The actual city, and most of the Magical Girls, probably exist; but all the interesting parts do not. Madokami responded to the timeline with "Literally what the fuck I don't even remember this and I'm omniscient."

Iroha, and thus Ui, Nemu, and Touka, cannot be Magical Girls in a canonical universe. Everything else is technically fair game if Firn feels like it.
 
So my basic plan is to start off by saying that I made a typo and I'm actually from Yokohama. I don't think we've heard anything about the magical girls from there and it should be outside of Tokyo's sphere of influence so it's a blank slate?

The question is where do we want to do from there?
 
Call me paranoid but can we have an OOC confirmation that Firn is controlling that account before we ask it questions or anything

Or know who controls it.
 
So my basic plan is to start off by saying that I made a typo and I'm actually from Yokohama. I don't think we've heard anything about the magical girls from there and it should be outside of Tokyo's sphere of influence so it's a blank slate?

The question is where do we want to do from there?

Just roleplay, buddy. This doesn't have to be some big thing where all the decisions are made by committee. It's not gonna be canon either way, so just have some fun.
 
Sent another email



I was trying to think of something a bit more creative than this but it's the obvious question for a reason.
 
We have a technical challenge, lots of tactical choices for our Homura conversation dealing with many future tasks.
Next time we must present stuff for our votes? That's what I will do, after this bit of long-term consideration...

I don't know about overcoming range limitations, that might require some other additional insight. But I do know that helping Dedolere is something that Sabrina ought to be doing anyway, as part of her wish, part of her nature. And if Dedolere is Feathers, then this will be a pro-active stance to addressing one of our two main opponents (Feathers, Kyuubey).

we're just well on our way to recreating the kamihama doppel system aren't we?

I've always saw witches as being a magical girls distilled dark side, all the parts of people that they try to ignore or put aside or see in a negative light distilled and amplified
so something tells me that dedolore would likely be full gilgamesh, wanting to help people but not really knowing how and not caring about that persons desires or what they actually want
basicaly all of our flaws and emotional baggage turned up to eleven with all our positive traits boiled off
I'll point out here, that there are proposed tests to tell exactly where the feather came from for certain, or at least certain enough to give us some much needed definite negatives. ....

How would contacting/befriending Dedolere work, though? I imagine a witch is a meguca's deepest, darkest self, wreathed in despair and wracked with madness. That could be different for us, though. Is Dedolere a separate entity from Sabrina? An aspect of her, or the inverse? Both at once?

The appearance of a Witch and her Magical Girl in the same setting is probably not supposed to play out like the power-leveling move from Kamihama? We could have a distinct intent and find a vastly more worthwhile result. In general, the conversation we are aiming for is between the Witch and others. It isn't that the Magical Girl getting a turn talking to the Witch is wrong, it is currently stereotyped in ways that make it less useful from the start. The Witch already knows the person she is part of fairly well, in a way.

If the Witch finds herself no longer a subconscious influence in her girl, but a free-standing (and non-magical) individual herself, that alone radically changes what sort of experiences that Witch can have. If we want to go with the "people are defined by other people" axiom, it opens the door less to hatching as a horror of limitless self-gratification and torment, and more to being forced to grow all the parts a human needs to live. Consequently, she becomes a person that can be reasoned with.

Essentially, the family of the girl containing the Witch are granted the task of struggling with her directly. This is an improvement, because the self-reinforcing ideation factor, the thing that makes the Witch within dangerous, is nerfed by the greater philosophy of existence while the Witch is 'out.' Interpersonal factors become literally unavoidable. The Witch has qualia and experiences forced upon her, not by warriors, but by time and entropy.

I consider asking "is the Witch a separate person" isn't a productive question, so defaulting to not trying to answer is better. We can just do it for a while, and see how it plays out.

Let's simply default to treating the situation like dissociative identity taken way too far. The Magical Girl in question should be "asleep," profoundly not able to interact. Our slight of hand is used to flip the venue, replacing the expected "Witch can somewhat take over from inside" position with "Witch has been ejected into a body of her own, with no resources or influence over the Magical Girl." By temporarily forcing a full split, things that would seem more like miracles become quite possible. I have no idea if such a state can become extensible over time. That would be fun, even if it changes reality quite a bit. Fun aside, the practical value of short separations is that the people who love a Magical Girl enough to join this treatment gain the power to become effective. Nobody has to die this way.

Turning the Witch into a complete person allows others to try to change her, just a little. And that little is all we ask for. Anyone else has to struggle with their dark side alone, in a clash of wills without words. It is a metaphysical situation most girls are not ready for. Our magical interference is a challenge that might be far superior to the Witch, instead.

The Feather therefore finds a great purpose, if it is what we think it is - because we are thinking about it. It can be a totem to make our interface body targeted and effective. We can be far more certain to connect Dedolere to a body that isn't Sabrina if we follow magical principles and use part of Dedolere as a symbol to link her, but not Sabrina, to the construct. This is both symbolic in a magical sense, and subconscious communication. We don't need to pick that apart, as long as Dedolere accepts the circumstance. Put the feather in / on the Chibi, and that marks it as no longer Sabrina's. Effectively, this is a voodoo doll of sorts.

I could deal with a future where Magical Girls in civilian life always carry either a personalized doll somewhere among their effects, or an actively animated chibi accompanying them. Everyone has them, it is no big deal. After a certain threshold of socialization is passed, the point is to bring her Witch out into the world. They don't have to split permanently. As I said before,

"Meet my dark side.
She likes cookies."

Is a nearly ideal outcome. It can be fixed that way. Anyone still has to budget their Grief, but the struggle gets easier. Over decades, the Magical Girl can turn that into stability. This is a genre-appropriate version of "The demons in my head? We all answer to the same name."

Advanced stuff like this is worth aiming for?

Has the eldest surviving Magical Girl already been down this route? We don't know if she made herself into a respectable human or not. It would be clever to see what the world knows.
 
Wait for talking to witches, should we start with witches inside the girls or the already hatched witches??
 
If a Witch already exists within the Magical Girl that incubates it, and can be distinct enough from its incubator to have its own personality and interpersonal faculties, then that kind of raises the question of how a Magical Girl can be said to become a Witch in the first place.

In such a case, I suspect that one of the following would have to be true:

A) Witching out is a symmetric transformation such that a Magical Girl still exists in some sense within an active Witch, just as a Witch already exists in some sense within an active Magical Girl. In this case, can we talk to the Magical Girls inside of Witches? Is that a plausible step towards dewitching, or a red herring?

B) Witching out is an asymmetric process whereby a Witch breaks free of the Magical Girl that incubated her and kills the Magical Girl in the process. In this case, I think our only hope for dewitching would be if Witches remember their incubators (consciously or not) with enough fidelity to reconstruct their personalities?
 
Shame about losing the DBZ joke, but at least we called them sempai!

And soon there may be Dedo-chibi hug times? This sounds like an excellent plan! I can't wait to see it!

(How does one Oriko-pose with paws anyways?)

So, something I noticed in the update, and the last few..... why DOESNT Sabrina have a smart phone anyways, if the tech isn't an oddity or anything? The tokyo group we met seemed to find it odd, with its potential nuisance in contacting them, aaaand way more importantly it imposed an extra 20? minutes travel time we could've spent on IRC if we had an IRC app on phone instead of needing to find a computer. Seems like a very worthwhile use of our shiny new meguca-made ID to figure out a prepaid smartphone or something?
 
Problem/possible problem.

I'd argue it needs to be considered the possibility that the witch/girl dualism is literally two sides of the same coin and QBs note on MS being larval stage witches is literal. (As opposed to the idea which seems currently dominant that the witch is a separate entity which hatches from the girls soulgem, like some manner of parasitoid wasp.)

Basically rather than making it possible to befriend your witch, this would necessitate accepting the witch, embracing it, but socializing the outcome to some manner. A witch maturing normally means abandoning all semblance of humanity which we wish to avoid... Which may be possible by positing a witch maturation that bypasses the grief event horizon, but I don't know if that is on the level of dancing with naked singularities so... It may be that witching out is a necessary step in the maturation process and what we want to do is basically invent a form of therapy to make the mature witch embrace an child-like outlook and naïveté.

More importantly
I think we want to avoid thinking of the witch as a separate entity, at least if we want to continue to entertain the thought of "dewitching" or at least socializing lapsed MS.

More likely the witch is an internal seed of an unwanted development we are going to have to develop means to cope with, contain, manage, handle and keep suppressed and dormant. Basically its our pet depression, not a parasitoid abomination which is fun to be with, and any magical girl which strives to prevent witchouts on a grand scale is basically a Peter Pan.
 
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Problem/possible problem.

I'd argue it needs to be considered the possibility that the witch/girl dualism is literally two sides of the same coin and QBs note on MS being larval stage witches is literal. (As opposed to the idea which seems currently dominant that the witch is a separate entity which hatches from the girls soulgem, like some manner of parasitoid wasp.)

Basically rather than making it possible to befriend your witch, this would necessitate accepting the witch, embracing it, but socializing the outcome to some manner. A witch maturing normally means abandoning all semblance of humanity which we wish to avoid... Which may be possible by positing a witch maturation that bypasses the grief event horizon, but I don't know if that is on the level of dancing with naked singularities so... It may be that witching out is a necessary step in the maturation process and what we want to do is basically invent a form of therapy to make the mature witch embrace an child-like outlook and naïveté.

More importantly
I think we want to avoid thinking of the witch as a separate entity, at least if we want to continue to entertain the thought of "dewitching" or at least socializing lapsed MS.

More likely the witch is an internal seed of an unwanted development we are going to have to develop means to cope with, contain, manage, handle and keep suppressed and dormant. Basically its our pet depression, not a parasitoid abomination which is fun to be with, and any magical girl which strives to prevent witchouts on a grand scale is basically a Peter Pan.
which would also explain doppel, as well as akuma and the angels of the cycle, because if the witch is simply an evolution thar comes being consumed by the negative side then if you come to terms with that side of you in a more healthy light without being eaten by it and losing sight of everything else it would lead to a more "safe and stable" witchout

tldr: talk to and come to terms with your dark side to witch out for superpowers
 
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Meanwhile it also has implications about putting aside childish things - like humanity - to embrace the glory that is our birthright.

PMMM is a cosmic horror story after all.
 
Inb4 Sabrina mentions Yokohama in quest and no one has any fucking idea what she's talking about and Sabrina rolls it off as "No it's cool just my weird thing again" and then goes somewhere isolated to freak out.
 
why DOESNT Sabrina have a smart phone anyways, if the tech isn't an oddity or anything?

We got our phone very early in the quest, and Mami was the one to pay for it (since we didn't have the stolen Yakuza money yet). Since we weren't very close with Mami yet, we went for the cheapest model phone they had available, to minimize how much we were imposing on her financially.

Now that we have a citizenship card (and our passport should be arriving soon, @Firnagzen ), we could use our millions of stolen Yakuza yen to get ourselves a proper smartphone, I suppose.
 
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