Voting is open
That is contingent on the assumption that IT is impossible to trace - do we know if that's accurate? Otherwise, since Yammar will at minimum be actively monitoring our ki signature, he would almost certainly just follow whatever trail it left immediately.
There is no evidence what so ever to support this claim and since you are making the positive claim here that IT is traceable when it has never been shown to be in the past since characters have had to locate our Ki signature in the past so that they could track us it is up to you to supply the evidence.

Also IT is both instant and does not travel between the intervening space due to it being teleportation so you can't even track it like that even if you tried.
 
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The plan to use Spirit Saiyan as bait to draw Yammar away and then heal our allies is interesting, but I have a question. Does anyone remember if we can actually IT straight back into the hall, or would we be forced to IT to the gates and enter normally? Because Poptart has said that traversing the gates is the really time consuming part, and can take up to a minute. Given that Super Saiyans can travel the length of the planet pretty much instantly, this probably wouldn't give us enough of a lead on Yammar to heal our allies.
 
The plan to use Spirit Saiyan as bait to draw Yammar away and then heal our allies is interesting, but I have a question. Does anyone remember if we can actually IT straight back into the hall, or would we be forced to IT to the gates and enter normally? Because Poptart has said that traversing the gates is the really time consuming part, and can take up to a minute. Given that Super Saiyans can travel the length of the planet pretty much instantly, this probably wouldn't give us enough of a lead on Yammar to heal our allies.
...The plan was never to use spirit saiyan as a distraction we will be actually charging up spirit saiyan we simply have the opportunity to heal our allies on the way out before we go do that meaning we have an extra contingency in place just in case we fail charging up spirit saiyan. And no I don't think we can IT straight back into the hall we'll have to traverse the gates to get back in but that shouldn't matter since we'll be healing our allies on the way out so we won't have to go back in and even if we do have to go back in the only reason we'd be forced to do so is if Yammar found our location and was closing in on it which would be on the opposite side of the sun so the sheer distances involved should make Yammar's travel time back more then enough for us to open the gates and do what ever we want with the extra time we have since Yammar will also have to open the gates when he arrives.

Like just to put into perspective how long it'll take Yammar to get to us not including scanning time and if he can even find us at all just based off the time it takes him to travel around the entire planet it should take him about 3444 instances to get to us and then he'll have to travel all the way back and deal with getting back inside to deal with us.
 
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...The plan was never to use spirit saiyan as a distraction we will be actually charging up spirit saiyan we simply have the opportunity to heal our allies on the way out before we go do that meaning we have an extra contingency in place just in case we fail charging up spirit saiyan. And no I don't think we can IT straight back into the hall we'll have to traverse the gates to get back in but that shouldn't matter since we'll be healing our allies on the way out so we won't have to go back in and even if we do have to go back in the only reason we'd be forced to do so is if Yammar found our location and was closing in on it which would be on the opposite side of the sun so the sheer distances involved should make Yammar's travel time back more then enough for us to open the gates and do what ever we want with the extra time we have since Yammar will also have to open the gates when he arrives.

Like just to put into perspective how long it'll take Yammar to get to us not including scanning time and if he can even find us at all just based off the time it takes him to travel around the entire planet it should take him about 3444 instances to get to us and then he'll have to travel all the way back and deal with getting back inside to deal with us.

I'm aware of the plan to actually charge up Spirit Saiyan and use it. In fact, it's probably what I'll be voting for. However, there was also an idea to simply draw Yammar out of the hall by charging up, then just as he reached us IT back and bean our allies, which is what I was referring to.

It's good to know we can't IT straight back into the hall though. That makes the bait plan much more difficult and a worse option than just charging Spirit Saiyan for as long as we can and using it to fight.
 
I'm aware of the plan to actually charge up Spirit Saiyan and use it. In fact, it's probably what I'll be voting for. However, there was also an idea to simply draw Yammar out of the hall by charging up, then just as he reached us IT back and bean our allies, which is what I was referring to.

It's good to know we can't IT straight back into the hall though. That makes the bait plan much more difficult and a worse option than just charging Spirit Saiyan for as long as we can and using it to fight.
Oh, my apologies for the confusion then. But ya unless we can IT back to the planet well still charging which I don't think is remotely feasible using spirit saiyan to fight instead of as bait is probably the better move in this case.

Also for the time being since most of the thread is in agreement that we should probably grab the Dandeer flail and eat a senzu bean and the like but deviates massively after that we should probably just vote to play up until we have the Dandeer flail again and then vote for what we want to do after.

Which is light of this unless anyone wants to poke some holes into it I'll probably be providing Poptart with my new write in plan soon:

[ ] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
- [ ] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
- [ ] IT over to Dandeer and use her as a shield/flail.

And have them remove my old one:

[ ] Telepathically shout at Yammar to block all incoming messages or possible Seer precog.
-[ ] IT to Dandeer, and use her as a shield/flail.
-[ ] While Yammar is at a disadvantage, Heal Beam your comrades. Give Jaffur, who Yammar implied only lost due to numbers, priority.
 
Point me? I remember the one got a bonus; you've posted more?
This is the second. This is an unrelated Omake, of lower quality but possibly higher canonicity. Out of curiosity, when was the Jaffur Recovery Roll bonus used?

On a related note, both I and @Simon_Jester were interested in seeing the mechanics behind this fight. Maybe post it as a Sidestory?
It's perfectly safe if you manage your diet and sleep; they don't take lots. The amount they filter out isn't enough for serious impacts, and it recovers in two days. It's just a stressful experience for me, and somewhat...draining. :D
Alright, well, take care of yourself. Not like you'll be more responsive if you wind up with a cold and have to sleep 14 hours a day.

...Incidentally, when does the vote open? I think we've got a few workable plans right now, and discussion is starting to wind down.
 
Alright since nobody has poked any holes in it I guess I'll go ahead.

So PoptartProdigy could you include this plan:

[ ] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
- [ ] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
- [ ] IT over to Dandeer and use her as a shield/flail.

In the moratorium unlock?

And remove the old one I posted which is this one:

[ ] Telepathically shout at Yammar to block all incoming messages or possible Seer precog.
-[ ] IT to Dandeer, and use her as a shield/flail.
-[ ] While Yammar is at a disadvantage, Heal Beam your comrades. Give Jaffur, who Yammar implied only lost due to numbers, priority.
 
This is the second. This is an unrelated Omake, of lower quality but possibly higher canonicity. Out of curiosity, when was the Jaffur Recovery Roll bonus used?

On a related note, both I and @Simon_Jester were interested in seeing the mechanics behind this fight. Maybe post it as a Sidestory?
Both are non-canon, bonuses to the next time you need to interact with Jaffur, and to healing attempts. It was used in getting Jaffur back in the fight.

I can do that, although it won't be terribly pretty. Y'all might be disappointed. I write those for me, not for anybody else to read.
...Incidentally, when does the vote open? I think we've got a few workable plans right now, and discussion is starting to wind down.
Convenient timing.



Vote's open, everybody!

[ ] At this point you need something exceptional. Visions show you things you'd think were relevant, right? Let it in and see what it has to say, as long as you're already out for the moment and nobody is defending themselves.
[ ] Take another bean, get back up, and fight.
-[ ] Fight at a distance, burning ki for time. You have Senzu beans; you can recharge. He can't. You just need to keep them safe, and you can wear him down.
-[ ] Okay, so last time didn't work out so well, but he must be at least a little tired now. Go full-bore and put him down, fast.
[ ] Take another bean, get back up, and run.
-[ ] Just run.
-[ ] Write-in one person to try to evacuate with you.
[ ] Write-in.

Here are the featured write-ins, presented here as they were presented to me, with no alterations.

[] Plan Screaming Saiyans
-[] Take another bean, get back up, and fight.
--[] Keep your distance and fight defensively. Your goal isn't to knock out Yammar, but to prevent him from doing the same to you as well as healing his allies.
-[] Broadcast to every single Saiyan on Garenhuld that you're trying to break the Sealing, Dandeer is mind-controlling Yammar and Berra and that they need to scream at Yammar right now.

[]Eat a senzu bean, then IT to Dandeer and grab her as a saiyan shield again.

[ ] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
- [ ] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
- [ ] IT over to Dandeer and use her as a shield/flail.

Fight! ;)
 
[X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
- [X] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
 
[X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
- [X] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
- [X] IT over to Dandeer and use her as a shield/flail.

I'm gonna hope that Poptart stops the update after we grab the Dandeer flail.
[X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
- [X] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
Buddy I think your missing the last third of the vote there.
 
[X] At this point you need something exceptional. Visions show you things you'd think were relevant, right? Let it in and see what it has to say, as long as you're already out for the moment and nobody is defending themselves.
 
Was that an option? I don't see it listed as an option.
You can still do write ins they just aren't boosted if you don't ask Poptart but anyway the purpose of the Dandeer flail vote is basically to get us into position to do that later except we jump to the other side of the sun instead of the planet.
Adhoc vote count started by Sir LagsAlot on Aug 30, 2018 at 10:32 PM, finished with 30676 posts and 10 votes.

  • [X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
    - [X] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
    - [X] IT over to Dandeer and use her as a shield/flail.
    [X] At this point you need something exceptional. Visions show you things you'd think were relevant, right? Let it in and see what it has to say, as long as you're already out for the moment and nobody is defending themselves.
    [X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
    -[X] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
    -[X] Fire a healing beam of ki at Jaffur.
    [X] Try to persuade Yammar to stop fighting via Communications.
    -[X] Telepathically transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
    -[X] Possible line of argument, to be used at Kakara's discretion: Dandeer has done terrible harm to House Vegeta and Clan Vegeta, and if she succeeds, she won't need a clan of super-saiyan royals anymore; she can control as many super-saiyans as she likes if she isn't stopped.
    -[X] Possible line of argument, to be used at Kakara's discretion: Dandeer did a MUCH worse thing than Yammar has ever done, but Yammar has a horrible reputation for his actions, while Dandeer's crimes aren't even remembered. Yammar should not be protecting Dandeer,in light of this.
    [X]Eat a senzu bean, then IT to Dandeer and grab her as a saiyan shield again.
    [x] IT to the other side of the planet
    -[x] Go spirit saiyan
    [X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
    - [X] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
    [X] Eat a Senzu Bean
    - [X] IT to the other side of the planet
    - [X] Go Spirit Saiyan
    [X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
    -[X] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
    -[X] IT over to Dandeer and use her as a shield/flail.
 
[X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
- [X] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
- [X] IT over to Dandeer and use her as a shield/flail.
 
[X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
- [X] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
- [X] IT over to Dandeer and use her as a shield/flail.

[X] Eat a Senzu Bean
- [X] IT to the other side of the planet
- [X] Go Spirit Saiyan

[X] At this point you need something exceptional. Visions show you things you'd think were relevant, right? Let it in and see what it has to say, as long as you're already out for the moment and nobody is defending themselves.
 
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[X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
- [X] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
- [X] IT over to Dandeer and use her as a shield/flail.
 
While we're bumming around, here's some thoughts on previous updates and me trying to connect things.


A pulse of magic rings out, and when you finish dragging your power level up to parity with Jaffur's, you see that Yammar has released Dandeer. Your eyes widen as he turns, eyes blank, and backhands Jaffur across the face. Time unfreezes as Jaffur hurtles back into the opposite wall, debris flying, and people scream.
So, 2 options here; either Dandeer had an emergency one-use super powered mind control spell, or she had him programmed from the beginning. I lean towards the second, because of this:
"BUTCHER!" howls your father, powering up and charging. Beside him, your grandmother issues a wordless scream, flying for Dandeer. She makes it halfway there before a dark, familiar ki signature flares across your senses, and a golden blur tears her out of the sky. Lord Vegeta, his eyes as blank as his father's, kicks you grandmother into the ground with an earth-rattling bang.
Vegeta was able to be summoned seemingly without any vocal or magical input, leading me to think that Yammar was just mind-controlled then.
Dandeer, sprawled on the floor where Yammar dropped her, gasps out, "Protect me!" Magic sings out one last time.

Your father, grappling with Yammar, stiffens and then disengages, his eyes blank as well.

This one is weird, because I feel like Berra and Vegeta's triggers should have been the same, so it's weird we didn't detect Vegeta being triggered.

This is also your friendly reminder that Dandeer had a plan of some sort:

Exiles flee every which way as Dandeer drags herself to her feet. "Keep them off of me!" she croaks. "While I...I need to work!"

So that's concerning.

In regards to the seer/mass mind control concept:

"How?!" you say, looking up at him. "How could she have possibly..." You trail off, realizing that it would be far from the first spectacular thing Dandeer has done. Except...How would the Seers have missed this? Also, Dandelor taught you that those kinds of workings take time, time and resources. Did she really blow all of that on subverting the Seers? When she had a people to run, and angry super saiyans as her political opponents? While helping to develop the ward the sorcerers used during your fight with Dazarel? If she's resorting to mass mind control, why not get the rest of the nobility instead?

The question posed here is pretty simply answered by the Carrack mind control concept:
And I'm just now realizing that you've always said that the Seers deliver their predictions through him, which isn't really suspicious when you're trying to run a conspiracy and thus avoid big gatherings or implicating more people than necessary if you're caught, but taken with everything-
A single point of failure removes the need for another mass mind control spell, which is good because if that was a possibility, we'd be fucked.

In regards to taking that vision:

It goes on like this. Vision after vision pummels at your mental barriers as you and Jaffur stand frozen.

Let's not do that again.

In regards to Yammar's speech.

You see, Jaffur is quite the combatant, Kakara. He's prepared all his life for the task of killing my son. And you know, I think he was honestly angry enough to do it before he had a chance to consider what he was doing. But...it wasn't just my son. And Jaffur has not trained all his life to fight two-on-one. Perhaps in another ten years. As it stood...no. Credit to him, he did take Vegeta with him, although they'll both recover given time. And then, I had a few seconds alone with the Senzus in between those two going down and you getting back up -- and you know what people like us can do with a few seconds."

I suppose it is in character for Yammar to monologue, but it really feels like there's something fucky about how he's phrased this-if anyone can see something off, please point it out.

Finally, in regards to Dandeer herself, I've been considering something:

"You used me," he says, a bitter smile on his face. "I never was anything more than a path to a higher position for you, was I? I know. I've seen how you treat Jaron, through the Seal. Oh, didn't you realize? You didn't put me to sleep. You locked me away."

Dandeer freezes, eyes wide. "What?!"

"Your Seal made a whole new person," says Jaffur, coming to a halt at a point right between her and the crowd before starting to pace. "Jaron? He's real. My brother, a pure-blooded human, made as a lock on the cage holding me in. Gotta admit; that was pretty clever. What's the one thing I wouldn't break, to get out?"

Jaffur clearly thinks that the sealing of himself was for Dandeer to get a higher political power, and that Jaron's creation was intentional, and a disincentive towards Jaffur breaking out. Dandeer seems to be shocked by this accusation. I figured it was either Jaffur reaching and Jaron being a big coincidence, which would mean Dandeer wouldn't know about that kind of magical technique, or It being intentional and Dandeer being an excellent liar.


Then I thought about the third option.


Compare this:
In your grip, Dandeer sobs. "Please let go it hurts let me go please-"

You shake her a little, scowling. "Shut up. You'll be fine. I can handle it."

She wails, "Please!"

With this:

You see her take a deep breath, eyes fixed on a wall.

"I told him. He went crazy. He attacked me," she says. You can see the skin at her throat fluttering slightly in time with her pulse. She fires up her aura and curls her fingers into fists. Deliberately, she keeps up her power level.

Just as deliberately, you can feel the bits keeping her durable draining away.

"He broke my ribs."

She drives her fist into the left side of her chest.

Compare the nervous wreck we've seen today:
"Berra, I don't understand, what's going on?!" cries Dandeer, scrambling backwards. "What are you talking about? What am I supposed to have done?"

The accusation rings in the Hall as Dandeer trembles on the floor.

With the monster we know exists:
Dandeer purses her lips. "Well. I suppose this was obvious enough. Alright, then." She sighs, walking towards her captive without any visible concern for the corpses on which she steps. "I'm sure you're wondering why everybody's dead and you're not."

Dandelor doesn't respond; he's trying to shift his weight so that he's not kneeling on anybody's body.

Dandeer's hand shoots out, cinching closed in Dandelor's hair and dragging him up to look at her. "Don't ignore me," she hisses. "Do you know why I was able to kill all of the sorcerers of our Clan today, Dandelor? Do you have an idea?"

He snarls at her, straining to get closer and attack.

She snorts, tossing him backwards. "It's because you all got complacent. I've treated you all like my enemies, while you were busy singing my praises and trusting that I'd bring in a golden age for magic. To you, I was a champion. To me, you were all targets. And you can see how that turned out." She turns away and starts walking vaguely towards the door. "Thing is, Dandelor, a girl can only get strong through overcoming an opponent if there's somebody to fight. You're that somebody from now on. I expect to see you regularly over the next few years. Train up."

Compare Jaffur's accusation of someone obsessed with obtaining political power and compare it to the Happy Family act that Dandeer is so obsessed with. These are basic inconsistencies in personality. We kind of figured something happened in between Dandeer being murder happy and the start of the quest, but I think something different happened.

At this point, I'm entirely convinced Dandeer has sealed herself, creating a new persona in the process. It would explain the difference in pain tolerance, in personality, why she would be so prepared in some circumstances and completely vulnerable in others, her seemingly disparate goals-everything.

It would also explain why she was so confused about what was going on: There's a decent chance that she doesn't remember half of the atrocities she's committed. It's certainly easier to pass a deception check when you aren't the one lying. Now, what we do with that is beyond me, but it's certainly my best guess at what's going on.
 
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Oh heck voting happened when I was typing.

[X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
- [X] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
- [X] IT over to Dandeer and use her as a shield/flail.

[X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
-[X] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
-[X] Fire a healing beam of ki at Jaffur.

[X] At this point you need something exceptional. Visions show you things you'd think were relevant, right? Let it in and see what it has to say, as long as you're already out for the moment and nobody is defending themselves.

[X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
-[X] Try to persuade Yammar to stop fighting via Communications.
-[X] Telepathically transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
-[X] Possible line of argument, to be used at Kakara's discretion: Dandeer has done terrible harm to House Vegeta and Clan Vegeta, and if she succeeds, she won't need a clan of super-saiyan royals anymore; she can control as many super-saiyans as she likes if she isn't stopped.
-[X] Possible line of argument, to be used at Kakara's discretion: Dandeer did a MUCH worse thing than Yammar has ever done, but Yammar has a horrible reputation for his actions, while Dandeer's crimes aren't even remembered. Yammar should not be protecting Dandeer,in light of this.

EDIT: Also sorceress is misspelled, for what it's worth.
 
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[sighs]

DAMMIT I get back JUUUST after Poptart opens the vote and finalizes the published write-ins.

EDIT: Also sorceress is misspelled, for what it's worth.
So is "telepathicly." There's an extra 'al' in that word.

While I'd admit 5 minutes is unlikely, it's been very strongly hinted at from Dandeer's actions and the Negaverse omakes that she has some ace-in-the-hole type spell. What it does or how it works, I don't know, but dandeer quest apparently decided it was more useful spending 10 years prepping it instead of another mass memory-wipe spell. I really don't want Dandeer up, it's the definition of asking for trouble.
I think she may have spent those ten years doing something other than prepping a mass-spell, not just prepping a different super-spell.

Also, if she started work on it ten years ago it's not a dedicated anti-Spirit Saiyan counter, because NO ONE knew that was possible, certainly not a controllable version of it. Like, I don't think even GOKU knew it could be controlled, and he invented it.



@PoptartProdigy , got a question.

I would like to note that the consensus on the first two options I list below as approval votes seems to be that the next update should stop shortly after grabbing Dandeer. That is to say, a lot of us want to do something OTHER than attack Yammar using Dandeer as a flail- but something that merits using Dandeer as a shield/hostage.

Is this also your understanding of the vote?

Or, in the event that

[] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
-[] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
-[] IT over to Dandeer and use her as a shield/flail.

wins, and assuming for the sake of argument that Kakara succeeds in grabbing Dandeer and has a choice of whether or not to engage Yammar again in combat... Would you be writing Kakara engaging Yammar in combat voluntarily, rather than giving us a vote on whether or not to do that?



[X]Eat a senzu bean, then IT to Dandeer and grab her as a saiyan shield again.

[X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
-[X] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
-[X] IT over to Dandeer and use her as a shield/flail.

[X] Try to persuade Yammar to stop fighting via Communications.
-[X] Telepathically transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
-[X] Possible line of argument, to be used at Kakara's discretion: Dandeer has done terrible harm to House Vegeta and Clan Vegeta, and if she succeeds, she won't need a clan of super-saiyan royals anymore; she can control as many super-saiyans as she likes if she isn't stopped.
-[X] Possible line of argument, to be used at Kakara's discretion: Dandeer did a MUCH worse thing than Yammar has ever done, but Yammar has a horrible reputation for his actions, while Dandeer's crimes aren't even remembered. Yammar should not be protecting Dandeer,in light of this.

[X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
-[X] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
-[X] Fire a healing beam of ki at Jaffur.

Aaand... I dunno, my gut says to vote for this though it MIGHT be a trap option:

[X] At this point you need something exceptional. Visions show you things you'd think were relevant, right? Let it in and see what it has to say, as long as you're already out for the moment and nobody is defending themselves.
 
[X]Eat a senzu bean, then IT to Dandeer and grab her as a saiyan shield again.

[X] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
- [X] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
- [X] IT over to Dandeer and use her as a shield/flail.
 
@PoptartProdigy , got a question.

I would like to note that the consensus on the first two options I list below as approval votes seems to be that the next update should stop shortly after grabbing Dandeer. That is to say, a lot of us want to do something OTHER than attack Yammar using Dandeer as a flail- but something that merits using Dandeer as a shield/hostage.

Is this also your understanding of the vote?

Or, in the event that

[] Take a Senzu bean and hold another Senzu bean in our mouth or cheek.
-[] Telepathicly transmit the memories of Dandeer's slaughter of the Vegetan sorceres to Yammar.
-[] IT over to Dandeer and use her as a shield/flail.

wins, and assuming for the sake of argument that Kakara succeeds in grabbing Dandeer and has a choice of whether or not to engage Yammar again in combat... Would you be writing Kakara engaging Yammar in combat voluntarily, rather than giving us a vote on whether or not to do that?
We share the same interpretation of the vote.
 
We share the same interpretation of the vote.
PHEW! That is a relief. Now I can worry less about that choice winning. Because grabbing Dandeer via IT is a pretty good tactic if we can pull it off, but there's a lot of disagreement about what to do NEXT.

This one is weird, because I feel like Berra and Vegeta's triggers should have been the same, so it's weird we didn't detect Vegeta being triggered.
Dandeer's had years in close proximity to 'prep' Vegeta for use as a defense-slave. She can work on him in private just about any day she wants.

By contrast, her access to Berra is much more limited and usually only happens when they're awake.

This is also your friendly reminder that Dandeer had a plan of some sort:
It took a while for her to accomplish, even on the timescale of regular saiyans, so hopefully we can stop her from implementing it.

So that's concerning.
In regards to the seer/mass mind control concept:
The question posed here is pretty simply answered by the Carrack mind control concept:
A single point of failure removes the need for another mass mind control spell, which is good because if that was a possibility, we'd be fucked.
Honestly, I'm not clear on how we weren't fucked as it was. I mean, Carrack knew so much about the plot that if he'd just told Dandeer in advance about it, she could have countered it pretty easily. Dandeer did NOT behave the way I'd have expected her to behave if she knew we were coming.

In regards to taking that vision:

Let's not do that again.
Hmmmm... think you may be misinterpreting what happened back there. The problem is, if Carrick's been suborned for a long enough period of time that he's been actively misleading us somehow, we do not know JACK about the Sight and cannot interpret what's happening to us. I'm not sure the 'barrage of visions' we've gotten is actually an attack. Is there ANY prior instance of anyone using the Sight to project visions at people as a distraction?

In regards to Yammar's speech.

I suppose it is in character for Yammar to monologue, but it really feels like there's something fucky about how he's phrased this-if anyone can see something off, please point it out.
I mean... I dunno? I'm not sure what you're pointing towards here.

Finally, in regards to Dandeer herself, I've been considering something:

Jaffur clearly thinks that the sealing of himself was for Dandeer to get a higher political power, and that Jaron's creation was intentional, and a disincentive towards Jaffur breaking out. Dandeer seems to be shocked by this accusation. I figured it was either Jaffur reaching and Jaron being a big coincidence, which would mean Dandeer wouldn't know about that kind of magical technique, or It being intentional and Dandeer being an excellent liar.

Then I thought about the third option.

Compare this... With this:

Compare the nervous wreck we've seen today:... With the monster we know exists:

Compare Jaffur's accusation of someone obsessed with obtaining political power and compare it to the Happy Family act that Dandeer is so obsessed with. These are basic inconsistencies in personality. We kind of figured something happened in between Dandeer being murder happy and the start of the quest, but I think something different happened.

At this point, I'm entirely convinced Dandeer has sealed herself, creating a new persona in the process. It would explain the difference in pain tolerance, in personality, why she would be so prepared in some circumstances and completely vulnerable in others, her seemingly disparate goals-everything.

It would also explain why she was so confused about what was going on: There's a decent chance that she doesn't remember half of the atrocities she's committed. It's certainly easier to pass a deception check when you aren't the one lying. Now, what we do with that is beyond me, but it's certainly my best guess at what's going on.
Hm. You know, Dandeer having a Jekyll and Hyde thing going is actually quite plausible.

Maybe when she was much younger, she tried to Seal away the 'saiyan side' of her personality, the ruthlessly competitive, obsessed with being the best, aggressive side? And she wound up with something a bit like the way Jaffur and Jaron are now, and a bit like Kakara having a saiyan masque. There are, in effect, two Dandeers "take turns" controlling her body, with very different personalities. What trigger flips her from one to the other is an open question, though for all I know THAT is what she was "working on" just now- trying to bring out the 'evil sorceror-queen' persona she needs in order to, say, cast attack magic.

I don't know what we can do with that. Maybe cause Dandeer to have a mental breakdown by reminding her 'fragile homemaker' side of what her 'ruthless atrocitymonger' side has done by zapping her with memories of her own actions during the slaughter of the Vegetan sorcerors. But I'd hesitate to try that until we either have her restrained, until we have corroboration, or until we somehow have no other choice...

Of course, the OTHER explanation is that she's just a very, very good actress.
 
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