chocolote12
A Penguin Flailing Against The Keyboard Of Life.
Yeah, that's not very sporting of you.
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
Please stop, 'I hope we fail to prove a point' is the sort of attitude that can make questing very unpleasant for everyone.
- Location
- Singapore
They will know as soon as the Spiders start hunting. The uncomfortable unknown is whether they'd break out their anti-Spider MO within those six months, and it so happens Mathilde is very effective at screwing over that MO.
Six months of raiding. In Six months, Mathilde with Johann's help could do alot of damage to Mors capability to divert heavy weapons at the Spiders. This is not 2 weeks, this is 6 months, or at worse 3. The expedition was about that long. I don't expect that we'd get them all, only that Mors ability to divet weapons from the front against the Spiders will be significantly curtailed if Mathilde had a few months at that problem.
They have to get past Dwarven Lines, who are doubtlessly prepared for Skaven incursions, since the actual nest is behind Dwarven Lines. The hunting grounds are beyond, and I don't think we'd get that proverbial caravan of vulnerable spiders in those hunting ground. Getting caught is always a risk in any scouting mission. But it's a moot point, since the spiders are going to start hunting Clan Mors rats anyway. Clan Mors already knows the Dwarves took the Upper Citadel, in all probability. And if Johann is going to gallivinate around in his own time in Skaven territory, and getting caught is a risk for him... well the risk of getting caught is inevitable anyway no matter which plan wins.
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Guile
Having a really great time right now
Speaking of! Forget that lesser liar. Accept only the genuine article, the God of Lies who has had our back from the beginning.
Do we need to go poke skaven? No!
Do we need to poke snake daemons? No!
We need to get to venerating our god on the site of his theological victory (where he, once again, saved our sweet incarnate butt).
I don't want another 6 months to go by with Ranald sadly shrineless. The longer we wait, the more alternatives (theological and tavern-wise) appear to distract the Undumgi.
We already spent one action laying claim to the site, we only need one more to get the ball rolling.
- Location
- Germany
What do I want?
The Spiders should be taught semaphore. We told Belegar they would be allies against the Skaven. For this they should be able to coordinate with the Dwarves.
I want to have a shrine to Ranald to spread his religion and the time to build one is now, before a major influx of settlers.
Unfortunately, neither of the leading plans have both.
[X] Plan Magical Mathilde
[X] Plan Publishing Power
[X] Plan Mors, Gunnars and Ranald
[X] Plan Talk to me Baby (Spider)
Several plans contain the line '-[] Help the We establish their new nest below the Citadel. [ACTION 1][COIN]', while actually putting the bonus from Ranald's Coin on another action. Could people maybe edit their plans? It's kinda confusing.
The Spiders should be taught semaphore. We told Belegar they would be allies against the Skaven. For this they should be able to coordinate with the Dwarves.
I want to have a shrine to Ranald to spread his religion and the time to build one is now, before a major influx of settlers.
Unfortunately, neither of the leading plans have both.
[X] Plan Magical Mathilde
[X] Plan Publishing Power
[X] Plan Mors, Gunnars and Ranald
[X] Plan Talk to me Baby (Spider)
Several plans contain the line '-[] Help the We establish their new nest below the Citadel. [ACTION 1][COIN]', while actually putting the bonus from Ranald's Coin on another action. Could people maybe edit their plans? It's kinda confusing.
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The way I see the 'allow Johann to spend time doing something' options is that it's a passive aggressive way of Mathilde ordering Johann about while pretending that she's not. It fits their previous interactions pretty neatly.
The spiders being unable to hunt enough to eat is certainly a threat to the relocation plans.
We know that the spiders have an absolute prerequisite for accepting an alliance, and that's its name in their language. They call alliance 'many-food'. That means we know that for this to work there has to be a food surplus when they relocate. If Clan Mors can press them hard and kill enough of their hunters so they don't have a significant surplus we won't be in a 'many-food' situation, so the alliance will probably fall apart, and they'll scurry off into the Underways.
That's why this is important. This is why the big reason the relocation might fail, because of a successful response by Clan Mors. Having two Magisters who are aware of this running around behind their lines at the time they're trying to suppress the spiders' hunting is the best thing we can do to stop that happening.
Kornet
Quite possibly a sloth abomination
- Location
- Mother Russia
Plan Citadel Focus does include building a tavern-shrine, amongst other things.
SuperSonicSound
Shadowmancer of the Shadow Cabal
Citadel Focus has us making the Shrine to Ranald.
Johann is almost certainly going down there anyway, whatever we vote for, so having Mathilde and the Gambler's face of the Coin going with him should significantly mitigate that threat, so that's a reason to support the Citadel plan, not oppose it.
A quarter of the dwarves are fluent in Reikspeil, and another quarter can get by. All your troops don't have to share a language with your allies to fight alongside them. It will help, but it's not essential, so can be done later.
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Aegon Targaryen
Dragonking of Fuyuki
- Location
- Romania
At least Queek isn't born yet, the Headtaker was really dangerous
- Location
- Singapore
Plus, Semaphores can still be taught in a future turn - infact, let Johann do it, since he probably would run into Spider Hunting parties during his raid. Semaphores would probably be a very useful way to communicate out there, so I can see it being very easy to get Johann to agree to handle that project.
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NavySeel
"I don't know what I'm doing."
- Location
- Places
...Do you honestly think this will persuade people to agree with you?
Chimeraguard
We do deserve to exist.
[X] Plan Citadel Focus
- Location
- Germany
Some other comments:
I don't have a problem with assisting Johann in studying the Skaven. This may well be where Johann is most useful. However, if we want to help Johann do what he wants to do anyway, why did we hire him as an underling? Could we maybe relieve him of his duty and get someone else?
Some people seem to be afraid that if we teach the Spiders Reikspiel, then ... what? The Spiders sneakily subvert the humans and take over Karak Nar? I really don't understand what they are concerned about.
I don't have a problem with assisting Johann in studying the Skaven. This may well be where Johann is most useful. However, if we want to help Johann do what he wants to do anyway, why did we hire him as an underling? Could we maybe relieve him of his duty and get someone else?
Some people seem to be afraid that if we teach the Spiders Reikspiel, then ... what? The Spiders sneakily subvert the humans and take over Karak Nar? I really don't understand what they are concerned about.
Kornet
Quite possibly a sloth abomination
- Location
- Mother Russia
Do you have a quote on that? Because I think that the entirety of k8p dwarf forces speak Reikspiel (evidence: Belegar gave his pre-battle speech only in Reikspiel) while in the Karak Azul contingent there is precisely one dwarf speaking it (evidence: the scene at the Karak Azul gates).
This is just a nitpick, though.
SuperSonicSound
Shadowmancer of the Shadow Cabal
Plan Citadel Focus
[Max] Current Task: Have Maximilian teach the We written Reikspiel.
[Johann] Allow him to spend all his time investigating Clan Mors.
[EIC] Instil corporate policy: always be scrupulously honest when dealing with Dwarves.
[SOCIAL] Wolf is now fully grown, and is a very large dog or a regular-sized wolf. Train him. (increases his intelligence, may deepen Familiar bond)
[PENTHOUSE] Have a tower built atop Karag Nar: -100gc for 1 room, bonus to room's purpose.
[Free] Request the translation item yourself (does not cost an action; converts 3 College Favour to Dwarf Favour).
Help the We establish their new nest below the Citadel. [ACTION 1][COIN]
Spend time assisting with a fellow councillor's task: Gunnar, assist him with human burial rites.
You have acquired the possession of the Temple where Ranald mugged Mork. Set up a shrine and spread knowledge of it throughout Karag Nar.
Write in: You've mapped the territory of Clan Mors. Help Johann poke Clan Mors
The Gambler: Poke Clan Mors
For those that aren't sure what Citadel Focus actually does.
Shrine to Ranald
Belegar task related
Relocate spiders (Belegar task specific)
[Max] Current Task: Have Maximilian teach the We written Reikspiel. (Likely task the next turn)
Write in: You've mapped the territory of Clan Mors. Help Johann poke Clan Mors (Part of a multi pronged effort, grab goodies with Johan, learn more about him. Assist with the relocation of Spooders by stealing tech from the Skavens)
Spend time with Wolf boy and Gunnars.
BoneyM said it some where recently in the last 20 pages.
[Max] Current Task: Have Maximilian teach the We written Reikspiel.
[Johann] Allow him to spend all his time investigating Clan Mors.
[EIC] Instil corporate policy: always be scrupulously honest when dealing with Dwarves.
[SOCIAL] Wolf is now fully grown, and is a very large dog or a regular-sized wolf. Train him. (increases his intelligence, may deepen Familiar bond)
[PENTHOUSE] Have a tower built atop Karag Nar: -100gc for 1 room, bonus to room's purpose.
[Free] Request the translation item yourself (does not cost an action; converts 3 College Favour to Dwarf Favour).
Help the We establish their new nest below the Citadel. [ACTION 1][COIN]
Spend time assisting with a fellow councillor's task: Gunnar, assist him with human burial rites.
You have acquired the possession of the Temple where Ranald mugged Mork. Set up a shrine and spread knowledge of it throughout Karag Nar.
Write in: You've mapped the territory of Clan Mors. Help Johann poke Clan Mors
The Gambler: Poke Clan Mors
For those that aren't sure what Citadel Focus actually does.
Shrine to Ranald
Belegar task related
Relocate spiders (Belegar task specific)
[Max] Current Task: Have Maximilian teach the We written Reikspiel. (Likely task the next turn)
Write in: You've mapped the territory of Clan Mors. Help Johann poke Clan Mors (Part of a multi pronged effort, grab goodies with Johan, learn more about him. Assist with the relocation of Spooders by stealing tech from the Skavens)
Spend time with Wolf boy and Gunnars.
BoneyM said it some where recently in the last 20 pages.
Chimeraguard
We do deserve to exist.
As I understand it, it's just this turn we're having him do what he wants, because we believe that letting him do so benefits our Belegar-assigned objective.
Later turns we'll definitely be putting him to work on other stuff.
Kornet
Quite possibly a sloth abomination
- Location
- Mother Russia
I'm sure Boney will find another skaven hero or two to torment us with.
CuttleFish2.0
Friendly neighborhood cuttlefish
- Location
- Seattle, Washington.
I don't want to punish anyone, I want everyone to remember that we can fail, and that failing bad enough has very serious consequence for the characters. At the moment the two leading plans spread us about doing a dozen different things, some of which I judge to be very risky; it just so happens that one of those is in my opinion less risky than the other. Not that is' good, but that if we fail at a number of things in it it puts less on the table. But they each have way too many moving parts doing way too many different things.
Citadel has Two actions on Johann Skaven tech scouting, two actions on our job (half of one from Max, one from us, and let's call it half for the item). then it has an action on Wolf, an action on helping Gunnar, an action on the EIC, and an action on the shrine. That's splitting our attention five ways.
Sure, Preliminary is similarly split, but it doesn't poke the skaven which means there's significantly less chance of a reaction from them.
He already has a plan, based on the expectation that he will be alone; meaning it's likely a lot more cautious about how far he goes and what risks he takes. Adding a Grey Magister of extreme skill opens up a lot of options for him to take much bigger risks.
The concern is of the vague general kind, if the spiders can communicate with people other than us then they might conciveably ally with another faction to betray us. If however the dwarfs are the only faction they can communicate with than they are the only option for an alliance. To be honest it seems rather excessive caution to me.
- Location
- Singapore
Because our interest intersect here and now, so it's the best time to get a better grasp on what Johann can do, and who he is as a person. It doesn't preclude us assigning Johann to task such as teaching the Spiders Semaphores in the future, or if Karagil becomes an assigned target for the realm in the future for example, to look into the boundary zones between Orc and Skaven territory on that peak. Or even to write papers with us in the future.
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Chimeraguard
We do deserve to exist.
Here.
Presumably the slack is from all the Karak Azul expatriate Clans who have now resettled Eight Peaks.
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- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
This is actually the tally screwing it up. For example, Plan Citadel Focus, if you look at veekie's original post, doesn't include the [ACTION 1][COIN] thing. I am not sure where that is coming from or why.
Kornet
Quite possibly a sloth abomination
- Location
- Mother Russia
Huh.
This paints Belegar as even more of a radical than I thought. It is the moment he lived for his entire life, he is at the gates of his ancestral hold and the retaking of Karak Eight Peaks is about to begin, he gives his grand speech and what language does he use? Reikspiel. Not even two speeches, one in Khazalid and another in Reikspiel, it's just Reikspiel.
CuttleFish2.0
Friendly neighborhood cuttlefish
- Location
- Seattle, Washington.
No. Because others are not as worried about failure as I am, they expect success, maybe they'll get it. I don't want failure, but I don't see the thread remembering that we can unless it happens.