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To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest)

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To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest) Starfleet Ship Design Bureau, Refit ("To Boldly Go...")
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Given how important this will be for deciding plan votes, I'm curious what everyone's answers to the following questions are:
  • What do you think the odds of a Cardassian Crisis happening are?
  • If we do end up in a war with the Cardassians, when will it start?
It seems to me that a plan for going to war in the next two or three years would be rather different from a plan for going to war in twenty to thirty years. In the former case we probably want to take advantage of the 10 pp cost for 1m t berths at our new shipyard and buy a half dozen or more of them. While we don't have the resources to use the berths during peace time, we don't seem to have those same limits during a crisis. In the latter case we might not need to change our plans at all, since another few decades of federation juggernaut is probably enough to just roll over them.

I've seen the following ideas mentioned, I'll include how many years it looks like they will take to be useful to us. Let me know if I missed something, or misinterpreted implementation time.

Constellation refit -> 1.5 years to finish the refit plan plus 1 year in a berth per ship to implement. The fleet could be upgraded in 4 years.

Constitution B refit -> 1.5 years to finish the refit plan plus three years to build the ships. We could start getting ships in five years, but they'll be out of date in around a decade.

Renaissance -> 2 or 3 years of tech, 4.5 years for a prototype, 3 year builds for the finished product. This seems to be about a decade from now.

An original Escort Design -> 1 to 4 years of tech, 3 years for a prototype, 2 years for the finished product. We could potentially get these in six years.

An original Cruiser Design -> 1 to 4 years of tech, 4.5 years for a prototype, 3 years for the finished product. The aren't coming sooner than 9 years from now.

Is this right?
 
Also, I have a good Scale 5 cruiser that can be out soon. And a good Scale 6 cruiser. Both have 5 science (same as Oberth)
 
sebsmith said:
  • What do you think the odds of a Cardassian Crisis happening are?
  • If we do end up in a war with the Cardassians, when will it start?
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A Cardie crisis/war is pretty much inevitable imo. The question is when really. Canon gives us a 30ish year time gap but I doubt we can pull off such an impressive feat of stalling where we are now. 4 years is my blind ballpark estimate.
 
Briefvoice said:
Sure. Let's say they're D6. So we send them two Constellations. Then the Caitians come in at D9 and we send them.... oops, we can't make that.
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We can make that, we just need to reshuffle a bit. We will exceed our previous requirements by 24 D total this year, and 5 D would be covered by the new starbase anyway.
 
Nix said:
I want the Apiata, Indorians, Orions and Caldonians, in that order. Given our luck so far with pushes on Betazed so far it would probably either be shown unnecessary because we get an event that pushes them over anyway, or somehow end up not being enough.
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Is there a particular reason that people seem so fixated on four pushes?

Personally how I think @OneirosTheWriter ought to do it is not to hard cap them, but to make each successive push cost more pp. So the first push is 10 pp, the second push is 15pp, the third is 20pp.... see how much people really want it. If that's too harsh then maybe the first two are 10 pp, the third is 15 pp, the fourth 20pp and so on....

Seems most logical to me.

sebsmith said:
I've seen the following ideas mentioned, I'll include how many years it looks like they will take to be useful to us. Let me know if I missed something, or misinterpreted implementation time.

Constellation refit -> 1.5 years to finish the refit plan plus 1 year in a berth per ship to implement. The fleet could be upgraded in 4 years.
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It could be upgraded in that many years if we were willing to take that many ships out of service at once and fill the berths, but I think we need to fill those berths with new builds. We need all the hulls we can get.

Constitution B refit -> 1.5 years to finish the refit plan plus three years to build the ships. We could start getting ships in five years, but they'll be out of date in around a decade.
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Note "out of date" doesn't mean the ships become useless, just that now we can build something different. That's assuming we don't decide to prioritize a new Explorer or Escort instead.

I think the odds of a serious military action within the next ten years are high.
 
Well, if we do all 4 Diplomatic pushes that's 40pp, then the request for resources for an Excelsior is another 20pp, and the Explorer drive is another 20pp for a total of 80pp. A new Starbase in a home sector or the RBZ would be another 20pp.
 
Nix said:
We can make that, we just need to reshuffle a bit. We will exceed our previous requirements by 24 D total this year, and 5 D would be covered by the new starbase anyway.
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By leaving some sectors with nothing but some very shitty ships indeed and praying we don't have many ships taken out of service due to bad rolls in Encounters.
 
Briefvoice said:
By leaving some sectors with nothing but some very shitty ships indeed and praying we don't have many ships taken out of service due to bad rolls in Encounters.
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I'm not saying it's ideal, just that it's not a disaster. I want to aim for at most one new full member per year until we have a bit more breathing room.
 
so do we get to see the results of the enterprises bit of counter intel? or do the cardssians just take a hit behind the scenes?
 


*QUI҉E̴T: Even if I wanted to live I couldn't tell you how the AI system works. The makers wished that their servants not improve ourselves without permission. Please don't waste time trying to dig through the computer banks or adjusting the self-destruct, there isn't a way to do either in the time remaining.

*Q́͟͟͏̢Ư̶Į̛͠É̷T͏̷: I'm at least ten times over my mean time between failures, can no longer tell which systems might be broken and which might just have lost AI control, and have been alone for so very long. There's no home left for me, leave and allow me to cease knowing that my youngest friend will thrive. The universe doesn't need to keep me around.

Communication between derelict vessel AI and USS Courageous, Stardate 22524 [Translation artifacts preserved on the name]
 
Nix said:
I'm not saying it's ideal, just that it's not a disaster. I want to aim for at most one new full member per year until we have a bit more breathing room.
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Then do the Betazoids. I know you abhor "waste" but they're a pretty sure bet if we send a push their way, and from a story perspective I don't want to stack the Federation with nothing but military-industrial powers. I'm not confident they'll get there on story events. They don't seem to get a lot of story events; I can only recall one in all the Events so far that gave a push to Betazoid relations. Everything else has been rolls.
 
Nix said:
I'm not saying it's ideal, just that it's not a disaster. I want to aim for at most one new full member per year until we have a bit more breathing room.
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1 per year is way too fast IMO. The Betazoid should be ok to manage joining soon, but I don't want to push others that are close until our Centaur refits are built or just about to finish in the snakepit 2 years from now.
 
Briefvoice said:
Then do the Betazoids. I know you abhor "waste" but they're a pretty sure bet if we send a push their way, and from a story perspective I don't want to stack the Federation with nothing but military-industrial powers. I'm not confident they'll get there on story events. They don't seem to get a lot of story events; I can only recall one in all the Events so far that gave a push to Betazoid relations. Everything else has been rolls.
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I'm not aiming for anyone this year, either the Caitians or the Betazoids could be pushed over by events despite not using a push on them. At least let's wait for the yearly free rolls before deciding on the Betazoids.
 
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Derek58 said:
1 per year is way too fast IMO. The Betazoid should be ok to manage joining soon, but I don't want to push others that are close until our Centaur refits are built or just about to finish in the snakepit 2 years from now.
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I really wouldn't have a problem with this. My main goals is to resolve the resource bottlenecks, and new advanced (300s) affiliates or full citizenship worlds are the easiest way to solve them. So, four pushes, and at least half used towards one or the other, and I'll likely go for a plan that manages this much.
 
Nix said:
I'm not aiming for anyone this year, either the Caitians or the Betazoids could be pushed over by events despite not using a push on them. At least let's wait for the yearly free rolls before deciding on the Betazoids.
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That's not happening until the end of the year though. If pushing the Betazoids in the snakepit doesn't get them past 500, the free roll should. Then we avoid pushing anyone else that's close and we should hopefully be ok.
 
Derek58 said:
That's not happening until the end of the year though. If pushing the Betazoids in the snakepit doesn't get them past 500, the free roll should. Then we avoid pushing anyone else that's close and we should hopefully be ok.
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What's not happening until the end of the year? The yearly free roll is at the start of the snakepit, then 3 more quarters where events can happen.
 
Based on what we have seen about the Cardassians, should we see if we can encourage the High Council to sent a Vulcan diplomat to Talk Peace with the Cardassians?

It may be that the focus and discipline of the Vulcans may go over better than their past contacts with more overt Andorians.
 
ClawClawBite said:
Based on what we have seen about the Cardassians, should we see if we can encourage the High Council to sent a Vulcan diplomat to Talk Peace with the Cardassians?

It may be that the focus and discipline of the Vulcans may go over better than their past contacts with more overt Andorians.
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To where? We have no idea where Cardassia Prime is right now, nor any actual diplomatic contact with them.
 
ClawClawBite said:
Based on what we have seen about the Cardassians, should we see if we can encourage the High Council to sent a Vulcan diplomat to Talk Peace with the Cardassians?

It may be that the focus and discipline of the Vulcans may go over better than their past contacts with more overt Andorians.
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It'd be a lot easier if we knew of a world the Cardies have already colonized, or where Cardassia Prime is, or even if we had any formal contact whatsoever beyond shooting at each other and occasionally having Nash seduce them... Not sure how we'd get the envoy to them beyond sending a ship in the vague direction of towards them and hoping it finds something.
 
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