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Puella Magi Adfligo Systema

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The modern internet: That magical place where having friends cut limbs and organs and grafting them into each other for fun... fits perfectly into a nominally 'romantic' genre of media.

Somehow.
 
Peeks.

The stuff before Onmur's post.

Didn't hit the insert quote.

Onmur said:
The modern internet: That magical place where having friends cut limbs and organs and grafting them into each other for fun... fits perfectly into a nominally 'romantic' genre of media.

Somehow.
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Though I HAVE been reading Worm fanfics lately so the post didn't register at the time.
 
Onmur said:
Maybe...

"She's holding a grudge... and I can't fault her for it. I'll just have to try and work past it with her."

Keep in mind Kirika does not like Homura.
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So, how about:

[x] Yeah... yeah, I'll try. Mami's already starting to warm up to you two, but Homura... well, when you went after Sayaka, you could have just as easily gone after Madoka, and Madoka is her Oriko, so it's going to be really, really hard to get her to come around. But I'll work on it.
[x] Let's... talk to Oriko a bit. There was actually something I wanted to discuss with her, but obviously this took priority. Hmm... and having some say in her own future might do her some good.
[x] I... was planning on letting Sayaka Miki know about you two at some point. It's only a matter of time until the information gets out, since the white rat knows it. Obviously, you two get quite a bit of say into how that will happen. I'm not sure Oriko's in a great state to discuss that right now, though...
[x] Follow best-buddy's lead on this. Try and raise the issue with Oriko, while giving her agency in determining the outcome.

Also, nice place you've got around here. Think I'll stay awhile (though wow that's a long archive to read through!)

Kind of wish I were here a couple of updates ago, maybe even for "yesterday's" discussion with Madoka, because there's one tack that I think would work especially well on Oriko and also on Madoka: the arrogance of self-sacrifice.

In Oriko's case, she is, like a teenager, focusing too much on the grand gestures. She is convinced that a question as big as "meaning of life" must have an answer as grand as saving the world, even if it costs her own life. The big problem with that is it's self-aggrandizement: she has convinced herself that she is the center of the universe, and everything must revolve around her, and her own great sacrifice. To be blunt: it's arrogance, pure and simple. "The mark of the immature man is that he wants to die nobly for a cause, while the mark of the mature man is that he wants to live humbly for one." Oriko's power will continue to twist on itself, and against her, until she puts aside her own need to assuage her own ego by attempting to die for the sake of the world, and instead decides to use her eyes and look to the person next to her, who only wants her to be happy.

We had a perfect opportunity to point out the same thing to Madoka "yesterday", using Sayaka as an illustration. Sayaka, like Oriko, is so fixated on the grand gesture of repaying perceived debts that she just threw away her life for a Wish. Frankly, it's rather amazing that Mami, Homura, and Sabrina, all of whom made Wishes because to do otherwise would be to immediately die, do not hate her for her presumption, because when you think about it Sayaka's insistence on butting her way into the hard life of a magical girl is hugely inconsiderate. All three of them had made sacrifices to keep her safe, and here she acts like those sacrifices are meaningless, and has decided to throw her life away to assuage her own bruised ego. Her intentions are noble, sure, but in her noble rush towards death she has forgotten that the people around her would prefer her alive, and whole and healthy, and not living with a ticking egg timer to her own death.
 
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Dark Mage said:
Peeks.

The stuff before Onmur's post.

Didn't hit the insert quote.



Though I HAVE been reading Worm fanfics lately so the post didn't register at the time.
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I'm kind of glad I got bored of Worm a while ago.

It sounds like a big part of that fandom went to hell, reading the random post about it.

Knightfall said:
Still a better love story then Twilight.
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This quest actually has characters in love, so... of course!
 
[x] Yeah... yeah, I'll try. Mami's already starting to warm up to you two, but Homura... well, when you went after Sayaka, you could have just as easily gone after Madoka, and Madoka is her Oriko, so it's going to be really, really hard to get her to come around. But I'll work on it.
[x] Let's... talk to Oriko a bit. There was actually something I wanted to discuss with her, but obviously this took priority. Hmm... and having some say in her own future might do her some good.
[x] I... was planning on letting Sayaka Miki know about you two at some point. It's only a matter of time until the information gets out, since the white rat knows it. Obviously, you two get quite a bit of say into how that will happen. I'm not sure Oriko's in a great state to discuss that right now, though...
[x] Follow best-buddy's lead on this. Try and raise the issue with Oriko, while giving her agency in determining the outcome.

Yoink.
 
Onmur said:
Maybe...

"She's holding a grudge... and I can't fault her for it. I'll just have to try and work past it with her."

Keep in mind Kirika does not like Homura.
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@Redshirt Army

That's why we tell her about the reason. Honestly, Kirika knowing about the past loop and Homura's motivation isn't harmful and should help her empathize.

I don't really like the current revised wording for the Homura explanation at all.
 
Ugolino said:
@Redshirt Army

That's why we tell her about the reason. Honestly, Kirika knowing about the past loop and Homura's motivation isn't harmful and should help her empathize.
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... Sympathize?

I mean, sure she can emphatize, I guess...

"Yeah, I totally remember the time I went back into the past a hundred times to save Oriko and had to kill her once."

DB_Explorer said:
English! English! Did you hear? MUG MORE LANGUAGES

Ask Kirika for help.

also

[x]Redshirt Army
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[Q] Let Best Buddy take care of everything, because Best Buddy is Best.
-[Q] "I must go. My planet needs me."
--[Q] It's way past time you made a space station.
 
Ugolino said:
@Redshirt Army

That's why we tell her about the reason. Honestly, Kirika knowing about the past loop and Homura's motivation isn't harmful and should help her empathize.

I don't really like the current revised wording for the Homura explanation at all.
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Fair enough. Unyoinked.

[x] Yeah... yeah, I'll try. Mami's already starting to warm up to you two, and Homura... she got hurt, badly, by other versions of you. But I'll work on it.
[x] Let's... talk to Oriko a bit. There was actually something I wanted to discuss with her, but obviously this took priority. Hmm... and having some say in her own future might do her some good.
[x] I... was planning on letting Sayaka Miki know about you two at some point. It's only a matter of time until the information gets out, since the white rat knows it. Obviously, you two get quite a bit of say into how that will happen. I'm not sure Oriko's in a great state to discuss that right now, though...
[x] Follow best-buddy's lead on this. Try and raise the issue with Oriko, while giving her agency in determining the outcome.

Any ideas on how to bring this up with Oriko (other than "let Kirika do it")? I'm not super happy about how sparse that is in the current vote.
 
Redshirt Army said:
Any ideas on how to bring this up with Oriko (other than "let Kirika do it")? I'm not super happy about how sparse that is in the current vote.
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Might want to address our previous 'pushy' actions first.

And maybe the fact that Oriko tried to run us from her house prison.

Perhaps apology (we've made quite some progress today) and ask to stick around? There's something else we want to talk with her, but we'd also like to just chat for a bit?
 
Also, we should let Sayaka know who they ARE today if possible. Maybe not the house fire but she should meet them- once we run it by Mami and/or Homura.
 
Onmur said:
Keeping in mind Best Buddy does not like Homu, is it OK to use that phrasing? "Madoka is Homura's Oriko?"

Maybe just say that Madoka is very important to Homura (hint, hint)?
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Onmur said:
... Sympathize?

I mean, sure she can emphatize, I guess...
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Er, the latter is why I'm using the whole "Madoka is Homura's Oriko" statement. This Kirika does seem to be surprisingly empathetic for someone who normally wishes herself into a brainwashing: telling her that she and Oriko has set Homura off in exactly the same way that anyone else would set her off by attacking Oriko... well that should give her some perspective on how badly the two of them fucked up, and how very, very contrite they need to be to Murderface from now on.

Past lives? Multiple loops? What basis for comparison would Kirika have for understanding any of that? "You were a coin-flip away from burning down her ojou's house, with her ojou inside"? Yeah, she'd understand that, probably be amazed that she and Oriko aren't retroactively dead already.
 
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Onmur said:
"... So I thought we could introduce Sayaka to Orik-"

"No."

"No."

"..."

"..."

"..."

"... Back to the drawing board."

/JustSocialgucaProblems
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I really wish we could have Madoka act as diplomat in this situation, if only to make Sayaka be more open to listen. Though that would mean convincing Homura to allow it.
 
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akrasiel23 said:
I really wished we could have Madoka act as diplomat in this situation, if only to make Sayaka be more open to listen. Though that would mean convincing Homura to allow it.
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I still think that Sayaka should be introduced to them on neutral terms, so she can form her own "natural" impressions of O&K.
 
TheEyes said:
We had a perfect opportunity to point out the same thing to Madoka "yesterday", using Sayaka as an illustration. Sayaka, like Oriko, is so fixated on the grand gesture of repaying perceived debts that she just threw away her life for a Wish. Frankly, it's rather amazing that Mami, Homura, and Sabrina, all of whom made Wishes because to do otherwise would be to immediately die, do not hate her for her presumption, because when you think about it Sayaka's insistence on butting her way into the hard life of a magical girl is hugely inconsiderate. All three of them had made sacrifices to keep her safe, and here she acts like those sacrifices are meaningless, and has decided to throw her life away to assuage her own bruised ego. Her intentions are noble, sure, but in her noble rush towards death she has forgotten that the people around her would prefer her alive, and whole and healthy, and not living with a ticking egg timer to her own death.
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to be fair, we do have bullshit Sabrina this time around, and technically an imperfect immortality until we figure out how to bullshit even harder.
Onmur said:
Keeping in mind Best Buddy does not like Homu, is it OK to use that phrasing? "Madoka is Homura's Oriko?"

Maybe just say that Madoka is very important to Homura (hint, hint)?


I don't know enough english for this...
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What is another word for 'set of three'?
This is all I could find. I'm not exactly sure where "pair" comes from, and whether its part of a bigger set.
 
I can almost imagine Homura answering:


"Maybe Madoka can't meet Oriko, but we should ask her what she thinks?"

"Nobody cares what Madoka thinks."


(Madoka is for protecting, not thinking).

... But Homu isn't quite that adept at foot chewing, I think.
 
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