Well, we did save two, namely Masami and her girlfriend.
Puella Magi Adfligo Systema
- Thread starter Firnagzen
- Start date
-
- Tags
- puella magi adfligo systema puella magi madoka magica be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist bad decisions dating mami tomoe (tomoe mami) diabolical laughter friendship is the best ship handholding identity crises microwaving tea gets you put in the bad place names are important the body is the fursona of the soul this is not the baked goods thread we don't talk about rionna what could possibly go wrong? who in the world is azure sanfrancisco?
Crasian01
Insane Incubator
Oh yes, that's right thanks. So more science is needed.
Cannongerbil
I came here to nep at you
- Location
- Soviet Lunar Base
Well, yes, but the map of the PSP games, plus other assorted side materials, show that Mitakihara isn't that much different from other East Asian urban centers (IE crowded with buldings), which is what made Madoka's house so absurd to begin with. There shouldn't be any space for Madoka's house to exist, but exist it does anyway.
theauthor
Birdie
- Location
- Soerabaja
Consindering mitakihara can build a school with anar londo in rooftop I'm not surprised.
Gadjo
Doka
I like to imagine that she originally lived in a normal apartment, or at least a smaller house, but that Homura's timeloops increased the house's potential as well. Like if she kept going long enough Madoka would be living in some kind of flying mansion with robo-servants.
Our ultimate goal is to control ALL of the grief in the world so that meguca don't have to worry about witches or despair, right? As I see it, there are three things we need to do in order to achieve this goal.
1. We need to either make it impossible for meguca to ever become witches (which was Madokami's solution) or else we figure out a way to turn witches back into meguca. Our research with Hildegard seems to be the most promising avenue of research at this time, though it's possible that creating bodies for the ex-witches will be impossible with our current resources; solving this problem might require someone to make a dedicated wish to that effect.
2. We need to be able to cleanse the soul gems of every meguca, but our range is currently limited to 100m. Possible solutions:
i. Use SCIENCE! to discover a way to extend our range.
ii. Use SCIENCE! to discover a way to warp space so that all of the world's grief comes within our 100m aegis.
iii. Turn into a witch.
iv. Use infinite time-stop.
v. Get the meguca to come to us for cleansing (probably via bulk shipping of grief seeds back and forth). This is probably the easiest solution to implement, but there are some morally problematic details that we'd have to resolve if it turns out that it's possible to turn grief seeds back into meguca.
vi. Recruit other girls to help us. If they wish for exactly the same thing that we did, then they ought to be able to gain (roughly) the same powers. If we can personally cleanse 100 meguca, then we'd need to recruit one girl for each 100 meguca to create a sustainable solution.
3. Make sure that the incubators don't interfere. This can be achieved by either making the new system more profitable than the old system or else by restraining/evicting them somehow (which would probably require a reality warping wish of some sort).
1. We need to either make it impossible for meguca to ever become witches (which was Madokami's solution) or else we figure out a way to turn witches back into meguca. Our research with Hildegard seems to be the most promising avenue of research at this time, though it's possible that creating bodies for the ex-witches will be impossible with our current resources; solving this problem might require someone to make a dedicated wish to that effect.
2. We need to be able to cleanse the soul gems of every meguca, but our range is currently limited to 100m. Possible solutions:
i. Use SCIENCE! to discover a way to extend our range.
ii. Use SCIENCE! to discover a way to warp space so that all of the world's grief comes within our 100m aegis.
iii. Turn into a witch.
iv. Use infinite time-stop.
v. Get the meguca to come to us for cleansing (probably via bulk shipping of grief seeds back and forth). This is probably the easiest solution to implement, but there are some morally problematic details that we'd have to resolve if it turns out that it's possible to turn grief seeds back into meguca.
vi. Recruit other girls to help us. If they wish for exactly the same thing that we did, then they ought to be able to gain (roughly) the same powers. If we can personally cleanse 100 meguca, then we'd need to recruit one girl for each 100 meguca to create a sustainable solution.
3. Make sure that the incubators don't interfere. This can be achieved by either making the new system more profitable than the old system or else by restraining/evicting them somehow (which would probably require a reality warping wish of some sort).
- Location
- spinning
It is criticism towards the mismatch between actions taken and "save everyone" ideal.
There is no conflict for those who follow PMAS for, say, interesting SCIENCE or fun of teasing Miki or the dynamic curbstomp combat.
But I am making an argument that for those who claim to follow that ideal that they should follow it or abandon it for another one lest they have hollow ideal - and I already suggest vote lines for what to follow it with.
The actions taken seem a lot more "save the Meguca I know" than "save everyone", hence this ...crisis of faith.
Yes, for less grieving will happen from it.
They are trapped in system indeed, hence the point. Without good works due being in system, you're left staring at someone with terminal cancer with estranged family....Who should still be saved, yes, but them dying due unrelated reasons is much smaller tragedy for less is lost and less is hurt. I do not intend to blame them for it, just like I do not blame terminal cancer patients for having cancer.
With great power comes great responsibility - but it is up to oneself to accept the responsibility.
Furthmore, I hold that being true to oneself is even more important.
For your first question, how many lives are Masami and Kyoko not-ire worth? These seeds and gems do not exist in vacuum, but are born from human sacrifices
As for Mami, there were some nice pages posted a bit ago.
She is lonely person who wants companionship and friends rather than being all heroic - and thus, she is driven by her attachments.
Even hunting is because her friend said that she should do it to be good. I don't think she is a bad person, but I do think she doesn't have the goal of "save everyone".
You're right that I'm complaining of the inconsistency - since as you said, saving everyone even in just Mitakihara won't get voted for and win. There are many moral guides that can even be called good, so it just doesn't match up for me.
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Cannongerbil
I came here to nep at you
- Location
- Soviet Lunar Base
Gadjo
Doka
So what you're saying is that, since we won't save everyone, we should quit trying to save people? That's incredibly naive. People are complicated, capable of both saint-like good and reprehensible evil. You don't have to quit trying to do good things because you aren't a saint.
I don't, actually. link it up, man, I want to go look at it (unless you're referring to Sendai).
NephyrisX
Luck is my dump stat. And the dice shows.
- Location
- Singapore
Oh shit you actually went there
NephyrisX
Luck is my dump stat. And the dice shows.
- Location
- Singapore
Let's just say that the shitstorm was so great that Nuts! had to be called in, four pages had to be removed because of said massive shitstorm, and the thread was placed under lockdown for half a day.
Yeah.
We won't vote for it because Firnagzen refuses to timeskip it, which he won't do because does not allow Sabrina to have a higher motivation than us (since the people who would be saved are more real for her than for us) to get her through the tedious parts.
It is an aggressive action meant to force them to rely on us for survival, because we are the only one who can provide a means for survival that does not rest on a massive pile of dead people.
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mothematics
How wide is the concept of "you"?
- Location
- the bottom of a coffee cup
- Pronouns
- She/Her
I'd very much like it if @Firnagzen didn't have to trawl through another shitstorm after he wakes - vacations are for fun times, you see.
Let's not burn down the thread.
Let's not burn down the thread.
Gadjo
Doka
Shit, man, and here I thought I had seen a flamewar. I haven't seen anything so bad the mods had to break it up.
There really isn't much point to continuing this discussion anyway. We aren't going to vote for it, and most of us aren't bothered by the lack of an enormous timestop witch hunt. The argument isn't really going to accomplish anything at this point.
mothematics
How wide is the concept of "you"?
- Location
- the bottom of a coffee cup
- Pronouns
- She/Her
- Location
- spinning
No?
No. I'm saying it is ok to save people, it is ok to follow lines like "I'll save everyone I know" or "All the puella whose names that I know I will save", but it isn't ok to claim to save everyone then do something different.
Wow. Carinthium?
...You're right. I'll stop discussing and replying on this topic now.
Under the Radar pt. 22
You take a sip of tea and set the cup down on the table. You lean back, stretching your arms luxuriantly as you stare up at the ceiling, before letting your arms flop over, draping them over the back of the sofa and simply thinking for a while. That abandoned house drifts before your mind's eye again, and you feel vaguely sick in your stomach as you tease out what might have happened. Small footprints, surrounding a clear spot in the dust.
Urgh.
Could you have done better?
You could. You could be spending your every moment in the time stop, hunting down every Witch in Mitakihara, in the world, with Homura. But... It'd take an age to do it. It'd be an immense, exhausting undertaking. And... Mami wouldn't take it well, and Homura... simply wouldn't.
"Sabrina?" Mami peers up at you, an expectant, curious look on her face.
You sigh, forcing a smile onto your face as you set those thoughts aside. "It's nothing, Mami," you say softly, half turning on the sofa to face her fully. "Just... I have some things I need to talk to you about." You swallow. "Things I need to apologize for."
A small, apprehensive, expression replaces curiosity, Mami looking worriedly at you. "Sabrina, I'm sure there's nothing for you to apologize for..."
You meet her eyes seriously. "I... there is, Mami." She opens her mouth to protest, and you hold up your hands. "Please hear me out first?"
Mami nods cautiously, reaching out to hold your hand. "Alright, Sabrina, but you don't ha-"
You raise a finger, and she cuts herself off, looking faintly sheepish as she realizes what she was doing.
A deep breath. "Mami, I'm sorry. I'm sorry for taking you for granted. I... Mami, you're an amazing, brilliant person, and I keep treating you as a... non-entity, and I just assume you'll go along with it, most of the time. I... I keep doing that, and I'm sorry."
Mami opens her mouth to protest, but you shake your bead, continuing. "And... I don't... I know you worry, Mami. When I... I don't, uh, take the best care of myself, and I keep getting hurt. I know you worry about me." You pause, taking a breath.
Mami flinches, the worried frown growing on her face. "Sabrina, that's n-not true, I- it's what makes you you, Sabrina, and I w-wouldn't change it for the world." She reaches out towards you, taking one of your hands between hers.
You close your hand around hers, but you shake your head as you continue. "And... that's just it, Mami," you say, your stomach twisting. "I... Mami, I feel like every time you even disagree with me, you're... scared. Scared of me, scared that I'll leave you." Mami's hands slacken on yours, and you grip back fiercely, bringing your other hand up to cover hers and not letting her pull away.
You look at Mami, looking at the worry lines etched around them, the worried, terrified frown framing her usually sleepy, half lidded golden eyes.
"I won't, Mami," you say. "I'd never leave you like that, never over something so small. I'm sorry for making you think that I would." You squeeze her hands in yours. "I'd never leave you, or think less of you, for being yourself."
"Sabrina, I-" Mami chokes off her own words, swallowing convulsively. Her hands tighten on yours. "I- Sabrina, no, I... I'm... I'm not..."
You smile at her, a small, tentative thing. "You told me you wouldn't change me for the world. I wouldn't change you for the world, Mami. I... I don't want you to change yourself because of me, Mami. I... please don't be afraid of disagreeing with me. I don't want you to be scared of me."
"I-I..." Mami tries to return the smile. "S-Sabrina, I. I can't lose you."
"And you won't, Mami," you say. "And if you need to tell me off for doing something stupid, you should."
"I..." Mami trails off, trying to meet your eyes. "I'll try, Sabrina. I-I'm sorry."
"No, I'm sorry, Mami," you say, bowing your head. "I'm sorry, for making you worry. I'm sorry, for taking you for granted. I'm sorry for making you afraid of me, Mami."
"It's not your fault, Sabrina," Mami says. "J-just..." She essays a smile. It's weak and fragile, but it's there. "Y-you said I should tell you off if you're being s-silly, right? S-so... Y-you're being silly, Sabrina." Her hands squeeze yours.
You can't help but chuckle a little. "OK, I asked for that." Your mirth fades all too quickly, though, and you look at Mami again. You suck in a deep breath. "But... I have one more thing to apologize for, Mami."
Mami shakes her head. "Sabrina, you... you don't have anything to apologise for."
Your heart sinks, just a little. She's still idealizing you, putting you in a pedestal."Please hear me out?" You say, pleading.
She nods, the golden drills of her hair swaying with the motion.
You take another deep breath. "Mami... There are... some things I haven't told you. I..." You swallow, watching her expression anxiously. "I don't want to keep secrets from you, Mami, but some of them aren't mine to tell, and... I'm not sure how to talk about some of the others."
You stop, still watching Mami's expression. A complex mess swirls in her eyes, that same fear from before making a return, and denial, and desperation. She licks her lips. "I... Sabrina, I."
"Mami," you say urgently, desperately, still holding her hands tightly in hers. "I don't want to keep these secrets from you. B-but. Some of them aren't mine to tell, and some... I'm don't... I'm not sure how to tell you."
You watch Mami helplessly as she works through it. Finally, she sucks in a breath, speaking in a soft, anguished voice.. "A-are you... S-Sabrina, I-I. Are you k-keeping t-things like. Like K-kyuubey did? B-beca- I-I- Sabrina.."
[] Write-in
And touchdown from my flight! Holding in abeyance:
Urgh.
Could you have done better?
You could. You could be spending your every moment in the time stop, hunting down every Witch in Mitakihara, in the world, with Homura. But... It'd take an age to do it. It'd be an immense, exhausting undertaking. And... Mami wouldn't take it well, and Homura... simply wouldn't.
"Sabrina?" Mami peers up at you, an expectant, curious look on her face.
You sigh, forcing a smile onto your face as you set those thoughts aside. "It's nothing, Mami," you say softly, half turning on the sofa to face her fully. "Just... I have some things I need to talk to you about." You swallow. "Things I need to apologize for."
A small, apprehensive, expression replaces curiosity, Mami looking worriedly at you. "Sabrina, I'm sure there's nothing for you to apologize for..."
You meet her eyes seriously. "I... there is, Mami." She opens her mouth to protest, and you hold up your hands. "Please hear me out first?"
Mami nods cautiously, reaching out to hold your hand. "Alright, Sabrina, but you don't ha-"
You raise a finger, and she cuts herself off, looking faintly sheepish as she realizes what she was doing.
A deep breath. "Mami, I'm sorry. I'm sorry for taking you for granted. I... Mami, you're an amazing, brilliant person, and I keep treating you as a... non-entity, and I just assume you'll go along with it, most of the time. I... I keep doing that, and I'm sorry."
Mami opens her mouth to protest, but you shake your bead, continuing. "And... I don't... I know you worry, Mami. When I... I don't, uh, take the best care of myself, and I keep getting hurt. I know you worry about me." You pause, taking a breath.
Mami flinches, the worried frown growing on her face. "Sabrina, that's n-not true, I- it's what makes you you, Sabrina, and I w-wouldn't change it for the world." She reaches out towards you, taking one of your hands between hers.
You close your hand around hers, but you shake your head as you continue. "And... that's just it, Mami," you say, your stomach twisting. "I... Mami, I feel like every time you even disagree with me, you're... scared. Scared of me, scared that I'll leave you." Mami's hands slacken on yours, and you grip back fiercely, bringing your other hand up to cover hers and not letting her pull away.
You look at Mami, looking at the worry lines etched around them, the worried, terrified frown framing her usually sleepy, half lidded golden eyes.
"I won't, Mami," you say. "I'd never leave you like that, never over something so small. I'm sorry for making you think that I would." You squeeze her hands in yours. "I'd never leave you, or think less of you, for being yourself."
"Sabrina, I-" Mami chokes off her own words, swallowing convulsively. Her hands tighten on yours. "I- Sabrina, no, I... I'm... I'm not..."
You smile at her, a small, tentative thing. "You told me you wouldn't change me for the world. I wouldn't change you for the world, Mami. I... I don't want you to change yourself because of me, Mami. I... please don't be afraid of disagreeing with me. I don't want you to be scared of me."
"I-I..." Mami tries to return the smile. "S-Sabrina, I. I can't lose you."
"And you won't, Mami," you say. "And if you need to tell me off for doing something stupid, you should."
"I..." Mami trails off, trying to meet your eyes. "I'll try, Sabrina. I-I'm sorry."
"No, I'm sorry, Mami," you say, bowing your head. "I'm sorry, for making you worry. I'm sorry, for taking you for granted. I'm sorry for making you afraid of me, Mami."
"It's not your fault, Sabrina," Mami says. "J-just..." She essays a smile. It's weak and fragile, but it's there. "Y-you said I should tell you off if you're being s-silly, right? S-so... Y-you're being silly, Sabrina." Her hands squeeze yours.
You can't help but chuckle a little. "OK, I asked for that." Your mirth fades all too quickly, though, and you look at Mami again. You suck in a deep breath. "But... I have one more thing to apologize for, Mami."
Mami shakes her head. "Sabrina, you... you don't have anything to apologise for."
Your heart sinks, just a little. She's still idealizing you, putting you in a pedestal."Please hear me out?" You say, pleading.
She nods, the golden drills of her hair swaying with the motion.
You take another deep breath. "Mami... There are... some things I haven't told you. I..." You swallow, watching her expression anxiously. "I don't want to keep secrets from you, Mami, but some of them aren't mine to tell, and... I'm not sure how to talk about some of the others."
You stop, still watching Mami's expression. A complex mess swirls in her eyes, that same fear from before making a return, and denial, and desperation. She licks her lips. "I... Sabrina, I."
"Mami," you say urgently, desperately, still holding her hands tightly in hers. "I don't want to keep these secrets from you. B-but. Some of them aren't mine to tell, and some... I'm don't... I'm not sure how to tell you."
You watch Mami helplessly as she works through it. Finally, she sucks in a breath, speaking in a soft, anguished voice.. "A-are you... S-Sabrina, I-I. Are you k-keeping t-things like. Like K-kyuubey did? B-beca- I-I- Sabrina.."
[] Write-in
=====
And touchdown from my flight! Holding in abeyance:
[X] If she seems ok or if she asks... Tell her about the metaknowledge. We knew who she was when we met her, the same way we did about the system and Kyubey. We don't know how. We knew who Madoka and Sayaka were too, despite that being impossible...and Homura too. But we were scared to tell her, so we...pretended. We're sorry we kept the truth from her. We knew she was a good person, and we really did want to be her friend.
mothematics
How wide is the concept of "you"?
- Location
- the bottom of a coffee cup
- Pronouns
- She/Her
:|
gimmie a minute and I'll write up a vote
gimmie a minute and I'll write up a vote
Yayyy, trauma and doubt for everyone!
*insert artificial happiness here*
In seriousness, though, Mami's about to lose it again. I'm at a loss on what to do here.
*insert artificial happiness here*
In seriousness, though, Mami's about to lose it again. I'm at a loss on what to do here.
Ho ho ho.
Lemme go drink some rum.
Lemme go drink some rum.
Please take a step back and realize what the metabomb would have done with thoughts like that in her head. Firn's being very generous here
@SynchronizedWritersBlock
Oh, I agree. I just have no idea what to do next.
Oh, I agree. I just have no idea what to do next.
