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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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Asheram said:
Alright, if the printing press is a real, legitimate thing, at this point in Warhammer History, then we need one here. I don't care if we're paying it out of our own pocket, we need a printing press.


Thank you, I'll remember to blame that one in whatever I do.
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Back when we wrote the biography of the dragon prince we rented printing press time for our publishing run.
 
Glau said:
I mean, we kinda spend more effort than we should really need to in order to AVOID accumulating more large chunks of wealth, so unless we've got a thing we can spend it into immediately, I have no idea why we would.
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We've got our library. It'd cost thousands - maybe tens of thousands - more than we have to get all the books we want once we get full access to Bretonnia and Marienburg and after we learn Tilean.

Asheram said:
Alright, if the printing press is a real, legitimate thing at this point in Warhammer History, then we need one here. I don't care if we're paying it out of our own pocket, we need a printing press.
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It's a thing both in canon and in Divided Loyalties. BoneyM said that books would cost 5 times as much without it.
 
Jyn Ryvia said:
petty sure that would fall into the library.
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Why would building a printing press and printing books for sale on the cheap be part of a library boon?
Asheram said:
... we don't even need a Boon for that. I'm certain we could wrangle some engineers and ask them to build a printing press for our leisure. (Copying books by scribe makes me antsy just by thinking about it.)
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Free runs of a couple hundred books each run, in perpetuity, seems like Boon material.

Like the Asarnil Memoirs, but whenever we want to spend a couple actions to write them.

Whenever we're not using it, the Karak can get use out of it.
 
Guile said:
Boon request: Build a printing press for K8P and allow us to do limited print runs of books we value whenever we want.

Mathilde versions of Sherlock Holmes penny dreadfuls and The Kazador Diaries, here we come
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I bet we could get Edda to help as well, she has the mechanical affinity trait for labor saving machines so I would bet she would support bringing in a printing press even if we do not make the library boon.
 
Guile said:
Free runs of a couple hundred books each run, in perpetuity, seems like Boon material.

Like the Asarnil Memoirs, but whenever we want to spend a couple actions to write them.
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Fair, but we could simply own the printing press and make any excess money be invested back into printing more books. I'm certain the dwarves would keep meticulous care of the accounts, and we'd... hm. A Dwarven Bank, now that'd be something... anyhow, I'm certain the Bursar wouldn't mind if we spent any excess on books, especially if we sent free copies to the Library back in Altdorf.
 
Guile said:
Boon request: Build a printing press for K8P and allow us to do limited print runs of books we value whenever we want.

Mathilde versions of Sherlock Holmes penny dreadfuls and The Kazador Diaries, here we come
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That seems more like a 5 dwarf favor type ask? Like, transcendent boons would been the entire Karak to our purposes and this is like three dwarves for a few months a year.
 
Guile said:
Why would building a printing press and printing books for sale on the cheap be part of a library boon?

Free runs of a couple hundred books each run, in perpetuity, seems like Boon material.

Like the Asarnil Memoirs, but whenever we want to spend a couple actions to write them.

Whenever we're not using it, the Karak can get use out of it.
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copying and recopying was part of the job for Libraries for most of history IRL, bibles were the biggest incomes after patrons.
 
Awetduck said:
It's a damn tragedy. Like we got dudes who's whole job is carving grudges onto grudgestones for grudge throwers and we couldn't have put the scrimshaw artist on that job? That kinda detail work he could have been grinding gears for gyrocopters or pouring runes. What a waste.
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I'm certain Belegar would be more than happy to slowly shift the Dawi culture of martyrdom, but it's something we need to be slow and very careful about.
 
BoneyM said:
Full disclosure: on top of travelling for the holidays (which overall is a good thing, but I don't travel well) I'm also dealing with having to find a new place to live. So update schedule might end up slipping a bit, and a bit more testiness might slip through my usual 'backspace it and reword it nicely' protocols in the coming days/weeks/months.



'Discourage' was a bit of a strong word. The thread's been good about remembering the limitations of stacking magical items.



1-2 with, 2-4 without, for distant languages that were still built for human mouths. 2-3/3-5 for non-human languages that still share a lineage with human-speakable languages. Anything more alien than that will be a case-by-case basis.



Marienburg and the Empire have a tricky relationship. The Empire would still very much like to get Marienburg paying Imperial taxes once more, and failing that trade going through Imperial companies rather than Marienburg ones would be in the Empire's best interests.



While it may not be what the thread decides to do if it does come to that, willing Mathilde's shares to the Grey College would be a pretty reliable way to put one hell of a leash on them in a post-Mathilde world.



A 'as and when the Karak can reasonably afford it' rider would be possible to tack on to just about any repayment method.



This is possible, but the trade companies and families you'd be enriching are the very same ones the Grey Order have to fairly routinely terrify back into the straight and narrow because they get too big for their boots.



As Belegar has been bringing attention to, this is the other side of the coin to Grudges, and Dwarf psychology is not at home to rationality in these matters.



He might try. That's why you should keep that in mind before you ask.



Outside of Boon-spending, this is something heavily dependent on circumstance. If the EIC can find enough demand to match supply, they're in a position to step into that role of middle-man naturally. If they can't, then by default the excess would go to Barak Varr and then on to the rest of the Old World via the pre-existing trade links.



Yes.



Considering that a dragon skeleton is hugely more of a power boost to Vampires and other Necromancers than it would be to regular wizards, that they aren't all riding around on dragons that suggests that there'd be more difficulties than logistical in making this happen.



Extinct. Most of them chose to remain behind and seal away tombs, vaults and treasuries. The very few survivors were reabsorbed back into the Karaz-a-Karak Thungnisson Clan.



No.



None.



Yes. They got Minor or Moderate boons.



That's a level of bookkeeping I'm not keeping track of.



Try it and find out.

(how much the concept of consensus reality applies to the Warhammer world, if it does at all, is a matter of both IC and OOC debate, so there's no real way to map out cause-and-effect in advance)



Not on its own. If the Under-Empire shatters or dissolves as a result to the extent that none of the resultant fragments can be considered a continuation or an inheritor of the Under-Empire, then it could be possible.



No.
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I mean take as much time as you need its the holidays and your one of the fastest producers of content on this website. Most quest update once a week. You do like more then one a day. I don't think anyone has the right to complain about you taking a break especially when its the holidays.
 
Slayer Replacement: Trial of Smednir. Cut their beards into a single braid, determine a lost artifact of dwarf-kind to be recovered or repaired or single out a treasure wielded by the Enemies of Dwarves to be destroyed. The the weapon placed on the shrine of Smednir they are forgiven their trespass.

Mathilde notes: find a way to game the system to make this more like wizard jouneymaning and less like exile.

Warhammer Fantasy RPG 1st ED -- Stone and Steel p.75
 
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Asheram said:
I'm certain Belegar would be more than happy to slowly shift the Dawi culture of martyrdom, but it's something we need to be slow and very careful about.
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and probably not live to see the first steps taken root. if belegar has a way to change things, we should stay out of it.

Like, this talk about changing an entire culture is arrogant and as an irish man i'm being uncomfortably remembered of all the Education acts of 1695-1830.

They were about 'fixing' a culture too. (really, its important to realize that the British thought they were going a good thing.)

outsiders do not change cultures by actively trying, at least not in a way that the people will thank you. the only way culture changed the 'right way' or adopted is over time and in interaction (overtime)

forcing 'your way' is arrogant.
 
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Jyn Ryvia said:
and probably not live to see the first steps taken root.

Like, this talk about changing an entire culture is arrogant and as an irish man i'm being uncomfortably remembered of all the Education acts of 1695-1830.

They were about 'fixing' a culture too. (really, its important to realize that the British thought they were going a good thing.)

outsiders do not change cultures by actively trying, at least not in a way that the people will thank you. the only way culture changed the 'right way' or adopted is over time and in interaction (overtime)

forcing 'your way' is arrogant.
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...No.
I will not accept your statement that attempting to help a culture out from a tradition of ritualistic suicide is arrogant.
 
Jyn Ryvia said:
and probably not live to see the first steps taken root. if belegar has a way to change things, we should stay out of it.

Like, this talk about changing an entire culture is arrogant and as an irish man i'm being uncomfortably remembered of all the Education acts of 1695-1830.

They were about 'fixing' a culture too. (really, its important to realize that the British thought they were going a good thing.)

outsiders do not change cultures by actively trying, at least not in a way that the people will thank you. the only way culture changed the 'right way' or adopted is over time and in interaction (overtime)

forcing 'your way' is arrogant.
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Oh wow, that's a little too real. I mean I'm sure we all have similar stories about the problems with colonization and imperialism.
Asheram said:
...No.
I will not accept your statement that attempting to help a culture out from a tradition of ritualistic suicide is arrogant.
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Let's table this whole piece right now as a little too real for this thread ok? Just till like...after the holidays once Boney has a house again and can put up with our personal histories real flavoring the narrative.
 
Asheram said:
I'm certain Belegar would be more than happy to slowly shift the Dawi culture of martyrdom, but it's something we need to be slow and very careful about.
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I feel like what the story has said about Slayer oaths isn't quite compatible with the thread's desire to shift dwarf culture away from Slayer oaths.

The basic problem as I see it is that while some dwarfs may take Slayer oaths out of a sense of social obligation, for many of them it's an alternative to outright committing suicide. If Slayer oaths didn't exist they might kill themselves instead. So it's all very well to say "oh, they could do this socially acceptable ritual instead" but if that ritual still leaves them with a desire to kill themselves then it hasn't really fixed anything.

Nobody in Warhammer is doing these kinds of epidemiological studies, but it would be fascinating to see a comparison between the percentage of dwarves taking Slayer oaths and the suicide rate among human beings.
 
Jyn Ryvia said:
copying and recopying was part of the job for Libraries for most of history IRL, bibles were the biggest incomes after patrons.
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That is a pretty good point. An absolutely, staggeringly huge library sounds like an incredible loss of money on the face of it, even if it's not a waste, but it does have ways of recouping those costs. Copying and selling books, and charging reasonable admission fees, are both pretty reliable ways of providing for the librarians who we'd need to take care of the collection, as well as stopping damages from disasters, thieves, and wandering itinerants who just like causing trouble (if they have to pay to get into the library, they'd be far less likely to destroy anything on a drunken whim, presumably).

Plus, we know that book sales are a good way to make lots of money (few spend as profligately as Mathilde individually, but I imagine she doesn't make up the majority of book purchases in any given year).
 
Awetduck said:
Oh wow, that's a little too real. I mean I'm sure we all have similar stories about the problems with colonization and imperialism.
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I admit that I've had to do research into the history of Irish hedge schools for an article this week (to be clear, not a journalist, my company pays for the data banks anyways so we get asked to look up and pass on stuff a lot) so the timing of this topic is hitting a nerve right now.

I will leave it
 
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Awetduck said:
Go jack that one kid that took the slayers oath. Best Carver in k8p
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"Beardling, you go to your death against an immortal foe that can never be defeated. Your sacrifice will build a brighter future for all. Now get your ass to work carving naughty illustrations for sleazy romance novels that our writers can churn out while being kept from their duty by the dread beast Writer's Block."
 
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