I'm going to be more than a little annoyed if we are prevented from selecting standard or heavy strength Shield systems of either type because we chose to stay under Starfleet's explicitly stated mass limit of 200kT. It would be a very counterintuitive design choice.
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2231: Project Constitution (Shields)
[X] Aft Phaser, Aft Torpedo (Cost 73 -> 79.25) [Second Tranche: 67 -> 73.25]
While not the most fiscally conservative decision you could have made the addition of an aft phaser bank and torpedo launcher will hopefully give the Constitution a stronger punch in any one-on-one engagements where manoeuvrability is expected to be a major factor and any stern chases. Although you've given the design teeth the matter of tactical mitigation is not one to be neglected. As it stands you have a number of different choices as to how the shield system should be configured.
The most straightforward and proven technology is the Type-1 shield, and a regular mount would provide the ship with a basic defensive bubble for the lowest cost you can manage. Alternatively if you are willing to be less efficient you could add redundancies and more robust emitter systems to channel more power, producing a 30% improvement in shield integrity for a 15% increase in cost for the starship as a whole.
The more daring option is to switch to covariant shields. A light shield grid would produce the same performance as the standard Type-1 with a more expensive initial construction batch, but then the second tranche with the technology's implementation ironed out would ship with quite a reasonable price. Much the same applies to the standard Covariant generators, which would have a heavier up-front cost and then normalise to only about 2% more expensive than the Type-1 heavy.
For maximum performance a heavy covariant-based emitter system would get you the strongest shields possible, a full 20% stronger than what the standard heavy can provide. The catch, of course, is the added expense. In addition to a major outlay of funds and resources for the prototypes the added complexity of the heavier system will still leave it a financially hefty course of action even after all the kinks are smoothed out.
The choice is yours, but once the shields are in place you will have the final cost of the Constitution Project, for better or for worse.
[ ] Type-1 Standard [27 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 84.75) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 78.75]
[ ] Type-1 Heavy [36 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 97.25) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 91.25]
[ ] Light Covariant [27 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 96) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 86.75]
[ ] Standard Covariant [36 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 104.75) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 93.75]
[ ] Heavy Covariant [44 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 116.75) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 103.25]
Two Hour Moratorium, Please
While not the most fiscally conservative decision you could have made the addition of an aft phaser bank and torpedo launcher will hopefully give the Constitution a stronger punch in any one-on-one engagements where manoeuvrability is expected to be a major factor and any stern chases. Although you've given the design teeth the matter of tactical mitigation is not one to be neglected. As it stands you have a number of different choices as to how the shield system should be configured.
The most straightforward and proven technology is the Type-1 shield, and a regular mount would provide the ship with a basic defensive bubble for the lowest cost you can manage. Alternatively if you are willing to be less efficient you could add redundancies and more robust emitter systems to channel more power, producing a 30% improvement in shield integrity for a 15% increase in cost for the starship as a whole.
The more daring option is to switch to covariant shields. A light shield grid would produce the same performance as the standard Type-1 with a more expensive initial construction batch, but then the second tranche with the technology's implementation ironed out would ship with quite a reasonable price. Much the same applies to the standard Covariant generators, which would have a heavier up-front cost and then normalise to only about 2% more expensive than the Type-1 heavy.
For maximum performance a heavy covariant-based emitter system would get you the strongest shields possible, a full 20% stronger than what the standard heavy can provide. The catch, of course, is the added expense. In addition to a major outlay of funds and resources for the prototypes the added complexity of the heavier system will still leave it a financially hefty course of action even after all the kinks are smoothed out.
The choice is yours, but once the shields are in place you will have the final cost of the Constitution Project, for better or for worse.
[ ] Type-1 Standard [27 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 84.75) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 78.75]
[ ] Type-1 Heavy [36 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 97.25) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 91.25]
[ ] Light Covariant [27 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 96) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 86.75]
[ ] Standard Covariant [36 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 104.75) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 93.75]
[ ] Heavy Covariant [44 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 116.75) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 103.25]
Two Hour Moratorium, Please
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Which is why it's likely just a case of a brain bug infecting a few posters and since shields haven't been the topic before now never really getting properly corrected.
If it was limited based on 'hull size' it'd say per 100kt, up to X.
Yes, shields multiply with weapons. But lower price multiplies with both. If we pay 25% more for shields, that means for the same price we bought 20% less weapons. This is the big issue with the large covariant. We get more shield power per ship, but only very slightly more across the entire build, and we lose significantly on firepower, so overall our combined shields×weapons goes down.
The Canon Connie massed 190kt and had Heavy Shields, that's only 10kt more than our 180kt design.
I highly doubt that that a drop of 10kt when both designs are sub 200kt will be the cutoff from Heavy, much less Standard Shields.
Edit: Ninja'd by QM, Heavy Shields are on the menu
I highly doubt that that a drop of 10kt when both designs are sub 200kt will be the cutoff from Heavy, much less Standard Shields.
Edit: Ninja'd by QM, Heavy Shields are on the menu
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If we got the option to build the megaprise i would have voted for that!
I think the sagarmarthas were bigger.
Well we have the answer now and we do in fact get all options.
- Location
- in between
[ ] Type-1 Heavy [36 Shields] (Cost 79.25 -> 97.25) [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 91.25]
[ ] Standard Covariant [36 Shields] (Cost 79.25 -> 104.75) [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 93.75]
[ ] Heavy Covariant [44 Shields] (Cost 79.25 -> 116.75) [Second Tranche: 73.25 ->103.25]
Anything less is unacceptably frail for the purpose of killing Klingon cruisers.
[ ] Standard Covariant [36 Shields] (Cost 79.25 -> 104.75) [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 93.75]
[ ] Heavy Covariant [44 Shields] (Cost 79.25 -> 116.75) [Second Tranche: 73.25 ->103.25]
Anything less is unacceptably frail for the purpose of killing Klingon cruisers.
A 7.5 cost difference in the initial tranche, brought down to 2.5 in the later ones.
Could go either way on this, tbh, though I'd like to help advance shield tech a bit earlier than it would be, help iron out the kinks for the next class before it has to start with them.
I feel like saving two cost to go with the large standards is kind of a waste of time and money, though. Second tranche is only two cost less, and we really do need to get the covariant shields up and running.
Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
[ ] Standard Covariant [36 Shields] (Cost 79.25 -> 104.75) [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 93.75]
This is the way to go, more expensive initial tranche, but afterwards the cost is negligible compared to Heavy Type-1, and it advances the technology, while getting equal performance. Lean into us having a wealthier Federation. I don't think this'll cost us a meaningful number of spaceframes compared to Heavy Type-1 at least, which is the alternative.
This is the way to go, more expensive initial tranche, but afterwards the cost is negligible compared to Heavy Type-1, and it advances the technology, while getting equal performance. Lean into us having a wealthier Federation. I don't think this'll cost us a meaningful number of spaceframes compared to Heavy Type-1 at least, which is the alternative.
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Strunkriidiisk
THE LEGEND
- Location
- Canada
- Pronouns
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[ ] Standard Covariant [36 Shields] (Cost 79.25 -> 104.75) [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 93.75]
[ ] Heavy Covariant [44 Shields] (Cost 79.25 -> 116.75) [Second Tranche: 73.25 ->103.25]
Standard or Heavy Covariant IMO.
There's no need for the poverty-spec option; taking Heavy Type-1 doesnt provide enough savings in the longterm to offset the longerterm malus to technological development of our shield tech.
NSMS
Probably evil, unfortunately.
- Location
- A rapidly widening tear in the fabric of reality
Okay, so we have final costs varying between 84.75/78.75 and 116.75/103.25, depending upon what we pick. Cost is a VERY important factor to consider here, because at the upper end it's over 20% of the cost of another min-shield ship.
My gut instinct says go for one of the 36 shield options, but I'm not sure which I prefer. 97.25/91.25 versus 104.75/93.75 is a very noticeable cost increase for the first run, but after that it's not really much different (about the cost of a torpedo launcher). Is that initial cost worth advancing the shield tech? I honestly don't know...
My gut instinct says go for one of the 36 shield options, but I'm not sure which I prefer. 97.25/91.25 versus 104.75/93.75 is a very noticeable cost increase for the first run, but after that it's not really much different (about the cost of a torpedo launcher). Is that initial cost worth advancing the shield tech? I honestly don't know...
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[ ] Type-1 Heavy [36 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 97.25) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 91.25]
We need, imo, the rush build on powerful ships. The covariant advance will only help in an uncertain future, having these ships in the greatest possible combination of numbers and effectiveness with the lowest possible risk is what's important now.
We need, imo, the rush build on powerful ships. The covariant advance will only help in an uncertain future, having these ships in the greatest possible combination of numbers and effectiveness with the lowest possible risk is what's important now.
The malus is five years when we are staring down an invasion now. It will likely be decades before another conflict- what are the chances that we need the shield tech in exactly that window?
Oh. It'll suck for the first tranche, which is bad, but starting with the second tranche it'll be a negligible cost difference vs a heavy standard.
That... Is making the decision somewhat harder.
darkstarling
Brilliantly Crazed
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So it looks like a Light Covarient Shield Grid will give us a small initial run in the lead up to the war but then the ships we make DURING the war will accelerate.
I was already planning Light Covarient, and I see no reason to change it. The heavier covarient shielding is just too expensive.
I was already planning Light Covarient, and I see no reason to change it. The heavier covarient shielding is just too expensive.
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This is an untested prototype so it can also fail and leave us with lower shield power on the first tranche.
Mechanis
Confirmed Extremely Screwed
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I'm not sure how you reach the conclusion that stronger shields somehow make the powerful weapons load we've already paid for weaker, but you do you.
As mentioned, I will shill for the large Covariants till I am blue in the face, but I expect that the Standard Covariant will be what has enough traction to win it for Team Let's Advance Our Shield Technology Please.
1000% agree. I do not want a glass cannon, I want a Battlecruiser that will meme all over the D6 effortlessly and hopefully still meme on the D7 in every conceivable combat metric.
Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
That being said, these are also significantly more mobile than the canon Connie, so we could probably get away with Light Covariant, which'll potentially let us field one more hull in every additional tranche after the initial draw, while still advancing the tech.
Endorfinator
Awkwardly Social
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- California
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Standard Covariant, helps advance the technology and the price difference is tolerable
Plus, in the grand scheme of things a 7.5 for the initial tranche and then 2.5 for all those that follow is rather negligible. Our cost savings from only getting side front phasers will cover for most of the former and all of the latter.
[ ] Standard Covariant [36 Shields] (Cost 79.25 -> 104.75) [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 93.75]
this vibes
this vibes