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To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest)

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To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest) Starfleet Ship Design Bureau, Refit ("To Boldly Go...")
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Simon_Jester said:
I dunno. Personally I'm fine with everything, except the sneers. If the sneers are to be believed, I shouldn't be doing this. If they're not, I'm fine.

But some days I seem to collect sneers.

[shrugs]
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I don't in the slightest mind you participating in the thread in all other ways other than trying to drag me into an argument, and I said before that you are a good writer. If I don't have any issue with you presence in the thread in general I very much doubt anyone else does.

[This is trying to be conciliatory while remaining completely honest. If it comes across differently please tell me, I'm perfectly willing to learn better.]
 
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Briefvoice said:
I don't recall anyone ever sneering at me, though maybe I'm either too dense to notice or am good at forgetting things like that shortly after they happen. It helps that I have been trying to be better about just letting other people get the last word occasionally.

As for your emergency deployment plans, they look fine, but I think that frankly, @OneirosTheWriter may end up doing movements differently the next time we're prepping for war. As with the recent Precipice vote, he'll likely give us options to choose from rather than open-ended "where do you want to send the fleets". That seems to make it easier for more voters to participate. Indeed, the person your plan ends up being the most useful for may be Oneiros himself, as he plots out what options would be reasonable to give us!
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Its definitely because you're too dense. I'm sneering at you right now and you don't even notice. :p

Nix said:
I don't think I ever stooped to a personal attack. If you think otherwise could you point out where and suggest alternative wordings that would get the point across just as clearly? In fact I deliberately rephrased some things to make it clear that they were about behavior and actions in this thread rather than about the person, and I have consistently used wordings like "refuse to do" rather than "incapable of doing", with the sole exception of things like inferences about the current(!) state of mind like "seem to be under the misconception that" above. I don't think that constitutes either a personal attack or an insult? Nor do I think calling something a painfully terrible argument or acurately describing related personal experience is.

Posting this in the thread rather than a PM because it's replying to something in the thread and because everyone else is more than welcome to give pointers on how to get myself sufficiently clearly across while avoiding whatever you consider either personal attacks or insults as well, but that definitely should happen in PMs.
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There's been more than a few times that you've called people who voted differently than you on ship building plans "insane," and, well...

Nix said:
I PMed you last time to either agree to some minimal ground rules (being able to abort arguments with you when they become too painful, basically) or to not try to engage me in an argument again. (Note how I have not quoted you since either). You ignored that. Don't quote and try to argue with me if you aren't willing to obey them, I consider it harassment. Dealing with you trying to substitute eloquence for making an argument with actual causal structure and basic respect for the nature of evidence has been one of the most unpleasant experiences I had in the last few years and I had more than enough of it.
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While nothing in that post was purely ad hominem, the effect of it as a whole certainly comes across that way. This may be entirely unintentional on your part - god only knows I've come down with Internet Tone Syndrome on occasion - but I can definitely see why SJ might be feeling the way he does after having it directed at him.

Hmmm...

I'm mini-modding, aren't I? Perhaps I should just shut the hell up now.
 
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Simon_Jester said:
It really depends on what the Cardassians do. If they roll up with a fleet that outmatches our squadron and its fortifications, well before we can do anything about it, then they do, that's all. In that case, I'd rather lose the starbase to a scuttling charge than lose the starbase to Cardassian boarding parties AND lose the CBZ squadron to Cardassian phasers. Also, the strongest thing in the area isn't Shallow Space Nine, it's the Indorion navy, so that is where any small Starfleet task force really wants to go if it's trying to make a last stand against a heavier opponent.

Also, I don't want to order any formation to "hold the line, die in place" in a war like this. That kind of military order was a bad idea when Stalin did it and a bad idea when Hitler did it and I'm liking the company it puts me in less and less with every person I think of who did it. We definitely have the option of trading space for time, and I'd much rather trade space for time than ships for time. Because to borrow from @Iron Wolf , who got it from Leslie's sister the folk singer... space is wide, and good friends are too few.
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That's not what I intended; I just want to put up *some* kind of a fight where we do have fixed defences. Our ships can leave, and if they're outmatched, they should... but they should get a bit of fighting in before they do. Our Starbase can't leave, so it should fight. Starbases are pretty tough for what we pay for them, so we should get full value out of them, in battle, before we allow their destruction. I don't want our enemies ever taking out one of our Starbases without paying a price for it, and burning a fortress undefended just seems wrong.

I'm thinking something along the lines of a skeleton crew of volunteers manning the defences aboard the Starbase, while the fleet positions to skirmish and harass, fighting to some sensible value like loss of shields. Between the two of them, we can put up a pretty decent fight, hopefully without much in the way of losses that we wouldn't already take anyways if we were planning on abandoning the Starbase.
 
OneirosTheWriter said:
No, that's not fair. Reconquering a planet is not a matter of days, no matter how overwhelming the force. Especially not against a foe as cunning as those on Celos. Especially not with next to know planning time. A pang of sympathy for the distant Union Head of State colours your reaction; they have had to make the call for such haste, and have to live with it on their conscience. But it is the same call you would have made.
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Bold should be No.
 
Keep at it @Iron Wolf, and I'm going to write an Omake with the rock whisperer being particularly interested in a chunk of Sci-fi Rock he's never seen before.

The catch? It's a chunk of, up until after his unfortunate layup in sickbay, previously unidentified invisible radiation rock. :p
 
Night said:
Senior crewman "Quartzite" in no way belongs to Straak. They are not in a relationship. The next time this comes up you will be referred to your division officer for appropriate discipline.
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Personnel Officers have multiple forms for you to sign, as well as mandatory sensitivity training courses.
 
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