By the way, Iron Wolf...

What happened to Sorkan? I liked him too.
I have an omake planned. It was supposed to be completed more around November but then I got busy and the plot moved ahead :|

I considered not having him die but I think infighting in the Oyana administration helps explain some of the more o_O things that have happened.

EDIT: Who knows, maybe Oneiros will disagree, Sorkan will be fine! Still walking and talking
 
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[DIPLO] Remain focused on Sydraxians
About this, are you guys really sure they would stay out? I feel there's not enough effort plus the Indorian request is more likely to work.
This could be their chance to finally get one last hurrah in before settling down for talks, from distraction to localised skirmish.
There really is no way in hell we are going to get anything useful done about them in the next two weeks. If they're going to be reliable Cardie allies or not, well, that question was effectively decided before this clusterfuck started. Having some affiliate back-up is plenty more useful right this instant (which is why I voted for @Simon_Jester )
 
There really is no way in hell we are going to get anything useful done about them in the next two weeks. If they're going to be reliable Cardie allies or not, well, that question was effectively decided before this clusterfuck started. Having some affiliate back-up is plenty more useful right this instant (which is why I voted for @Simon_Jester )
Look, maybe Briefvoice is right, and we'll have a diplomatic breakthrough where we find a Sydraxian leadership figure actually willing to open communications with us in a couple of weeks. I think it's a big roll of the dice, but if we could do it the payoff would be HUGE.

A similar roll of the dice, with better odds but lower reward, would have been to try and secure Dawiar neutrality. I STILL think that if we do go for a state of emergency, that should be one of the first things we try. We're fairly well prepared to fight the Sydraxians if we have to, but having to worry about fighting the Dawiar is going to tie up a LOT of heavy metal that we could really use in the fight against the Cardassians themselves.

I pushed for the Indorion thing because I consider it to be high probability of success, high reward- because a combined fleet of 35-40 Combat is a lot more likely to be able to hang together and survive in battered form than a pair of separated 15-20 Combat forces, in the face of what might be coming at them if the Cardassians attack.

The reward for rendering the Dawiar neutral might actually be higher, the reward for rendering the Sydraxians neutral almost certainly would be... but the probability of the diplomatic action making the decisive difference seems rather lower.
 
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To what degree are we able to influence where Federation borders grow? I know we're having stuff happen corewards of Apinae, but does that mean our borders will grow there, or is it just our ships patrolling? I'd like to extend our borders at (f,-4) and (e,-4) if possible, to cut the Cardassians off from Qloath and Dawiar without going the long way around, and to shorten our CBZ sector which will make our forces there more concentrated, and reduce the area they could feasibly attack through.

Federation boundaries, when not defined by treaties, are a bubble around Federation inhabited systems. Member homeworlds, colonies, mining outposts, research stations, and the like. Past that, it is what the High Council wants to claim. That is a political decision, not a Starfleet one, though they listen to us when we offer advice.
 
To me the Sydraxian Diplo choice was partly about the Sydraxians but more about keeping our relations with the Yrillians and Gretarians. Pushing them to support us and get the Sydraxians into talks and then abandoning them almost immediately would make things more difficult on that front. Especially when we're negotiating for peace, either after a war right now, or one that starts later.

The only other choice I thought about was the one to move the Indorian Fleet and I think the SOE would also let us do that if we need their support at Starbase 9.

I think the Dawiar are very likely to want no part in this given that they know how big the Federation is, how advanced it is and the fact that we are right on their border. In our last real conflict with them they had bad information from the Cardassians. On top of that all of Cardassia's recent actions have shown them how good an ally they are. I doubt they would be willing to do much to help Cardassia in any way at this point.
 
I don't think 3hrs will make much difference to the results, but it'll give me time to get home before anything happens.
 
By the way, I just wanted to float this past people. It's the executive summary of my "Epsilon-3" mobilization plan draft. My assumptions:

1) All votes currently ongoing proceed just the way they're trending now, with the current majority frontrunner winning the vote.

2) We're at High Alert, so Federation ships can go where they want, Defense requirements are halved, and ships move at two squares per week, just like in Grey October.

3) I'm assuming the Cardassians don't immediately make any guarantees to Celos. If so, we have a few more weeks before the state of emergency triggers as per the 'conditional declaration' option that's dominating the vote tally right now. Might as well get Starfleet ready as soon as possible, though. Most of this is stuff we'd have to do anyway even if we did have a state of emergency, though.

4) By the same token, we can't issue orders to member worlds, but we CAN issue strong suggestions via the MWCO, hopefully, so I wrote those in. They also give a guideline to what we might try to accomplish in the event of a State of Emergency being declared.

Okay, so here goes.

STARFLEET PLAN

"First Fleet" is made up of ships drawn from Starfleet's back-field. We mass it at Ferasa. These ships can help the Caitians against the Dawiar, or move on to reinforce our forces on the Spinward Front with Cardassia. They'll be ready in about 2 weeks.

"Second Fleet" out of, essentially, the Sydraxian Border Zone squadron, plus a few reinforcements. We already voted to park them in Sector 0d, so that's where the orders talk about them going. Since their orders have already been cut, they'll be on station in 0-1 weeks.

"Third Fleet"assembles at Selindra, in Amarkia Sector, out of reinforcement ships drawn from the backfield, including the pair of ConnieBees recently completed at San Francisco Yards. These ships are our reserve force; we can order them on to reinforce the Indorions or the Apiata, or to join First and Second Fleets against threats on our flanks, or whatever we think best. I figure we want at least ONE force that isn't pre-allocated to doing what we think it ought to do NOW, in case the picture changes significantly. Third Fleet will be ready to go and on station within 2-3 weeks.

"Fourth Fleet" at Apinae, the Apiata homeworld, is basically the Explorer Corps. We've put the whole band back together in action, for the first time since the Biophage. Given that the Apiata have an extremely strong fleet, and that Second Fleet is not far away, I honestly think that's enough firepower for anything we're likely to need in that area. The Explorer Corps will need 1-2 weeks to make the rendezvous, I think. We could reinforce Fourth Fleet more heavily, but I honestly think we're going to need every regular Starfleet ship we can spare over near Indorion space, where...

"Fifth Fleet" at Lapycorias, assembles starting with the Cardassian Border Zone fleet, and reinforced by just about every ship we can spare from the rest of our space, headed over there as fast as we can. If Fifth Fleet has to fall back, then it does- I'm hoping we can avoid getting pushed entirely out of Indorion space, but if we can't avoid it, then we can't. The Cardassians will be hitting that area hard, I suspect, especially if they see an opportunity to catch us split up. Reinforcements won't start trickling into Lapycorias for about 2 weeks. But by the end of Week 4 or so, the Combat 17 squadron we have stationed there will have grown to Combat 46 and three Excelsiors... that is, if there's still a base and a fleet left there to reinforce after Weeks Two and Three.

"Sixth Fleet" is our wartime designation for the Anti-Syndicate Task Force (thank you Sulu). For now they remain where they are, because we anticipate the Syndicate being very frisky for the next few months. Maybe later we can pull ships off the Task Force to help the other fleets. I hope so.

LEFTOVER SHIPS

The RBZ and KBZ keep their Excelsiors and Oberths because that war may go up any time now and we need the counter-cloak capability.

A few other Starfleet ships remain scattered here and there throughout our space, because I'm assuming High Alert and the same mobilization rules as Grey October. Everything moves except two Excelsiors and two Oberths (one each for the RBZ and KBZ), and an Oberth and two Constellations covering some residual garrison requirements around Sol and Vulcan.

So in case of a state of emergency, there is effectively nothing left for Starfleet to pull out of the backfield... but we can start issuing fancy orders to member world fleets.

MEMBER WORLDS

Basically, for each member world I tried to pick a useful role for them. And, in the case of the fleets we may want to order into battle soon, a rally point within their sector. I don't want to go into the details; this post is 840 words long as it is.
 
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… how many people here are actually able to understand all that is being discussed about SoE stuff. Honestly, after a few pages, my response can be summed up as "uhh"(amount of the letter h variable) and scratching my noggin.
 
Well, it basically broke down into four big questions.

1) What should the ships in Orion space do? There are four groups of ships, all of which report to Uhura. There's Eaton's little task force that's been there a long time, Nash's big task force of Amarki that just showed up, and the Earth and Andorian task forces of redshirt ships that fade into the background being quietly awesome.

2) What should our border fleets do? In particular, what about the Sydraxian and Cardassian border fleets, since war seems pretty likely right now?

3) Should we declare a state of emergency, and if so, when?

4) What should our diplomats concentrate on for like the next two weeks? We can ask the Qloath or Indorions for a little extra help in their regions of space. We can try to make sure the Dawiar stay neutral. We can try to get the Sydraxians to talk to us. Or we can tell all our affiliates to STAY DOWN AND NOT PROVOKE ANYONE, pretending to talk to everyone while realistically we're looking at that bee-girl in the corner.
 
To extend that, the consensus answers appear to be:

1) Nash will go hunting for Syndicate ass to kick out in deep space, while Eaton hovers around Celos and helps our people retake the planet. The Earth task force will stick around the planet Freedom and keep the Syndicate from retaking it while Uhura goes to take care of Celos. The Andorians will keep escorting our supply ships so the Syndicate can't just pirate our stuff.

2a) Our Sydraxian Border Zone fleet should fly off into the deep-space area between the Sydraxians and the Amarki. Because Amarki space is lightly defended, what with most of their navy being off on Nash's Magical Mystery Asskicking Tour over in Orion space.

2b) The Cardassian Border Zone fleet should turtle at its starbase for now, because they are probably outnumbered and outgunned like 3:1 by the Cardassians next door to them at Bajor. So getting frisky over there would be a big mistake.

3) We should automatically declare a state of emergency, which is effectively Sousa appointing herself temporary dictator, IF the Cardassians make a statement guaranteeing the independence of Celos. That would enable us to tell member world fleets to leave their home sectors and help us out in other areas, it'd let us mobilize civilian organizations like we did against the Biophage. The idea is that this signals to the Cardassians that we're willing to not fight, but are OMG SERIOUS about Celos. I'm... kind of not sure this idea will work as planned at that exact moment, what with the whole "claiming this is a Federation-wide life-threatening emergency and assuming dictatorial pretty darn extreme powers" thing. But that's me.

4) We should focus on trying to get through to the Sydraxians, so that we don't disrupt our effort to reach them, and don't mess up our diplomacy with the Gretarians and Yrillians either. The payoff, if we're lucky, might even by the Sydraxians deciding to sit this one out, which would be REALLY AWESOME. If we can do it.

Note that I disagree with the consensus on (3) and (4), but I'm not going to lie and pretend people don't think what they really think. Even if I think they're making a mistake.
 
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[X][SOE] Arrange for an SoE immediately following a Cardassian guarantee for Celos
[X][SFTF1] Support Operations on Celos
[X][STFT2] Hunt and Destroy Syndicate Space forces
[X][UETF] Support Operations on Freedom
[X][ATF] Escort shipping
[X][CBZ] Focus on defence of Starbase 9 at Lapycorias
[X][SBZ] Focus on defence of Square 0d
[X][DIPLO] Remain focused on Sydraxians
 
Ghosts and Whispers happened at the start of 2310. It's now the end of 2312, almost 3 full years later.The Cardassian fleet had 148 combat as of the end of Ghosts and Whispers.

We know that they produce 2 Jaldun a year. A high estimate would be that they produce 2 Takaaki a year too. Each ship is C4, so add 16 combat each year. The Cardassian fleet therefore has about 196 combat today (high estimate).

Let's presume that war begins today. We call the Indorian fleet (unknown strength, ~20C) to Lapycorias and we have 40C sitting behind a 10C Starbase. The Cardassians activate a warplan and sortie 50C from Bajor/CBZ towards Indoria and 50C from forward deployment towards Apinae. These are conservative estimates. Let's also assume that the remaining 100C is spread out evenly among the six known Cardassian worlds (16C each).

The question is, presuming both sides avoid combat until clear superiority is obtained, who wins a deployment race? I will define clear superiority as 150% more combat than the other side, including static defenses for the lesser side. I will also continue the deployment as if nothing happens so we can see who arrives late.

Week 0:
Apiata (80C) vs Cardassia (50C)
(150% threshold met)
CBZ+Indoria+SB9 (50C) vs Cardassia (50C)

Week 1:
15C arrives from Explorer Corps
70C arrives from Sydraxians
EC+Apiata+Apinae SB (105C) vs Cardassia+Sydraxia (120C)

16C arrives from Balogot
CBZ+Indoria+SB9 (50C) vs Cardassia (66C)

Week 2:
10C arrives from Explorer Corps*
9C arrives from Amarkia*
EC+Starfleet+Apiata+Apinae SB (124C) vs Cardassia+Sydraxia (120C)

16C arrives from Galundun
23C arrives from CAN*
CBZ+CAN+Indoria+SB9 (73C)* vs Cardassia (82C)

Week 3:
15C arrives from SBZ
EC+Starfleet+Apiata (129C) vs Cardassia+Sydraxia (120C)

16C arrives from Trangot
31C arrives from SFTF2*
CBZ+CAN+Indoria+SFTF2+SB9 (104C)* vs Cardassia (98C)

Week 4:

32C arrives from Karadoc and Vedarot
14C arrives from Sol
10C arrives from Unassigned Pool
7C arrives from Tellar
EC+Starfleet+Apiata (160C) vs Cardassia+Sydraxia (152C)

16C arrives from Cardassia Prime
11C arrives from Ferasa
Starfleet+CAN+SFTF2+Indoria (121C) vs Cardassia (114C)


*The question is, can a small reinforcement fleet safely breach a blockade of the Starbase when the total fleet is still outnumbered. The answer is likely no without great risk. But if the CAN does not arrive on Week 2, for example, the Cardassians meet the 150% threshold.

Anyway, the point is; we defend both locations by massing fleets, then our fleets get "pinned" at a known location for at least some deployment weeks, needing the safety of static defenses to escape engagement. It's unlikely we would "escape" a siege of SB9, for example, if we holed up and waited for reinforcements. And the Cardassian reinforcements happen faster than ours up until Week 3.

THIS IS NOT A DEPLOYMENT PLAN. It is a mathematical exercise of how fast ships can be expected to move. A real deployment plan would likely amass a fleet as far back as Amarkia, wouldn't strip sectors dry, would account for the Dawiar and Lecarre, and so on. I hope to illustrate, however, that it is likely our units "in the field" so to speak WILL get pinned at fortifications by Cardassian advanced forces. Only in Week 0 will we have the flexibility to decide to abandon any positions.
 
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"Fourth Fleet" at Apinae, the Apiata homeworld, is basically the Explorer Corps. We've put the whole band back together in action, for the first time since the Biophage. Given that the Apiata have an extremely strong fleet, and that Second Fleet is not far away, I honestly think that's enough firepower for anything we're likely to need in that area. The Explorer Corps will need 1-2 weeks to make the rendezvous, I think. We could reinforce Fourth Fleet more heavily, but I honestly think we're going to need every regular Starfleet ship we can spare over near Indorion space, where...

The only change I would consider is asking one or more EC ships to do their "sprint" thing to Lapycorias or Indoria. That would be a serious boon to any calculations on how much force to use against that map square. I'm unsure if it's wise, but it's something to consider.
 
3) We should automatically declare a state of emergency, which is effectively Sousa appointing herself temporary dictator, IF the Cardassians make a statement guaranteeing the independence of Celos. That would enable us to tell member world fleets to leave their home sectors and help us out in other areas, it'd let us mobilize civilian organizations like we did against the Biophage. The idea is that this signals to the Cardassians that we're willing to not fight, but are OMG SERIOUS about Celos. I'm... kind of not sure this idea will work as planned at that exact moment, what with the whole "claiming this is a Federation-wide life-threatening emergency and assuming dictatorial powers" thing. But that's me.
I was under the understanding that if Cardassia declares for Celos negotiations are effectively over and it's war.
 
If it does come to war, I think I may have a plan to end it quickly.

Apiata ships are at least as fast as anything we or the Cardasdians have got, and they have a big enough fleet to spare a few from defense. They also, at this point, have some experience with economy raiding.

If we can get an apiata battle group behind the front lines, it can zip around Cardassian space and destroy freighter after freighter, mining facility after mining facility, while having a good chance of avoiding their starbases and few remaining garrison warships.

Do enough damage, and I'll bet we can convince the cardassians that this war isn't worth it.
 
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Maybe so, maybe not, but I bet the Apiata are! :evil:
If it does come to war, I think I may have a plan to end it quickly.

Apiata ships are at least as fast as anything we or the Cardasdians have got, and they have a big fleet. They also, at this point, have some experience with economy raiding.

If we can get an apiata battle group behind the front lines, it can zip around Cardassian space and destroy freighter after freighter, mining facility after mining facility, while having a good chance of avoiding their starbases and few remaining garrison warships.

Do enough damage, and I'll bet we can convince the cardassians that this war isn't worth it.
Yeah. Plan Epsilon-3-B(ee), variant codename "Float and Sting" does indeed contain some provisions along those lines. There's language in the plan for having the Apiata go on the offensive against the Cardassians, assuming the Cardies don't just throw their entire battle fleet straight at Apinae and leave the poor bee-girls too busy to do any such thing.

The only change I would consider is asking one or more EC ships to do their "sprint" thing to Lapycorias or Indoria. That would be a serious boon to any calculations on how much force to use against that map square. I'm unsure if it's wise, but it's something to consider.
The main reason I don't propose that is that I'd rather keep the Explorer Corps as a united body to increase its effect as a striking arm rather than parceling it out in penny packets. One ship, however powerful, can be cut off and destroyed. Four heavy ships working together require a fleet to oppose them.

This is particularly helpful in Apiata space, because it will mean that invaders pushing into Apiata territory (or Cardassian defenders trying to repel an Apiata attack) cannot "fan out" to cope with harassment attacks by individual Stingers or pairs or trios of same. If they try, they get hammered by four Excelsiors. Conversely, if they concentrate to repel the attacks of a united Explorer Corps, they're leaving a lot of targets bare and vulnerable to Apiata raids.

Also, I am really hoping we can start this mobilization plan soon. If we're lucky and quick, we can steal a march on the Cardassians and start reinforcing Indorion space and/or Lapycorias before they're ready to attack it.

I was under the understanding that if Cardassia declares for Celos negotiations are effectively over and it's war.
That is an assumption a lot of people are making, yes.

Me, I favor having the trigger for "state of emergency" be "visible evidence of large Cardassian fleets massing," because that constitutes an emergency under present conditions whether the Cardassians have formally declared their intent to support Celos or not.

Conversely, if the Cardassians declare for Celos but don't overtly do anything, or if they do something like the Cuban Missile Crisis and send only a squadron or a convoy or something... That is simply not a Federation-wide, existential emergency. If we try to declare a state of emergency in response to something like that, it may result in Sousa being in hot water with the Federation's political structure after the crisis ends.
 
I don't think Cardassia would do that, and even if they did something like that, I defer to Sousa not being an idiot and Oneiros not offering trap options/interpreting votes in a hostile manner.

Most things happen logically, after all, and a Federation assault on Celos after the guarantee may simply be a pretext for Cardassia to DOW us in defending Celos; That's the most likely presumption if Cardassia declares but does not intervene immediately.
 
It's difficult to use the Apiata as advanced units because even if their fleet is impressive (80C at minimum, probably more like 100C now), the Sydraxians are literally one map square away. Sydraxian pressure acts as a check to Apiata offensive ability.

e: The opposite applies, however. The Apiata act as a check to Cardassian support of the Sydraxians if we choose to go after them first.
 
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