I think I'm also going to reaffirm my vote for

[x] Onmur

Last time I checked we we're trying to avoid rants. And NSMS's vote (while not a bad vote under any other circumstance) is a rant no matter how you look at it.

Also agreed, Megane is trying to get a reaction out of us. She'll be sorely disappointed.
 
The Onmur vote is awful and I'm not voting for it despite the wagon. It's literally saying nothing and being vague for no real gain, and I have no idea why the thread's been so obsessed with avoiding giving answers lately...only that this vote is a)not going to win Ono over, b)not going to TELL her much of anything for NO reason whatsoever, c)going to make for a very short update, again for no reason whatsoever. I don't mind wagoning but it has to be a vote that's actually worth voting for. This really doesn't qualify. At all.

Why the hell aren't we going to give Megane a reaction? This isn't some kind of contest. We WANT her to know the facts about Sendai. What is the point of 'winning' by not giving her a reaction and not giving her ANSWERS as a result?!

@Muramasa

Honestly, you were better off with the original vote than the Onmur one.
 
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Well, I'd like a middle ground. Onmur's is kind of vague for no reason, but Ugo's is kind of a history lesson. Too short and too long, those two.
 
I honestly have this urge to just pull out our nifty new gun and test it on Ono's soulgem. But Mami :(

Solution: We give the gun to Mami! (Note: This is not actually a good idea!)

Or worse. Just grief her right up into glass witch. We could always use more grief seeds to experiment on. And if we can fix em, no hard done! This is a horrible option btw.

Well, Mandabar, I don't think we need to worry about Sabrina. Word of the QM is that Sabrina won't witch out unless the thread collectively gives in to despair.

Or we do it on purpose for SCIENCE like idiots.
Well Cool. I don't really thing Sabrina was going full witch or anything though guys. She wasn't even griefing/despairing out or anything. Just... An altered state of mind.

I'm serious. She was letting some of her inner witch out. That dialogue isn't a red herring I think by any stretch of the mind. I'm pretty firm on this. It MEANS something. It's no coincidence that the Black Feather of Doom came out of that Barrier.

Is there any reason why we aren't doing more general point/theme/tone votes instead of dialogue votes?

I can assure you, our plans won't make it past point 2 or 3 at the most before it gets derailed somehow in the story by events/QM and we have to make more choices.

Squeeeee Senpai noticed me!
 
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The Onmur vote is awful and I'm not voting for it despite the wagon. It's literally saying nothing and being vague for no real gain, and I have no idea why the thread's been so obsessed with avoiding giving answers lately...only that this vote is a)not going to win Ono over, b)not going to TELL her much of anything for NO reason whatsoever, c)going to make for a very short update, again for no reason whatsoever. I don't mind wagoning but it has to be a vote that's actually worth voting for. This really doesn't qualify. At all.

Why the hell aren't we going to give Megane a reaction? This isn't some kind of contest. We WANT her to know the facts about Sendai. What is the point of 'winning' by not giving her a reaction and not giving her ANSWERS as a result?!

@Muramasa

Honestly, you were better off with the original vote than the Onmur one.

The vote covers giving answers as soon as we know where exactly she's getting the Sendai story wrong. I think that's more important instead of getting defensive and blurting our spin on it at the start.

What is the point of 'winning' by not giving her a reaction

She's looking for guilt or rage for our actions down there. We would feel guilt for different reasons but that can easily be misunderstood.

and not giving her ANSWERS as a result?!

Go read the vote again and stop overreacting. She's going to get answers.
 
The vote covers giving answers as soon as we know where exactly she's getting the Sendai story wrong. I think that's more important instead of getting defensive and blurting our spin on it at the start.



She's looking for guilt or rage for our actions down there. We would feel guilt for different reasons but that can easily be misunderstood.



Go read the vote again and stop overreacting. She's going to get answers.
It's stalling and wasting time OOC and IC for no reason.

She's going to hear us mumbling and just conclude that she was right because we haven't said much of anything to suggest otherwise. Is it reasonable? No, but that's what Ono is likely to do unless we spell things out for her.

Not if we actually explain ourselves. Somehow I don't think being an emotionless drone the way you're suggesting would go over any better than actually being completely honest. The facts are on our side so WHY are we not using that?

No, she isn't, or there wouldn't be a problem in the first place.

The Onmur vote, in chronological order.


That was a mess. I didn't leave until everybody agreed to not kill each other, yes.
We tell her that she's RIGHT about us. She's going to take that as "Yes I was gilgameshing".

But, I'd like to hear what you know about it, if you would?
Adequate.

If she seems ambivalent, or demands to be release at this point, offer to go for a walk while we talk, so long as we just talk.
Don't interrupt her.

Wasted opportunity to offer to release her ourselves. Properly. Phrasing.
-[X] Offer to share your own version of events, or at least of that which you know.
Vague. WHY is this so vague?! It cuts off after the equivalent of a line of story. WTF is that suppose to do?

If you want Sabrina to say something, SPELL OUT WHAT YOU WANT HER TO SAY. THIS VOTE IS THE EQUIVALENT OF [Q]DO SOMETHING. IT DOESN'T ACTUALLY DO ANYTHING BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T SAY WHAT YOU WANTED HER TO DO.
If she doesn't trust us, we could take her to meet the people involved on both sides of the conflict, if she wants.
No context. No explanation. She still thinks we went roughshod over everyone. We shouldn't leave things on this note.
-[X] Offer Gem cleansing to Homura.
Fluff.

This vote says little of value and wastes an update to do it in a tense situation when we JUST got our first opening.

We've gone absolutely nowhere with Ono and it's largely our own fault. Not ONCE have we voted to actually do something relevant or useful that might get through- such as giving detailed answers while we have her attention.

This whole mess could have been avoided if we'd just spelled things out several updates ago. We didn't. Firn threw us a bone despite our votes, not because of them, and now we're going to screw up the Sendai opening as well by not actually responding to it properly.
 
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Reconsidering.

[x] NSMS


Mind you there's a lot in Ugo's post I don't agree with, but he does have some points in there. For now, that's enough to change my vote.
 
Hmmm. Reread the NSMS vote and while I'm concerned about the clarity of the way NSMS chose to express the points- and didn't say that Akiko was crazy or that we didn't mean to Gilgamesh or explain how and why we did it...I really, really don't like the Onmur vote's approach.

[x]NSMS

Ono might misunderstand us but...
 
I know it's counterproductive, But I kinda wish we were late enough to Ono for her grief spiral to have completed and just become another witch for us to come across.

I feel horrible. But this isn't good for our loved one.

On another note, this whole quest made me really want to watch Madoka Magica again until I realised I don't want to watch past Episode 2. For obvious reasons.

I heard there are other timeliney stuff to watch? Or is it all games/drama/manga?

Things Muramasa Tallied

Hmm. Is there any reason the tally does that? Just glancing it over seems the NSMS votes (4 of them that I saw) are spread out separately into groups of 2? Probable that all the new ones will split up as well? I'm still lost on the subtleties of the tallying system. I assume the difference in a dash (-) or the word Plan might change things?
 
Alternative vote proposal:

[]Sendai was a mess. That wasn't what I wanted to happen or why I went there. I went to stop a war that'd have killed a dozen magical girls and even more civilians.
[]Cleanse everyone. Ask Ono who told her about Sendai, and exactly what they told her.
-[]Tell her our side of things. Everything we can without bombing her, starting with the Sendai girls and Akiko. How you went to Ishinomaki to rescue them and end a war. Tell her about the other girls and what Akiko'd been doing.
-[]She'd been beating the University girls down and starving them to death with her tax. She didn't want to negotiate, or stop. She didn't care about the people she was hurting. We...had to do a lot of damage to stop her and her allies. She...went catatonic after she lost.
[]The rest of the Sendai girls gave up and agreed to leave the others alone, if she wants to call that toeing the line. What were we supposed to have done?
[]You can ask any of the girls who were there about what happened.
[]I don't like talking to you like this (referring to the bindings). If we let you down, will you hear us out?
-[]It's Mami's call.
[]And, no, not like Sendai. We're not going to hurt Ono unless she hurts people. We just want to help her stay alive.

[q]You know nothing, Megane Ono.
 
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Vote changed.

[x]Sendai was a mess. That wasn't what I wanted to happen or why I went there. I went to stop a war that'd have killed a dozen magical girls and even more civilians.
[x]Cleanse everyone. Ask Ono who told her about Sendai, and exactly what they told her.
-[x]Tell her our side of things. Everything we can without bombing her, starting with the Sendai girls and Akiko. How you went to Ishinomaki to rescue them and end the war. Tell her about the other girls and what Akiko'd been doing.
-[x]She'd been beating the University girls down and starving them to death with her tax. She didn't want to negotiate, or stop. She didn't care about the people she was hurting. We...had to do a lot of damage to stop her and her allies. She...went catatonic after she lost.
[x]The rest of the Sendai girls gave up and agreed to leave the others alone, if she wants to call that toeing the line. What were we supposed to have done?
[x]You can ask any of the girls who were there about what happened.
[x]I don't like talking to you like this (referring to the bindings). If we let you down, will you hear us out?
-[x]It's Mami's call.
[x]And, no, not like Sendai. We're not going to hurt Ono unless she hurts people. We just want to help her stay alive.
 
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Vote tally:
##### 3.21
[x] Muramasa
No. of votes: 2
moonstne, chocolote12

[x] Ugolino
No. of votes: 3
angelofwhim, MrLZRS, Sereg

[x] Sendai? So you heard about that mess. Or a version of it. I certainly did make mistakes down there but overall I'd like to think I helped change things for the better.
[x] Can you tell me what exactly you heard about the Sendai and Ishinomaki conflict? I don't mind talking about it. In detail. I can even introduce you to other girls directly involved.
[x] Listen to what Megane has to say. Don't interupt.
[x] Talk about the Sendai and Ishinomaki conflict.
No. of votes: 1
noahgab1133

[X] You hadn't wanted or intended for things to go that way over there at all. But considering the alternative was allowing a war to escalate that would have killed at least a dozen magical girls and who knows how many more civilians...
[X] How did you find out about that? Can you tell me what exactly you heard about the Sendai and Ishinomaki conflict?
[X] Listen to what Megane has to say. Don't interupt.
[X] Ask her if she will listen and not attack again if let down. Leave it to Mami.
-[X] If she does get let down, prepare to grief bind if she attacks again.
[X] Talk about the Sendai and Ishinomaki conflict.
-[X] You had heard about a conflict in Sendai. At first, it has seemed like a battle over territory. Tell her about the scale of the conflict and how other cities and groups were getting dragged into it. The sheer numbers of magical girls would have resulted in many of their deaths and who knew how many innocent people.
-[X] Several girls you knew were already getting attacked, so you decided to over there and try and end the conflict peacefully before it escalated further, perhaps by offering free grief cleansing services. Mitakihara also would have gotten dragged in regardless, since some girls from there knew of you.
[X] Except it turned out that the Sendai group had been extorting the University group of their grief seeds. Tell Megane about the effect it had on the UG including about how one of their members had already died and another left because of it.
-[X] Not to mention that Sendai's leader, Akiko, wanted the entire Ishinomaki group dead.
No. of votes: 1
Agent Whiskers

[X] That was a mess. I didn't leave until everybody agreed to not kill each other, yes.
-[X] But, I'd like to hear what you know about it, if you would?
--[X] If she seems ambivalent, or demands to be release at this point, offer to go for a walk while we talk, so long as we just talk.
---[X] Don't interrupt her.
-[X] Offer to share your own version of events, or at least of that which you know.
--[X] If she doesn't trust us, we could take her to meet the people involved on both sides of the conflict, if she wants.
-[X] Offer Gem cleansing to Homura.
No. of votes: 6
Onmur, Skelm, Dirtnap, Kyrina, Redshirt Army, defenestrator

[x] What? 'I made sure people toed the line?' Is that what you've heard? You really think I could police twenty-odd girls in two different cities?
[x] And how do you even know I was there - it was barely a couple of days ago, no-one there mentioned you, and now someone's dragging my name through the mud in the next city over?
[x] There's no fighting there right now because no-one really wanted to fight - the entire conflict was one girl stirring up trouble and everyone else getting ready to defend themselves.
[x] And it was Chouko and Yumi that agreed to stop the fighting - I didn't make anyone do squat.
[x] My contribution to the whole thing was stopping Little Miss Psycho's sudden-but-inevitable betrayal and then helping paramedics save innocent people that she put in danger.
[x] That's it - that's why I was there: I didn't want people to die. Same reason I'm hear with you right now.
No. of votes: 1
PhantomFractions

[X] I didn't leave until people stopped killing each other or starving other people to death and i'm proud of doing something instead of letting people die
-[X] Sorry, i truthfully thought you were simply ignorant of the situation, but seems that you know the danger of a being a magical girl, am i wrong?
-[X] if seems like she know what she we are talking about keep going, if not.
--[X] Because to me you seems pretty much calm considering that you're were going to die in...what? a day? two? Or maybe i should be counting in hours?
-[X] Still i...don't understand, in that case why you are so adverse against me? Why do you prefer practically kill yourself before even talk to me?
-[X] We both know i'm not going out of here until i know you are not dangerous, to yourself and to others, so now we can finally talk, i only ask this: if there is problem, if you have a problem with me, i want to talk, before people die for nothing.
-[X] You want to know the reason? Because i already saw too many people like you die because they were ignored, instead of being treated like they deserved.
-[X] let her talk, if don't seems to dangerous free Ono.
No. of votes: 1
Lord Marshal

[X] Sendai was a mess, I'm not going to pretend otherwise, but what do you think would have happened if I had just left it? The University Girls had already lost a friend and had their lives ruined by Akiko's extortions, and Akiko has some sort of complex over grief seeds that kept her obsessing over them and a huge grudge against Ishinomaki. Neither side would have given up, and both were already calling in allies when I intervened. How many Magical Girls do you think would have died if I hadn't gotten involved? How many civilians would have been caught in the crossfire before it ended?
-[X] So I'm curious- what is it about me refusing to leave until both sides stopped trying to kill each other, convincing them to sit down and negotiate to try and find a peaceful solution, and stopping Akiko from continuing her grief seed racket that you dislike enough to decry it as me making people 'toe the line'?
-[X] If she expresses confusion over what we're talking about, ask her about what she's heard about Sendai and offer to explain the situation in more detail. If she refuses to believe us, offer to put her in contact with the other girls who were involved.
-[X] If she seems ambivalent, ordemands to be released at this point, offer to go for a walk while we talk, so long as we just talk. If she doesn't demand it, offer to let her down anyway so long as she doesn't try attacking us again.
No. of votes: 2
GilliamYaeger, Aranfan

[x] NSMS
No. of votes: 2
AuraTwilight, 'Lement

[X] Sendai was a mess, I'm not going to pretend otherwise, but what do you think would have happened if we had just left it? There was too much bad blood and too many grudges for either side to give up, and with both of them already starting to call in allies... how many Magical Girls do you think would have died if we hadn't gotten involved? How many civilians would have been caught in the crossfire before it ended?
-[X] You must've heard the news; three people died there, and that was one fight, one where we stopped both sides from calling in their full stable of favors and reinforcements. If we had stood aside and let them fight, let them escalate, let more battles happen... why is stopping that such a terrible thing that you decry it as making them 'toe the line'? Why is that more important that the lives of innocent people?
-[X] If she expresses confusion over what we're talking about, ask her about what she's heard about Sendai and offer to explain the situation in more detail. If she refuses to believe us, offer to put her in contact with the other girls who were involved.
-[X] If she seems ambivalent, or demands to be released at this point, offer to go for a walk while we talk, so long as we just talk. If she doesn't demand it, offer to let her down anyway so long as she doesn't try attacking us again.
-[X] Offer Soul Gem cleansing to Homura.
No. of votes: 5
NSMS, Mandabar, Gadjo, Lordsservent, TJSomething

[X]What exactly did you hear about Sendai?
No. of votes: 1
DracoDracul

[x]Sendai was a mess. That wasn't what I wanted to happen or why I went there. I went to stop a war that'd have killed a dozen magical girls and even more civilians.
[x]Cleanse everyone. Ask Ono who told her about Sendai, and exactly what they told her.
-[x]Tell her our side of things. Everything we can without bombing her, starting with the Sendai girls and Akiko. How you went to Ishinomaki to rescue them and end the war. Tell her about the other girls and what Akiko'd been doing.
-[x]She'd been beating the University girls down and starving them to death with her tax. She didn't want to negotiate, or stop. She didn't care about the people she was hurting. We...had to do a lot of damage to stop her and her allies. She...went catatonic after she lost.
[x]The rest of the Sendai girls gave up and agreed to leave the others alone, if she wants to call that toeing the line. What were we supposed to have done?
[x]You can ask any of the girls who were there about what happened.
[x]I don't like talking to you like this (referring to the bindings). If we let you down, will you hear us out?
-[x]It's Mami's call.
[x]And, no, not like Sendai. We're not going to hurt Ono unless she hurts people. We just want to help her stay alive.
No. of votes: 3
Ugolino, Muramasa, Godwinson
 
Considered NSMS and Onmur, but Ugolino's improvements are fine with me, so sticking with my vote.
 
And the whole reading of witch runes thing.
They're just alternate symbols for German. Sabrina knows everything we know. She could always read the runes. She's also a polyglot.
I honestly have this urge to just pull out our nifty new gun and test it on Ono's soulgem. But Mami :(
No. Bad.
Just... An altered state of mind.
Actually, we just don't like anything else manipulating grief that's in our range. That's why Witches feel so wrong. Mami just barely counted for that dislike because she was surrounded by our grief and therefore moving it.

I know it's counterproductive, But I kinda wish we were late enough to Ono for her grief spiral to have completed and just become another witch for us to come across.
No, that'd just have given us a HBSOD, because we could have saved her soul and we didn't. I'm glad that we're enduring the Onoplomacy rather than having to deal with that.
 
[X] Ugolino

Simply because it has cleansing before we really get going. I feel that can only help.
 
Personally, I dislike some of these choices, but the thread in general's been clear about wanting to act faster than I about this.

[X] Ugolino

And it doesn't have the problem I saw with NSMS' vote.
 
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