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RHUNRIKKI STROLLAR (Warhammer Fantasy Golden Age Dwarf Runelord Quest)

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On Thread Etiquette:
I'm not going to weigh in on the logic of either side's arguments, but I will ask that everyone read over what they write and really consider if the words they used are polite and won't be inflammatory intentionally or not. You cant account for people's tolerances perfectly but at least try to say your piece without saying things that can be easily construed as overly dismissive of the other side of the argument, thank you.

Please endeavour to be cordial. :^)
 
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My expectation is that a non-prosthetic Rune of Windsight *requires* a Master Rune, otherwise it's going to be such a finagly bitch that even the Dawi, masters of finagly bitch precision nonsense, can't accept it.
 
BungieONI said:
I'll be interested in an apprentice after this next part of Windsight where we figure out how to do it without maiming. Gives us the right environment to entirely revamp the teaching curriculum. Which is probably round turn 62 or 63 tbh given the war and megadragon.
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I think this would be a mistake. We still understand little about both the results of our observations and the influence of the observation itself. Breaking a teaching methodology that has been refined over thousands of years and starting to experiment on an apprenticeseems irresponsible and dangerous to me
 
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ArchAIngel said:
My expectation is that a non-prosthetic Rune of Windsight *requires* a Master Rune, otherwise it's going to be such a finagly bitch that even the Dawi, masters of finagly bitch precision nonsense, can't accept it.
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Bah, Beardling thinks a little hard delicate work is too much for wind sight. Runesmiths have been working for Millennia without progress, or even hope of a possible end goal. Yet, you are giving it on a gromil platter and you still think you can complain about how difficult it is to make. BAH! Do what any self respecting Runesmiths does when a rune isn't exactly what you need, research and work on it until it works the way you want it. Lazy beardling…In my day we…*incoherent grumbling*
 
mmgaballah said:
has that been out right stated ? , cause I don't see a reason we can't fit the relevant rune on a lens and call it a day unless the gm rules it otherwise
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Rule of Form, we do not know a lens form for the Windsight rune. It's an accounting abstraction to say for instance 'Snori knows how to put the Rune of Fire on arms, armor and banners', what's really happening is he knows a version of the Rune of Fire that can work in those circumstances . The only runes for which this is not the case are the Ancestor Runes.

Personally I do not think a lens form existsm, but we will have to see.
 
...Oh if we become an Ancestor God the removal of an eye in exchange for Windsight is going to become a whole symbolic thing isn't it? even if we make a version that doesn't require maiming, it's probably going to end up being a monocle/eyepatch out of tradition eventually. I don't know how to feel about that.
 
DragonParadox said:
Rule of Form, we do not know a lens form for the Windsight rune. It's an accounting abstraction to say for instance 'Snori knows how to put the Rune of Fire on arms, armor and banners', what's really happening is he knows a version of the Rune of Fire that can work in those circumstances . The only runes for which this is not the case are the Ancestor Runes.

Personally I do not think a lens form existsm, but we will have to see.
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Rule of Form also calls out that runes cannot be engraved on brittle materials. With glass, leather, ceramics and paper being called out specifically as being unable to be used to carve runes on.
 
theretrodragon said:
...Oh if we become an Ancestor God the removal of an eye in exchange for Windsight is going to become a whole symbolic thing isn't it? even if we make a version that doesn't require maiming, it's probably going to end up being a monocle/eyepatch out of tradition eventually. I don't know how to feel about that.
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Personally I feel fine, it's not like they lose functionality. I'm not going to lose sleep over the most mild kind of dwarf cybernetics culture imaginable. 'Oh no you need to replace one of your meat eyes in order to comprehend the secrets of the universe and master untold arcane secrets'.
 
Vuus said:
I think this would be a mistake. We still understand little about both the results of our observations and the influence of the observation itself. Breaking a teaching methodology that has been refined over thousands of years and starting to experiment on an apprenticeseems irresponsible and dangerous to me
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Not really what I had in mind - I don't intend to break it. The pedagogy itself? The physical exercise, the lectures, the cryptic riddles, the coded written lessons I don't see any reason to change. How Snorri teaches doesn't need to change much, or at all, I don't think. What I'm talking about is the curricula, the content the pedagogy provides. By revamping the teaching curricula I mean taking a look at the statements made to apprentices and then changing the ones that are wrong. As well as being able to explain more of what is going on - for example, teaching the kid about the Winds from the ground up or the stilling field.

By turn 63 we'd have 16 progress into Understand Runecraft, and have resolved the Stilling Field issue. Which is about triple where we'll be at the end of this turn. This is also the turn I expect to be the latest before I'd want to grab an apprentice and the earliest is 62.

Dutch said:
Rule of Form also calls out that runes cannot be engraved on brittle materials. With glass, leather, ceramics and paper being called out specifically as being unable to be used to carve runes on.
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True! Though Snerra seems to have figured out a way around that with her Rune of Piercing Sight on its specialized glass (or maybe gemstone?) lenses.
 
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tri2 said:
im willing to vote to take an apprentice WHEN we don't have a mega gronti project, a war going on, and after karstah learns how to train an apprentice from us and we finish up our current windsight related research.
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To be honest, if the people's conditions for taking on a new apprentice are when we have some time on our hands and aren't working on something important then we're never going to be taking on a new apprentice. I genuinely can't remember the last time we didn't have multiple time-sensitive irons in the fire with more on the way. I think it's been actual, out of quest years.
 
TheDuke said:
To be honest, if the people's conditions for taking on a new apprentice are when we have some time on our hands and aren't working on something important then we're never going to be taking on a new apprentice. I genuinely can't remember the last time we didn't have multiple time-sensitive irons in the fire with more on the way. I think it's been actual, out of quest years.
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i mean i would like us to finish our current backlog at least cause they kinda either very important and/or time sensitive
 
theretrodragon said:
...Oh if we become an Ancestor God the removal of an eye in exchange for Windsight is going to become a whole symbolic thing isn't it? even if we make a version that doesn't require maiming, it's probably going to end up being a monocle/eyepatch out of tradition eventually. I don't know how to feel about that.
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Not if Granny Valaya and Her cult has to say about it:

soulcake said:
(*New*)[ ] [Difficult] Extra-sensory Pt. 2: [Cost: 8 actions] Master of the Odd will proc. Gain progress towards Understanding Runecraft. Karstah's creations will now add progress to Understand Runecraft. Improving the Rune of Windsight, or finding a way to provide an equivalent level of detail without needing the user to maim themselves is the goal. Otherwise you're limited to people missing eyes, assuming that you don't want the Cult of Valaya turning around and sending you to meet with the Ancestor Queen Herself. Which is a safe assumption to make.
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Wait a bit after we cleared the bar to let the Masters crack that but without maiming themselves first, before we release improved version of the rune.
 
tri2 said:
i mean i would like us to finish our current backlog at least cause they kinda either very important and/or time sensitive
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Right, but by the time we finish our current backlog of very important and/or time sensitive things to do there will probably be a whole new backlog of important and/or time sensitive things to do. Conclude the war with the Fimir? Now there's an opportunity to faff about on Albion or Ulthuan we don't want to miss. Finish our Windsight research? Now that's chained into a near breakthrough with Akazit or what have you that we really want to get done. We've been working through a continuous string of important and/or time sensitive things every turn for the past, like, 40 turns. If the condition for accepting new apprentices is "when we haven't got any important stuff coming up" then we're never going to be accepting new apprentices because there's always important stuff coming up. I'm pretty sure bird yells responded to me with a meme joking about this exact dilemma like five odd years ago.
 
MoonSerpent said:
Wait a bit after we cleared the bar to let the Masters crack that but without maiming themselves first, before we release improved version of the rune.
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I'm pretty sure there are plenty of Runelords who would tell the cult of Valaya to stay out of their business while fetching the eye-poking spike. Again I do not think there is a non-sacrificial way to do this because you do not see magic with your eyes, that is just how the brain translates it, you see it with your soul. Something you can take on and off at will won't integrate properly.
 
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I actually like the whole Odin aesthetic thing (especially since Santa Claus is partly inspired by Odin) and also there is the conclusion that seemingly all cultures come to eventually:

Knowledge comes at a cost!

And to learn world shattering knowledge demands a sacrifice, somthing that will really cost you...
 
Honestly, loosing an eye is small price when looking at bigger picture but it is something runesmiths needed to think about REALLY HARD and quite possibly it will be limited to Master Runesmiths and higher.
 
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