by BungieONI on May 14, 2017 at 1:15 AM, finished with 33198 posts and 89 votes.
Click to expand...
 
Okay, simple stances here:

Pro-Hero:
-The key factor here is the explicit risk of not getting a Hero King.
-Secondary factors are
--Personal and objective immediate fairness to the son
--Personal and objective immediate meritocracy to the son
-Trivial factors are:
--Other side apparently arguing like poopy heads
--The son might ruin society if he's rejected like past rejected Heroes never did.

Pro-Legitimacy
-The key factor here is the explicit risk of damaging the institution, as represented by the risk of losing 1 Legitimacy. This is further compounded by the son occupying a title created by his mother, making it look skankier than it really is to the People on the ground.
-Secondary factors are:
--Risk of losing the Golden Age bonus for our only female King if the Stability is lost. We need to maintain Stability 3 until the next turn to get it. Which we won't if we take a Legitimacy hit.
--Reinforcing Social and Subjective Fairness through establishing a precedent of recusing yourself from family related concerns.
--Reinforcing Social and Subjective Meritocracy through pushing back the system of entanglement in generational favors.
--The risk of a Proclaim Glory to repair Legitimacy being used to set the concept of inherited power by the son.
--The risk of reversing progress made against family values
-Trivial factors are:
--Other side apparently arguing like poopy heads
--Lustful son's use and abuse of power to get lots of sex producing fun results

That should be a suitable summation of both side's perspective and focuses?
 
Last edited:
veekie said:
--Risk of losing the Golden Age bonus for our only female King if the Stability is lost. We need to maintain Stability 3 until the next turn to get it. Which we won't if we take a Legitimacy hit.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I like the summation veekie but this is an assumption, where is your basis?

Also, for Reinforcing Social and Subjective Fairness through establishing a precedent of recusing yourself from family related concerns. Are we sure our People are knowlageable enough to get this kinda thing? They are smart enough, but do they have the context?

Your summation of the Pro-Hero Side is accurate.
 
veekie said:
Pro-Hero:
-The key factor here is the explicit risk of not getting a Hero King.
-Secondary factors are
--Personal and objective immediate fairness to the son
--Personal and objective immediate meritocracy to the son
-Trivial factors are:
--Other side apparently arguing like poopy heads
--The son might ruin society if he's rejected like past rejected Heroes never did.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Actually a key factor is creating Heritage based discrimination, the most competent person will not be elected if their related to the leader, that's fucked up
At least in my opinion, I mean its just as likely that this vote reverses the last vote in any case so I guess it'd be at least secondary
 
Last edited:
@Academia Nut Say, random question, what kind of food preservation techniques have the People discovered? More specifically, with the presence/abundance of salt now, have they discovered salting/curing?
 
We were very deliberate in every choice so far, in order to make it so your heritage isn't the sole defining factor to your prospects.

And here we are, this close to going all the way around and becoming what we swore to fight.

@veekie The concept of "conflict of interests" is more or less non-existent in the People, as per WoG. So some of your points in Pro-Generic aren't valid.
 
Last edited:
Spectrum said:
@Academia Nut Say, random question, what kind of food preservation techniques have the People discovered? More specifically, with the presence/abundance of salt now, have they discovered salting/curing?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I think we do. It's just one of those subsidiary techs that aren't listed.

For instance we have successful head drilling. And can set bones.

etc.
Adhoc vote count started by BungieONI on May 14, 2017 at 1:40 AM, finished with 33204 posts and 89 votes.
Click to expand...

Adhoc vote count started by BungieONI on May 14, 2017 at 1:43 AM, finished with 33205 posts and 90 votes.
Click to expand...

Adhoc vote count started by BungieONI on May 14, 2017 at 1:44 AM, finished with 33206 posts and 91 votes.
Click to expand...
 
[X] Send an envoy to request the Thunder Speakers rein in youths (-2 Diplomacy, chance of TS king actually complying, small chance of triggering war)
[X] Remain quiet (Next king is probably standard)

I'm tired of not having agency on the main turns. I wanted to do those study metal actions while we can. Hell I wanted to do it last turn to keep the belief from becoming entrenched.
 
Last edited:
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top