I was referring to ways to increase the amount of individuals we have through spending in the Snakepit, which wouldn't really make sense to change due to a leadership change in the academy, would it?
The previous academy head gave us additional tech crew as their bonus. During the snakepit we had the option to do an academy expansion for techs. We have now switched to a new academy head so I would expect the academy expansion to switch to the type of crew they boost which is enlisted
Right.
A production rate of two Ambassadors every 1.25 years is impressive.
An Explorer class hull requires 2Sm cargo a year. (Mostly tricky to machine parts, I think, but whatever. Our resolution isn't that good and would drive us mad if it were.)
An increase then of 2x2/1.25=3.2Sm cargo each year for the Supply Loop from Ambassador production alone.
A cargo ship hauls 8Sm and 2Blk and takes 2 years to build.
Sol the Ambassador factory, requires (2x3.2)/8=0.8 or 4/5 cargo ships from a dedicated cargo ship berth just for Ambassadors.
This covers nothing about the spacelift capacity to support that industrial production or resource extraction.
Star Fleet is hungry for every single kind of hull it can get folks. Never, ever, forget that.
Right.
A production rate of two Ambassadors every 1.25 years is impressive.
An Explorer class hull requires 2Sm cargo a year. (Mostly tricky to machine parts, I think, but whatever. Our resolution isn't that good and would drive us mad if it were.)
An increase then of 2x2/1.25=3.2Sm cargo each year for the Supply Loop from Ambassador production alone.
A cargo ship hauls 8Sm and 2Blk and takes 2 years to build.
Sol the Ambassador factory, requires (2x3.2)/8=0.8 or 4/5 cargo ships from a dedicated cargo ship berth just for Ambassadors.
This covers nothing about the spacelift capacity to support that industrial production or resource extraction.
Star Fleet is hungry for every single kind of hull it can get folks. Never, ever, forget that.
So that says to me add another berth to the aux yards in addition to the new berths for regular Starfleet. What sort of supply draw would we have at 2 ambassadors, 1.5 cruisers and 2 escorts a year? Would let us know how much aux yard space we need
Right.
A production rate of two Ambassadors every 1.25 years is impressive.
An Explorer class hull requires 2Sm cargo a year. (Mostly tricky to machine parts, I think, but whatever. Our resolution isn't that good and would drive us mad if it were.)
An increase then of 2x2/1.25=3.2Sm cargo each year for the Supply Loop from Ambassador production alone.
A cargo ship hauls 8Sm and 2Blk and takes 2 years to build.
Sol the Ambassador factory, requires (2x3.2)/8=0.8 or 4/5 cargo ships from a dedicated cargo ship berth just for Ambassadors.
This covers nothing about the spacelift capacity to support that industrial production or resource extraction.
Star Fleet is hungry for every single kind of hull it can get folks. Never, ever, forget that.
We don't have 8 3mt berths in Sol. I think we have 5 maybe 6 berths total so we would have to build 3 3MT berths on the next snakepit. at 28 each that comes to 96 pp we could use elsewhere. Depending on our next captains log we just might be able to manage it alongside all the other things we need to buy. Like the colonies, expansions, and what ever else we might need.
So that says to me add another berth to the aux yards in addition to the new berths for regular Starfleet. What sort of supply draw would we have at 2 ambassadors, 1.5 cruisers and 2 escorts a year? Would let us know how much aux yard space we need
I know that you're hungry. We are all hungry. I hunger too.
Above the pit in the center of the bridge, the holographic image of the organism hovered in place in orbit of the moon. It was a work of incredibly natural beauty, of sun and starlight reflected across myriad branches and through a prism of living diamond, of fractal gleams and icy spires of nearly infinite complexity. Of incredible mystery as well, as somehow this primordial animal traveled through space at speeds that even the creations of the known galaxy's greatest minds could not hope to match.
Hybor kept his eyes trained on the holographic representation, and at his prompting, all six hundred men and women aboard the Death Rattle thought in unison.
But I am alone. I do not wish to be alone.
He turned his head to the communications officer seated a few meters around the rim of the display pit. She held up her fingers in an affirmative sign; the psionic masking system was working. Neither Hybor nor his officer used words - spoken or otherwise - to communicate. Their voices needed to remain clear and unified.
I have found a safe place. Away from the hunting things. Let us no longer feed alone. Let us come together and mate.
An image followed the unvoiced words. A small, white star, orbited by three planets. A small nebula hugging its oort cloud in its wispy blue pseudopods. A star just two systems away, deeper into Seyek space. Its system, according to the maps that had been shared, uninhabited.
Please. I don't want to be alone anymore. Please come. Please.
Alarms rang out as the glimmering beauty halted in its orbit, rotating counterclockwise in place within the void. The communications officer gave Hybor a questioning look, but he silenced her with a curt nod. Not yet. No risking subspace communications yet.
And then, the crystal creature rose from orbit, surrounded by a soft violet phosphorescence, and tore itself out of sensor range so quickly that the computer could barely track it.
Hybor relaxed, a smile starting to creep its way across his dark teal lips. Alright, Lieutenant. Drop the mask and open a channel to the Seyek. Helm, get us out of the gravity well and prepare for warp.
The Death Rattle carefully extricated itself from the moon's atmosphere, where it had been holding position opposite of the crystalline entity, using unmanned satellites to keep track of its position. Just inside of telepathy range, and just outside of the monster's line of sight. As the battleship moved, the holographic scene of the lunar orbit was replaced by the image of a hooded, reptilian creature.
"Hello again, Marshall Sensrik," Hybor bowed his diamond-crested head and respectfully blinked his bright red eyes, "I hope this isn't an inconvenient time?"
The seyek officer narrowed its beady eyes. "If this message wasn't important enough to take precedence, would you have bothered sending it Captain?"
Hybor tightened his lips. A rude people. He appreciated their pragmatism, but even by the standards of the mindblind, the seyek had a bluntness that irked him. He imagined extending one of his fingers into each of the impudent reptile's eyes and watching it writhe and twitch as the blood oozed forth. The approval of his bridge crew poured into him, as they shared and relished the image. Good sorts.
"Quite astute, as I've learned to expect from you Marshall. I have reason to believe that the crystalline entity will be entering the Perdanis system from a vector of 15 degrees spin, 28 above the galactic plane, at some time between thirty-one and thirty-five hours from the present."
Sensrik raised his scaly eye-coverings. "With what degree of confidence?"
Hybor shrugged his black-robed shoulders. "I'm afraid I can't give you an exact probability estimate. But I do assure you, my good Marshall, the entity is more likely to approach that system, by that vector, at that time than anything else. I would reccomend putting the Starfleet ship's longranged sensors to work in anticipating any irregularities in its approach; they seem to be a bit better at that than either of us, if you don't mind my saying so."
The seyek was silent for a moment. The sounds of the bridge monitors alone echoing across the bridge.
"Very well, Captain. We will find an in-system hiding place for our ships."
Hybor smiled and bowed politely, while silently leading his officers in a litany of curses at the Marshall for being so slow. "Thank you for your time, and good hunting. Death Rattle out."
Lay in a pursuit course of our own, Captain?
Hybor furrowed his eyebrows at the helm officer, who shrank away. No. We still don't know the entity's own sensor range. Set a course for Alpha Karenin III.
Amid the images of the helm officer being flayed alive for her idiotic suggestion, Hybor allowed the others to see the reasoning in his surface thoughts. The Sign of Rethellia would be among the ambushers at Perdanis, and its photon lance weapon had the best chance of killing the beast. But if the creature managed to escape again, likely wounded, it would seek out the nearest life-bearing world to feed itself and heal the damage just as it had after encountering the frigates. If the Death Rattle got the drop on an already wounded crystalline entity, well.
Weapons, ensure that we have a maximum yield torpedo loaded in each catapult. If it comes down to us, we're likely to get only one salvo.
...
Legate Cadren rose from his desk, a wide smile crossing his scaly gray face. "Ah, General Hybor, I finally meet the new sector commander. And this fine young officer would be...?"
"Commander Thulsa, sir." The woman at Hybor's side introduced herself with a bow of the head and a soft smile. "I am honored by your presence."
YOUNG officer? I wonder what Cardassian blood tastes like.
Forgive the savage, Commander, Hybor thought at her, it cannot help its nature. He also imagined Legate Cadren screaming in a black pit as fat, glistening offal-grubs burrowed in and out of his skin leaving infected, bleeding holes the size of fingers. A smile crossed Thulsa's face.
"Pleased to meet you, Commander," the cardassian returned a perfunctory, almost mocking head bow of his own before returning his attention to Hybor. "Your record is an impressive one, General. According to your government's files, you've never lost a battle, even outnumbered as you were during the recent pirate troubles. I only hope you understand, however, just what we're up against in the Gabriel Expanse."
"I can't pretend to know what fighting against the Federation is like, my good Legate," Hybor took a step forward, his long black cloak swishing around his legs, "but I have had the good fortune of fighting alongside them, in a manner of speaking. In some regards, this can be far more instructional."
The legate raised his ridged eyebrows and nodded thoughtfully. "A chance to observe their tactics from the inside. Of course."
"Ah," Hybor allowed himself a small smile as he gave the cardassian a placating gesture, "indeed, but it is not enough to observe the enemy's tactics. One must also understand their culture. Their history. Their art. I have made a holistic study of the Federation's dominant societies since our first contact with them in Ashidi space, and I believe this may prove useful."
Legate Cadren gave him a skeptical grin. "Their art? Really now?"
"Indeed, Legate." Hybor stepped around the office table, leaving Thulsa by the door and placing himself nearer to the Cardassian. "The chances of victory are correlated quite closely with one's level of understanding of the opposition. At every level."
The expression of bemused humor on the cardassian's face grew stronger. Even through Cadren's anti-telepathy training, Hybor could tell he suspected this was all a joke at his expense. "Please, general, I simply must see a demonstration of this process."
"As you wish, Legate." Hybor raised his arm and pointed one dark teal finger at the door. "The office door, raised above the plane of the control room so that the station's officers must look upward at the commander's room. Tenuous dominance hierarchy that requires constant reinforcement. The officer must constantly proclaim that he or she is strong and important, or else their underlings will fail to believe it. This reflects a level of social conditioning that equates power with superficial grandiosity. It also demonstrates a certain mistrust of the underlings' loyalty, if the need is felt to constantly reinforce it. The commander is a slave to his or her office, every word and movement dictated by the constant need to maintain the facade of godlike superiority, leaving little room for personal flexibility. Against such an enemy, I would pursue tactics that humiliate the commander, calling his, or her, superiority into question. This will result in a breakdown of morale beginning with the senior officers and filtering down to the lowliest crewmen and foot soldiers. Likewise, I would set events in motion to implicate a conspiracy among the enemy forces. They need not turn on one another completely; merely suspect one another more than they already do. Confusion and suspicion spread. More conservative strategies are employed to compensate for the internal chaos. In the meantime, I would perform aggressive actions with my own forces to exploit the opportunities that this creates."
Silence rang across the office. Hybor could swear he heard the cardassian's heartbeats.
"How long have you spent devising this particular strategy, general?"
"In the time since you asked for a demonstration of my methods, Legate."
More silence. Thulsa gave him an inquiring glance.
Their ART? Really? Where is THAT coming from?
Its gibberish, of course. "My" assessment of CDF structural vulnerabilities comes from the tactical think tank on Aedi Prime. The Cardassians believe that we are a mysterious people of mysterious methods. The less they understand our true methods, the more leverage we can gain in this sector.
"I'm sure we'll make an excellent team, Legate," Hybor smiled again, "but, if I might be so crass, there were refreshments on the agenda?"
Just as expected, they recieved the news of the successful raid on the Caitians just as lunch was finishing. Hybor didn't even need his telepathy to know that the Legate, who otherwise might have been an obstruction, was now totally in his thrall. After all, cardassians need to look up at you, or they might start getting ideas.
We don't have 8 3mt berths in Sol. I think we have 5 maybe 6 berths total so we would have to build 3 3MT berths on the next snakepit. at 28 each that comes to 96 pp we could use elsewhere. Depending on our next captains log we just might be able to manage it alongside all the other things we need to buy. Like the colonies, expansions, and what ever else we might need.
2 Ambassadors every 1.25 years only requires six 3mt berths not eight. Eight is for between 2 and 2.13 Ambassadors every year. Getting to six simply requires building one extra 3mt berth at either UP (28pp) or SFFY (37pp).
2 Ambassadors every 1.25 years only requires six 3mt berths not eight. Eight is for between 2 and 2.13 Ambassadors every year. Getting to six simply requires building one extra 3mt berth at either UP (28pp) or SFFY (37pp).
If we have 6 berths building Ambassadors continuously than that means we don't have any 3MT berths to build any other kind of ships that berths can build. I added 2 more Berths to make up for that problem if we do that. 6 berths to build Ambassadors. 2 Berths to build something else that we might need.
2 Ambassadors every 1.25 years only requires six 3mt berths not eight. Eight is for between 2 and 2.13 Ambassadors every year. Getting to six simply requires building one extra 3mt berth at either UP (28pp) or SFFY (37pp).
We have 5 3mt berths at up currently and 1 3mt at san Fran. So we are at 6 already. I would like to add some more, at least 1 at san Fran so we can dual build.
If we have 6 berths building Ambassadors continuously than that means we don't have any 3MT berths to build any other kind of ships that berths can build. I added 2 more Berths to make up for that problem if we do that. 6 berths to build Ambassadors. 2 Berths to build something else that we might need.
You do know we have 3x 3mt berths and 2x 2.5mt berths outside of Sol right? We'd still have plenty of berths left over for repairs, refits of Excelsiors, and anything else that could need that size range.
We have 5 3mt berths at up currently and 1 3mt at san Fran. So we are at 6 already. I would like to add some more, at least 1 at san Fran so we can dual build.
While technically true that statement was in the context of doing paired Ambassador builds. So we'd still need another berth at either UP or SFFY to make a pair of Ambassadors every 1.25 years possible.
A concept I was working on the SDB. Got some likes and Discord talk, but not a lot of discussion, so I figured I'd bring it over here after clearing with Oneiros that it wouldn't upset the Council too much.
Starfleet has grown. A lot. We've gone from a mere handful of ships to ~80 Starfleet vessels. Within the next few years, we will likely break a hundred ships. We have the coverage of our existing responsibilities and the numbers to consider moving from highly generalist ships that are cost-efficient to building small numbers of particular specialists for missions that require a specialist.
Therefore, I am proud to present the Aphelion-Class Scout-Skirmisher. The Aphelion is intended to absolutely crush the scout phase, as it can be configured to have S9-10-- equal to the Ambassador, and higher than any other faction's scout ship by a long haul. Given that the Scout ship also participates in Skirmish, the Aphelion also has the combat stats of nuFrigate and D8 (+3-4 over the Kepler and four times higher than a Takaaki). This will allow it to not only survive skirmish and if necessary Vanguard, but will also allow it to strongly tilt Skirmish advantage to Starfleet. S9 also will significantly increase the average S-score of the minesweeping line to boost fleet survival on the offensive.
The Aphelion is not an efficient ship, and it's mostly intended to do one job. I will admit that immediately. It's not intended to be (although it's just as tough as a Rennie and close to it in a fight, more if we put Arrays on it, and crushes it handily at Science or Reaction, for +10 SR -1O -1E +1T). It's intended to be a small-production class, with likely no more than 3-5 operating at any one time (I would like to see one for each active border zone, but that's probably a bit much). That's because you need one per decent-sized fleetball. If we're running more than 3-5 fleetballs we can dip into the Kepler reserve. The advantage of the Aphelion is that it lets us crushingly capitalize on Federation advantages in Scout and Skirmish, since we're building a generalist frigate with D6 to backstop this vessel. This helps us outweigh the Cardassian advantage in Vanguard so that we maintain superiority into the Heavy Metal phase. In peacetime, S9 D8 allows it to act as a generalist cruiser (since it has generalist frigate stats) with enhanced Science capability.
As a secondary focus, acquiring a primary scout vessel will allow us to build Keplers more cheaply than we would otherwise, and optimize them for peacetime operations. In an ideal world, we shouldn't be using Keplers in battle. Those should be the ships that are holding the line back home while we pull in the Excelsiors and Rennies and general/combat frigates into fleetballs, led by the Aphelion. It means we won't have to debate lowering Presence in order to have a Kepler that's optimized towards battle (a circumstance it should rarely, if ever, enter).
It requires mid-2320s technologies, depending on how things shift out, for a final statline of C3 S10 H4 L5 P3 D8, 120/90, 2/4/4. For comparison against other ships in the same ballpark:
Rennie: +10 SR, -1O, +1T. C-2, S+7, H/L same, -1P, +3D
Kepler: +15-20SR (depending on final design), +1E; +1 C, +3S, +2 H, +1-2L, +3-4D
GenFrig: +25-30SR, +1 ET OR OET; -1C, +6S, +1H, -1P, +2D
If we COULD do it, and I'm not saying we can, the most compelling reason not to do it is that Keplers are fragile. Explorer Corps ships do sometimes fail Science tests even with Science 7 or 8, and they can certainly fail a Presence test with Presence 5. When they do, they often have to fall back on the Combat/Hull/Shields to survive hostile attention, bad space weather, or the like.
That is the kind of situation where a Kepler is likely to fail and be destroyed or take crew losses.
Since we're not exactly overburdened with an excess of Explorer Corps crew replacements, it's best if we put them on ships that can survive an accident pretty well.
We can finish a whole 'nother round of Excelsior construction between now and the time the Ambassador becomes available for mass production in very late 2321 or early 2322. The only sticking point is crews. And we could certainly use a few more explorers here and there between now and 2325 when mass Ambassador production becomes available. If nothing else, by 2320 or so the Cardassians will have a LOT of refitted cruisers that are probably going to be stronger than the Renaissance-class in combat, so just mass-producing waves of Rennies and nothing heavier isn't necessarily a good plan for beating them.
Meanwhile, right now the Centaur-A is the best choice we have for skirmishing frigates. Miranda-As were great fighting frigates under the older versions of the combat engine but are unsuited now. If we get into a big battle, we're going to very much want those Centaur-As around as scouts and skirmishers. Plus, the Centaur and Miranda classes are very crew-efficient.
That will change if and when we get a new frigate design, but no such design will complete prototyping before, oh, 2322 or 2323 at the earliest. Enough time to build a lot of ships.
3mt berths are tied up with Ambassadors, 1mt berths are busy with Rennies/Kepler/Aux and when they finish those waves there's a new frigate and hopefully enough 2mt berths for heavy cruiser production.
On top of all that there are refits for Ambassadors, Excelsiors, Centaurs, Mirandas and possibly the Oberth that need to be snuck into the plan.
Refits for Ambassadors are over ten years down the road, there is no likely way we're getting a meaningful refit for the Oberth given how absurd and tiny and overspecialized the ship is, there were only two Centaurs to refit in the first place and we finished the job ten years ago, and the Miranda refits are nearly done if not entirely so.
… you know, with how cheep tech academy expansions are, I wonder if using such would allow for us to make a glut of Kepler class vessels or maybe, if we gain enough of an excess of personal in an area, that it would allow us to form research teams without making requests of the council?
A tech team isn't just people, it's labs, research equipment, authorizations, and so on. There's still going to be a political cost to creating the new teams and bureaucracy to support them, even if all the people in question are Starfleet Academy graduates.
Plus, with such a huge glut of extra Academy graduates in the science tracks, we're going to run into problems with politicians questioning the need to keep expanding the Academy itself.
We still have several years before the Ambassador design is available for general production, so we don't have to buy all the desired slipways at once. Yearly expansions for Utopia Planitia should do nicely, assuming there's room in our 'budget' of political will.
We still have several years before the Ambassador design is available for general production, so we don't have to buy all the desired slipways at once. Yearly expansions for Utopia Planitia should do nicely, assuming there's room in our 'budget' of political will.
That's my plan. One 3mt expansion a year at either Utopia Planitia or San Francisco fleet yards a year. I actually plan on buying 1 3MT berth and 2 or 3 2MT berths when the next snakepit comes since we barely have any 2MT berths in the Federation according to the shipyard report.
That's my plan. One 3mt expansion a year at either Utopia Planitia or San Francisco fleet yards a year. I actually plan on buying 1 3MT berth and 2 or 3 2MT berths when the next snakepit comes since we barely have any 2MT berths in the Federation according to the shipyard report.
Weird thought: if the Council doesn't let us build it, maybe we give the design over for production by our member states? If five got built across any number of member states, thanks to United Starfleet we might well be able to have one per fleetball anyways.
On the other hand, there's been discussion of a 1.8mt cruiser or pocket battleship for awhile. If we start placing one 2mt slipway at Utopia Planitia every year or two, there should be plenty of room for ship construction by the time we actually want to lay them down in numbers.
A concept I was working on the SDB. Got some likes and Discord talk, but not a lot of discussion, so I figured I'd bring it over here after clearing with Oneiros that it wouldn't upset the Council too much.
Starfleet has grown. A lot. We've gone from a mere handful of ships to ~80 Starfleet vessels. Within the next few years, we will likely break a hundred ships. We have the coverage of our existing responsibilities and the numbers to consider moving from highly generalist ships that are cost-efficient to building small numbers of particular specialists for missions that require a specialist.
Therefore, I am proud to present the Aphelion-Class Scout-Skirmisher. The Aphelion is intended to absolutely crush the scout phase, as it can be configured to have S9-10-- equal to the Ambassador, and higher than any other faction's scout ship by a long haul. Given that the Scout ship also participates in Skirmish, the Aphelion also has the combat stats of nuFrigate and D8 (+3-4 over the Kepler and four times higher than a Takaaki). This will allow it to not only survive skirmish and if necessary Vanguard, but will also allow it to strongly tilt Skirmish advantage to Starfleet. S9 also will significantly increase the average S-score of the minesweeping line to boost fleet survival on the offensive.
The Aphelion is not an efficient ship, and it's mostly intended to do one job. I will admit that immediately. It's not intended to be (although it's just as tough as a Rennie and close to it in a fight, more if we put Arrays on it, and crushes it handily at Science or Reaction, for +10 SR -1O -1E +1T). It's intended to be a small-production class, with likely no more than 3-5 operating at any one time (I would like to see one for each active border zone, but that's probably a bit much). That's because you need one per decent-sized fleetball. If we're running more than 3-5 fleetballs we can dip into the Kepler reserve. The advantage of the Aphelion is that it lets us crushingly capitalize on Federation advantages in Scout and Skirmish, since we're building a generalist frigate with D6 to backstop this vessel. This helps us outweigh the Cardassian advantage in Vanguard so that we maintain superiority into the Heavy Metal phase. In peacetime, S9 D8 allows it to act as a generalist cruiser (since it has generalist frigate stats) with enhanced Science capability.
As a secondary focus, acquiring a primary scout vessel will allow us to build Keplers more cheaply than we would otherwise, and optimize them for peacetime operations. In an ideal world, we shouldn't be using Keplers in battle. Those should be the ships that are holding the line back home while we pull in the Excelsiors and Rennies and general/combat frigates into fleetballs, led by the Aphelion. It means we won't have to debate lowering Presence in order to have a Kepler that's optimized towards battle (a circumstance it should rarely, if ever, enter).
It requires mid-2320s technologies, depending on how things shift out, for a final statline of C3 S10 H4 L5 P3 D8, 120/90, 2/4/4. For comparison against other ships in the same ballpark:
Rennie: +10 SR, -1O, +1T. C-2, S+7, H/L same, -1P, +3D
Kepler: +15-20SR (depending on final design), +1E; +1 C, +3S, +2 H, +1-2L, +3-4D
GenFrig: +25-30SR, +1 ET OR OET; -1C, +6S, +1H, -1P, +2D
Two immediate major issues and a host of minor ones.
The first is whether the Council would assign such a design militarization. Don't forget that we have to put the ship in a role before it can be proposed. We just built a new science frigate and we were required to give such a design P3+. This can't viable go in the science frigate role because we just filled that role with something else. So what is it other than a dedicated combat ship. Even your post talks purely about the combat benefits; noncombat use us entirely an afterthought. So it won't pass the sniff test.
The second is whether there is a cap on the scouting and skirmish bonuses. We have seen that when a fleet declines to participate in one of the phases the other fleet wins by default, which means that even flawless victory must be limited. While we haven't seen a cap in opposed battles I'm confident that there would be one, given that at 200% the opposing fleet would be at 0%. So the use of a ship completely focused on the early phases may be limited. I think it's very likely that we'd cap out at 1.25 or 1.50.
