- Location
- america
i kinda like sabrinas personality, she is kind of a pacist while not being one, being nonviolent? or she is always trying to pull a diplomatic victory, even if she sucks at it.
Puella Magi Adfligo Systema
- Thread starter Firnagzen
- Start date
-
- Tags
- puella magi adfligo systema puella magi madoka magica be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist bad decisions dating mami tomoe (tomoe mami) diabolical laughter friendship is the best ship handholding identity crises microwaving tea gets you put in the bad place names are important the body is the fursona of the soul this is not the baked goods thread we don't talk about rionna what could possibly go wrong? who in the world is azure sanfrancisco?
- Location
- Not the asylum anymore
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Hey!
We don't suck at diplomatic victories!
We're just... socially challenged.
- Location
- america
sv literaly cant into social, like, im a introverted nerd and i can tell that you guys just, dont get how talking to people works, its mostly bandwagons and trying to do 15 hundred different things in a convo and forcing it all in even as it overwelms and sometimes angers the person we are talking to, we also seem to forget to give people space, we are way to pushy and i kinda blame that on doing this thing day to day like this? even a week long time skip would be welcome.
sorry if im rambling or if i insulted anyone with this, its just what i have noticed about it.
DB_Explorer
Purveyor of alternate realities.
- Location
- San Diego, California
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I think its that the nature of the medium means we over focus on minutia. Our social always did better when we focused on tone and intent. Since really social is almost more about approach then specific content.
- Location
- america
yep, if the social votes were JUST the setting of the tones and intents that we wanted i dont think sabrina would ever freaking worry about social, but we also put in words and cringy paragraphs and like, gosh but rereading someone the banwagoned votes........man what were you guys thinking back then,
(ALSO WE STILL HAVENT GOTTEN THE CUTE SKINNY GIRL TO GET SOME FAT ON THEM BONES YET.)
Vebyast
Nascent Transhuman
Okay, goals.
Just to be sure: @Firnagzen, we talked about our potential opponents, including their histories and motivations, in sufficient detail for Oriko to notice any major discrepancies? We're probably not going to be presented with a Kanna Hijiri that has a totally different motivation than canon?
Proposed vote fragments:
[] Privately talk to Niko. Gently explain the possibility of Kanna Hijiri.
-[] Reassure Niko about her Wish.
-[] In case Kanna is listening or has replaced Niko, be supportive and understanding. You can't blame her for feeling lost after waking up with no memory.
-[] Ask Niko what she wants to do about telling the other Pleiades.
-[] Your belief: Kanna needs support and hugs right now, not a manhunt, and the Pleiades should know the entire situation so they can do that.
[] Telepathically tell Kirika and Oriko to saturate themselves with antimagic, but to not react if they see our opponents standing in the room with us or anything like that. If they're going to give you a chance to talk at them, you'll take it.
[] Talk about Clear Seeds.
-[] Explain what it means for getting in a fight.
-[] Discuss rules of engagement: Ask everyone to open with an offer: If our opponent just wanted the Clear Seed, we're happy to provide cleansing and support. We want to help everyone, including the girls that've been driven to extremes by grief or trauma.
- Our opponent. She has a perception-filter-type stealth device, so for the sake of drama, poetry, and talking to people, that we can and should assume that she's standing right there next to us listening to everything we say.
- Target state of mind: Basically the same for all of our opponents. Nobody is beyond redemption, just ask for help and we'll be happy to give it. 100% rehabilitative justice.
- Method: She probably won't run away unless we give her a reason to run. So we need to get to the message part before we execute on any counter-stealth schemes. Oriko and Kirika will provide compelling examples. We can pull this off with a "rules of engagement" and "what to do if you find her" talk.
- Information control.
- The Soujus and Airi Anri should both be safe to talk about.
- Airi Anri is a major witchbomb threat. The wiki says it's central to her motivation; if we're dealing with her, we need to avoid villainous monologues because they will start with "You killed my friend" and explaining that would be a Problem.
- Niko's Wish is rather personal. We may not want to reveal it.
- How much do we want to protect Niko herself? We should probably assume she's smart enough to figure out Kanna Hijiri's backstory given only a few hints.
- In case Kanna Hijiri is our opponent, if we talk about her at all, we'll want to avoid negative terminology like "artificial person" or "evil clone". I'd actually appreciate some brainstorming on the topic of non-judgmental language for Kanna Hijiri. We don't need to be reinforcing her problems.
- We should use ourselves to give context. Particularly given that we should be assuming that she's listening in on this conversation, we'll want to mention that as an aside if we discuss her.
- I can't recall if the Pleiades know about soul gems. If not, explaining the Soujus' motivations may be somewhat rocky.
- I think we want to: Infodump Anri.
- Warn about infohazard?
- I think we want to: Infodump Soujus.
- Explain soul gems?
- Thread discussion necessary: How much to explain about Kanna Hijiri.
- How much explanation is actually necessary?
- How much can we shade the truth to inform about capabilities without revealing details? For example, can we just say that she copies powers and that we should assume she has the Pleiades' powers?
- When voting: Take care to use non-judgmental language.
- Thread discussion necessary: How to not hurt Niko?
- Niko's Wish was to create a version of herself with a happy life. Learning that Kanna goes evil is going to fuck Niko right up. We need to provide support and ensure that the other Pleiades do the same.
- We will assume that Kanna is listening. We need to be supportive for her as well.
- We should not reveal Niko's wish to the other Pleiades.
- I think we need to: Assume our opponents are listening in and use that to our advantage.
- We should let our opponent know that we can resolve this peacefully. We can do this by explaining to the Pleiades what a Clear Seed theft means and what we intend to do about it, using the Kures as examples.
- We should attempt to address our opponents' psych problems while we explain to the Pleiades.
- Thread discussion necessary: How to resolve Airi Anri?
- Thread discussion necessary: Is there anything we can do in this direction for the Soujus? The wiki summary makes them seem like marauding crazies with no actual characterization, which is not great for the therapeutic approach.
- Kanna Hijiri is actually surprisingly simple to help. "Fake people" aren't fake at all. Use ourselves as an example. Then basically just tell the Pleiades that she's Niko's adopted younger sister and sound the charge for a hugpile.
Just to be sure: @Firnagzen, we talked about our potential opponents, including their histories and motivations, in sufficient detail for Oriko to notice any major discrepancies? We're probably not going to be presented with a Kanna Hijiri that has a totally different motivation than canon?
Proposed vote fragments:
[] Privately talk to Niko. Gently explain the possibility of Kanna Hijiri.
-[] Reassure Niko about her Wish.
-[] In case Kanna is listening or has replaced Niko, be supportive and understanding. You can't blame her for feeling lost after waking up with no memory.
-[] Ask Niko what she wants to do about telling the other Pleiades.
-[] Your belief: Kanna needs support and hugs right now, not a manhunt, and the Pleiades should know the entire situation so they can do that.
[] Telepathically tell Kirika and Oriko to saturate themselves with antimagic, but to not react if they see our opponents standing in the room with us or anything like that. If they're going to give you a chance to talk at them, you'll take it.
[] Talk about Clear Seeds.
-[] Explain what it means for getting in a fight.
-[] Discuss rules of engagement: Ask everyone to open with an offer: If our opponent just wanted the Clear Seed, we're happy to provide cleansing and support. We want to help everyone, including the girls that've been driven to extremes by grief or trauma.
- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
A couple things, @Vebyast .
First, going too heavy on the "redemption" angle isn't going to sit that well with the Pleiades - this is still someone who hurt Kazumi's friends and rummaged through their stuff, and she's still working off her panic. Exercise moderation.
Second, with both Kirika and Sayaka calling out PMKM!Hijiri's motivation as outright "stupid", I'm not at all convinced that we can trust that part of her backstory to hold true, and would only be moderately surprised if Niko's wish was significantly different in wording and/or effect than in canon.
First, going too heavy on the "redemption" angle isn't going to sit that well with the Pleiades - this is still someone who hurt Kazumi's friends and rummaged through their stuff, and she's still working off her panic. Exercise moderation.
Second, with both Kirika and Sayaka calling out PMKM!Hijiri's motivation as outright "stupid", I'm not at all convinced that we can trust that part of her backstory to hold true, and would only be moderately surprised if Niko's wish was significantly different in wording and/or effect than in canon.
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SaltyWaffles
I am dissapoint, son
- Pronouns
- He/Him
It's the difficulty of trying to navigate social minefields indirectly, through the limitation of setting plans in personal timestop and then watching them play out until the next timestop arrives of its own volition.
Honestly, it's a wonder that we players have been able to do as well as we have, considering the limitations of the medium.
Some of us do suck at reading people and the situation, though. Which makes the whole democratic, enforced-bandwagon nature of the quest all the more difficult to deal with.
Also, it's a high-pressure situation, often times, because here, social is often a difference between life and death, since emotions literally kill meguca. We have to play therapist to a large variety of people, except that we (usually) can't afford to wait and be patient about things. Sayaka is a great example of this--if we hadn't dealt with her issues as well as we did (and as quickly as we did), there was the real risk that she'd decide to fight a Witch on her own...and potentially suddenly get herself killed due to sheer inexperience (and the lack of a dedicated powerset that she has instinctive skill and capability with), combined with overwhelming eagerness to prove herself. Megane Ono was another classic example--we had to do multiple interventions in the span of almost a single day just to keep her from killing herself.
Honestly, it's a wonder that we players have been able to do as well as we have, considering the limitations of the medium.
Some of us do suck at reading people and the situation, though. Which makes the whole democratic, enforced-bandwagon nature of the quest all the more difficult to deal with.
Also, it's a high-pressure situation, often times, because here, social is often a difference between life and death, since emotions literally kill meguca. We have to play therapist to a large variety of people, except that we (usually) can't afford to wait and be patient about things. Sayaka is a great example of this--if we hadn't dealt with her issues as well as we did (and as quickly as we did), there was the real risk that she'd decide to fight a Witch on her own...and potentially suddenly get herself killed due to sheer inexperience (and the lack of a dedicated powerset that she has instinctive skill and capability with), combined with overwhelming eagerness to prove herself. Megane Ono was another classic example--we had to do multiple interventions in the span of almost a single day just to keep her from killing herself.
SaltyWaffles
I am dissapoint, son
- Pronouns
- He/Him
We can have this discussion in a privacy field, you know. And Kirika should be able to disrupt the effect through her antimagic. We should ask about her maximum range, and the maximum range at which she can cover an entire area around her.
Vebyast
Nascent Transhuman
...Hum. I didn't get the impression that they were talking about Kanna specifically. I probably should have asked about that earlier. @Firnagzen, this:
Who was that pointed at? Or was it more than all three of them were stupid?
And that's why I'm asking how much detail we got into with Oriko. If we told Oriko all of that and she basically said "Yep, that's what I've seen too", then I think we can assume that it's actionable for this reality even if it is totally dumb?
DB_Explorer
Purveyor of alternate realities.
- Location
- San Diego, California
- Pronouns
- He/Him
we're not sure who the enemy is right? We just have ideas?
- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
If you reread the part where we told Mami, Homura, and the Kures about Hijiri, Kirika says she thinks she's played a JRPG where the villains motivation was the same as canon!Hijiri's by way of mockery.
Edit: Cite.
I took that as a sign from the QM to expect more depth in this iteration of her motives.
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Dantalion
Insight: 368
- Location
- A Guest Room at the Brass Embassy, dying of Frenzy
- Pronouns
- Any
Nothing definite. I will say that it's probably not the Soujus - they'd have taken Niko's soul gem if it were them, and they lack a power that could pull off a stealthy KO.
Hijiri and Yuuri are more likely, as they're more vengence-oriented, at least in PMKM.
Assuming, of course, that our metaknowledge is sufficiently accurate.
You don't know - why not ask in character?
There was this proviso for not steamrolling Kazumi, and so Sabrina didn't - she wasn't in any state to really plan coherently or work on these things. Also, the windshield takes a few moments because it's transparent via active (Witchy) Grief.
I mean Momo also misses literally all the time, probably because she's wearing only half a pair of glasses.
Motile Mollusc
Bitten by a radioactive were-tilde
- Location
- Here
Hmm. Would it be less stupid if instead of snaps/seeks revenge/replace humanity it was an attempt to remove fighting and suffering? For which a wide area memory/perception alteration device and a game-changing power source would be useful.
I mean, it's still a dubious RPG/anime plot, but it fits more with her origin wish as described, if that's a strong influence (we sort of have a small sample size).
A possible variation might be planning to only apply it to herself, instead of in general, as being happy and innocent is much easier if you can just not know of all the nasty stuff.
- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
There's a lot of possibilities - to many to really narrow things down much, at this point. Assuming Firn wants to keep the core of the character intact, all I'd say with any certainty is that Hijiri is somehow connected to Niko, and has a motivation that sets her against the Saints.
Motile Mollusc
Bitten by a radioactive were-tilde
- Location
- Here
... As they have the same taste in food, Niko once bought the last piece of a type of cake Hijiri was going to buy. She's held a grudge ever since.
The theft is to make sure no one else will ever buy that cake before her again.
The theft is to make sure no one else will ever buy that cake before her again.
- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
still makes more sense than puella magi kazumi magica
Karnewarrior
Leastmost of the Hanged Man Arcana
Just gonna point out to the thread that I suggested this a few pages back, because I knew this was the response we'd get.
Torgamous
Aspiring Gynoid
- Pronouns
- She/Her
For planning purposes, why not answer now and then have Sabrina ask early in the next update?
Onmur
Archangel of Nutella.
Well, of course she is! She just apologized for losing the Seed!
Oooooohhhhhhh waaaaaaaaaiiiiiiiiit you mean Hijiiiiiriiiiiiiiiii...
Well, we should mention the reason why we believe Hijiri might go crazy; IIRC, it's simply lack of understanding.
From Niko's perspective, she believes she can't live a happy life, so she gave up everything so someone else could.
From Hijiri's perspective, she was made as a fake replacement to cover up for Niko who went to have a happy fun magical life, while she was stuck a muggle.
So yeah, Niko's Wish didn't work exactly as intended, but it can.
Always Happening
We could have prevented this.
- Location
- On a train with no brakes
Now let's be fair to the poor girl; she managed to hit once, even if it was by sheer bloody happenstance.I mean Momo also misses literally all the time, probably because she's wearing only half a pair of glasses.
Fair enough. It's a very short ranged prototype, no more than a few meters radius.
Now let's be fair to the poor girl; she managed to hit once, even if it was by sheer bloody happenstance.
- Location
- america
that is........thats some horrible eyesight if that is what she is seeing. like srs.Fair enough. It's a very short ranged prototype, no more than a few meters radius.
blast flame
How far will we go if it means lighting the way?
- Location
- Perth, Australia
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Sometimes SV's love for Girls Und Panzer makes me wonder if I should watch it.