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I'm actually pretty satisfied with it right now as it currently stands since it covers the K8P and Empire topics I can think of off the top of my head. I'd personally just leave off the academic stuff, purchase a package or two more of Bretonnian and Tilean romance books for entertainment, memes and learning those languages and I'd be quite satisfied with that.

That's just my take on it.
Bonuses from books from different cultures stack on the same topic, so we are actively encouraged to expand the library. Plus, there is the bragging rights of having one of the most comprehensive libraries available. We can also later send a copy of our library to the college for some rep boost because they quite likely don't have as comprehensive a set-up as we might.
Not worth the time compared to everything else we could be doing
This can also be a social action where we learn from people we know (There is that Tilean undumgi leader) and we get separate bonuses per topic per culture so every argument about getting books also applies here.
 
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Looking at how the We has described themself, I kind of wonder what leads to there being other-We. They have no leadership caste, so theoretically any group of this-We that included enough breeders to sustain their numbers could break off to become an other-We, but what causes that? Does a We split once it reaches a certain size? Will they purposefully send out groups of this-We if food is overly scarce instead of allowing themself to shrink in population? Do they bud off other-We when the Echoes the We relays to itself aren't internally consistent, and the number of this-We relaying each Echo is even enough that the dissenting this-We can't just be eaten?

Personally, I'm hoping for the last option, because a species that reproduces by getting into arguments with themselves sounds amazing.
 
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Proportions don't matter. Objectively, it's more money than many people get to see in their entire lives. It doesn't become reasonable just because we've got a lot of it.

We can have quirks and character traits without throwing literally triple digits of cash at them on a whim.

Ok, so who is that silver flowing to? We had a pretty successful book run and got back, what, a few hundred crowns from sales in the empire? On the investment of time of author, subject, and prepayment for ~25 inkmakers, papermakers, printers, binders, distribution agents, and transporters? So that's really not a high wage for anyone involved. (I think the elven sales should be discounted because other popular books wouldn't have the hook to pull in that audience.)

So I view large amounts of money here as supporting artists in the empire. And would actually direct our personal purchases in ways best suited to do that. Mathilde has to have favorite authors, she'd care at least a little about making sure her buying their book meant they got paid for it. (Pay your artists people! 😁 )

It is my belief that Johann is a liability. He is too focused on his personal research to be trusted to act in the best interest of K8P and his character traits seem to put his goals and research above healthy relationships.

Agreed this is a high probability case, but I want to give him one more honest shot. I was thinking about his scenes and the thing that set me on edge with him, I realized, was how much he was treating us as a peer when i expected to hold a position of mutually acknowledged superiority.

So now that we both have a mutual understanding of what is going on now, I want to give him an honest chance to work with us rather than at cross purposes. But that also means we really need to see him onscreen for a semi-extended period of time, so we can hear the character's voice again and get context.

If there isn't a working understanding between us that we can rely on (if not fully trust), then I will vote with you to cut him lose and either pick up Pan on the payroll (as her work with halflings moves down to part-time) or get a new wizard sent out. Ideally a grey who can integrate analysis and run two spynets for us- EIC, Karag Nar, and link into larger grey. Cover two organizations and ideally also get research support or manage any non-payrole wizard visitors, keeping them happy and safe and keeping us informed of their activities.
 
Bonuses from books from different cultures stack on the same topic, so we are actively encouraged to expand the library. Plus, there is the bragging rights of having one of the most comprehensive libraries available. We can also later send a copy of our library to the college for some rep boost because they quite likely don't have as comprehensive a set-up as we might.
Yeah I knew about that when I posted, I'm just not all that fond on spending our money on it past a certain point of +'s reached which we've gotten pretty close to now in my opinion.

Later I'll be keen on it but, not right now.
 
If there isn't a working understanding between us that we can rely on (if not fully trust), then I will vote with you to cut him lose and either pick up Pan on the payroll (as her work with halflings moves down to part-time) or get a new wizard sent out. Ideally a grey who can integrate analysis and run two spynets for us- EIC, Karag Nar, and link into larger grey. Cover two organizations and ideally also get research support or manage any non-payrole wizard visitors, keeping them happy and safe and keeping us informed of their activities.

So basically, we want the Grey Journeyman equivalent of Julia of if Johann doesn't work out? Colored me sold in this scenario, if we can somehow acquire a competent Grey Journeywoman or man we can mentor, work with and who can assist us to manage the information gathering activities in Karak Eight Peaks and it's surrounding regions we plan on establishing to get badly needed eyes and ears down there for the Grey College. The more I think about it, one of the things we are badly missing here is another Julia, in our new role in Karak Eight Peaks.


Fair enough. What are people's thoughts on getting books on at least swordsmanship then this turn? We have the 25-favor greatsword coming up and people have been wanting to get our trait this before then. Grabbing a few books on it is probably helpful. We can get imperial, bretonnian and theoretically dwarven.


I'm all for it, and maybe we might even want to ask Gunnar for leads on texts and manuals on Dwarven Swordsmanship, if they do exist.
 
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Fair enough. What are people's thoughts on getting books on at least swordsmanship then this turn? We have the 25-favor greatsword coming up and people have been wanting to get our advanced greatsword trait before then. Grabbing a few books on it is probably helpful. We can get imperial, bretonnian and theoretically dwarven sources.

EDIT: We should also consider what else we might need for next turn. Since we are now expected to buy books before we know what we need next turn, it's useful to try and figure out what we might want to do. I think it was mentioned that the mushrooms were a problem? We might be asked to look into that.
 
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Fair enough. What are people's thoughts on getting books on at least swordsmanship then this turn? We have the 25-favor greatsword coming up and people have been wanting to get our advanced greatsword trait before then. Grabbing a few books on it is probably helpful. We can get imperial, bretonnian and theoretically dwarven sources.
Maybe? I'd go for dwarven since we're gonna be working with Gunnars if I get my druthers, and as someone raised a very interesting point the Dwarves are the ones who'd probably come up with a fighting style for short people wielding magically sharp weapons.

Imperial roots are good but I'm not interested in Bretonnian because we have no teacher really and more importantly have only fought on horseback once, during the East Gate and its not something I see us doing much of.
 
One of the problems with Johann is that he is a gold wizard trying to play a grey wizards game. And he is doing a fairly well job at it. That should raise some red flags.

In fact he has has so many red flags everytime I see him speak can imagine red flags pouring from his mouth.
If you're trying to convince people of the veracity of your claims, it's probably best to not go to the depths of uncharitable interpretation and utter prejudiced exaggerations.

Look at what you are saying, for goodness sake. You are being so utterly biased at Johann that the point you brought as opener to convince others is him being a Gold Magister that is good at something not their regular trade... when we're playing as a triple-classing Knight-Mage-Assassin Hero Unit attempting to quadruple-class into a Priestess/Sorceress and possibly quintupling to Trade Mogul Prestige Class.

So what's your point here, "No NPCs should be capable of doing the things Mathilde does better than her?" Couch it up in all the ways you want to, but when you start calling Johann 'gold snake', you're doing nobody favours in attempting to sell to people that your concerns are in any way rational.
 
Maybe? I'd go for dwarven since we're gonna be working with Gunnars if I get my druthers, and as someone raised a very interesting point the Dwarves are the ones who'd probably come up with a fighting style for short people wielding magically sharp weapons.

Imperial roots are good but I'm not interested in Bretonnian because we have no teacher really and more importantly have only fought on horseback once, during the East Gate and its not something I see us doing much of.
We do have that female Knight among the unumgi. People mentioned wanting to interact with her again. I do think understanding how to use a greatsword from horse-back is probably important because our shadow horse gives us a huge advantage in an open battle and horse-riding is a core character trait of Mathilde. Potentially even more so than greatswording.
 
I don't know if it's been mentioned in the thread, but how would everyone feel about getting books from Araby regarding their Djinn? They're elemental spirits that are used by Araby's Magicians to cast stronger magics and one magical weapon was created by dunking the product into the blood of a Djinn. (Admittedly that weapon was made by Chaos, but it's just proof of concept.)
 
It might be "true to the setting" but it's also completely wince-inducing from a modern perspective. Like if any real world researcher thought like that, I'd hope they'd get drummed out of any institution they were a part of. In shame.
Its actually a very new attitude from a historical perspective. Free flow of information that is. One of WW2's stranger effects on America was that so very many people got taken out of the workforce and so many random women got tossed into it that it broke the equivalent of the Guild system. A lot like the Black Death broke the social order by sheer attrition, old power structures just imploded. When the people got back they started this thing called the 'Do It Yourself' movement. DIY meant knowledge of hoarded skills where suddenly up for grabs do those who could pay. People randomly gained skills in things that weren't their actual profession and the market for materials to do DIY stuff got to the point is was standardized instead of mass produced.

This may seem like a minor thing, but if you've ever dealt with houses from before that time period you know the truth, everything is of nonstandard size and angles are weird. Nothing is straight. Groups made their own custom parts on seemingly random scales so you had to hire the same people over and over again or risk redoing things till you ended up on a different random scale of parts. Finding windows that fit the old window frame is a convoluted, luck based missions that involves silly prices or reworking the thing.

Companies are still trying to get back to those 'good old days'. You can tell by the way they've invented dozens of different screw heads. Philip's[+] and flathead[-] used to be a matter of size and many screwdrivers could handle most of those types. Now we have dozens of incompatible square head sizes, equally random triangle head, and random prong number star bits for little reason beyond greed and the bits for the changable drivers are often soft enough to break after half a box and good luck finding replacement bits after a few months.

Lets non spend too much time going over how once they got those color mix codes on paint they started randomly switching around the names of paints at the same store every few months/years. Same name on different colors, because... pretty much just because the can confuse you int buying the wrong paint under the same name.
Holding the snakeblood as our personal shiny for research seems both suboptimal and greedy. We're damn good at this magic stuff, sure, but we're not Gold-Wizard good at research and it's not like shared credit actually hurts us much mechanically. This is especially true if it ends up being something that requires a lot of actions sunk into it to actually make something worthwhile from.
There is the simple matter that you don't reward bad behavior. He wants to play mind games with people. Letting him play with what may be a unique substance is a reward for his past behavior.

There is also the matter of it being a good idea to do the preliminary research yourself before bringing in outside help for a second opinion. Letting him in on the ground floor means admitting to him you need the help to do anything about this because you can't do it yourself. That is the reason Mathilde failed to just hand the 'box of snek' off to the college originally.
Gold is the color of logic. I believe he is acting logically. We already know one of his goals, the study of skaven tech, but what goal would have him hiding his true strength and distancing himself from his fellow wizards?
Nasty truth about logic is logic is not infallible, only internally consistent. Also it can be completely flawed and based on bad information. People hear the world 'logic' instant think its made of smart.

Logic is like statistics in that it says whatever the hell you want it to. You can give a hundred students the same statistics (exact same statistics) and get dozens of radically different, mutually exclusive results. All logically rational results.

Also, let us never forget that 'Insane troll logic' is in fact a recognized type of logic... if one not respected and commonly derided. He must have a reason or twelve for why he wasn't sharing said logic... which he doesn't apparently feel like sharing with MC. Even in private. There is little to no reason to let him into MC's confidence without him letting her into his. He didn't even make smug, self important attempt to weasel his way in.

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I am in agreement with you that without knowing his logic, its very hard to actually evaluate his logic.
Again, triple digits of cash would get Mathilde "one bookshelf" of books.
Sigh... this is why you charge admission to the public section of the library in books. They want different tiers of access they need to show up with 'donation books'. a little grey mage rumor control and people buy those books for you. Some plan to act all grey wizardy and get people to gather your shinies for you would be nice.
 
(I wonder if Warhammer has double-entry bookkeeping? It became popular among European mercantile/banking interests in the fifteenth and sixteenth centuries, which is about the analogous time for Warhammer's tech/cultural level afaict.)
I never did understand why double-entry bookkeeping was such a huge innovation back in the day.
It's amazing how much better than Belegar our stats are. He has two stats that are better than us, each only by two. We have three stats that are better than his, with our stat total being 28 points higher than him. Then you get into our magic, which adds a ton of power to our character as well.
He is only like 70 or 90 years old, right? Man's got some growing to do before he can get on our level
Gorgeous might be overstating things. I don't think we've ever been mentioned as much of a looker.
I believe Boney once said 'Gorgeous for a peasant; no pock marks at all.'
 
I never did understand why double-entry bookkeeping was such a huge innovation back in the day.
Anti-corruption mostly. Someone can change one of the books (public book) and the other is their to conflict with it. Also works with anti-error work and anti-damage. Points of failure increase basically. Makes it a hell of a lot easier to figure out what the hell went wrong... and where. It might not seem that important, but paper trails make everything run more smoothly... more so when the major relative issues with lower levels of medical tech and safety tech made spontaneous accountant existence failure such a common thing.

Its like much of the increase in life span is do to less infant mortality. Its very telling that babies weren't too be named until two years of age in African societies.
 
Well... I'm afrad this will flag the Once and Future Git to come beat us up and steal it.
The prophesied champion of the greenskins that Wurrzag is looking for.
The prophesied leader of Orks who head butted Archaon so hard his third eye broke.

The dude is such a beast that even the Brown Wind decided to bind with him.

I'll never skip an opportunity to post this.

Gorgeous might be overstating things. I don't think we've ever been mentioned as much of a looker.

I kind of imagine that thousands of years from now, when someone inevitably creates a dramatic reenactment of the Karak Eight Peaks Reclamation Wars (in the style of our own world's historically inaccurate but totally badass renditions of the Battle of Thermopylae et al), they'll portray Mathilde as a six foot tall statuesque supermodel wearing maybe half the fabric of an actual magister's robes, King Belegar as the musclebound badass from Dragon's Crown, and Kragg as just Kragg but his Anvil is a mecha.

And then some mad genius from Nippon goes ahead and creates Fated Grandiose/Ordering which portrays King Belegar and Kragg as anime girls, kicking off the War of the Grudge Against Anime or something
 
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It kinda makes me wonder if Belegar Quest has noticed that we sometimes show up with bloody rents in our clothing and no wounds underneath, like after we took a bolt in the shoulder under Karag Lhune.

Perhaps Belegar is a gentledwarf and tries not to look too closely at a manling so lacking in even chainmail that she's basically naked all the time.
I'm just glad we don't have to experience the literal waifu wars.

"Give me one good reason we don't marry Princess Grimbrow right now!"
Thank goodness we're the Mayor of Forever Alone Village, and don't have that problem!

Princess Edda, Princess Kazarina, Mathilde, the halfling priestess... to say nothing of spunky firebrands like Sky-Thane Gotri! Belegar is rolling in waifu material! He may well be the most elegible bachelor in Karak Azkor.
 
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I'm disappointed, too, that last turn cut out all of her purchases of romance novels. I guess because they don't provide mechanical benefits either. It's just one of the points of her characterisation since basically the start of the thread that she enjoys them, nothing important.

Please do not mischaracterize the discussion on the romance novels, plenty of people were fine with a huge romance book colection, what we were not fine with was spending two years of Sirland's inteligence budget on romance books, some of which Mathilde could not even read.
 
And then some mad genius from Nippon goes ahead and creates Fated Grandiose/Ordering which portrays King Belegar and Kragg as anime girls, kicking off the War of the Grudge Against Anime or something

Which FGO Assassin will Mathilde be most similar to then, in folk memory? I guess in this case, Mathilde would be the rare dual class Caster/Assassin like Semiramis.
 
Another big problem I have with him is that as a Magister he refused to work with a fellow gold journeyman in an active warzone. Maybe he was afraid of getting caught. Maybe he didn't want to show his hand and reveal he knew far more than he should. But the fact he was unwilling to put his fellow gold wizard above his "mission" tells me a lot about his character.
My problem with Johann is that we know literally nothing about him. The only thing we know about his relationship with Max is when Max said grimly, 'He knows what he did.'

That tells us literally nothing. We learned inverse facts, since now we're more curious than ever.

Hopefully actually having him around rather than getting shipped off to Altdorf for 6 months will help with that.
I would like to say that in the next Library vote I will be happy to support one purchase of Romance novels, not "expansive", not in a bunch of her non-native languages. Keep it at that, don't go overboard, and we have the votes.

Anyone else agree?
Nah. Maybe I want to read something Obscure, maybe I want to read something Esoteric, okay? Maybe I want the epic love story between a dwarf and his crossbow. Maybe I want Nagash fanfiction.
Spending hundreds of crowns on completely unnecessary luxuries in one go is a good way to show the college we can't be trusted with large sums of money. I will certainly support a modest purchase the next turn, and a policy of slowly growing our collection if it's ever mentioned that we've read through them all. Otherwise, let's try to keep in the same postal code of our vow of poverty.
Therefore, we should continue to sit on our 8000-some gold crowns? You know, keeping to our vow of poverty, and all.
 
Which FGO Assassin will Mathilde be most similar to then, in folk memory? I guess in this case, Mathilde would be the rare dual class Caster/Assassin like Semiramis.
Yeah but you forget that we will soon have a legendary sword and that we are already a knight with a sword as part of our heraldry, so we will be a Saber/Caster/Assassin which is pretty neat.
 
Which FGO Assassin will Mathilde be most similar to then, in folk memory? I guess in this case, Mathilde would be the rare dual class Caster/Assassin like Semiramis.
Yeah but you forget that we will soon have a legendary sword and that we are already a knight with a sword as part of our heraldry, so we will be a Saber/Caster/Assassin which is pretty neat.

Wonderful, so Mathilde becomes this universe's Saber-face.
 
Kragg as an anime girl

hey witch hunters, i know you gotta burn the thread down now and salt the ashes. don't worry, i wasn't feeling attached to life anyway.

Yeah but you forget that we will soon have a legendary sword and that we are already a knight with a sword as part of our heraldry, so we will be a Saber/Caster/Assassin which is pretty neat.

brb, writing up a Mathilde servant sheet
 
We do have that female Knight among the unumgi. People mentioned wanting to interact with her again. I do think understanding how to use a greatsword from horse-back is probably important because our shadow horse gives us a huge advantage in an open battle and horse-riding is a core character trait of Mathilde. Potentially even more so than greatswording.
We can always learn that after we train with Gunnar.
 
Maybe I want Nagash fanfiction.

This... may be more common than you imagine. After all Nagash is a significant part of Sigmar's story. His crown of sorcery almost corrupted the First Emperor and defeating Nagash's army of the undead was one of the Man-God's great feats. So though Nagash's true origins and nature may be the realm of wizards and academics anyone who has ever read a holy book of Sigmnar knows of him. When one considers that Sigmarite holy texts are the first thing many people read as it is the most common book I would imagine many an aspiring writer took inspiration from them. Most would probably stick to Sigmar and his vassals, but I can imagine a daring romance writer inventing a tragic backstory for Nagash.
 
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