The Stormbringer
Worm Fanfic & Crack Connoisseur
- Location
- Spaaaaace~!
Dabbling Academic... Does that mean he can teach anyone how to build his tech or magic now?
Brockton's Celestial Forge (Worm/Jumpchain)
- Thread starter LordRoustabout
- Start date
Probably Full Metal Alchemist, that's the safest bet.
Yeah, since in-universe technically anyone can learn it. Only they don't because it requires skill and talent.
- Location
- Not here. Maybe on SB.
I, for one, do have reasons to suspect otherwise. Because if there's no real Joe, why would the Forge (and his Passenger) connects to the set of zeros and ones (or whenever other sumbols Shards' programming uses)? A lot of Shards simulates reality, some of which creates thousands, or maybe millions of simulations at once. Do you think that every Joe from the PtV's simulation receives connection? I doubt it.
Second argument against it - if simulated Joes receive connection to the Forge, the Shards, who control the simulation, will receive all the info about the CF and perks, unless CF blackboxing simulated Joe so Shards can't look how he works. And Occam-sama taught us to not add unnecessary complexity.
Third argument against it - if simulated Joes receive connection to the Forge, then simulated Joes would have all Joe's powers. Including Spiral and psionic, for example. But we have WoG that Shards won't be able to simulate Spiral and psionic.
Responding to attack - no. Responding to appearance of enemy and attacking them - I'd say that's proactive.
He did get powers during that fight, after he heard about Lung's rampage (iirc). That might be it.
Both? Both! Yes, both is good. (c)
Joe's Passenger is overcautious about Coil, that's not something to argue about. And they do want to deny Coil info.
Now that is the thing I argue against. To simulated Passenger it might not be obvious at all. And I can see that happening in "normal reality" if the Passenger have reasons to think that's a simulation.
Doubt it. Really, really doubt it. Otherwise, the scene with Garment wouldn't have happened.
People already explained "magic" part. About "his tech" - he excessively uses his fiat-based effects for it, so no. But just tech that he can build without the need of fiat to function? Yep, no problem.
Also he can teach people skills from Star Trek now. Before it would be difficult because how big the gap between current science level and Star Trek level.
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MaimakteriAnn
(Verified Sleepy)
- Location
- Enormous And Round Terran Homeworld
- Pronouns
- She/Her/Dr
Why can't you use it to break down living creatures? Breaking down Sun Wukong is the only thing they use it for in journey, and they are surprised and annoyed when it doesn't dissolve him because he is too many kinds of immortal at once. So clearly they expected it to be able to break down a living divinity at least.
The Shallow
Shallow, Yet Deep
- Location
- Your Universe
- Pronouns
- She/They
No more cringe than My/Names/Jeff pronouns.
First, we've seen that advanced simulations can almost act as their own realms, according to Joe with the Soul Interface system. Additionally, given that Shards can interact with Souls, thanks to Parahuman/Magic equivalency, I'd say that the simulations emulate Joe's soul. Duplicates, who share Joe's soul remain connected, so that is how forge-chan remains connected.
As for shards gaining all that data, please explain how the scene with Garment, which included ex nihlo matter generation and power interactions with Fashion, which runs 100% on fiat, happened. Because I refuse to believe Shards figured out how Garment or Fashion works that quickly.
EDIT: To clarify, it is my belief that the level of simulation allows Fiat to activate, warping the simulation, meaning that coil-style simulations can be used to glean data on the forge.
Ah yes, the central thing we keep getting back to...
HOW THE FUCK IS THE PASSENGER BEING SIMULATED BY A SHARD
PLEASE
FUCKING
EXPLAIN
YOU SAY THAT SHARDS COULDN'T POSSIBLY GET ALL THE CF KNOWLEDGE, AND YET THEY CAN EMULATE THE PASSENGER?!?!?!?!?!
I can't say I understand the jump authors reasoning, but closest I could say would be is that that was that one dude's (I'm not gonna try butchering his name) personal crucible, and that this is a generic version. I guess if Joe, Aisha, or anyone else want smoking red eyes they can get them though
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Coil experenced a simulation, but we don't know how accurate it was. Simulated Joe could be responding to the lack of information from his passenger or just about anything and we have no way to verify it. The specific perk that gives an exception for Coil could even mean the Forge specifically helps that shard and no other shard.
The Shallow
Shallow, Yet Deep
- Location
- Your Universe
- Pronouns
- She/They
It is true that we don't know the accuracy of Coil's simulations as simulations, or what simulated Joe experienced, but given the accurate simulations of Garment and her interactions with Fashion, I feel it's safe to say that Coil's simulations are accurate, and that Joe doesn't lose his perks or anything like that. Also, extrapolating a free perk that says "due to complications, Coil can't be blocked" to mean "the passenger/forge favour Coil and will give him free info" seems like a stretch personally.
EDIT: Also, this is completely irrelevant of my discussion with Koraan, seeing as we are discussing the specifics of the passengers presence, rather than it's existance.
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ImperatorV
The Laughing One
- Location
- The Voyaging Realm
That's hilarious. Given all the ancient Greek theming of Apeiron (Greek demigod, Greek name, ect), it'd probably be a Greek accent. Whatever that sounds like. LordR wouldn't even need to transcribe the accent, just note in the narration and people's reactions that it's there.
The results of that perk could be incredibly disruptive... But Joe would probably just make voice filters for everyone, which would make it a non-issue after the first five minutes. So it'd be just another brief detour, nothing major.
Unless other factions also develop an accent, in which case things get messy.
- Location
- Not here. Maybe on SB.
Bullshit level scanning and analysis capabilities. The very main purpose of the Shards is to gather and analize data, after all.
I can easily see them able to decipher effects of Fashion perk from the how the molecles of air interacts with Joe. And they had much more data, just from the fight with Oni Lee alone.
Matter generation also been shown by Garment before the Coil's simulation happened. And back then Joe didn't have the anti-clairvoyance curtain for his Workshop, so Shards was able to see that. Maybe they didn't figure out yet that she needs money for it, and simulated Garment created everything really ex-nihilo, we have no way to know for sure.
I said that we have WoG that Shards unable to predict Spiral and psionic. That mean they do not receive information from the Forge.
And yes, I believe that they can emulate Joe's Passenger, since they have data of their interactions. Maybe Shards can't emulate them with 100% accuracy due to insufficient amount of data they have. But I doubt that accuracy of simulation much below the 99,9%, or Joe would've been immune to precogs already, without the need for perks.
Also, if you have reached this level of emotions, maybe we should either stop it or at least take a pause.
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Debatable especially with the fact it isn't molecules or whatever like you said that is causing such effect especially since it's Fiat back, I wouldn't say "easily" especially when things involve Joe powers because in the end that just a conjecture that is being made up.
Just pointing this out Shards can't do Ex-nihilo they can only fake it through dimensional stuff, like pulling matter from other dimensions to make it even possible. Ex-nihilo what garment does is nearly physics breaking enough that it reaches the realm of breaking entropy.
Okay? What's the use of emulating the passenger? It's not like it's the one with CF power or knowledge, also just to point this out Lord said in one of his post since the rolls to get the power are truly random it sort of disrupts precogs a bit and the other effect interfere with said accuracy so it more then below 90%, I think Lord said it only got worse somewhere. Remember how tattletale power couldn't figure the fiat backed effect of the stuff that gets fix after 2-3 days? And tattletale call it impossible? There's probably more things lord mentioned that are Interfering with scans or analyses of the shards.
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You know our concept of time and the story concept of time is the thing that is screwing with us the most and is not even intentional
- Location
- Not here. Maybe on SB.
Joe's body acts like been made from steel/plastic/boxing gloves/ets under the effect of Fashion perk. I don't say they can ubderstand how that happening. But what happening - I don't think they had any real problem with understanding. There a whole bunch of forces that affects us constantly, like gravity, air around us and so on. From how those powers affect Joe differently when he donning the certain items, they can extrapolate the effect (but not the mechanism behind it, since fiat is fiat).
I said, that if Shards didn't figure out that Garment needs money, the simulated Garment may had power to summon matter ex-nihilo.
To emulate his reactions and, more importantly, his interactions with Joe. That's one of the main point of the discussion we have with The Shallow, btw.
1) This happened before his creations demonstrated this ability. And since this ability is fiat-based, there are no signs by which its existence can be extrapolated.
I wouldn't be surprised if Shards currently assumes that all Apeiron's works restores itself in two days.
2) What Shard says to it's host is very much not equal to what Shards know/detects. They operate in accordance with the rules they set for the host's powerset. For example, do you really think that Coil's shard can only simulate two timelines at once?
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It's simulated, your spelling it wrong repeatedly.
- Location
- Not here. Maybe on SB.
Thanks. English isn't my native language, so things like that happens sometimes.
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- Location
- Not here. Maybe on SB.
Gifts arrives every other week, iirc.
And if he will get the book, and that will be a copy of the BCF... Interludes, folks.
- Location
- Paradise, Hawaii
So, question?
Tattletale ended up asking Aperion for access to her watch/ supercomputers functions.
Aperion let her have access with a warning.
What can she learn from it?
Edit: A side note, Aperion can become a Prehistoric Wolf thing, can Bitch mutate that form as well?
Tattletale ended up asking Aperion for access to her watch/ supercomputers functions.
Aperion let her have access with a warning.
What can she learn from it?
Edit: A side note, Aperion can become a Prehistoric Wolf thing, can Bitch mutate that form as well?
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Cave_Canem
Miniature Cyberwolf
From what was said in chapter, I got the impression he just reactivated what it had before, not any extra abilities.
He said they could discuss it if she needed more direct access for a later job.
- Location
- Deep inside the sand
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Alec said Apeiron was on international news. What did they talk about regarding his title?
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- Location
- United States
That's the one where he doesn't have to go to the bathroom if he doesn't want to right?
Edit: Never mind, completely seperate perk.
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You know weirdly I think the most useful thing he got here outside of the glove might have been the Flack Jacket.
Because it's a jacket. Core body armor that is fiat backed. like the battleship boots, except unlike that it's one that can be wrapped around his most squishy and vital of meat stuff that lays under his neck.
All he'll need now is some kind of head piece perk and he could be an indestructible walking torso!
Edit: Also Aisha ships Gloveperon. I approve!
Because it's a jacket. Core body armor that is fiat backed. like the battleship boots, except unlike that it's one that can be wrapped around his most squishy and vital of meat stuff that lays under his neck.
All he'll need now is some kind of head piece perk and he could be an indestructible walking torso!
Edit: Also Aisha ships Gloveperon. I approve!
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- Location
- USA
He doesn't need that much coverage though. He has a bunch of different piece that are specialized for different defenses and he gets the benefit of all of them everywhere.
- Location
- Paradise, Hawaii
This is not some vague dig at Aperion using his Glove to scratch his back, right?
There are teeth attached to the glove.
The remaining perk in the Clothing Constellation (from "The World Ends with You") is "Fashion nonvictim". It's very similar to the "Fashion" perk got as his first roll, way back in Chapter 2, in that wearing a single piece of armour will protect him as though he was wearing a full suit of armour made from that material, but it has an extra effect: so long as what he tries to wear is "fashionable", he is comfortable wearing it. Even if it's massively the wrong size/shape for him, he can wear it in a way that looks good, and he's perfectly at ease in any weather; t-shirt in a monsoon, speedos in a snowstorm, full black-leather in a heatwave. Again, only if the outfit is "fashionable", but… *gestures at Garment Gloves*
Oh, and it might come with a Free Perk too. Either "Revival" or "Reaperdom", both of which have sub-variants. For example, "Revival" has "Discombobulate"(which is basically a knock-off version of Tattletale's power that only works on people, but not on objects/events), "Hear My Voice" (discount Bad Canary / Jedi Mind Trick plus super-singing abilities), "Keikaku Doori" (gives him the ultra-planning make-it-look-like-an-accident abilities that everyone already thinks he has) or "Mental Fortress" (which makes him immune to mind-reading, and many Master or Stranger effects. So, he would completely no-sell Gallant's blasts, Glory Girl's aura, Cherish, or even Heartbreaker), while "Reaperdom" lets him shift between the real world (RG) and the afterlife (UG) to become invisible & intangible (and use his Player Pin to read people's thoughts), and summon a shadow-duplicate to help himself fight, plus the sub-variants such as creating Noise monsters to fight for him, creating new and more powerful versions of the Entanglement Pin he got with the other TWEwY perk, or the ability to transform into a Noise-based monster form. However, Reaper abilities are powered/charged by death; he gets 1 week of use for every person who dies as a result of his actions. (Technically, the Reaperdom sub-variants are bought with CP, but comes with 200 CP free to spend on them. Whether LR will allow Joe's extra charge to be spendable or not if Reaperdom is rolled is up to him.)
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Is it possible that Accord might go (or send someone) to the summit? He's from out of town, but Boston is reasonably close and he is extremely obsessed with Apeiron.
That and whatever it being impossible for him to choose the timeline that didn't have it happen looks like from his point of view. And/or something happening that his simulation couldn't predict.
That and whatever it being impossible for him to choose the timeline that didn't have it happen looks like from his point of view. And/or something happening that his simulation couldn't predict.
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