Remove ads

Brockton's Celestial Forge (Worm/Jumpchain)

Reader mode
The Shallow said:
Yeah suspected that, and mentioned that earlier. Still, just as a concept it's still interesting. Like The AIs would likely just get more efficient at their tasks or smth, Tetra possibly something about the connection? but Aisha is a bit of an enigma(pun intended). Like, would she have a minor tinker/shaker power of minaturizing tech? Would her existing power get upgraded? Etc.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
First: Second-triggers don't just hand out new minor powers, they ping nearby shards to reconfigure your existing power.
I'm gonna guess that Aisha theoretically Second-triggering and pinging M/E would look something like "adds a detrimental mental effect to Aisha's power" - Given the theme of 'Miniaturization and Efficiency', maybe it scrambles people's minds when they try to think of Aisha/look at her/her name/other reminders that she exists (making their mind Less Efficient - people linger on certain thoughts for longer than they would otherwise, have a harder time drawing conclusions, take longer to process stimuli, trouble with recalling memories, etc.). That, or it makes them better at processing things but with hard-core tunnel vision on whatever they were focusing on before the effect took hold.
As far as the A.I. and Tetra go first we have to think of what the trigger Is;
We've already seen that Survey has a lot of issues in regards to categorizing, cataloguing, and fully analyzing everything in her environment, which causes her stress in her dealings with Joe and his perks and the like. So I'm thinking that Survey's trigger would involve somehow being thrust into an environment where she can't accurately perceive/categorize/analyze Anything in her environment. Using the power of artistic license i'm going to say that this gives Survey a power that imposes hard-rules on her environment, making the objects in that environment behave as they 'should', which has a handy side-effect of making them more efficient than they would otherwise be ().
I imagine Tetra probably triggers from isolation from Joe, who's been around to interpret her vibes and the like for essentially her entire life. So she gets a master power that lets her create Joe-shaped minions (flavored by Tetra's memories of the duplicates) that essentially act as a Joe-skinned Mr. Meseeks - pop into existence, do whatever Tetra asks of them, and then disappear. This process is, of course, Very efficient. The minions act with as much grace as The Bogeyman (Contessa), the Numberman, or the former S9 member Harbinger who seems to have disappeared one day.
Fleet, of course, would never reach the amount of mental anguish it requires to trigger. Fleet remembers The Road, after all.

I have solved the concept. Cease all interest immediately. (/s)
 
The Shallow said:
Was rereading, and I came across this little thing:

I vaugley remember watching Samurai Jack, but I was a young kid at the time. Anyone familiar with what this would entail?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
The aspects of how the runes get more powerful, by detail, materials and construction where made by Lord as there was not a lot of info about them.

It's similar to the Alchemy that he got from samurai jack as the perk was based of one episode and had Lord ask for ideas on how it should work, then he figured out a way by having achemly being effects that will atleast change you a little, I. E want to breath underwater you get glowing eyes, skin hard as iron, expect scales, this means that the alchemy is best at changing your shape.
 
Mourning Glory said:
The aspects of how the runes get more powerful, by detail, materials and construction where made by Lord as there was not a lot of info about them.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
The question was about "The power could be further boosted by arcane methods and rituals in the inscription process".
I.e. how Joe can dance with a tambourine during the carving process to make runes even more powerful?
 
Some WoG on Magitek Mastery:
Me:
Also I'd like to hear your interpretation and usage of the Magitech Mastery perk, it was one I had my eye on, but it seemed like it could be used for almost anything that I didn't want to hype up too much. So I'm curious the possible applications of it.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Lord:
The biggest things about Magitek Mastery, at least in terms of infusing life with magic, come from the lines "allowing them access to that magic system", "enhancing them physically", and "no upper limit to them beyond what the magic's system is capable of". If you infuse someone with a fire spell you don't just give them the ability to use that fire spell, you give them access to the entire magic system that was used to cast that fire spell. This brings up the question, what counts as a magic system? If you have two different types of magic in the same universe do they count as distinct systems, or is it all the same magic? That's a complicated question and will need to be addressed on a case-by-case basis, but given the source of the power and the fact that monster abilities were treated as distinct from conventional magic (blue magic) I'm inclined to rule that you can have multiple types of magic in the same universe.

A major aspect that was snuck into the perk was the point about "enhancing them physically". There are limited examples of what this could mean from the game beyond the combat abilities of Celes and Kefka, but it's clear there's some level of enhancement to the body that comes from the process, which would likely be specific to the system in question. Harry Potter magic would probably grant the enhanced durability that wizards are regarded to have based on the types of things they survive in the books. Strike witches would grant a persistent version of the enhancements that allow the witches to function in the air, breathing in low oxygen environments, protection from wind, cold, and g-forces, and minor reinforcement against damage. For Fate it would probably function as a persistent and inherent version of personal reinforcement. Other systems would grant other benefits, and there's nothing to indicate these can grow without limit like the rest of the magic given, but the bonuses could stack, meaning you'd get as many as you had types of magic systems you had to use.

The key question for this story is what is the 'magic system' for parahumans? The basics are known, have trigger event, get related powers, the nature of which are based on your shard and the nature of your trigger. The thing with Magitek Mastery is that it allows the infused powers to grow to the limit of what is possible in the system. That might be the most significant part of the perk. It acts to remove limits to growth, even in systems where growth isn't possible. Joe could use it to grant parahuman powers to a normal person, but he could also re-infuse a parahuman with their own power to allow them to grow in strength and ability without needing a second trigger. It applies to other magic systems as well. In Fate it would let a magus improve their magic circuits and add additional ones through training and practice, up to the limit of what is possible in magecraft.

That raises the question of what are the limits of the parahuman power system. Scion would be the logical place to look, but he isn't really in the 'parahuman' space. Same with Endbringers. You want to look at actual Parahumans and see how far their powers can go. Who are the premiere parahumans? The absolutely most powerful? Eidolon, Galstig Uaine, Sleeper, Ash Beast, Nilbog, Tinker 15, and Khepri. At the bare minimum, that is the level that Magitek Mastery would allow a person to reach. If Joe infused someone with parahuman energy they could train their way up to the point where they could challenge S-Class threats. Given the fact that clusters and trump powers are part of the parahuman system there is also the possibility of gaining new abilities, new powers or different classifications of your own power.

Attaining this kind of power isn't an easy matter. The wording of the perk with the emphasis on the ability starting weak and needing practice and development suggests it is a major endeavor to develop just a single form of magic. You are probably looking at months or years to attain prominence, and potentially the work of a lifetime to truly reach the peak of a system. That said, the 'peak' of what even a single system of magic is insane. In Harry Potter that would mean Dumbledore at the very minimum, and would probably be much more powerful. With Fate that could mean Merlin or Solomon, and that's still assuming that True Magic, divine powers, phantasmal beasts, and the abilities of servants fall under a different system, otherwise you'd be able to accomplish that as well. You could use the accelerated version of infusion to cut the time down dramatically, probably reducing it to days or weeks instead of years, but the mental instability that can create is a very bad combination when paired with the kind of power the perk unlocks.

Finally, there is a level of 'parahuman power' above even what you see from the capes listed above. While it would technically be possible to reach that point using the growth from Magitek Mastery, that would be one of the "the work of a lifetime" examples previously mentioned. With that said, since it is technically possible as an expression of parahuman power, a cape who had their limits removed with Magitek Mastery could potentially become a Titan through their own effort, and maintain control of themselves and their abilities while in that state.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Basically, Joe getting this perk would be absolutely bonkers as it's basically infinite power for him and allows power growth and just massive boost for everyone else
 
Last edited:
In Fate it would let a magus improve their magic circuits and add additional ones through training and practice, up to the limit of what is possible in magecraft.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Now that's something I don't see as plausible (that's my opinion, and I don't say that is the right one, or that LordR should listen to it, but have to bring an argument anyway).
In the Fate system, one can't increase the number of circuits through time and practice. There, iirc, is some obscure methods, but most if not all of it either have horrible price for user or need a sacrifice... Often both.
So, IMO, number of circuits is one of a "limit of what the magic's system is capable of" for Fate magic.

Some might think the same about parahumans - that one can't make their power stronger through time and practice, only through Second Trigger. That's not exactly right. For example, we can remember Skitter's canon inconsistent range, that sometimes increases or decreases, apparently based on her emotional state/stress level. Another example is Sechen Range.
So, parahuman powers not have that hard limit, unlike circuits.
 
Koraan said:
In the Fate system, one can't increase the number of circuits through time and practice. There, iirc, is some obscure methods, but most if not all of it either have horrible price for user or need a sacrifice... Often both.
So, IMO, number of circuits is one of a "limit of what the magic's system is capable of" for Fate magic.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Well there's also the method of getting a dragons core or heart like Artoria and Sigurd, tho I only remember Sigurd gain his dragons heart by killing and eating the heart of a dragon to boost his magic power. I think saber gain her own by doing something similar, I think. So there's the option of increasing magic power through killing a dragon for somehow.
 
Daxus1120 said:
Well there's also the method of getting a dragons core or heart like Artoria and Sigurd, tho I only remember Sigurd gain his dragons heart by killing and eating the heart of a dragon to boost his magic power. I think saber gain her own by doing something similar, I think. So there's the option of increasing magic power through killing a dragon for somehow.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Question:How did Artoria gain a dragon core?
Answer:A wizard did it.
(Merlin infused into her the blood of a dragon when she was a baby)
 
With Joe's self modification ability and some research, wouldn't he be able to increase his magic circuits sans sacrifice/flavors of horribleness? He's working at a crazy level. Note, I'm talking possibility not willingness.
 
Koraan said:
In the Fate system, one can't increase the number of circuits through time and practice. There, iirc, is some obscure methods, but most if not all of it either have horrible price for user or need a sacrifice... Often both.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
For an obscure method to increase the number of circuits, complete with "horrible price", just look at Shirou: at the beginning of Fate, due to misinterpreting a lesson, he would temporarily convert his nerves into new circuits, rather than use his actual circuits. Very dangerous, very painful, lots of long-term side-effects even from being successful. Not unreasonable, though, to consider that there might be a way to make the effect permanent. Probably difficult, since Magic Circuits only exist partially as a physical object, and the rest is a spiritual component as part of your soul, but guess who can work with the Soul as easily as with physical materials?

For a less obscure method, widely used in the Fate universe, there's surgery and transplants — the most common example being the transfer of a Magic Crest (specialised circuits which have been deliberately primed/imprinted with specific magecraft, and made more "stable", so that they can continue to exist without the Soul after death) passed down a family line, but it is also possible to transfer regular circuits between a pair of living magi. The "sacrifice" involved is an organ donor (willing and/or post-death), while the "price for user" is hit-and-miss: either you get the most explosive example of transplant rejection imaginable, or the transplant takes perfectly and you don't even need to take immune-suppressing anti-rejection drugs.

So... Joe could probably extract 5 nerves from his leg, convert them into 25 master-crafted Magic Circuits ("Yay for Workaholic!") outside of his body, then convert one of the circuits back into 5 nerves (more "Yay for Workaholic!") to replace the extracted ones with — unless, of course, his regeneration had already restored the missing nerves.

(Saber's Magic Core, from her Dragon Blood, replaces her Magic Circuits — effectively, she has a single circuit of absurdly high quality and capacity. If a normal magus can be consider as "battery powered", having to stop and recharge, then Saber has roughly the equivalent of a portable nuclear reactor)

The ultimate, overall issue is, of course, a lack of actual knowledge on how to use Magecraft. He just about managed to bodge together the single most explained example in the setting, albeit with significant setbacks along the way, so finding another example to successfully (and safely) reverse-engineer might difficult. Thanks to his efficiency perks, he's unlikely to run out of mana for projections, so what else would he need the new, upgraded, circuits for?
 
Last edited:
Koraan said:
Just like I said, "horrible price for the user or a sacrifice". And I don't sure if that gives them more circuits, btw. More energy? Sure. Better quality of circuits? Likely. But more circuits? Dunno.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I think it's supposed to be a magic core, my interpretation is that is a specialized organ to make magic or something, the point is it's not just circuits being better or more numerous
 
Chronocidal said:
For an obscure method to increase the number of circuits, complete with "horrible price", just look at Shirou: at the beginning of Fate, due to misinterpreting a lesson, he would temporarily convert his nerves into new circuits, rather than use his actual circuits. Very dangerous, very painful, lots of long-term side-effects even from being successful. Not unreasonable, though, to consider that there might be a way to make the effect permanent. Probably difficult, since Magic Circuits only exist partially as a physical object, and the rest is a spiritual component as part of your soul, but guess who can work with the Soul as easily as with physical materials?

For a less obscure method, widely used in the Fate universe, there's surgery and transplants — the most common example being the transfer of a Magic Crest (specialised circuits which have been deliberately primed/imprinted with specific magecraft, and made more "stable", so that they can continue to exist without the Soul after death) passed down a family line, but it is also possible to transfer regular circuits between a pair of living magi. The "sacrifice" involved is an organ donor (willing and/or post-death), while the "price for user" is hit-and-miss: either you get the most explosive example of transplant rejection imaginable, or the transplant takes perfectly and you don't even need to take immune-suppressing anti-rejection drugs.

So... Joe could probably extract 5 nerves from his leg, convert them into 25 master-crafted Magic Circuits ("Yay for Workaholic!") outside of his body, then convert one of the circuits back into 5 nerves (more "Yay for Workaholic!") to replace the extracted ones with — unless, of course, his regeneration had already restored the missing nerves.

(Saber's Magic Core, from her Dragon Blood, replaces her Magic Circuits — effectively, she has a single circuit of absurdly high quality and capacity. If a normal magus can be considered as "battery-powered", having to stop and recharge, then Saber has roughly the equivalent of a portable nuclear reactor)
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

heck I wouldn't be surprised if he could make a magic core from himself, since it is not only dragons that have it but other magical beasts as well, so his gorgonopsid form would probably count for that

at what point does a magic circuit becomes a core? is it beyond the S-rank?

heck it may count as an actual dragon since dragons were humanities interpretation of dinosaur bones and magic is part faith
 
lorimalron said:
With Joe's self modification ability and some research, wouldn't he be able to increase his magic circuits
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
With some research Joe can do almost anything. And that seems to be well within his capabilities.

Chronocidal said:
So... Joe could probably extract 3 nerves from his leg, convert them into 25 master-crafted Magic Circuits ("Yay for Workaholic and Shipping the Product combo!") ... then use nanites to heal the missing nerves
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
FTFY.

edit:
Mourning Glory said:
Considering how it's not be shown once, I would say no till it's show as that would be something lord would want to show.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Took me some time to decupher second part of your comment, and I still don't sure what you tried to say there.
Anyway - that quote was from not even the perk description, but the text of the chapter (chapter 17).
 
Last edited:
RogerDodger123 said:
Yeah, Joe still hasn't gotten that 1,200 point perk that is so completely fucking broken it is not even funny, and he already can do almost anything given enough time.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Darksiders has actually been excluded from the forge, although even if LordR was familiar with the source material he might still choose to exclude it.
Becoming a Maker, even if it wasn't post-spark, is pretty fucking broken.
The Celestial Forge is crafting power made Creation Myth, but I feel literally breathing life into clay crosses a line.
Also, let's be real, he'd never roll it.
 
RogerDodger123 said:
Yeah, Joe still hasn't gotten that 1,200 point perk that is so completely fucking broken it is not even funny, and he already can do almost anything given enough time.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
You mean this one?
Maker (1200CP)
You gain an alternate form of a maker, broad, Immensely strong and around 12 feet tall. You also gain supernatural powers of creation, able to make impossible things from practically nothing. Though it may take many years of practice, you will be able to master the art of crafting life from clay, Forge magic spells from ideas of the mind, and matter from nothing. You may eventually create new worlds from the void and forge new forces such as a unique form of magic or entropy as you create the new plane."
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Granted, the jump in price of this one from the others of 800cp to 1200 means that this is practically guaranteed to be the last perk. In terms of sheer brokenness, we'd look more towards The Maddest Science Yet, the perk that gives Washu tech, the same character that has universes in bottles and pretty much a god of knowledge. Or, in terms of 600cp perks, again we can look to Magitek Mastery, Item Construction A+++, and divine crafting perks which can massively change things.
 
How excited/confused would panecea be to touch apeiron and see the weird stuff that's happening with his body? all of the chimera optimizations, the mass effect organs, the demi God, were-form+magic familiar, life fiber DNA bullshit that somehow is and isn't expressing itself, neural brain implant (this is before the megaman ZX perk turns it biological), and the possible conria pollenta changes from perk progression. Basically joe would feel like a completely different monster if examined now.
 
A few more questions to our wonderful author @LordRoustabout

1. what is your name

2. what is your quest

3. what... is the capital of Assyria

4. would you consider adding perks from other versions of the forge once you are out of rolls?, bear in mind I'm not necessarily referring to the ones with actual power, just the funny free ones like the Gears of War one that makes Joe proficient on swearing

5.what is Joe's birthday?

6. will there be any special moment when the forge is complete?

7. would you consider adding new characters to the roster through the forge? Like the free 24 kerbals, felyne companion, avid glove, Etc?

8. of the current roster, who is likely the most difficult character in the slaughterhouse 9 for Joe to deal with?

9. if the situation came to it, how powerful would the Steel Monkes (I'm naming Apeirons team since you didn't) be by themselves? Could they break out Joe out of the PRT if it came to it?

10. if you could add any perk to the forge from a future version, what would it be?

11. if you could have a single perk from the forge, what would it be?

12. does/would Joe count as a phantasmal beast/magical creature for the purpose of creating a magical core? assuming it is possible to create non-draconic magic cores
 
Though panecea doesn't really seem very close to being at the end of her master/stranger isolation, so the only way someone would check joe would be if bonesaw appears with the rest of the nine, witch probably isn't happening as it's only been like a week or something since his debut, but mr. "Three day old technology doesn't cut it" and Mr. "were-beast that can control fire and killed lung" really isn't not painting a giant slaughterhouse nine target on his back
 
Last edited:
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top