Correct.
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
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- warhammer warhammer fantasy fantasy be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist pansexual protagonist ck2 quest divided loyalties mountain vietnam ranald is real this is a dwarf quest (dwarfs) this is maybe an elf quest this is not a vampire quest this is not an empire quest try it and find out open voting
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Correct.
- Pronouns
- He/His/etc
Excuse my poor memory for a moment - with Vlag restored is there anything else we need to do for this energy from Dum to make it all the way to Karaz-a-Karak?
Chlof
Her Ladyship
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Well, there goes Operation: Just Fly Over Him.
Not that Mathilde's aware of, and she checked that it was flowing on from Karak Vlag properly.
King Arthur
The Once and Future King
Here's my theory.
Dum isn't actually in the chaos wastes.
You can only reach it and exit it via the wastes, but the actual location is somewhere in the south, its just that the roads to and out of Dum are in the wastes.
The beastmen are an illusion, and we can't tell because the magic of the illusion is happening elsewhere and we are only seeing the results.
My strongest pieces of evidence are the fact that the temperature is weird, I think I remember Mattie seeing somethin weird about the actual spatial distance between us and the Beastmen, and that the Beast men demigod showed Borek affection.
Even if Borek was a literal demon in disguise, we wouldn't see affection from this specific Beast men, its not capable of it. That's another Dwarf.
Dum isn't actually in the chaos wastes.
You can only reach it and exit it via the wastes, but the actual location is somewhere in the south, its just that the roads to and out of Dum are in the wastes.
The beastmen are an illusion, and we can't tell because the magic of the illusion is happening elsewhere and we are only seeing the results.
My strongest pieces of evidence are the fact that the temperature is weird, I think I remember Mattie seeing somethin weird about the actual spatial distance between us and the Beastmen, and that the Beast men demigod showed Borek affection.
Even if Borek was a literal demon in disguise, we wouldn't see affection from this specific Beast men, its not capable of it. That's another Dwarf.
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Sure. That makes some sense-only he and the Lunatic Prince (who, like, totally makes more sense here as something to bind, IMO) could do that. But where did they learn of Morghur in the first place, and how did they bind him?
DocMatoi
Theoretical Lover of Girls
- Location
- within 2 hours of the White House
- Pronouns
- They/Them
This is an important factor.
Fact:Morghur doesn't control his aura of Fuck Your Body Plan.
Fact: dwarves aren't that resistant to mutation.
Fact: Borek didn't mutate when within spitting distance of "Morghur"
Theory: that's not Morghur
also: fuck you @BoneyM I'm supposed to be leaving for work
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NexusEye
Aspiring God
- Pronouns
- She/Her
The Runic Daemon Enslavement theory is possibly the most plausible one so far but if so why would they program Morghur/the Runes controlling Morghur to affectionately run its claw through people's hair, what's the purpose of that? Everything about this situation is weird.
We don't have any view of the Kul and Kvellige tribes from where we are right now correct?
- Location
- Germany
@BoneyM Are we talking about visible energy here, or is that something happening in our Windsight?
Would make a difference for me at least, because if it's normally visual stuff it could be part of an illusion.
Meanwhile if it's a movement of the Winds that we percieve with Windsight, then it's extremly unlikely to be an illusion, as every Windsight is different and it seems hard to cover them all with illusion.
Allright my theory.
[] [Theory] "Under the light of Morrisleb, one of the terrible fates that can befall men is to become beastmen. In the depths of the wastes, perhaps even Dwarves can be mutated without turning to stone. We have seen with Karak Vlag that even Dawi are not wholly immune to the great corruption."
"Most of those who are so transformed go mad. But not all of them. Those that do not might either kill themselves or, in terror, flee to join their new fellows rather than be hunted down."
"Morghur, or Cor-Dum is said to have been born 300 years ago, although tales of similar beings about throughout history. The gods of Chaos are cruel, and tales of them transforming those in their power into kin of their for sport abound. It is known as one of the possible origins of the Skaven, as well as one of their most fearsome and terrible magicks.
"I suspect that, 300 years ago, when Karak Dum fell into the Chaos wastes, it held for some time, but eventually the 4 visited on Karak Dum such a fate, transforming the population. But as it was an entire population rather than a few isolated humans surrounded by humans who would simply kill them at once, they did not simply die. Twisted, corrupted of form, they could never return to the Karaz Ankor. Many of them are still insane, such as the Shadowgrave. But something of them persists, and Dawi are not content to simply destroy themselves. Instead they follow the path of Morgrimm, becoming slayers.
These beastmen could never be true slayers of course, they know that. But for the most part they remain here, fighting to protect the land which was once theirs. Perhaps some part of them hopes that when they die, the Ancestors might spare some pity on them, reclaim their souls and allow them to try again as new Dawi."
Essentially, the entire Karak were transformed into Beastmen. What few parts of them remain sane prevent them from damaging the waystones and keep them fighting chaos to protect Karak Dum. Dwarves go slayer rather than suicide and this is them trying to do the same while knowing that Beastmen slayers would never be accepted.
[] [Theory] "Under the light of Morrisleb, one of the terrible fates that can befall men is to become beastmen. In the depths of the wastes, perhaps even Dwarves can be mutated without turning to stone. We have seen with Karak Vlag that even Dawi are not wholly immune to the great corruption."
"Most of those who are so transformed go mad. But not all of them. Those that do not might either kill themselves or, in terror, flee to join their new fellows rather than be hunted down."
"Morghur, or Cor-Dum is said to have been born 300 years ago, although tales of similar beings about throughout history. The gods of Chaos are cruel, and tales of them transforming those in their power into kin of their for sport abound. It is known as one of the possible origins of the Skaven, as well as one of their most fearsome and terrible magicks.
"I suspect that, 300 years ago, when Karak Dum fell into the Chaos wastes, it held for some time, but eventually the 4 visited on Karak Dum such a fate, transforming the population. But as it was an entire population rather than a few isolated humans surrounded by humans who would simply kill them at once, they did not simply die. Twisted, corrupted of form, they could never return to the Karaz Ankor. Many of them are still insane, such as the Shadowgrave. But something of them persists, and Dawi are not content to simply destroy themselves. Instead they follow the path of Morgrimm, becoming slayers.
These beastmen could never be true slayers of course, they know that. But for the most part they remain here, fighting to protect the land which was once theirs. Perhaps some part of them hopes that when they die, the Ancestors might spare some pity on them, reclaim their souls and allow them to try again as new Dawi."
Essentially, the entire Karak were transformed into Beastmen. What few parts of them remain sane prevent them from damaging the waystones and keep them fighting chaos to protect Karak Dum. Dwarves go slayer rather than suicide and this is them trying to do the same while knowing that Beastmen slayers would never be accepted.
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- Location
- France
I would suggest a scouting run. Mathilde is really good at scouting. Then we can make a better decision when we have more information.
Obviously we'd want to stay far from Cor-Dum, but that's not a reason to avoid the entire mountain. Let's check what's happening to the dwarfhold inside that mountain! An alliance? A siege? a dwarfhold covered in beastmen symbols from the inside out? Both at once? Or perhaps signs of massive translocation or time-fuckery magic?
Hopefully they'll be more open to exchanging a few words than the last bunch. Their problems are the opposite of Slaaneshi daemons, after all.
EDIT: My personal guess is that the desert is the answer to Cor-Dum's forest. The Chaos Gods clearly don't want this whole area to become a massive beastman forest, so they just nuked it by applying a biome that's very hostile to trees.
Obviously we'd want to stay far from Cor-Dum, but that's not a reason to avoid the entire mountain. Let's check what's happening to the dwarfhold inside that mountain! An alliance? A siege? a dwarfhold covered in beastmen symbols from the inside out? Both at once? Or perhaps signs of massive translocation or time-fuckery magic?
Hopefully they'll be more open to exchanging a few words than the last bunch. Their problems are the opposite of Slaaneshi daemons, after all.
EDIT: My personal guess is that the desert is the answer to Cor-Dum's forest. The Chaos Gods clearly don't want this whole area to become a massive beastman forest, so they just nuked it by applying a biome that's very hostile to trees.
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She doesn't see any, and if there were any in the desert portion she'd see them unless they were on the northern side.
Both.
pucflek
Verified simpleton
- Location
- Czech Republic
Yeah pretty sure the first theory with the "we bound Morghur" is the correct one. He worships the entire mountain as a herdstone. Even though its pure. The Dwarfs did something really fucky here.
NuclearConsensus
Herald of the Thorned One
- Location
- the Philippines
Not as unlikely as you think, I'd say. We're in the Wastes, where reality wants to break more than usual. Runelords managed to boil earth all the way down south in Eight Peaks just off of the Eye of Gazul's effects. Radical runefuckery could probably do the same and more up here, especially given Dum knows about its waystone and could likely siphon some of its flow off to do shit with.
Unlucky Bibliophile
Meganekko
By the way Borek framed things, they've messed with things that shouldn't. I'm immensely curious, because Chaos Dwarves 2.0 seems unlikely with the waystone still in effect and a number of factors not lining up.
But on the other, do we want to chance things? Risk the lives of everyone in the expedition? Borek seems resigned; he seems content to leave us without explaining a damn thing. If this was an illusion, he could have told us. If this were anything else but appeared to be, he would have revealed it. But it was such a strong shame that Borek... left. He could've told anyone. Instead, he left a vague message, told us to turn back, and went back to join his people.
So, I say we just turn around. Leave. Borek's home. He's clearly left leadership in our hands, too. It'd leave a bad taste, but we still have people waiting for us at K8P and a chaos artifact to steal.
But on the other, do we want to chance things? Risk the lives of everyone in the expedition? Borek seems resigned; he seems content to leave us without explaining a damn thing. If this was an illusion, he could have told us. If this were anything else but appeared to be, he would have revealed it. But it was such a strong shame that Borek... left. He could've told anyone. Instead, he left a vague message, told us to turn back, and went back to join his people.
So, I say we just turn around. Leave. Borek's home. He's clearly left leadership in our hands, too. It'd leave a bad taste, but we still have people waiting for us at K8P and a chaos artifact to steal.
I can see two real possibilities here. I think Boreks words and actions to us hold the key. What we know is that borek knew this was a possibility, and didnt like it but still accepted it. Furthermore he said that they had tried as hard as they could, and told us to go home. They are obviously hostile to the local chaos tribes, and werent corrupted to the point where anyone could tell the difference with Borek.
1. The dawi here went into really dark shit to survive, and managed to chain/somehow ally with the shadowgave to fight chaos as the last option despite hating it. Kinda like parts of this thread using dhar at times, and probably with most of the same rationalizations. If this is the case, there is nothing else we can do. We cant rescue them because they dont want to be rescued, and everyone else will refuse to accept them anyway. If we kill the shadowgave it respawns somewhere else without its bindings, leaving chaos open to consolidate its power.
2. Borek was replaced by a greater demon of Tzeentch and what we see is designed to trick us in some way. If this is true it still doesnt explain quite a bit, and going forward would have both the shadowgave AND a greater demon of tzeentch on our asses. Should Morghur also be an illusion we might be able to win that, but any amount of inspection should be able to see through it. If it doesnt, either it's real or the demon is a massively strong on a scale far eclipsing us. In both options, rushing in is suicide.
I cant think of any other feasible options that could be going on. Continuting is suicide.
1. The dawi here went into really dark shit to survive, and managed to chain/somehow ally with the shadowgave to fight chaos as the last option despite hating it. Kinda like parts of this thread using dhar at times, and probably with most of the same rationalizations. If this is the case, there is nothing else we can do. We cant rescue them because they dont want to be rescued, and everyone else will refuse to accept them anyway. If we kill the shadowgave it respawns somewhere else without its bindings, leaving chaos open to consolidate its power.
2. Borek was replaced by a greater demon of Tzeentch and what we see is designed to trick us in some way. If this is true it still doesnt explain quite a bit, and going forward would have both the shadowgave AND a greater demon of tzeentch on our asses. Should Morghur also be an illusion we might be able to win that, but any amount of inspection should be able to see through it. If it doesnt, either it's real or the demon is a massively strong on a scale far eclipsing us. In both options, rushing in is suicide.
I cant think of any other feasible options that could be going on. Continuting is suicide.
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
Well considering that we were just talking about using duar as a desperation tactic to fight against Morghur can we really blame them for using shady means to fight off far worse?
Edit: ninja
Edit: ninja
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- Location
- Germany
Damm, so whatever that is we see, actually makes the Winds stir.
Seems like it's real enough.
Seems like it's real enough.
No way. There is no possible way that Morghur has been bound/built by a bunch of crazy Dawi. He would never get the kind of respect by Beastfolk that he gets in canon if he was.
Aside from the near impossibility of making such an alliance, how would they get into contact. I doubt that there is a Beast-Path within a hundred miles of here. If they did choose to make such a devilish deal, I imagine that they would strike a bargain with one of the Chaos Gods directly. Besides Morghur makes a horrible guard dog seeing as he keeps going after Athel Loren.
pucflek
Verified simpleton
- Location
- Czech Republic
Its most certainly not an illusion. The reality is shrieking away from Morghur. Morghur is real.
Not if you enslave him, and drag Athel Loren there. Honestly? Another, this time OOC theory. The way Morghur goes after Athel Loren actually possibly/impossibly could make him maleable to a deal. We know Beastmen are smart enough to sometimes use order to get things done, and if there is one thing Morghur could drag himself into sanity for, its an unasaillable access to Athel Loren. The Dwarfs dragged Athel Loren into Chaos wastes, thus giving him uninterrupted access. In turn, he slaughters their enemies.
Tbh no. thats weird bullshit scratch that.
But Borek was not surprised so yeah, i think he just knows they decided to start enslaving beastmen. RuneMASTERS and all.
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