Jensaarai
Sing Victory Everlasting
- Pronouns
- They/Them
The usual specification you'd see in the technical manuals and whatnot is something like "maximum speed for 12 hours."
Linked contents
- Location
- Illinois
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Ok, I'm very sorry everyone. I read the tactical systems argument yesterday and saw repeated mentions of a tactical assessment as something Starfleet Tactical should be doing. I started writing just such an assessment then, and only finished it now. Now it does come to the conclusions I support, but hopefully in a clear and rational manner. Maybe the ideas in here can be helpful when we get to later design stages and even later ships, but think of it as an in-universe document that I am really hoping does not restart the argument. Maybe we can call it sidestory/omake. I've put it in spoilers since it ended up pretty long.
Project BRAHE Tactical Assessment
STFLT EYES ONLY
Project BRAHE seeks to produce a capable scientific support and survey vessel. BRAHE is also expected to serve as a testbed class for a number of experimental technologies, in particular: the warp 7 engine, type 2 warp coil, deflector shield, and prototype phaser beam system. BRAHE is likely to mass around 220,000 to 240,000 tons when completed, with most internal space reserved for scientific functions. This report seeks to assess the likely threat scenarios for Project BRAHE vessels, and recommend self-defense armament accordingly, keeping in mind the primarily scientific function of the design. Given highly limited fleet numbers following the Earth-Romulan War, BRAHE likely to operate alone at most times. Support likely to be .5-2 days away at maximum warp.
Section I: Likely Threats
Cosmozoan: Threat from spaceborne life is variable. Capabilities may be unusual, and must be assessed by vessel upon encounter.
Class I: Limited Tactical Capability
Class I threat vessels are limited in capability and/or technology. Class I threats include small-scale pirate vessels, low-technology powers, and more capable pirate craft.
Class Ia: Ia covers most pirate vessels and vessels from newly warp capable groups. Armament likely equivalent to ZHENG HE or early STINGRAY class ships. Vessels likely capable of Warp 3.
Class Ib: Class Ib vessels include high capability pirate craft and very small warships from major threat powers such as RED, along with warships of minor powers. Size and overall armament may be similar to STINGRAY or SKATE class ships. Likely Warp 5 capable.
Class Ic: Small threat vessels capable of warp 7 or higher. LIME vessels preserving old technology may fall into this category.
Class II: Substantial Tactical Capability
Class II threat vessels are larger in size or more technologically advanced than Class I vessels. Class II vessels include highly capable old-technology pirate vessels and small or medium warships of threat powers.
Class IIa: Threat vessels limited to warp 5. Vessels armed more heavily than STINGRAY class ships. Damage output similar to ENTERPRISE or SKATE class ships. Most RED and GREEN warships fall into this category.
Class IIb: Threat vessels capable of warp 7 or higher. These vessels are similar in armament to Class IIa, but are more threatening due to higher speed. Threats of this type are extremely dangerous. LIME vessels preserving old technology may fall into this category by speed alone.
Class III: Tactical Overmatch
Class III vessels are equivalent in tactical capability to THUNDERCHILD class ships.
Analysis: BRAHE is 180% the mass of the STINGRAY and 60% the mass of the ENTERPRISE. Given scientific focus, tactical overmatch is likely only possible against Class I vessels. Class IIa vessels may be escapable at high warp. Class IIb threat vessels must be dealt with by scientific or diplomatic means.
Section II: Threat Scenarios
Scenario I: Planetary Survey Encounter, Low Sublight, UFP Claimed Space
Project BRAHE in orbit of planetary body within Federation claimed space, conducting survey. 2 shuttlepods in atmosphere of planet on mapping mission. Class I threat vessel emerges from behind planetary shadow and demands Project BRAHE exit system immediately due to mining claim. BRAHE informs threat vessel that BRAHE is within UFP claimed space. Threat vessel disregards UFP claim and again demands BRAHE exit system without smallcraft recovery. BRAHE begins smallcraft recovery. Threat vessel fires upon BRAHE.
Tactical Requirements and Solution: Priority requirement is for BRAHE to finish smallcraft recovery, achievable with advanced defenses such as shields. Secondary requirement is for BRAHE to be able to sustain UFP claim to system, or to establish detente with threat vessel in order to negotiate claim. Class Ia or Ib threat vessels likely in this scenario, particularly Ia. Detente or threat defeat requires armament between early and current refit STINGRAY class ships, estimate 2-3 phasers and 1 torpedo to match. Defeat of Ia class vessels probable with this armament. Defeat of 1b vessels less likely, but detente should be possible to establish.
Scenario II: First Contact Encounter, High Sublight, UFP Claimed Border Space
Project BRAHE enters system at mid to high impulse near edge of UFP claimed space. 2 Class Ia threat vessels from unknown power demand BRAHE leave system. BRAHE transmits UFP claim. Threat vessels fire upon BRAHE with early phase cannon equivalent to demonstrate resolve.
Tactical Requirements and Solution: Priority requirement is for BRAHE to establish detente and communications in order to negotiate. Establishment of detente can be achieved with minimal armament, 2-3 phasers. Torpedo fire unnecessary.
Scenario III: Major Power Confrontation, High Sublight and Warp Flight, UFP Claimed Border Space
Project BRAHE enters system at mid to high impulse near edge of UFP claimed space. Class Ib threat vessel equivalent to SKATE class from RED demands BRAHE surrender for entering Red territory. Red threat vessel highly belligerent, belonging to minor faction inside Red. BRAHE transmits UFP claim and issues distress call, moves to exit system at high impulse. Threat vessel fires on BRAHE with 2 disruptor cannons and one torpedo tube. BRAHE returns fire and goes to warp, moving towards nearest friendly vessel, 6 hours away with both vessels at maximum warp. Red bandit pursues.
Tactical Requirements and Solution: Priority requirement is for BRAHE to escape Red bandit. BRAHE weapons must cover rear arc of vessel. Once at warp, engagement can only be done by torpedoes in this scenario. BRAHE should have higher maximum warp factor than Class Ib threat vessel, but must escape threat torpedo range. This scenario suggests a rear torpedo launch requirement.
Scenario IV: Pirate Raid, Warp Flight, UFP Claimed Space
Project BRAHE at cruise of warp 5. Class 1b vessel approaches BRAHE at warp 3, appearing to be a civilian freighter. Threat vessel then accelerates to warp 5 sprint to merge warp fields with BRAHE. Threat vessel closes and fires on BRAHE. Threat vessel seeks to disable shields and board in order to acquire BRAHE prototype technology.
Tactical Requirements and Solution: Priority requirement is for BRAHE to escape threat vessel. Threat vessel will immediately seek to disable BRAHE warp capability, or force BRAHE to warp 5 or below. BRAHE weapons should cover nacelles. BRAHE should move to maximum warp as soon as possible. This scenario suggests a rear torpedo launch requirement and phaser coverage requirement.
Scenario V: Pirate Intercept, Warp Flight and High Sublight, UFP Claimed Space
Project BRAHE at cruise of warp 5. BRAHE receives distress call from civilian vessel under attack by Class Ia pirate threat vessel. BRAHE is 1 hour away from civilian vessel at maximum warp, nearest SKATE class patrol vessel is 3 hours, though distance is identical. BRAHE moves to maximum warp and intercepts threat vessel attempting to board civilian. Civilian vessel is forced out of warp by time of BRAHE arrival.
Tactical Requirements and Solution: Priority requirement is for BRAHE to disable threat vessel and render aid to civilian. BRAHE can only engage with torpedoes, if available forward, until warp bubble merge. On arrival to civilian vessel, BRAHE armed with 2-3 phasers and possible torpedo launcher should be capable of defeating or dissuading Class Ia threat vessel.
Section III: Conclusions
Project BRAHE armament should be established at a level to defeat or deter Class I threat vessels, and escape Class IIa threat vessels. BRAHE is likely to operate alone given limited fleet numbers, and outpaces all current potential escorts. Defeat or deterrence of Class I threat vessels ensures that BRAHE is able to: defeat local pirates, press or negotiate UFP system claims against pirates and independent mining groups, render aid to civilian vessels, and establish deterrence and communications with initially hostile vessels.
The following is necessary to achieve this aim: directed energy weapons capable of full coverage of the vessel, including the nacelles. This document estimates 3 phaser turrets or phase cannons in order to ensure coverage. The following is also preferred: 1 torpedo launcher, preferably mounted to fire in the aft arc, to deter or defeat pursuing threat vessels at warp. While fore torpedo coverage is advantageous in circumstances in which the BRAHE initiates combat, this scenario is a secondary concern, as more modern patrol-capable vessels with the Warp 7 engine come online. This armament is superior technologically, but inferior in number, to that mounted on the STINGRAY class. BRAHE masses 1.8 times that of the STINGRAY, suggesting that this armament should not substantially affect primary scientific functions, particularly with the reduction to one torpedo launcher, substantially more massive internally than the directed energy armament.
STFLT EYES ONLY
Project BRAHE seeks to produce a capable scientific support and survey vessel. BRAHE is also expected to serve as a testbed class for a number of experimental technologies, in particular: the warp 7 engine, type 2 warp coil, deflector shield, and prototype phaser beam system. BRAHE is likely to mass around 220,000 to 240,000 tons when completed, with most internal space reserved for scientific functions. This report seeks to assess the likely threat scenarios for Project BRAHE vessels, and recommend self-defense armament accordingly, keeping in mind the primarily scientific function of the design. Given highly limited fleet numbers following the Earth-Romulan War, BRAHE likely to operate alone at most times. Support likely to be .5-2 days away at maximum warp.
Section I: Likely Threats
Cosmozoan: Threat from spaceborne life is variable. Capabilities may be unusual, and must be assessed by vessel upon encounter.
Class I: Limited Tactical Capability
Class I threat vessels are limited in capability and/or technology. Class I threats include small-scale pirate vessels, low-technology powers, and more capable pirate craft.
Class Ia: Ia covers most pirate vessels and vessels from newly warp capable groups. Armament likely equivalent to ZHENG HE or early STINGRAY class ships. Vessels likely capable of Warp 3.
Class Ib: Class Ib vessels include high capability pirate craft and very small warships from major threat powers such as RED, along with warships of minor powers. Size and overall armament may be similar to STINGRAY or SKATE class ships. Likely Warp 5 capable.
Class Ic: Small threat vessels capable of warp 7 or higher. LIME vessels preserving old technology may fall into this category.
Class II: Substantial Tactical Capability
Class II threat vessels are larger in size or more technologically advanced than Class I vessels. Class II vessels include highly capable old-technology pirate vessels and small or medium warships of threat powers.
Class IIa: Threat vessels limited to warp 5. Vessels armed more heavily than STINGRAY class ships. Damage output similar to ENTERPRISE or SKATE class ships. Most RED and GREEN warships fall into this category.
Class IIb: Threat vessels capable of warp 7 or higher. These vessels are similar in armament to Class IIa, but are more threatening due to higher speed. Threats of this type are extremely dangerous. LIME vessels preserving old technology may fall into this category by speed alone.
Class III: Tactical Overmatch
Class III vessels are equivalent in tactical capability to THUNDERCHILD class ships.
Analysis: BRAHE is 180% the mass of the STINGRAY and 60% the mass of the ENTERPRISE. Given scientific focus, tactical overmatch is likely only possible against Class I vessels. Class IIa vessels may be escapable at high warp. Class IIb threat vessels must be dealt with by scientific or diplomatic means.
Section II: Threat Scenarios
Scenario I: Planetary Survey Encounter, Low Sublight, UFP Claimed Space
Project BRAHE in orbit of planetary body within Federation claimed space, conducting survey. 2 shuttlepods in atmosphere of planet on mapping mission. Class I threat vessel emerges from behind planetary shadow and demands Project BRAHE exit system immediately due to mining claim. BRAHE informs threat vessel that BRAHE is within UFP claimed space. Threat vessel disregards UFP claim and again demands BRAHE exit system without smallcraft recovery. BRAHE begins smallcraft recovery. Threat vessel fires upon BRAHE.
Tactical Requirements and Solution: Priority requirement is for BRAHE to finish smallcraft recovery, achievable with advanced defenses such as shields. Secondary requirement is for BRAHE to be able to sustain UFP claim to system, or to establish detente with threat vessel in order to negotiate claim. Class Ia or Ib threat vessels likely in this scenario, particularly Ia. Detente or threat defeat requires armament between early and current refit STINGRAY class ships, estimate 2-3 phasers and 1 torpedo to match. Defeat of Ia class vessels probable with this armament. Defeat of 1b vessels less likely, but detente should be possible to establish.
Scenario II: First Contact Encounter, High Sublight, UFP Claimed Border Space
Project BRAHE enters system at mid to high impulse near edge of UFP claimed space. 2 Class Ia threat vessels from unknown power demand BRAHE leave system. BRAHE transmits UFP claim. Threat vessels fire upon BRAHE with early phase cannon equivalent to demonstrate resolve.
Tactical Requirements and Solution: Priority requirement is for BRAHE to establish detente and communications in order to negotiate. Establishment of detente can be achieved with minimal armament, 2-3 phasers. Torpedo fire unnecessary.
Scenario III: Major Power Confrontation, High Sublight and Warp Flight, UFP Claimed Border Space
Project BRAHE enters system at mid to high impulse near edge of UFP claimed space. Class Ib threat vessel equivalent to SKATE class from RED demands BRAHE surrender for entering Red territory. Red threat vessel highly belligerent, belonging to minor faction inside Red. BRAHE transmits UFP claim and issues distress call, moves to exit system at high impulse. Threat vessel fires on BRAHE with 2 disruptor cannons and one torpedo tube. BRAHE returns fire and goes to warp, moving towards nearest friendly vessel, 6 hours away with both vessels at maximum warp. Red bandit pursues.
Tactical Requirements and Solution: Priority requirement is for BRAHE to escape Red bandit. BRAHE weapons must cover rear arc of vessel. Once at warp, engagement can only be done by torpedoes in this scenario. BRAHE should have higher maximum warp factor than Class Ib threat vessel, but must escape threat torpedo range. This scenario suggests a rear torpedo launch requirement.
Scenario IV: Pirate Raid, Warp Flight, UFP Claimed Space
Project BRAHE at cruise of warp 5. Class 1b vessel approaches BRAHE at warp 3, appearing to be a civilian freighter. Threat vessel then accelerates to warp 5 sprint to merge warp fields with BRAHE. Threat vessel closes and fires on BRAHE. Threat vessel seeks to disable shields and board in order to acquire BRAHE prototype technology.
Tactical Requirements and Solution: Priority requirement is for BRAHE to escape threat vessel. Threat vessel will immediately seek to disable BRAHE warp capability, or force BRAHE to warp 5 or below. BRAHE weapons should cover nacelles. BRAHE should move to maximum warp as soon as possible. This scenario suggests a rear torpedo launch requirement and phaser coverage requirement.
Scenario V: Pirate Intercept, Warp Flight and High Sublight, UFP Claimed Space
Project BRAHE at cruise of warp 5. BRAHE receives distress call from civilian vessel under attack by Class Ia pirate threat vessel. BRAHE is 1 hour away from civilian vessel at maximum warp, nearest SKATE class patrol vessel is 3 hours, though distance is identical. BRAHE moves to maximum warp and intercepts threat vessel attempting to board civilian. Civilian vessel is forced out of warp by time of BRAHE arrival.
Tactical Requirements and Solution: Priority requirement is for BRAHE to disable threat vessel and render aid to civilian. BRAHE can only engage with torpedoes, if available forward, until warp bubble merge. On arrival to civilian vessel, BRAHE armed with 2-3 phasers and possible torpedo launcher should be capable of defeating or dissuading Class Ia threat vessel.
Section III: Conclusions
Project BRAHE armament should be established at a level to defeat or deter Class I threat vessels, and escape Class IIa threat vessels. BRAHE is likely to operate alone given limited fleet numbers, and outpaces all current potential escorts. Defeat or deterrence of Class I threat vessels ensures that BRAHE is able to: defeat local pirates, press or negotiate UFP system claims against pirates and independent mining groups, render aid to civilian vessels, and establish deterrence and communications with initially hostile vessels.
The following is necessary to achieve this aim: directed energy weapons capable of full coverage of the vessel, including the nacelles. This document estimates 3 phaser turrets or phase cannons in order to ensure coverage. The following is also preferred: 1 torpedo launcher, preferably mounted to fire in the aft arc, to deter or defeat pursuing threat vessels at warp. While fore torpedo coverage is advantageous in circumstances in which the BRAHE initiates combat, this scenario is a secondary concern, as more modern patrol-capable vessels with the Warp 7 engine come online. This armament is superior technologically, but inferior in number, to that mounted on the STINGRAY class. BRAHE masses 1.8 times that of the STINGRAY, suggesting that this armament should not substantially affect primary scientific functions, particularly with the reduction to one torpedo launcher, substantially more massive internally than the directed energy armament.
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- Location
- Southern Virginia
That threat assessment is deeply flawed, since the purpose of Brahe-project vessels has nothing to do with asserting sovereignty or first contact. If confronted with a hostile presence the only course of action it needs to be calale of is turning around and leaving. A dedicated cruiser would follow up, and in any case these ships should not be operating close to known frontiers. They are internal survey vessels, not explorers.
I think the pirate threat is greatly overrated as well. Pirates are pirates to take valuable commodities that can be fenced back into the broader markets. Attacking Federation starships is both a waste of time as they do not carry any bulk commodities of value and attacking them is certain to get Starfleet to prioritize eliminating the pirates responsible. Pirates never fare well when a real power has reason to smash them to pieces. And anyway simply being able to run away is more than adequate.
[X] Sprint Configuration (+0.4 Maximum)
This ship is not a purpose-built testbed and it is already prototyping a bunch of new technology. It still needs to make sense within its own scope of work and for that neither experimental configuration is actually all that helpful for it. Sprint speed at least is useful for running away and the benefits of that nacelles configuration will help avoid another Warp 4.9 disappointment in a project that really needs to work as specced to help cement together the new Federation.
I think the pirate threat is greatly overrated as well. Pirates are pirates to take valuable commodities that can be fenced back into the broader markets. Attacking Federation starships is both a waste of time as they do not carry any bulk commodities of value and attacking them is certain to get Starfleet to prioritize eliminating the pirates responsible. Pirates never fare well when a real power has reason to smash them to pieces. And anyway simply being able to run away is more than adequate.
[X] Sprint Configuration (+0.4 Maximum)
This ship is not a purpose-built testbed and it is already prototyping a bunch of new technology. It still needs to make sense within its own scope of work and for that neither experimental configuration is actually all that helpful for it. Sprint speed at least is useful for running away and the benefits of that nacelles configuration will help avoid another Warp 4.9 disappointment in a project that really needs to work as specced to help cement together the new Federation.
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- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] Sprint Configuration (+0.4 Maximum)
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- He/Him
That's Starfleet Command's problem, not ours. Our next project is going to be the workhorse cruiser, anyways (barring surprise plotlines crashing into us).
LunaMoth
Wings of Kynareth is my comfort song...
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- He/They
This thing is not a patrol boat please don't turn it into a warship just because it could possibly need to respond to distress calls at some point, we already have two ship types that fit in the patrol boat role and just need a refit.
- Location
- Australia
While I don't disagree, I'll point out if we engineer it with too much emphasis on problem solving the price will mean a longer wait before they can get to building the ships actually made to fulfil that purpose, as well as mean we will have less science ships for actually surveying.
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- He/Him
What calls? Does Earth currently have any meaningful offworld population that isn't a smouldering radioactive crater, courtesy of the Romulans?
United Earth Starfleet hasn't been folded over into a larger Federation-wide institution yet. That will change soon, I'm sure, but it will be easier to justify seconding Starfleet to the Federation once we actually have a fleet again.
- Location
- France
- Pronouns
- She/They
I don't think all Humans retreated to Earth and even if they somehow did, they're going to go right back to spreading around now that the peace is signed. We can also answer calls from our allies even if our structures haven't been folded together yet.
I don't think this means this ship should be equally able to perform all roles, but we have plenty of internals and will probably have opportunities to give it secondary capabilities and being capable of warp 7 means it'll get opportunities to use those.
StriderInCosmos
Wanderer in the Worldsea
- Location
- Somewhere in... Terminal Dogma? I think?
And all told, we'll be making a much more capable vessel for answering any sort of distress calls that come our way after this, whether it's the explorer or the utility cruiser. Right now, there's no need to make this ship class a hero, seeing as it'll probably be staying in its lane and poking off any cosmozoa or small attack craft insane enough to buzz something like the Brahe project.
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- He/Him
And that line of thinking changed the NX project from a science-focused research and exploration ship into a utility cruiser. A useful role, but not what we as a thread voted to do in this case. For this ship, we should keep our focus on sensors, lab space and computing. Calls for involved engineering tasks (supporting the construction of a fixed research outpost and so forth) are what the utility cruiser will be for.
It wasn't a science focused research ship in canon, *either*.
- Location
- France
- Pronouns
- She/They
No? What would make this fail at being a science ship is not doubling on science. But if we double tap the science lab and we still have a little bit of room we can and should think about what calls it's most likely to have to answer in the period where it's our only warp 7 capable ship.
I don't think engineering is our best use here to be clear. It did show itself to have upsides in the previous quests but I think some cargo handling so it can carry a few valuables around is probably a cheaper way to give this an useful secondary role it can help with in a pinch, and could also be relevant if it want to bring bigger samples back home. A med bay could also be a consideration since that would benefit a lot from fast response times and it's unlikely the utility ship will have the space.
- Location
- Somewhere in the Ashes
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- She/Her
That's an SFB Gorn ship.
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- He/Him
We explicitly and deliberately broke from canon, so I don't see what this has to do with anything? We chose non-science options in place of science options, so the ship's focus shifted away from science to tactical and engineering. That was a result of our choices, and personally I think a good outcome overall, given the design's performance in repelling the Romulans.
But it doesn't change the fact that we turned that ship into a decidedly non-science focused design.
Bio-labs are still labs!
I was saying it was never science focused ever, and pretending it was is .. kinda weird. It was always a explorer.
- Location
- United States
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] Parallel Configuration (+0.2 Cruise/Maximum) (Prototype) [1 Success Check]
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- He/Him
And we turned down the opportunity to focus that ship more heavily on science. Which is fine! But Project Brahe is a science ship; let's keep focus on scientific instrumentation once the opportunity arises.
- Location
- Columbus, OH
[X] Parallel Configuration (+0.2 Cruise/Maximum) (Prototype) [1 Success Check]
I just had a thought - there's very little in the timeline for the next, what, century? Ninety years, at least? That sure is a long time where the Federation expanded and explored and nothing worth remembering happened. At least, in the original cannon. Sure, there was probably a lot of antipiracy efforts and carefully-not-provoking-the-Klingons, but no wars, no famous explorers, and no major treaties outside the general structure of founding the Federation. I'm excited to see what happens in this new timeline.
One thing that occurs to me is that TOS seems to have involved a lot of long-distance trips that weren't practical later. Edge of the galaxy, center of the galaxy, whatever. Perhaps this involved an unusual period of unstable-but-traversable wormhole activity. That, along with increasing Klingon rivalry might mark the transition period between the early Federation and the TOS era.
I just had a thought - there's very little in the timeline for the next, what, century? Ninety years, at least? That sure is a long time where the Federation expanded and explored and nothing worth remembering happened. At least, in the original cannon. Sure, there was probably a lot of antipiracy efforts and carefully-not-provoking-the-Klingons, but no wars, no famous explorers, and no major treaties outside the general structure of founding the Federation. I'm excited to see what happens in this new timeline.
One thing that occurs to me is that TOS seems to have involved a lot of long-distance trips that weren't practical later. Edge of the galaxy, center of the galaxy, whatever. Perhaps this involved an unusual period of unstable-but-traversable wormhole activity. That, along with increasing Klingon rivalry might mark the transition period between the early Federation and the TOS era.
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