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Paths of Civilization

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TotallyNotEvil said:
[X] A significant number (-1 Stability, +2 Econ)
[X] Keep it secret (Chance of Stability loss)
[X] Megaproject Support

So, we've just rolled multiple, perfectly timed crits, and are now something like four thousand years ahead on fighting one of the biggest enemies mankind ever knew.

And you want to share it for free with out warmongering neighbors?

Herd immunity? The People see disease and say bring it on, we don need no stinking buffers when we could instead have our enemies die at little to no cost.
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We... actually do need stinking buffers. Otherwise we will be affected by each epidemic that comes along.

It's also worth pointing out that we ultimately got LoO for giving out food when we were starving. Giving away life is the right thing to do by a lot of measures.
 
TotallyNotEvil said:
And? Looks like a short term Diplo boost to me, given easy access to the sea. Besides, it still doesn't impede them from, say, making war. They can always take the salt.
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Who the hell is suicidal enough to go against the one people that never seem to get sick, can write geas over their entire population, including immigrants(!), have never lost territory, and have bad terrain all the way there?

Plus we earn goodwill from providing the cure, so likely group that tries it is going to get hit by literally everybody that can hit them, including parts of their own civ.
 
[x] The whole lowlands are kind of a mess, you know? (-3 Stability, +6-8 Econ, other effects)
[x] Share with even those who don't want to listen (-1 Diplomacy, +1 immediate Stability, chance for additional stability, other effects)
[X] Megaproject Support

Hell yeah, that was an awesome turn. Don't think it'll win, but still casting my vote to go full throttle.

I don't know about everyone else, but I'm kind of worried about the growing cultural divergence between us and the March. Once we finish pumping out megaprojects and taking advantage of the chaos in the lowlands, do you guys think we can work on nipping that potential problem in the bud?

Not really much to do about it right now when there's such a great opportunity right in front of us, but it's at least something to keep in mind. I'm just going to sit back and hope our provinces will make new settlements up north while supporting whatever megaproject we're doing next turn.
 
TotallyNotEvil said:
And? Looks like a short term Diplo boost to me, given easy access to the sea. Besides, it still doesn't impede them from, say, making war. They can always take the salt.
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Who? Who is strong enough to conquer us?

The Dead Priests, who are waaay on the other side of the plains and are busy trying to fight off everyone at once?

The Hill Kingdom, whose Hero has just died and plunged their kingdom into a civil war?

The Eastern and Western Thunder Horses, who are beating the shit out of each other because "there can only be one!"?

The Metal Workers, who are all the way across the sea?

The Southern Viking dudes, who are really far away and also probably have their own sources of salt if they live on the coast?

Like, I'm sure that at least a few of our neighbors will recover eventually, but by spreading our knowledge like this we're basically acting like the Spirit Talkers 2.0 - now with even more bullshit technology! By telling people how to protect themselves against the sickness, we can earn a lot of goodwill. Who's going to want to start a fight with those people who came to your village and helped save your children's lives?

And even apart from all that, we are really good at fighting defensively. We have the traits, terrain and technology to make it really hard for anyone to take territory from us. The only ones who had a chance of taking us was the nomads because they specialized in hit and run techniques and even they got shat on when we threw a Heroic General and more defensive technology (watchtowers, ho!) in their direction.
 
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veekie said:
Actually, demonstrated the math earlier. Its actually better for us to be at stability -1 this midturn, so we can springboard to 2 next turn with Restore Order(which incidentally might help quell the bad practices in the March)
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No offense, but I for one am going to support a Southshore Province > springboarding to 2 with a restore order.
 
Sugnez said:
[x] The whole lowlands are kind of a mess, you know? (-3 Stability, +6-8 Econ, other effects)
[x] Share with even those who don't want to listen (-1 Diplomacy, +1 immediate Stability, chance for additional stability, other effects)
[X] Megaproject Support

Hell yeah, that was an awesome turn. Don't think it'll win, but still casting my vote to go full throttle.

I don't know about everyone else, but I'm kind of worried about the growing cultural divergence between us and the March. Once we finish pumping out megaprojects and taking advantage of the chaos in the lowlands, do you guys think we can work on nipping that potential problem in the bud?

Not really much to do about it right now when there's such a great opportunity right in front of us, but it's at least something to keep in mind. I'm just going to sit back and hope our provinces will make new settlements up north while supporting whatever megaproject we're doing next turn.
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If you're worried about the stability between us and the March, why are you voting for the max stability loss?!? +6-8 econ also uses up all the remaining slots ending the baby boom, and immediately putting us into red econ max limit.
 
ugh, I just want the next post blargle so excited despite it being 11 and the convo being 9x slower
 
Academia Nut said:
Special Note: Because of the discovery of needing clean water and large amounts of salt to most effectively fight these sorts of disease, starting the Saltern or the Garden next turn will provide +1 Stability as the People are assured that the king is being proactive in protection against demons
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SALTERN

God yes

Based Saltern, much love, this is what I asked for last turn

[X] A significant number (-1 Stability, +2 Econ)
[X] Share with friendly groups (Chance of other effects)
[X] Megaproject Support

Saltern and kick it next turn along with double Secondary->Main Grand Sac
 
[X] Megaproject Support
[X] A significant number (-1 Stability, +2 Econ)
[X] Share with even those who don't want to listen (-1 Diplomacy, +1 immediate Stability, chance for additional stability, other effects
 
[X] The whole lowlands are kind of a mess, you know? (-3 Stability, +6-8 Econ, other effects)
[X] Keep it secret (Chance of Stability loss)
[X] Megaproject Support
 
May I ask why some of you are voting to keep the medicine secret and not choose the risk free share with our friends option since it seems better in every way?

Also good night everyone see you all tomorrow with hopefully less than 15 new pages awaiting me.
 
Tally
Adhoc vote count started by Killer_Whale on May 5, 2017 at 2:22 AM, finished with 386 posts and 70 votes.
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NotteBoy97 said:
May I ask why some of you are voting to keep the medicine secret and not choose the risk free share with our friends option since it seems better in every way?

Also good night everyone see you all tomorrow with hopefully less than 15 new pages awaiting me.
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Because it isn't risk free. It also helps stabilize the lowlands when them being stuck in chaos is preferable. That gives us more opportunity to finish our own projects without having to deal with them.
 
[X] There is a war going on too you know (-2 Stability, +4-5 Econ)
[X] Share with even those who don't want to listen (-1 Diplomacy, +1 immediate Stability, chance for additional stability, other effects)
[X] Megaproject Support
 
[X] A significant number (-1 Stability, +2 Econ)
[X] Keep it secret (Chance of Stability loss)
[X] Megaproject Support
 
[X] There is a war going on too you know (-2 Stability, +4-5 Econ)
[X] Share with even those who don't want to listen (-1 Diplomacy, +1 immediate Stability, chance for additional stability, other effects)
[X] Megaproject Support
 
Candesce said:
If we pass on the New Settlement - Southshore chance, anyway. But yes, being at -1 and RoOing is a really nice opportunity.
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Not strictly passing on it, under this arrangement we'd take Southshore the turn after that.

Obviously patience might be on short supply, but everything is still good to go, despite claims to the contrary
zamin said:
The Southern Viking dudes, who are really far away and also probably have their own sources of salt if they live on the coast?
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Incidentally they aren't Southern Vikings, but rather the Southern Metal guys, who suffered a polity collapse recently, so their fringes turned to raiding.
Umi-san said:
No offense, but I for one am going to support a Southshore Province > springboarding to 2 with a restore order.
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Fair enough. It's not a big problem, even if we DO wind up at -1 Stability this turn, since taking the Garden or Saltern would zerolize the Stability immediately anyways.

Just taking advantage of an opportunity to get Stability cheaply, since the Highland Kingdom's civil war means that they aren't competing with Southshore this turn, but ARE likely to spawn more refugees in the coming turns.
Spectrum said:
Saltern and kick it next turn along with double Secondary->Main Grand Sac
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Uh, seriously, why kick it? We don't need to Kick it to finish it in record time with Megaproject Policy, and while it's USEFUL, it's not super urgent so as to eat a Stability hit for it.

Look at this lineup:
-The Gardens
-Starting Economy 5
--Main action + 2 Policy Main actions means we can complete it in one turn for Econ 3 if we roll well. We get Symphony bonus to this roll.
---Economy -3 best case
---Economy -6 worst case
---Assuming Symphony bonus shifts the roll by one point, the average Econ cost of The Gardens is 4-5
-The Gardens will generate Economy based on it's description. Economy +2(?)
-Divine Stewards will generate Economy and Stability. Economy +1(?)
-Stone Age Canal will generate Art and Mysticism
-Baby Boom continues due to Gardens making high populations more sustainable. Economy +3

If we do The Gardens, unkicked, we are likely to be able to start the Saltern the next turn, with Econ 5-8. Which allows us to immediately start the Saltern with the Gardens bonuses on top. And grab a new province a long the way if we want to. No need to stop to rebuild Economy.

Whereas if we Kick the Saltern we're not going to be able to pay for the Gardens, as we're going to need to rebuild the Economy AND spend more actions restoring the Stability cost.
 
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