- Location
- UK, Cardiff
[x] Redshirt Army
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Puella Magi Adfligo Systema
- Thread starter Firnagzen
- Start date
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- Tags
- puella magi adfligo systema puella magi madoka magica be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist bad decisions dating mami tomoe (tomoe mami) diabolical laughter friendship is the best ship handholding identity crises microwaving tea gets you put in the bad place names are important the body is the fursona of the soul this is not the baked goods thread we don't talk about rionna what could possibly go wrong? who in the world is azure sanfrancisco?
- Location
- Texas
[X] Redshirt Army
So, uh, I'm finally caught up on the story. I've gotta say, if Sabrina's thought are indicative of the thread, then you guys and gals are hilariously strange. And to be honest the Bowser story just cemented that in my mind. Anyways, hi everyone!
So, uh, I'm finally caught up on the story. I've gotta say, if Sabrina's thought are indicative of the thread, then you guys and gals are hilariously strange. And to be honest the Bowser story just cemented that in my mind. Anyways, hi everyone!
Nickballas
Pride is an interesting aspect of human nature.
- Location
- Greece
- Location
- Texas
Lightly seasoned!
On a more relevant note, I feel as if Sabrina's efforts are getting to be too spread out. It's a nice thought to want to meet all of these small groups, but we will never be able to personally meet everyone. And to be honest, I'm starting to feel...character fatigue? The cast is growing unwieldy and it's only going to be worse in the worse. If we really want to help everyone, we need for our actions to achieve more per action, and on that topic I have a few suggestions.
Apologies if someone else has brought these ideas up before, I haven't read through the entire thread.
1. Trading clear seeds for a larger number of grief seeds. (With the groups that already have a clear seeds, I understand that we want every group to have at least one clear seeds free of charge.)
2. Sending out ambassadors to friendly groups to establish relations, trade, magic/enchantment sharing, etc. without us. This will both lessen the amount of people we have to keep track of by abstracting it, and increase the amount of people actually being helped. I suggest Saito and Watanabe, and perhaps the Animators as a second group.
3. Using the now freed time to actually start preparations for the first big fight. If we manage to survive, we will hopefully have plenty of time to dedicate into the dewitching project. To be honest, dewitching should probably not be our first priority, or even our second or third. It's a long term project, it doesn't help us survive or bring people to our side, and without an alternative to Grief or Clear Seeds, we can't sustain such a large population of magical girls without once again stretching ourselves thin cleansing everyone.
- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
Hello, hello!
Welcome to the ongoing discussion, and I hope you enjoy yourself.
tarrangar
Fat arctic chicken
Problem with that, if she became Prime Minister of Japan, she would be tempted to either wish for more time for her work(yes even with Homura's timestop) or wish for all the paperwork to just autocomplete itself.
This should wait until they have had the Clear Seeds for some time, us wanting Grief Seeds right now, make the Clear Seeds seem less legit, us wanting Grief Seeds after the Clear Seeds have proven themselves for at least some weeks, will be better received, as at that point it's 100% clear, we haven't just worked out some kind of new scam.
And aside from that, what do we want more Grief Seeds for? We don't like handing Clear Seeds out to people we aren't sure wont abuse them, and mass producing Clear Seeds and handing them out to random Meguca, is basically the only thing we would need Grief Seeds for.
If we want to trade for things, I think it would be better to trade with Meguca's who have creation type powers, it's a big world out there, I'm sure there's some Meguca, with powers that specialize in making equipment others can use, which might prove a very useful boost for Walpurgisnacht.
Nickballas
Pride is an interesting aspect of human nature.
- Location
- Greece
Sabrina Tries Summoning.
/
/
The battle for the fate of the world was not going well for the Mitakihara girls.
Their battered bodies standing and kneeling before a relatively prestine looking Akuma Homura.
"Trying to defeat me is pointless... I will bring everything back to where it should be. The incubators subjugated and you ignorant."
She then started aproaching Sabrina who was struggling to stand and surprisingly gently lifted her chin so she could look her in the eye while her friends tried to will themselves to recover faster to aid her.
"You need not fight anymore Sabrina. Your life's purpose was a complete success and helped ease some weight off my metaphysical shoulders that would have been quite bothersome to carry."
Sabrina grit her teeth and looked the Devil right in the eye.
"I will fight if this is the outcome you're intending Homura. I might agree with the cause behind this but the methods leave much to be desired!"
The being that was no Witch or Magical Girl sighed. "And what could you possibly do to stop me Young one? Fighting me with all you had certainly did not help did it? Or did you forget that I brushed all of you and your friends attacks with ease and this was with me not even trying. What could you possibly do to even the playing field even when all of you attacked me at once and with very good coordination I might add?"
Sabrina did not answer verbally. Instead she clenched her fist and started gathering Grief behind her.
A Curious construct started to form but before anyone could try to start to make heads or tails what it was another more obvious thing caught the attention of everyone there.
Hope was part of the weird blob that was taking shape and it was a LOT of it, in fact it was an Equal amount of Grief and Hope, that was taking a more and more distinct form.
The most obvious thing about the shape was that it was at least 3 meters tall.
Another thing that became obvious was that it was weird mix of humanoid and bestial and seemed to have Spikes destributed amongst it's form.
Before anyone could keep guessing what it was it coalesced into a form that was quite obvious and brought everyone a stange mix of of incredulity, amusement, hope and outrage.
"What the Hell Sabrina?!" Surprisingly enough it was Sayaka not Kyouko who voiced her mixed feelings of the situation first.
"What are you trying to pull Sabrina." Deadpanned both Akuma and Akemi in eerie sync.
"Hehehehehe... weeeell see I just pictured the most Relentless and Vicious being I can think of that can actually be reasoned with." Answered Sabrina while under the gaze of every girl there while sweating just a bit although her summon appeared to be examining himself.
"And you though making a Ninja Turtle or whatever is going to help us? What stupid leaps of logic did you take to think this will help?!" Shouted Kyouko with a rather Red With Rage face.
"Um actually it's Bow-"
"I DON'T CARE WHAT IT'S ACTUALLY CALLED THIS IS SO STUPID!!!"
Sabrina winced while under the judging stare of everyone bar her creation/summon.
"GAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!"
That is until said creation started chuckling rather loudly. The magical girls and the Devil flinched at the volume and underying power it suggested and the girls started realising how intimidating the being actually looked like.
"So minion, why did you summon me in this unfamiliar realm? It better be important or you'll be doing chores around my Castle for at least a week if the reason is not good enough!"
The being- no Bowser stated while pointing threateningly at Sabrina as if he knew his Sum-MINION with just a glance.
Sabrina floundered and sputtered for a few seconds to the amusement of everyone before firming her resolve and kneeling surprising everyone bar Bowser and speaking in a steady voice.
"Akuma Homura is a threat to your rule my King and though I would not bother you and defeat her with just myself and my friends it doesn't seem to be enough! So I beg you Lord Bowser please help me defeat her!"
Bowser chuckled loudly again getting a wince from everyone but himself and replied in a surprisingly jovial but firm tone.
"I don't need no help Minion. I will face this Pretender myself and holler at ya if I absolutely need it."
Bowser then turned to the Devil while she looked at him with distaste and boredom, something he either did not realise or simply ignored it.
"Oh please what could your construct do that your hopeless naivete and outright stupidity couldn't help you with? Can't you see Sabrina this is Po-"
The interruption came in the form of a Massive fist driving itself in the Devils torso which resulted in her getting sent flying rather far and crashing through quite a few buildings. Everybody was shocked! Nobody even saw the humanoid turtle dragon even move. Bowser huffed.
"I better not hear ya insult my Minion again. ONLY ME AND MY DIRECT SUBORDINATES ARE ALLOWED TO INSULT MINIONS WITHOUT SOME RETRIBUTION!"
Akuma Homura reappeared before everyone visibly ruffled and upset.
"That was not part of my plan." Homura opined brushing herself off while trying not to show she was in actual pain.
"That thing just gave me conseptual damage... How is that possible?!" raged Akuma internally.
"You are but a fake construct beast. Not some King. I will change this world to my image and you will not stop my ambition!"
"GAHAHAHAHAHA!!! You really sweat the details. What matters is that you are a threat to what is MINE and I won't have that oh Devil. So let me bust your face with my fists and be done with it."
That declaration certainly set Homura off as she narrowed her eyes and adopted a threatening stance while gathering magic in her gloved hands.
"So be it ignorant beast I will not suffer you a moment longer in my world. I will make your meaningless existence vanish in an instant."
"HA! Me Vanish from this world because you simply will it so? NOT TODAY! I am staking my claim to a territory that's not yours! SO YOU VANISH!!"
SHOWTIME!
Shameless plug in.
- Location
- Texas
Sabrina has said over and over how she wants to help everyone, presumably giving them clear seeds. Unless Mami has a stash of grief seeds hidden somewhere, we as a group do not have a significant surplus of grief/clear seeds to hand out. The kinds of people who will be coming for us include the desperate who will possibly not have any seeds themselves, and hunting in Mitakihara will not remain lucrative (or perhaps even possible?) once a large enough population of PM is settled there. The "who" is addressed by the other point I brought up, having ambassadors go around to meet, vet, and give clear seeds to other groups. It's not much different than what we are doing now, it just gives us more time to pursue other projects.
tarrangar
Fat arctic chicken
If they don't have any seeds, we just cleanse them manually until they get ahold of a seed, Mitakihara do have a fair amount of witches to hunt, sure as more settle in it will be harder to find one, but seeing as we are in Mitakihara, it don't really matter that it might take a month to find a witch, aside from that we can also pull in some seeds from other sources, asking for 2 seeds for 1 clear seed, when trading with the wealthier groups, are far less suspicious, than asking for large amounts of Grief Seeds at once.
And Meguca's haven't been arriving in big numbers yet, they will eventually, but initially it's going to be a trickle, and we can get enough seeds to handle that trickle, and by the time more Meguca arrive, than we have seeds to cleanse, we will have been around for longer, and so the suspicion will have lessened further.
But really I don't think it's the time to try to trade for a mass of Grief Seeds yet, getting ahold of some so we can meet need for Clean seeds sure, but we only need a limited amount for now.
Aside from that, with time we are also going to have more hunting areas open up, for now Meguca's jealously guard their hunting grounds, Meguca's with Clear Seeds however, only need to hunt to prevent the witches from eating people, it take a bit of time to internalize this of course, but a group of Meguca that has had a Clear Seed for a few weeks, and have built up a stockpile of normal seeds, is likely to be far more relaxed about poaching.
Heck they might even welcome, an outside Meguca passing though and hunting a witch, as that allow them to take a break, the Pleiades Saints are likely to get to that point relatively soon, because they very much trust us, and so trust that the Clear Seeds aren't going to blow up in their faces, but I suspect that even kyouko, is going to stop caring as much about keeping her hunting grounds to herself, by the time her Grief Seed reserve get into triple digits, probably not enough that she will just allow you to hunt in her territory for free, but by the time she has that kind of reserve, she's likely to allow you to hunt in her territory, if you pay a fee.
Of course if we suddenly start to need Clear Seeds to hand out faster than we can hunt Grief Seeds, we might need to try to buy some, but I see no reason to do it early, worst case there's a waiting list, and multiple groups have to share 1 Clear Seed for a time.
- Location
- Texas
That's literally what I said in my first point. I'm not saying to ask for all of their grief seeds over even just a large amount. Just to trade at a higher than 1 to 1 ratio.
We already barely have time to hunt. I do not want Sabrina to have to make multiple trips a week to a bunch of MP just for upkeep, there are better uses for our time. Better to never need that to come up and just get a couple dozen seeds stockpiled.
I do not think this will happen anytime soon. MP are territorial, and that attitude isn't going to change just because they have a clear seeds.
Additionally, I have a pretty strong desire to collect as many grief seeds as possible. Once a seed is fed to QB, it's out of our reach and that MP is lost forever. We should try to minimize the amount of permanent MP death by aquiring the maximum number of grief seeds.
tarrangar
Fat arctic chicken
You said a large amount, not a small amount, asking for 2 Grief Seeds for 1 Clear Seeds, is a good way to get enough Grief Seeds to convert to Clear Seeds that we can give away Clear Seeds to girls without a Grief Seed to convert, is distinctly different from asking for 10 Grief Seeds for 1 Clear Seed, asking for a small amount extra, will work far better than asking for a large amount.
We can just tell them to hunt themselves, Mami control Mitakihara, and so long as they promise to kill the Familiars too, she has nothing against other magical girls hunting in Mitakihara, as Mami is the magical girl that trust Sabrina the most.
And we don't need to make trips to them, we can just make a communal Clear Seed, that all groups staying in Mitakihara can use to cleanse, until they get their own personal Clear Seed.
We can get one of the groups that permanently settle in Mitakihara to handle the communal Seed, but we don't need to personally go around and cleanse them, a Clear Seed can provide cleanses for a hundred groups, and they can come to the Seed.
It's probably not changing for all Meguca, but how territorial Meguca are varies, neither Mami or the Pleiades Saints were very territorial to start with(aside from Mami's rules, but those were about how you have to behave when in her territory, not about whether you're allowed to hunt in her territory) and with them no longer being resource restrained, they're going to be even less territorial.
they will still have standards you must adhere to, but neither Mami or the Pleiades Saints, are at all likely to tell you, that you may not hunt in their territory now that they have unlimited cleanses, and while far from all Meguca are like them, there's a fair amount of Meguca like them, who are likely to welcome outsiders, now that they don't need to hunt for sustenance any more.
That's a good argument, the problem is that setting out to collect as many grief seeds as possible, make our goodwill seem suspicious, so we need to temper that desire.
Also they aren't necessarily lost forever, we suspect the Incubators will declare war on us eventually anyway, after we have dealt with Walpurgisnacth and Feathers, figured out an alternative to Grief Seeds, and dealt with the toxicity inherent in Meguca society, I suspect we are going to want to take the fight to the Incubators, so we might eventually raid their bases, and reclaim those Grief Seeds.
- Location
- Texas
Please don't put words in my mouth. I said "Trading clear seeds for a larger number of grief seeds." As in Grief Seeds > Clear Seeds.
That's not a bad idea. I would prefer each group having their own, but this is not an unworkable alternative.
I want to point out that what we were told by Mami and Homura about how territorial PM are hasn't exactly matched up to our reality. That's...good I suppose?
I don't think the incubators have a pile of grief seeds. I believe they probably toss them in the emotional equivalent of a furnace.
tarrangar
Fat arctic chicken
I misread you then, as long as it's only a slightly larger number I agree it's a good idea.
They would get their own eventually, a communal Seed would just be a stop gag measure, with a communal Seed, a group can afford to wait as long as necessary, which mean it don't matter, if we temporarily end up with a backlog, of dozens or even hundreds of Meguca's waiting for their own Clear Seed.
It's not a permanent solution, but it mean that everyone can afford to wait, and they can either wait, until it's their turn to hunt in Mitakihara, or work out a deal for hunting in someone elses territory, which shouldn't be that hard, as with free cleanses from the communal Seed, they can afford to accept lopsided deals, and even before we made post Grief Seed scarcity a potential reality, cutting a deal to get to hunt in anothers territory was a possibility.
It was a too lopsided deal that was the university groups problem, they had to pay 3 Grief Seeds a week to Sendai, for Sendai to tolerate them hunting in Sendai's territory, with getting free cleanses in Mitakihara, a Meguca can afford to agree to give 4 out of 5 Grief Seeds from their hunts to the territory holder, as they only need 1 Grief Seed to be turned into their Clear Seed, and they can use the communal Clear Seed, to cleanse between hunts until they get their own.
So yeah I don't think finding places for them to hunt is going to be a problem, Meguca aren't going to suddenly become not at all territorial, but a lot of Meguca with Clear Seeds, are going to be all for renting their territory out, for a percentage of the Grief Seeds acquired, they might demand a high percentage, but that's not much of a problem, as even if a Meguca demanded 99 Seeds for letting you hunt a hundred witches in their territory, with a communal Clear Seed giving you endless cleanses, that would still be terms you could survive, although you would most likely look for a less extortionist Meguca to cut a deal with.
It has absolutely been accurate for some groups, but Meguca are individuals, there's all kinds of them, and they react as individuals, with Grief Seed scarcity territorialism is the norm, but there's outliers even then, with Grief Seed scarcity becoming less of a problem, territorialism is becoming less prevalent.
I doubt that, I think they use Grief Seeds as perpetual energy generators, if they only got a one time energy payout, I think Kyubei would be diverting all Grief Seeds given to them to us so we could turn them into Clear Seeds, as the Grief we extract is also fuel for them, so if a Grief Seed was burned up when they use it, they would want as many Clear Seeds made as possible.
As Clear Seeds would essentially be them being paid twice, as they got all the Grief in the Grief Seed, and when the Clear Seed is filled up in a few hundred years, they would get the normal Grief Seed payout, the fact Kyubei isn't trying to get us to make as many Clear Seeds as possible, make it way more likely, that Grief Seeds are renewable energy sources for them, not one use fuel.
If the Incubators destroyed Grief Seeds to harvest their energy, Kyubei should be funneling every Grief Seed it can to us, as each Grief Seed cleared, would represent an increase in its income, roughly equal to a witch, sure that increase would be centuries away, but kyubei is very much patient.
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- Location
- Texas
I suppose we really have no idea what happens to grief seeds after QB takes them, but the mere fact that the cycle works as it does makes me lean towards believing that QB is not interested in renewable grief seeds so much as renewable humans with potential.
If I was QB and I was interested in renewable PM power, I would simply siphon grief from soul gems as it appeared. QB is not doing this, therefore it's likely that the act of becoming a witch generates more energy than a PM can generate over the course of a human lifetime.
If becoming a witch does indeed generate more grief than a PM can generate by living a human lifetime, then QB has no incentive to push Grief Seeds our direction. The grief from the seeds is already generated whether or not we drain them, and us draining them lessens the likelihood of PM witching out.
From QB's point of view, a Grief Seed has already done it's job by housing a Witch's grief for it to process, the fact that PM can use them to drain their own grief is only a tertiary use of the seeds that allows PM to harvest the Grief Seeds for QB.
I don't see any reason for QB to retain the Grief Seeds after it receives possesion of them. They are most likely gone forever.
tarrangar
Fat arctic chicken
Grief Seeds are perpetual energy generators, Sabrina has confirmed it, they're slow as hell, but our Clear Seeds are generating Grief, it would probably take something like a million years for one to fill back up with no outside interference, but they would fill back up.
And I don't think QB can just funnel grief from a soul gem, it probably take specialized machinery to drain Grief from Grief Seeds, but I really don't think they're one time payment.
Also yes the payment from witching out is much larger, than what a PM generate per day, but standard PM healing can make you immortal, so all PM will witch out anyway, no matter how much it's delayed, even if their physical body age to death from lack of healing, their soul gem would eventually fill up and spawn a witch.
So yeah I really don't think the Incubators destroy Grief Seeds to generate energy, they're perpetual energy producers, it's more likely they use them as such.
- Location
- Texas
What do you suppose it does with them, if it can neither remove the grief from them and does not destroy them to generate energy?
I suppose a very, very generous interpretation of KB's actions is that it releases filled filled Grief Seeds back on Earth in order to generate witches for PM to farm, but rehatched witches are said to be stronger than first-timers, so that seems unlikely.
I understand what you're saying about Grief Seeds being very very slow infinite energy generators, but I think QB wouldn't care about that in the same way that we humans don't bother generating power by putting a tiny propeller at the exhaust of a car. Is it technically a waste to not do so? I suppose so, but there are just better ways of getting power. Humanity's population is expanding, increasing the amount of MP that QB can contract and later harvest. Slowly leeching grief from Grief Seeds is an inefficient use of it's resources.
At the end of the day this conversation comes down to what we believe is most likely. Do we hold out hope that QB is holding on to these seeds, or do we operate under the assumption that they are destroyed and do everything in our power to save as many grief seeds as possible. After all, if grief seeds are permanently destroyed, it's the same as a PM dying. Sabrina is very much against the unnecessary death of PMs, I don't see why she would feel any differently about this.
- Location
- Colorado
Contrary to general opinion in this thread, not everything is better with a bunch of friends hanging around. Something like this should be between the two people reconciling and maybe a mediator. Like if Kyouko is bringing Yuma it might be fine, but we don't even know that yet. If she genuinely thinks violence will break out she might not want Yuma anywhere near there.
tarrangar
Fat arctic chicken
QBs goal is to combat entropy, it has been on Earth contracting girls for millennia, and its specie consider emotions a mental illness, yes it's very much in it for the long game, and would definitely set up renewable energy farms, even if they took millions of years to pay off, it's immortal, it fully internalize this fact, and its goal spans eons, it don't matter to it whether gains are short or long term, it will take whatever option, will get it the greatest profit, before the heat death of the universe.
And I didn't say QB couldn't drain Grief at all, I said it couldn't drain it easily, QB very likely have the capability to drain Grief from Grief Seeds, and turn it into useable energy, but it don't have said capabilities, in the small meat puppet it use to contract magical girls, Grief extraction is probably done in specialized facilities.
If QB didn't have these capabilities, I'm almost sure it would want Clear Seeds made, because it still get 100% of the Grief in the Grief Seed, when those are made, and the Clear Seed will be filled up again in just a few hundred years, which is a blink of an eye to QB, and it's not like it will lessen the total amount of witches, sure it will postpone the creation of lots of witches by centuries, but that's a blink of an eye to an immortal, all magical girls still only have 2 fates, either their Soul gem is destroyed, or they witch out, it don't matter if they witch out in day or in millennia, QB is in no hurry, he can wait however long he has too.
Us making Clear Seeds don't lessen the odds of PM witching out, except in that it make the chance of Soul gem destruction a little higher, it delay it by a long time from a mortal perspective, but QB don't have a mortal perspective, it has an immortal perspective, whether you witch out tomorrow or in a millennia is meaningless, it still get its prize in the end, if delaying your witching out for a millennia get it a second prize, then it will be all for that.
AuraTwilight
The Sorcerer of Smiles
- Location
- The Silver City
Sabrina has observed that a Grief Seed will generate grief on its own over time, because the Witch inside is still dreaming, still suffering.
Would YOU take a battery that will recharge itself, indefinitely and eternally, and just burn it for a one-time use?
Absolutely not. Kyubey is collecting souls and setting them up to suffer for all eternity, and is always collecting more because the nature of entropy means that energy needs will always pace higher and higher.
tarrangar
Fat arctic chicken
That's not actually how entropy work, entropy is that every action make some energy unusable to the system, but the rate at which energy is lost isn't always increasing, so if the Incubators manage to set up enough Grief Seed generators, there will come a point where they're generating energy, as fast as entropy is consuming energy, although I suspect the Incubators would just continue making more generators anyway, and use the energy to expand the universe.
But yeah the Incubators are in for the long haul, they're fighting the Heat death of the universe, an event that's many billion of years away, they're certainly aiming for long term gains over short term gains.
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Raiseth
I Find Your Lack of Memes Disturbing
- Location
- Russia
Er.
Quick crash course on the current theories of entropic decay, which PMMM universe seems to work on, more or less.
The universe expands at an accelerated rate. That means that the clusters of matter we call celestial bodies have a prevailing tendency to come apart at a constantly increasing rate.
Any new matter or energy introduced to such a system will always require a corresponding increase in quantity with time to counteract the constant acceleration of expansion of the system.
In other words the matter remains, yes, but in a lower energy state useless in terms of anything related to energy consumption. And as it does so at an accelerated rate, currently explained by dark energy theory, there never will be enough energy introduced to the universe to sustain it.
As an attendum, some Questers raised a possibility that, due to Incubators constantly combating entropy, as they claim to, at least, the observable acceleration of expansion of the universe doesn't reflect the actual physical constants of entropic decay. As it is, heat death of the universe is scheduled to start sometime in a thousand billion years, more or less. Depending on how much effort and energy the incubators spend on fighting entropy, the life in the universe became sustainable only because of their efforts in the dark-energy-dominated era of the universe.
Well, of course they also could use Magical Girls as their energy industry, which is also fighting entropy, lol.
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DB_Explorer
Purveyor of alternate realities.
- Location
- San Diego, California
- Pronouns
- He/Him
... man when a girl from out of town who just moved in inevitablely wishes to understand how the universe works, so she can finish her homework because this is Mitakihara, she's going to figure out something wrong with the Incubators plan.
AuraTwilight
The Sorcerer of Smiles
- Location
- The Silver City
...Um. Sir, when the entire problem is that energy becomes progressively unusable and everything atomically deteriorates, and the Incubators are (allegedly) trying to maintain interstellar civilization, which by the nature of civilization will always need more energy as it does more things, the rate at which the Incubators need to collect energy will only ever ascend, which means the need to circumvent entropy will only exponentially increase as a priority and need.
Like holy shit just compare humanity's energy consumption today to what it was even just 30 years ago.
- Location
- Somewhere up the tree
The issue with that idea is both that the reality of our universe and the mundane side of pmmm are close to identical. So assuming that the very laws of physics are different by such an extreme margin doesn't make sense
Another problem with that idea is that. If the laws of physics to derail so heavily, then the universe shouldn't have been able to support life long enough for the incubators to evolve. Due to how massive the difference in inuput vs output would be for energy
Like, say that the universe only had a billion years left without incubator intervention
Then that would mean that in the pmmm universe. If you were to drop a nuclear bomb on a civilian population center Then it wouldn't even bring the regular temperture even one degree away from absolute zero. Instead of the nearly three hundred thousand degrees Celsius it would in our reality
its more likely, that since the incubators are the only truely immortal thing we know of the the Pmmm universe (the don't eat, sleep, age, They don't need anything to survive and you can't kill them, and if you killed every body in the universe they'd just create the exact same number instantly) Its possible that the heat death of the universe is the only thing that threatens their continued existence. So its in the end, the whole system is a giant immortality plot for an already immortal creatuee
- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
I mean, Firn's interpretation of the Incubators explicitly is powerful enough to change apparent cosmological constants as measured by humans:
It seems a little strange to say that the Incubators must have evolved in a universe with the same conditions as our IRL world, too.