Puella Magi Adfligo Systema
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- puella magi adfligo systema puella magi madoka magica be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist bad decisions dating mami tomoe (tomoe mami) diabolical laughter friendship is the best ship handholding identity crises microwaving tea gets you put in the bad place names are important the body is the fursona of the soul this is not the baked goods thread we don't talk about rionna what could possibly go wrong? who in the world is azure sanfrancisco?
UbeOne
Daydreaming CPU
- Location
- Philippines
- Pronouns
- She/Her
She's not asking a yes/no question.
AuraTwilight
The Sorcerer of Smiles
- Location
- The Silver City
You know a way easier solution than turning everyone into sane witches or destroying a concept would be to have a shitload of magical girls make a communal Barrier.
This is an argument about definitions. Fundamentally, the ability to reality-warp with no energy costs is inherent the "magical girl / witch / etc" being's existence, and finding a way to unlock that without being "overwhelmed by a curse that they will spread to the world" is the goal, whether you call that 'sane Witch' or something else.
This doesn't make sense - the reason we didn't tell her was very specific to her - because we expected her to react negatively because of her connection to what Oriko had done. There was no general "Oriko is a secret" principle, and no reason to think she thinks there was one.
You know, except the part where it affects whether someone can become a magical girl. Sure maybe that 's Kyubey's fault, but why do you expect him to cooperate with changing it?
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OctarineShrike
Avatar of Mandos
Because if he's going along with this, he no longer needs to worry about energy yields. Just offering ascension to anyone interested. If he wanted to engineer emotions into himself he could theoretically join the Rakshasa parties at the end of the universe.
Madou Sutegobana
Autocorrupt has been disabled.
- Location
- Twin Realms Mandala
My objection to discussing Oriko is that it's phrased in a very insensitize manner.
We spent quite some time trying to convince Oriko that she doesn't need to be a villain for the greater good, that we can get along, that we consider her a friend, and then we turn around and tell the Meguca equivalent of a newspaper that she's our token evil teamate and we need to hire some people that can take her down if she regains her powers and immediately returns to her wicked ways.
And yeah, that's how Kyuubey would summarize it to her if he decides to make trouble for us!
Edit: So yeah we're saying some very not-nice things about Oriko and making it sound like we're only keeping her around because her visions are useful. Heck we might not need Kyuubey to screw us over, if Oriko's visions return and show her the conversation it would look like we we're disingenuous with her the entire time!
We spent quite some time trying to convince Oriko that she doesn't need to be a villain for the greater good, that we can get along, that we consider her a friend, and then we turn around and tell the Meguca equivalent of a newspaper that she's our token evil teamate and we need to hire some people that can take her down if she regains her powers and immediately returns to her wicked ways.
And yeah, that's how Kyuubey would summarize it to her if he decides to make trouble for us!
Edit: So yeah we're saying some very not-nice things about Oriko and making it sound like we're only keeping her around because her visions are useful. Heck we might not need Kyuubey to screw us over, if Oriko's visions return and show her the conversation it would look like we we're disingenuous with her the entire time!
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- Location
- ⇙
Not sold on the Oriko wording either.
Saying a precog told us and maybe adding the bit about her having lost her power should be enough of an explanation. No need for details.
Further explanations can wait until it becomes relevant.
Saying a precog told us and maybe adding the bit about her having lost her power should be enough of an explanation. No need for details.
Further explanations can wait until it becomes relevant.
The Narrator
Disembodied Voice
- Location
- Somewhere Offscreen
Do you expect Sayaka to understand that?
Anyway, I think that there should be an "Oriko is a secret" principle. A precog is the kind of resource that a rival might try to ensure that you lose permanently. Recall that in some possible futures Oriko saw, it was an unknown magical girl that killed her. Right now, less than a dozen people in the world know about her. Let's keep it that way.
Also, as others have noted, Godwinson's vote is seriously oversharing. Those details are not necessary to answer her question, and are opening a whole other can of worms.
I feel like there's a fundamental disconnect here, and I think it might be an issue of timescale.
Even if our established calculations about the lifespan of the universe are all screwy because Incubators!, the sun has billions of years of life left in it. And that's just as a main sequence star, never mind how long it'll be a red giant or keep radiating heat as a white dwarf. We will still have an energy source available for a long, long time.
Our modern prejudices about race and gender aren't still going to exist in five billion years. It's debatable whether the population of Earth in that time will still resemble humanity at all or whether it will have evolved into something unrecognizable. Most of those other issues will probably have been wiped away or radically changed by technological advances long before then. When you're talking about the heat-death of the universe, the only issue is finding a source of usable energy, and magic can provide that; that's the whole point of the Incubators' operation.
The measures you're proposing are simply far in excess of what's necessary to accomplish the stated goal.
The only way for humanity to have "evolved" at all is if it has a substantial majority who do not have biological immortality.
The Narrator
Disembodied Voice
- Location
- Somewhere Offscreen
If a substantial majority of humanity has biological immortality, then turning people into witches seems even more unnecessary, because they already have most of the benefits thereof.
Evolution doesn't necessarily refer to 'natural evolution'. We could all be mind uploads at that point and for many that would be a kind of evolution.
- Location
- Borneo
Human Evolution?
Pfft, it's obvious that we all turn into Humanoid Bug People capable of literally beating the shit out of Gods!
Pfft, it's obvious that we all turn into Humanoid Bug People capable of literally beating the shit out of Gods!
The Narrator
Disembodied Voice
- Location
- Somewhere Offscreen
And here I thought we were going to evolve into giant salamanders that are allergic to water. 
Onmur
Archangel of Nutella.
This semi-randomly gives an idea.
We could use some meguca with powers based around avoiding/repairing collateral damage. I'm pretty sure Walpurgis starts wrecking shit pretty quickly when she arrives, so it'd be nice to have some way to protect the city or at least be able to quickly put the building back together after the fight.
I'm thinking of this only because the mention of a Barrier made me think of those used in Bleach (and other works), which cover an area of the physical world with some sort of spiritual copy, allowing the fighters to wreck the place with no damage being done for real.
Karnewarrior
Leastmost of the Hanged Man Arcana
Should we make a barrier before WPN shows up and then ambush her and toss her in before we try to fight her?
Because that would be pretty funny regardless of success. "GET! IN! THE! BARRIER! YOU! WITCH!"
Because that would be pretty funny regardless of success. "GET! IN! THE! BARRIER! YOU! WITCH!"
OctarineShrike
Avatar of Mandos
It's more if it works we might be able to stop that stuff immediately. Stopping racism and bringing about a post scarcity society now is better if you're weighting the present higher than the future. Like if there's a 1 percent chance you'll get hit by a bus tomorrow, any pleasant experiences you have tomorrow are 99 percent of the value of pleasant experiences today.
If I were Kyubey here I might be bringing up life yet to evolve as an ethical snag in this plan.
It does however avoid the snag of a broken masquerade forcing economies of scale turning the world into a wikipedia edit war or something.
Edit: I just realized I may be sounding very close to this. Not sure of the implications.
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- Location
- Illinois
Kyubey definitely knows, which, well, he's under no obligation to not talk about it and he's actively working against us or will be. I don't think this is an issue.
Yeah. And, well, the hell is she doing here now? This timeline? We could really use more information on her.
The Narrator
Disembodied Voice
- Location
- Somewhere Offscreen
I don't see why you think that giving people grief bodies would put an end to racism. There's almost no actual biological difference between humans of different ethnicities, and that's never stopped bigots before. Hate doesn't care about logic or facts.
As for post-scarcity, that would only apply within the fantasy world of their Barriers. Anyone who wanted to exist in the real world would find that space and material objects are still finite.
That's a good point. Kyubey has a history of sharing that sort of information, and doubtless will do so again in the future.
I still don't see what purpose is served by telling Nadia a whole story about Oriko (and throwing some shade about how untrustworthy she is) right now, however. It's a huge diversion from the current discussion.
A Red Letter Day pt. 8
"A precognitive told me before her Wish power faded," you explain, and grimace. You don't... really like talking about Oriko like this behind her back, former enemy or no. And really, that's the point. Former enemy. You certainly have no qualms about thinking of Ono or Hiroko as the pains they are.
Well, Hiroko, maybe.
Sayaka's expression is tight, but controlled, only the clenching of her fist giving lie to her emotions. Madoka shrinks a little, glancing past Nadia at her friend.
"A precognitive," Nadia says, scowling. "Someone who sees the future, yes?"
"Mm. She caused us... well, she caused us a lot of trouble at first," you say. And now she's under house arrest without a guard, and only her goodwill and the implicit threat of you and Homura coming down on her like a ton of bricks holding her there. "It's actually why I was hoping you might know someone with a danger sense."
Nadia smacks her palm against her face. "Of course, this makes sense. Future-seers are just as impossible as you are." She jabs an accusing finger at you, scowling. "Yes, this makes perfect sense."
"Sorry?" you say with a shrug.
Nadia groans, Mami patting your linked hand in amused consolation.
"Is it that impossible?" Sayaka asks.
"Yes," Nadia grumps, hand still firmly in place. "Sayaka, I have been a traveller for seven years, fimti? I have heard every story and I have seen every horrible fate. There are many con-artists and many girls who did... terrible things. There has not been someone who can actually do what your friend can do."
Sayaka shrugs, settling back in her chair. "Right. I'll take your word for it."
"Incidentally, Nadia, you should probably be careful of Turkey around October to September," you say. "There's a major earthquake due there, I think."
You're not technically sure that the earthquake's going to happen. The Fukushima meltdown didn't, but the tsunami did, and yet, the Syrian civil war seems to be ongoing. It's probably reasonable to conclude that some of the human events have been eliminated by the presence of magical girls.
Nadia's face does something complicated and borderline non-euclidean, and she sighs. "Of course."
Sayaka snickers, ducking her face behind her arm to muffle her laughter.
Mami shakes her head, smiling in amusement. "Sabrina, did you have more questions?" she prompts gently. "Or more warnings?"
You smile back at her, squeezing her hand in thanks. "Well... Are there any particularly nasty groups? Like... You know what Sendai was doing, right? Pressuring people using their services to extort for Grief Seeds, that kind of thing? I mean... I know I'm gonna make a lot of waves with free cleansing and Clear Seeds and so forth, are there any groups that might be problems?"
"Nasty groups?" Nadia asks, opening her hands. "If magical girls think I sent others to attack them, I am dead. I am only myself, fimti? I do not paint targets."
You open your mouth to argue, but Sayaka beats you to the punch. "What?" she snaps, straightening with a sharp jerk. "Why would you help them hide?"
Nadia tilts her head and leans forward. "Yes, Sayaka. I am helping the Iowa group by hiding the fact that they tend to raid cities, fimti?" Her eyes flicker over to Mami, intent and sharp. "I am helping the Saja by not telling you about their tribute system. Ay. I cannot speak about the San Shi Hui, with their protection racket."
She pauses, smiling faintly and soaking in the flabbergasted look from Sayaka. "The last two, Korea and Hong Kong."
"And Iowa?" you ask.
"They travel almost as much as I do. The last I heard, they were in India," Nadia says with a shrug.
Madoka looks horrified, instinctively clutching for the nearest person - Homura. She has a death grip on Homura's wrist, fingers tight, and Homura looks petrified. Frozen in place. It would be funny if it weren't depressing.
"I see," you say. Mami squeezes her fingers, and you give her a soft smile before assuming a regretful, fake voice. "I'm sorry we couldn't see eye to eye, but I certainly wouldn't want you to be troubled by other groups. Perhaps I'll have other questions in a bit - well actually, um, I have questions now."
Nadia smirks, making a little 'go on' gesture.
"Well, I was wondering - Riona Mag Aoidh... hang on, 'Mag Aoidh' is her surname, right?" You continue at her nod. "Riona. Is she feared because she's powerful, or because she's powerful and mean? There's a difference, after all."
"Powerful. She's..." Nadia mutters for a second in Darija, taking a moment to stuff her mouth with more fries, chewing and swallowing before continuing. "Reserved, yes. Does not become friends. If she offers cider, refuse politely, fimti? She brews it herself, but it is..." The Moroccan girl winces.
"Noted," you say with a snort. Friendly, then, for a given value of friendly. "What about Old Lady Catherine? I mean what are her powers, when did she contract, that kind of thing?"
"Don't call her that," Nadia says, brow wrinkling. "She is nasty. She does not pick fights, but she will not even try to save you unless it helps her somehow. She is jaded and cynical. No friends. No family. She is... I think she is a healer, but I am not sure."
"Huh," you say, scowling. That can't be the only way to live to be old as a magical girl. You refuse to let it be, because like hell your friends aren't going to live to see old age, and like hell you'll let them become that.
"Mm." Nadia says, feeding herself the rest of the fish and setting the fork down with a satisfied clink. "Next question?"
"Yeah - do you have a cellphone number, or an email address or something? And do you know of any magical girl forums, or chats, or such?" you ask.
"Cellphone, no," she says. "I do not have a stable income, fimti? I cannot have a plan. Email, yes. Chats, yes. Remind me to show you before I leave."
"Right," you say, nodding. "Next, uh... Last two questions from me! One, do you know of any magical girls who might be willing to travel to Mitakihara to help fight a giant, city-destroying Witch? And do you know anything about the group in Asunaro?"
"Giant, city-destroying Witch?" Madoka squeaks.
Homura stiffens, eyes snapping to you.
[] Write-in
Um...
Well, Hiroko, maybe.
Sayaka's expression is tight, but controlled, only the clenching of her fist giving lie to her emotions. Madoka shrinks a little, glancing past Nadia at her friend.
"A precognitive," Nadia says, scowling. "Someone who sees the future, yes?"
"Mm. She caused us... well, she caused us a lot of trouble at first," you say. And now she's under house arrest without a guard, and only her goodwill and the implicit threat of you and Homura coming down on her like a ton of bricks holding her there. "It's actually why I was hoping you might know someone with a danger sense."
Nadia smacks her palm against her face. "Of course, this makes sense. Future-seers are just as impossible as you are." She jabs an accusing finger at you, scowling. "Yes, this makes perfect sense."
"Sorry?" you say with a shrug.
Nadia groans, Mami patting your linked hand in amused consolation.
"Is it that impossible?" Sayaka asks.
"Yes," Nadia grumps, hand still firmly in place. "Sayaka, I have been a traveller for seven years, fimti? I have heard every story and I have seen every horrible fate. There are many con-artists and many girls who did... terrible things. There has not been someone who can actually do what your friend can do."
Sayaka shrugs, settling back in her chair. "Right. I'll take your word for it."
"Incidentally, Nadia, you should probably be careful of Turkey around October to September," you say. "There's a major earthquake due there, I think."
You're not technically sure that the earthquake's going to happen. The Fukushima meltdown didn't, but the tsunami did, and yet, the Syrian civil war seems to be ongoing. It's probably reasonable to conclude that some of the human events have been eliminated by the presence of magical girls.
Nadia's face does something complicated and borderline non-euclidean, and she sighs. "Of course."
Sayaka snickers, ducking her face behind her arm to muffle her laughter.
Mami shakes her head, smiling in amusement. "Sabrina, did you have more questions?" she prompts gently. "Or more warnings?"
You smile back at her, squeezing her hand in thanks. "Well... Are there any particularly nasty groups? Like... You know what Sendai was doing, right? Pressuring people using their services to extort for Grief Seeds, that kind of thing? I mean... I know I'm gonna make a lot of waves with free cleansing and Clear Seeds and so forth, are there any groups that might be problems?"
"Nasty groups?" Nadia asks, opening her hands. "If magical girls think I sent others to attack them, I am dead. I am only myself, fimti? I do not paint targets."
You open your mouth to argue, but Sayaka beats you to the punch. "What?" she snaps, straightening with a sharp jerk. "Why would you help them hide?"
Nadia tilts her head and leans forward. "Yes, Sayaka. I am helping the Iowa group by hiding the fact that they tend to raid cities, fimti?" Her eyes flicker over to Mami, intent and sharp. "I am helping the Saja by not telling you about their tribute system. Ay. I cannot speak about the San Shi Hui, with their protection racket."
She pauses, smiling faintly and soaking in the flabbergasted look from Sayaka. "The last two, Korea and Hong Kong."
"And Iowa?" you ask.
"They travel almost as much as I do. The last I heard, they were in India," Nadia says with a shrug.
Madoka looks horrified, instinctively clutching for the nearest person - Homura. She has a death grip on Homura's wrist, fingers tight, and Homura looks petrified. Frozen in place. It would be funny if it weren't depressing.
"I see," you say. Mami squeezes her fingers, and you give her a soft smile before assuming a regretful, fake voice. "I'm sorry we couldn't see eye to eye, but I certainly wouldn't want you to be troubled by other groups. Perhaps I'll have other questions in a bit - well actually, um, I have questions now."
Nadia smirks, making a little 'go on' gesture.
"Well, I was wondering - Riona Mag Aoidh... hang on, 'Mag Aoidh' is her surname, right?" You continue at her nod. "Riona. Is she feared because she's powerful, or because she's powerful and mean? There's a difference, after all."
"Powerful. She's..." Nadia mutters for a second in Darija, taking a moment to stuff her mouth with more fries, chewing and swallowing before continuing. "Reserved, yes. Does not become friends. If she offers cider, refuse politely, fimti? She brews it herself, but it is..." The Moroccan girl winces.
"Noted," you say with a snort. Friendly, then, for a given value of friendly. "What about Old Lady Catherine? I mean what are her powers, when did she contract, that kind of thing?"
"Don't call her that," Nadia says, brow wrinkling. "She is nasty. She does not pick fights, but she will not even try to save you unless it helps her somehow. She is jaded and cynical. No friends. No family. She is... I think she is a healer, but I am not sure."
"Huh," you say, scowling. That can't be the only way to live to be old as a magical girl. You refuse to let it be, because like hell your friends aren't going to live to see old age, and like hell you'll let them become that.
"Mm." Nadia says, feeding herself the rest of the fish and setting the fork down with a satisfied clink. "Next question?"
"Yeah - do you have a cellphone number, or an email address or something? And do you know of any magical girl forums, or chats, or such?" you ask.
"Cellphone, no," she says. "I do not have a stable income, fimti? I cannot have a plan. Email, yes. Chats, yes. Remind me to show you before I leave."
"Right," you say, nodding. "Next, uh... Last two questions from me! One, do you know of any magical girls who might be willing to travel to Mitakihara to help fight a giant, city-destroying Witch? And do you know anything about the group in Asunaro?"
"Giant, city-destroying Witch?" Madoka squeaks.
Homura stiffens, eyes snapping to you.
[] Write-in
=====
Um...
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UbeOne
Daydreaming CPU
- Location
- Philippines
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Quick, we need more donations for the Don't Make A Wish foundation!
Onmur
Archangel of Nutella.
I agree we need to show we're confident we can deal with Walpy, and just going for overkill.
