Paths of Civilization

Deadly Snark · Apr 28, 2017

Painfulldarksoul said:
His system is our old system and only works for kingdoms smaller in scale than ours. His reasoning is herp derp, simple good old ways and the king is trying to make better laws, cause he's corrupt. Electing him means, going back to the old system and using it for a very long time, despite it not working.

He is pointedly not using the old System exactly, he has put forth changes of his own, one of which is Hereditary Landownership which is also an system that works for large kingdoms.

He's angry because like many he understandably thinks that the Chiefs are making laws and systems that are way too complex. Meaning too complex for ordinary people to understand, which makes it easier for the Chiefs to screw over the population and gather up wealth just by abusing their greater understanding of the system.

He wants to simplify things so that the people have more power and get their rights protected and can actually understand the tax law and thus avoid getting screwed over, in his eyes. Which again, he has a point.

Katsuragi · Apr 28, 2017

[X] Snub him (Small chance of -1 Stability)
[X] Stop trading with both (-4 Diplomacy)
[X] We will find land for you to settle (-1 Stability, +2 Econ)

tryrar · Apr 28, 2017

Powerofmind said:
The old system worked just fine, there were just some wastage issues.

Ok, the old system had its issues and that's why we voted to do tax reform. Saying it was fine is a bald-faced lie

Microtec1 · Apr 28, 2017

[X] Snub him (Small chance of -1 Stability)
[X] Stop trading with the Highlanders (-3 Diplomacy, small chance of the Highlanders declaring war)
[X] We will find land for you to settle (-1 Stability, +2 Econ)

Kiba · Apr 28, 2017

Powerofmind said:
The old system worked just fine, there were just some wastage issues.

He is definitely not going to keep the old system, but he's going to systemize it while only doing conservative changes.

Theunderbolt · Apr 28, 2017

tryrar said:
WHY IS EVEYONE VOTING TO KEEP TRADING WITH BOTH WHEN THAT OPTION CLEARLY STATES IT WILL LEAD TO WAR?!

SV in a nutshell.

bluefur87 · Apr 28, 2017

tryrar said:
...point. We can simply secondary GS next turn to bring stability up one

And what happens if we lose 2 Stab this turn, bringing us down to -1 Stab?

We absolutely can not afford a war right now.

SpeckofStardust · Apr 28, 2017

tryrar said:
Ok, the old system had it's issues and that's why we voted to do tax reform. Saying it was fine is a bald-faced lie

no the old system wasn't perfect, which is why everyone went for the 'perfect' new system

VoidZero · Apr 28, 2017

tryrar said:
Dude, the issue is a war at this time is the WORST thing to happen, since it sucks up secondary actions we need to resolve the crisis. And no, I don't think electing the guy is solving the crisis, and is still a terrible justification for a war just because.

We didn't declare war, someone else did. The March and our Military 8 are stable enough to hold and make gains in the war, if it occurs.

For all we know, HK might declare war anyway, so risk of war exists.

Also, electing that king will end the crsis; therefore no problem.

Ephemeral_Dreamer · Apr 28, 2017

[X] Snub him (Small chance of -1 Stability)
[X] Stop trading with the Highlanders (-3 Diplomacy, small chance of the Highlanders declaring war)
[X] We will find land for you to settle (-1 Stability, +2 Econ)

DragonParadox · Apr 28, 2017

[X] Snub him (Small chance of -1 Stability)
[X] Stop trading with the Highlanders (-3 Diplomacy, small chance of the Highlanders declaring war)
[X] We will find land for you to settle (-1 Stability, +2 Econ)

hylas240 · Apr 28, 2017

[X] Elect Cwriid heir (+1 Stability, Crisis Ends on his terms)
[X] Stop trading with the Highlanders (-3 Diplomacy, small chance of the Highlanders declaring war)
[X] We will find land for you to settle (-1 Stability, +2 Econ)

Change pending further information.

Spectrum · Apr 28, 2017

bluefur87 said:
It's the same as Legitimacy currently and that is maxed. All we really care about is technically fulfilled.

It's not the same.

Academia Nut said:
It's stability?

vs

Academia Nut said:
Requirements to fix: Restore stability?, restore legitimacy, communication??, literacy??

vs

Academia Nut said:
Requirements to fix: Restore stability?, restore legitimacy?, ???, ???

Bold/test size my emphasis

tryrar · Apr 28, 2017

SpeckofStardust said:
no the old system wasn't perfect, which is why everyone went for the 'perfect' new system

Look, I'll be the first to admit we might have gone a little too complicated as a first try at tax reform, but saying the old system worked perfectly well is very misleading.

If we can come out of this with simple quotas and flat labor payments, then I'll be happy

tenchifew · Apr 28, 2017

VoidZero said:
We didn't declare war, someone else did. The March and our Military 8 are stable enough to hold and make gains in the war, if it occurs.

For all we know, HK might declare war anyway, so risk of war exists.

Also, electing that king will end the crsis; therefore no problem.

...the march is on the other side.

March protects us from north and west.

HK and TH are in the east and south,

notgreat · Apr 28, 2017

Why "Stop trading with the Highlanders"? The extra +1 diplomacy IMO is absolutely not worth the small chance of war. It's a single action's worth of stats in exchange for a ~20% chance of failing the crisis. (~25% chance of war, likely lose 2-3 actions from it, combine with another LoO trigger and we won't have enough stability or if some other actions are needed and we don't have the slots)

We've got so much diplomacy right now, this is the perfect time to spend it. It also keeps things fair as we'll completely avoid taking sides, and we can't spare those actions.

bluefur87 · Apr 28, 2017

Spectrum said:
It's not the same.

vs

vs

Bold/test size my emphasis

Huh. I did not notice that.

Still, all we need is the bare minimum. Hmm, maybe extra stability would increase the timer?

VoidZero · Apr 28, 2017

Also, are you guys joking with the -2 stability with looming economy crsis and risk of war?

Do you really want to temp the dice by punching martial hero in the face when he have his own province & army?

Umi-san · Apr 28, 2017

[X] Suppress the Young Stallion movement (-1 Stability, +1 Turns to resolve crisis, small chance of civil war)
Honestly just tired of his shit. + we get yet another turn.
[X] Declare war on the Highlanders (-2 Diplomacy)
Prefer the TH.
[X] We will find land for your to settle (-1 Stability, +2 Economy)
Large chance to lose stability for no gain otherwise.

tryrar · Apr 28, 2017

Umi-san said:
[X] Suppress the Young Stallion movement (-1 Stability, +1 Turns to resolve crisis, small chance of civil war)
Honestly just tired of his shit. + we get yet another turn.
[X] Declare war on the Highlanders (-2 Diplomacy)
Prefer the TH.
[X] We will find land for your to settle (-1 Stability, +2 Economy)
Large chance to lose stability for no gain otherwise.

Why. JUST WHY. We can't afford war right now.

bluefur87 · Apr 28, 2017

VoidZero said:
Also, are you guys joking with the -2 stability with looming economy crsis and risk of war?

Do you really want to temp the dice by punching martial hero in the face when he have his own province & army?

He isn't going to rebel. He doesn't do the politics well enough to actually throw a fit.

That said, if we combine it with a potential war, then things are going to get really messy and I really wish people would stop tempting the war. We really, really can not afford it now. All it costs is 1 Diplomacy point, bringing us down to 5 instead of 6 to make sure we don't get sucked into a war during a crises.

Please, we do not want to waste time getting involved in this!

VoidZero · Apr 28, 2017

tenchifew said:
...the march is on the other side.
March protects us from north and west.
HK and TH are in the east and south,

We have in the past and present sent war parties to DP and ST areas for war. So saying the March can't send troops down to our area is strange.

tenchifew · Apr 28, 2017

Spectrum said:
It's not the same.

vs

vs

Bold/test size my emphasis

Ok, so we need to have stability 2 to be properly safe.

tryrar · Apr 28, 2017

VoidZero said:
We have in the past and present sent war parties to DP and ST areas for war. So saying the March can't send troops down to our area is strange.

It is six months on the other side of our territory. No way in hell are they sending troops that far to war when they need to protect our northen flank.

tenchifew · Apr 28, 2017

VoidZero said:
We have in the past and present sent war parties to DP and ST areas for war. So saying the March can't send troops down to our area is strange.

They can.
Not easily though.

Paths of Civilization

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