Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
A friendly reminder to new questers to read the Informational threadmarks and FAQ specifically before asking a question. Links below:

Frequently Asked Questions
Here is the Detailed Rune List
Discord.

On Thread Etiquette:

I'm not going to weigh in on the logic of either side's arguments, but I will ask that everyone read over what they write and really consider if the words they used are polite and won't be inflammatory intentionally or not. You cant account for people's tolerances perfectly but at least try to say your piece without saying things that can be easily construed as overly dismissive of the other side of the argument, thank you.

Please endeavour to be cordial. :^)
 
Last edited:
@soulcake just for clarification:

Runemetal 2b is about figuring out a process that would be workable for other Runelords, right? And 3b would be distilling that process into something much more accessible to dwarves in general?
 
I think you are misremembering, soulcake actually said the opposite

This is partly why I want to do both comissions, the cults are the largest most powerful organizations we can gain standing with and it is very hard to gain that standing because of their existence as Karaz Ankor wide entities.

The update does nicely explain why the results of making chain were so muted, trust Snorri to keep it secret because he didn't do it properly to his own mind. Based on his criteria are we sure he's descended from Thungni not Morgrim?
I was basing that statement off of the requests when we took them which stated that the local guilds had approached us. And further, making enough equipment for every single elite of one of the cults in the entire Karaz Ankor is impractical for Snorri.

Yes, we get standing with the entire cult, because we help an important section of it but its not the entire thing's elites at once. There isn't much point for Soul to differentiate between Kraka Drakk's Valayans and Gazul worshipers and the rest of the empire since it isn't very relevant to us.

E: I don't agree with the assessment of it being our most important commission either, is the root of my objection. It's up there since its important sections of Kraka Drakk, but stuff like Kraka Grom, work for Otrek and others are of comparable scale.
 
Last edited:
I was basing that statement off of the requests when we took them which stated that the local guilds had approached us. And further, making enough equipment for every single elite of one of the cults in the entire Karaz Ankor is impractical for Snorri.

Yes, we get standing with the entire cult, because we help an important section of it but its not the entire thing's elites at once. There isn't much point for Soul to differentiate between Kraka Drakk's Valayans and Gazul worshipers and the rest of the empire since it isn't very relevant to us.

E: I don't agree with the assessment of it being our most important commission either, is the root of my objection. It's up there since its important sections of Kraka Drakk, but stuff like Kraka Grom, work for Otrek and others are of comparable scale.
I read the requests as the local cults contacting Snorri on behalf of the global organization, presumably as one of a number of different runesmiths contracted for the purpose of equipping all their elites with the completed armour being issued to people across the Karaz Ankor. I'm not sure I'd say they were the most important request we've ever gotten but I do think you can argue have the best reward out of the requests we've had due to the difficulty of gaining cult standing.

@soulcake can you confirm if the cult request are purely from the local part of the cult of from higher up?
 
I was basing that statement off of the requests when we took them which stated that the local guilds had approached us. And further, making enough equipment for every single elite of one of the cults in the entire Karaz Ankor is impractical for Snorri.
Both the Valaya and Gazul request talk about the coming wave of colonization. It sounds like those who will go and help with that will get our items. Having our work out there in two major Cults across the entire Karaz Ankor will help.
 
So Dwalin just happened to choose to educate his apprentice right near Snorri's workshop rather than anywhere else?

Dammit Snorri, your colleagues are right. Be more social!
 
Finally got caught up!

I must say, your story is surprisingly good at getting general feels across, and also in making the competent people seem actually competent.

New*)[ ] The Movement of Things Pt. 4: [Cost: (10 -1) =9 actions] Student of the Odd and Mind for Constructs will proc. With all of the extant examples of the Rune you now have thanks to your trade with Valma, you now have a deeper understanding of just what parts of it draws upon the Deep Magic. Improving the strength, efficiency and utility of the Rune of Waking can't be feasibly done through simple, relatively speaking, changes now. No, you can already tell that you'll have to manipulate the connection to the Deep Magic somehow.

(*Updated*)[ ] The Mind of Things Pt. 3: [Cost: (10 -3) =7 actions] Student of the Odd and Mind for Constructs will proc. The Rune of Forged Limb has made you curious. Due mostly to the fact that it shares a seemingly unnecessary connection to the Master Rune of Waking and a whole host of other Runes. What exactly lies behind such a concept? Understanding the connection between mind and body, and how Runes play into such a thing could prove valuable, perhaps even key, to not only for future prosthetics but maybe even more esoteric avenues of research. Bah, who's to say?

(*New*)[ ] The Happening of Things: [Cost: 8 actions] Student of the Odd will proc. The vision gnaws at you, a flame to the parchment of your mind. There is a theory, a hypothesis you wish to test and the faintest inklings of a Rune in your mind's eye. But there's a good deal of preparatory work to be done. One doesn't futz about with what you think you saw in that vision after all!

Is Dwarf Santa trying to forge souls?

You remember, and sometimes that is enough.

Now I wanna give him a hug.

Or rather 'I bet no one else will be stubborn enough to actually do it, you try-hard.'

"Ha! I win!"

"And it only took you how many thousands of years for a crazy to pop up?"

Hope she doesn't get caught up in the Kadrin business but it should be fine.

"As my masterpiece, I present accidentally crowning the new king!"

*touched grumbling*
"...she really does take after me!"


Snorri may think that it doesn't count because he used specific unique artifacts to do it, but it appears the Ancestors disagree.

Or agree with his assessment of cheating, given who wrote him.

Don't forget that they expected to see a failed attempt as well. And Snorri just goes and tells them that "No, can't say I succeeded quite yet because it takes too long".

He pulled a Snorri again.

We shall continue working on them till the end of times!

As chaos overtakes, the last defender if the last bastion of order shouts his ancient battlecry:

"KEEP QUIET I'M TRYING TO WORK IN HERE!"

Considering it took us one serving of Durin's Consternation before we unlocked Rune Metal 1B, I feel like the Ancestors have a skewed perspective of what "a bit of adversity" is :V

He barely even had to build any civilisations, back in their day, you know, they had to...


So. Snorri has gotten some blistering commentary on his social life. Only one thing for it - show them that they're wrong! Just how many actions would it take for us to personally interact with every Dwarf in Kraka Drakk?!

Bah! To inefficient. Make more Snorris instead.
 
I have been trying to figure out how we can do a bunch of the things efficiently, and this is what I have come up with.

docs.google.com

Efficient Action Plan


However, I can't find the costs for Triage 2 or the princely commission, and if there is anything else missing please tell me.
 
Breeds with extreme speed? Eats themself into equilibrium? infesting proper dwarfholds?
Call em gnubblers or whatever ya like, i know thaggoraki when i see it!
 
Another question @soulcake if we ever meet magic elves, how would our anti magic trait affect them?
Teports of Magical Elves dealing with Runesmiths say they sorta feel uncomfortable as their magic recoils against the natural anti-magic of a Runesmith. No known interaction with a Runelord, but it's likely the same but worse you imagine. If its like with the Brana, it ought to be bearable in most cases Snorri reckons.
Theres still gonna be people who want to kill Snorri for recreating the feats of the Ancestors
Uh I think you may have mistaken the thing about Runesmiths and Torques. The issue was giving away Runic items without having confirmed the validity of the Brana's worthiness, which was sidestepped when Thungni literally went and gave the okay. The grumbling afterwards was because you did it before Thungni did.

Dwarfen faith isn't that explicitly zealous. Its ancestor veneration at its core, and trying to live up to the examples and deeds of your Ancestors is a pretty universally lauded goal among the Dawi. Their natures make them believe it isn't very possible mind you, because old stuff is always better, but if you do it, no one's gonna kill you over it. They'd congratulate you and say, "you're not as terrible as everyone else beardling."

The issues of Dwarf faith are less to do with trying to do what the Ancestors Did and more the whole Change vs Tradition vibe.
@soulcake : Reading the update it seems like making chain is more a matter of strength, endurance and persistence then skill. That being the case could we make a Gronti to do it? That seems like it would fill the share with runesmiths level anyway. Also means that Snori doesn't have to put himself though that tedious process again.
Gronti requires an entire set up to make the chain, which would cost Adamant. A lot of Adamant. Like enough to dent your reserves to even make enough equipment for 1 Smith to do it.
Hold on just a minute...You mean to tell me that Snorri could build up an entire "Dwarven Water industry" using his purifying Runes to make the perfect purified/distilled water formula?!

Snorri might get filthy rich from using his Runes appropriately...I mean he could build automatic drinking dispensers if he wanted too...
There's already Runes of Water. It's scuffed old 1st edition lore, but it does exist in canon. Also completely pure water is bad for the body IIRC.
@soulcake just how many actions would we need to have a meaningful conversation with everyone in the Hold?
couple a hundred of em.
Runemetal 2b is about figuring out a process that would be workable for other Runelords, right? And 3b would be distilling that process into something much more accessible to dwarves in general?
Snorri believes so yes.
@soulcake can you confirm if the cult request are purely from the local part of the cult of from higher up?
Whole cult, but going through local channels to ask you. Because Moira brought you up when they were figuring out who to commission, and then the Gazulites went and asked you for similar enough reasons through similar means.

To be clear for both requests, you're only making some of the Armour needed, and only for the oldest of the old Valkyrie Guard, Watchers and Guardians. Which, while numerous, is still comfortably in your means. Normally this many Dawi would be out of your price range to do all at once, but they're paying you both monetarily and materially so it's doable.
 
Last edited:
Hmmm, guess the only Ancestor we haven't gotten a gift from yet is Thungni. Ironic. I'm sure that wasn't intentional or anything, eh soulcake?

Edit: Oh wait, we haven't gotten one from Morgrim yet either.
 
Last edited:
I have been trying to figure out how we can do a bunch of the things efficiently, and this is what I have come up with.

docs.google.com

Efficient Action Plan


However, I can't find the costs for Triage 2 or the princely commission, and if there is anything else missing please tell me.

Triage 2 is an incomplete set, it should cost 2 actions.
The 2 parts of princely commission should cost 1 action each.

Action boni only trigger if the actions are invested in the same turn, as a result:
-Chimera Autopsy and kholeks brain are 3 action options
-Secret of light is 3/1
-Happening of things is 3/3
-Runemetal pt.5 is 4 actions
-Runemetal 2b is 4/1 or 3/2
 
I was thinking two actions on each of them, just knock it out entirely on turn 35. That leaves Gimli's thing getting two total actions into the talisman (accounting for the third going into the part 1), which is comparable to what went into the Pyrestrike Cloak of his grandfather and Orra's stuff with three actions and a Troll Heart into the Master Rune.

That leaves us turns 36, 37, and 38 to do Valaya's Basket (6), Dronril (1), Zufazul (1), and 2b (9). All of that is doable. We could do four actions into 2b on turn 36, crank out one action on Dronril and one on Zufazul and one on Chain 2b with a flex on turn 37, then bang out Valaya's Basket on turn 38. Be all prepped and ready to go on turn 39 with her armor commission.
How many actions are Orras and Gimlis requiring? I ask because productivity wise we are most efficient at 3->5 which is why looking at Valaya's Commission the most effeicient way of doing actions is, 3,3,2 which gives an ovferflow of 1. We can also do 4,4 and that meets 12 exactly. I do prefer 3,3,2 as both of them are using 8 actions overall, we just get one overflow from 3,3,2 compared to none for 4,4.

Interestingly enough anything with Journeyman of the Odd is most efficient at 3->5 except with soul into earth which allows us 3->6 and 4->8. Mind for Constructs+Journeyman though is still 3->6.

edit- also when is Orra and Gimli due, that information has been removed from the commission section
 
Last edited:
Looking at the next few turns, what I would prefer to do is something like this.

Turn 35
- 3 Actions Wardstones
-1 Action Triage pt2
plus some retainer stuff.

Turn 36
-3 Actions Valaya Commission
-1 Action Princely wedding Part 1

Turn 37
-3 Actions Valaya Commmission
-1 Action Princely Wedding? or

Turn 38
-2 Actions Valaya Commission
-2 Actions Gazul Commission

Turn 39
-3 Actions Gazul Commission
-1 Action Odd Places 9/10 or Zhufazul or Dronril, Dronwut

Turn 40
-3 Actions Gazul Commission
-1 Action Odd Places 9/10 or Zhufazul or Dronril, Dronwut
 
Chimera Autopsy and kholeks brain are 3 action options
This is for action economy, and both Kholek and Chimera are four action items. Which means that if we spend 3 actions on them we get five and overkill. If we spend 2 actions one turn, and 1 action the next, we get four.
Edit: The stuff listed under three actions are, for the most part, five or six action items where we really want to spend three actions in a single turn to knock them out.
 
Last edited:
"Grimvala," he says with a nod as he takes his seat across from her, "Something on your mind"
Missing a question mark on that.
Gold. Goldsmiths. One of his fellow retainers.

It's Enlag.

Because whenever it involves Enlag and Goldsmiths, it's almost always Enlag.

"It's Enlag and the Gold Song isn't it," he asks, pinching his nose.
... Ha. It's the gold song from Discworld, except for Warhammer. They try to come up with new descriptors and words for gold. Hence why the song can take so long to do! Because it's a challenge to come up with new descriptors for it.

That's something from actual Warhammer Fantasy lore too, I think. i.e. The gold song. Pretty sure I saw something like that in the wiki. Not sure whether they took it from Pratchett or whether Pratchett took it from them. Or whether both took it from Tolkien. Hee.
Dumaraz - Darkness Splitter, named for the foaming white rapids that carve through the black volcanic sands and that form the river banks, and for the dark caverns it's carved through the mountains between its source and the Sea of Claws.
- The Rune Metal Pt. 1b complete! The Rune Metal Pt. 2b unlocked!
-- Creating a Gromril Chain is… disturbingly easy, if incredibly tedious, for you and only you. Taking years of concentrated effort, even for you, to make but a single shirt. You can do it, doing what only Grungni could, but...leaving it as simple proof of concept, let alone one that requires such extraordinary circumstances, doesn't sit right with you.
-- +1 Gromril Chain Shirt. Making this shirt took the same amount of time as several hundred sets of far more effective platemail. The inefficiency galls you, potential prestige be damned.
-- +2 progress to The Rune Metal Pt. 5, new totals: [Cost: (12 -4) =8 actions]

- +5 progress to The Rune Metal Pt. 2b, new totals: [Cost: (14 -5) =9 actions] Without Zharrgal or Barak Azamar you would have required an entire forge set composed entirely of Adamant to forge the chain. As is, you can likely create the pieces needed to make it less of a hassle. Making a method to do this for other Dawi though...still eludes you.
9 actions... If we put all 4 Snorri actions into this, we'd get +2 bonus actions from Soul of the Earth and +2 bonus actions from Journeyman of the Odd, for a total of 8. If we put 3 Snorri actions into this, we'd get +1 from Soul of the Earth and +2 from Journeyman of the Odd, for a total of 6.

This... might be doable for Turn 40, Armoured Maidens, but... very tricky to manage for Prince Gimli's wedding gift at Turn 36.

If we tried to make it work, it'd require... The minimum amount of actions into the Princess's prosthetics, let's say 1. (Shameful. For 3 runic items.) And we spend 3 Snorri actions on the Rune Metal 2b, bringing it down to 3 actions needed.

Then on turn 36, we spend... 1 action on designing the wedding gift, 1 action on making it, and 2 Snorri actions (with Soul of the Earth, it turns into +1 action) on finishing up Rune Metal 2b.

This is literally barely doable, but requires totally focusing on Gromril Chainmail and 1-actioning the requests. Which, to be fair... We can do that. We are a Runelord. If an item takes 1 action to complete, then us taking 1 action on it is not slacking. Just... some of us were hyped for going very into the Prosthetics and the Wedding Gift, with many actions on them, so...

And to top it off...
A month later you find yourself finally thinking all of this oddness is done and dealt with. Your colleagues had all found lodgings elsewhere or gone home after promising not to reveal what you'd shown them, the newest members of your Hearth Guard were being integrated, and work on Grom was finally reaching the stage where you were finally needed.
We might be seeing Karak Grom-related actions cropping up too.
- +5 progress to Dronril, Dronwut, new totals: [Cost: (6 -4 -1[Standing Bonus]) =1 action]
This was a highly convenient time to get a standing bonus on a research. Because if it were left at 2 actions left, you'd either need to spend 2 at once and thus overflow it... or drag it out over the course of 2 turns. Instead, it's neatly left at just 1 action to finish off!

... Argh, speaking of research, we still haven't gotten around to uncovering what Kholek's brain can do! Damn you Master Yorri, you jinxed us by joking how we'll keep it on ice for ages like we did the Troll heart!
 
This is for action economy, and both Kholek and Chimera are four action items. Which means that if we spend 3 actions on them we get five and overkill. If we spend 2 actions one turn, and 1 action the next, we get four.
Edit: The stuff listed under three actions are, for the most part, five or six action items where we really want to spend three actions in a single turn to knock them out.

If we want to complete kholek/chimera with less than 4 actions we need to invest 3 in one turn, 2/1 doesn't trigger boni so we wind up one action short.
 
Back
Top